Wolfninjajedi Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) he took on quite a few sith on his way to malgus armies of them... like i said they werent that great and malgus and the whole team is kind of on another lvl then those guys but thats the issue with the same speed advantage and no one being able to take them out instantly its the same game as the last one but more in favor for the republic. Ya Jace went through 2 Sith in the trailer, who charged at him, nameless guys. I mean...ya I guess its impressive that he just tossed away two sith but it seemed like anyone could have done that with the way it happened. Anyway I shall leave this thread now, and just watch to see what others have to say. Edited May 7, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZahirS Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 How is Revan in Empire team makes no sense? If he is switched to Republic as it should be, I might jump to the defend the republic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 How is Revan in Empire team makes no sense? If he is switched to Republic as it should be, I might jump to the defend the republic! Its Sith Lord Revan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 I assume we're going with the "at the height of their power" buff here, right? Because I'm a bit confused about which characters we're talking about, seeing as they have storylines and progress over time. So I assuming it's: Obi-wan as seen in Revenge of the Sith Jace Malcolm as seen in Hope Trailer Satele Shan as seen in Hope Trailer Meetra Surik after defeating Darth Traya Malgus as seen in the False Emperor FP Is that right, or are they different than I'm thinking they are? Younger? Older?All right except this is Grand Master Satele Shan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 All right except this is Grand Master Satele Shan. Did you really just nerf the losing side? BIOWARE EMPLOYEE *Points* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) A hard counter means there is a 100% provable way to show how they lose near instantly Sateele is the grand master of the jedi of this era and took on malgus pretty well malgus is arguably on the same lvl as revan as is surik Jace is one of the best soldiers the republic has ever seen he has taken on his fair share of sith and bounty hunters while the team he is facing are exceptional there is no reason to say they take him out in a matter of a couple seconds and obi-wan we all know to be a hell of a tank with his form making him nearly untouchable unlike the last game which could be shown with 3 of the members losing extremely quickly (as in under 10 seconds) to a couple of the team this is not the case for any of the members on the republic thats what i mean about hard counters unless you can prove that some one can take out sateele or surik in a matter of seconds which I would strongly argue against. Longest, Sentence, Ever.... But i agree Pretty much anyway... Edited May 7, 2013 by Selenial Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKulvax Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Its Sith Lord Revan. This is what makes me think Revan is the weak link of the Empire side, Revan in his prime is fine and dandy, but Darth Revan hardly shapes up for me. Edited May 7, 2013 by LadyKulvax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 Did you really just nerf the losing side? BIOWARE EMPLOYEE *Points* Hardly, Grand Master Satele Shan is not BAMF powerful and arguably relatively equal in power to Malgus and likely surpassed by Vader - though that is a matter for debate. On the other hand Jedi Knight Satele is no real match for Malgus, and likewise Vader, given from what we see in the Hope Trailer. Which would essentially make the battle lopsided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Hardly, Grand Master Satele Shan is not BAMF powerful and arguably relatively equal in power to Malgus and likely surpassed by Vader - though that is a matter for debate. On the other hand Jedi Knight Satele is no real match for Malgus, and likewise Vader, given from what we see in the Hope Trailer. Which would essentially make the battle lopsided. But then...how do we even knew if Satele improved or not? Sure she is Grand Master...but, that is just a title and didn't the Jedi Knight in the story surpass Satele? Didn't she outright say this? I can't recall if she did or not. << Edited May 7, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 But then...how do we even knew if Satele improved or not? Sure she is Grand Master...but, that is just a title and didn't the Jedi Knight in the story surpass Satele? Didn't she outright say this? I can't recall if she did or not. <<Yes, but the JK is not involved so... But either way we do have a fair amount of knowledge concerning her abilities as she has appeared in various materials other than SWTOR post-Hope. However we do have to make some minor assumptions, basically Hope Satele x2 or something to that effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Yes, but the JK is not involved so... But either way we do have a fair amount of knowledge concerning her abilities as she has appeared in various materials other than SWTOR post-Hope. However we do have to make some minor assumptions, basically Hope Satele x2 or something to that effect. Actually we can also make some of the same assumptions with Jace he was the leader of havoc squad during a war against the sith. They were known for going into high risk area's unaided and taking out the opposition with the number of sith and sith lords to think that him and his team didn't fight a lot of them would be fool hardy. Yes we only saw him topple a couple of no names but we know from the war itself and what havoc squad was known for doing that there is no way they didn't take on lots of other sith lords and at the time getting tossed back by the force of malgus's lightning when he was arguably one of the most powerful sith of the era is nothing to skoff at. Like I said I know these guys are on a different lvl then most of the opponents that jace fought but that by no means doesn't mean he will be taken down quickly in fact being non-force sensitive with a lack of gadgetry means the enemy is even more likely to underestimate him and his abilities. But ya as I have said earlier the strat for the republic winning is the same as the seps for the last game but from showings of the characters and having less easily exploited weaknesses means that they will be even more effective at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Hardly, Grand Master Satele Shan is not BAMF powerful and arguably relatively equal in power to Malgus and likely surpassed by Vader - though that is a matter for debate. On the other hand Jedi Knight Satele is no real match for Malgus, and likewise Vader, given from what we see in the Hope Trailer. Which would essentially make the battle lopsided. Not what she says bud. If you select the option in the republic Holo-Call for Colocoid War Games, asking her why she does not fight, she states: "I am not the warrior i once was, my power has faded and my role is to lead" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I think the best course of action for the Republic is to have Satele back using Battle Meditation. Of course Jace will guard her. With Satele's Battle Meditation going, the Empire will be at a significant disadvantage, especially with Obi-Wan being boosted by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) I think the best course of action for the Republic is to have Satele back using Battle Meditation. Of course Jace will guard her. With Satele's Battle Meditation going, the Empire will be at a significant disadvantage, especially with Obi-Wan being boosted by it. Satele hasn't been shown to know Battle Meditation....it was speculated by master Dar'Nala but never confirmed so that doesn't really hold any weight if she hasn't been shown to know it. Edited May 7, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 Not what she says bud. If you select the option in the republic Holo-Call for Colocoid War Games, asking her why she does not fight, she states: "I am not the warrior i once was, my power has faded and my role is to lead"Oh, really? That's interesting. OK 'optimal strength Satele' - whatever that is. Oh and thanks for bringing that to light, that quote is very informative I was not aware that her power had waned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZahirS Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Seems to me Satele on her peak probably used battle meditation along with meditating on the events during the war, she might aswell have it because she is daughter of Bastilla (Note is not 100% sure). But there is more evidence that she had the ability, even in her waning years as grandmaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Seems to me Satele on her peak probably used battle meditation along with meditating on the events during the war, she might aswell have it because she is daughter of Bastilla (Note is not 100% sure). But there is more evidence that she had the ability, even in her waning years as grandmaster. Just because she is the daughter of Bastilla doesn't mean she has Battle Med, she hasn't been shown to have it its only been speculated. So until she is shown to use it, she doesn't have it...just because a child is born to a force user doesn't mean they will be force sensitive, the same thing applies pretty much to Satele she may be the daughter of Bastilla but that doesn't mean she inherited Battle Meditation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 I think, concerning Battle Meditation, we cannot give this ability to her. As it is pure speculation whether she had it or not, and if she did have it, should would have used it by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Honostly using battle meditation in such a small scale fight would be less beneficial then having an agile ball carrier like her. Like I said there is no reason for the republic to truly fight they have the same advantage the seps had in the last match they are slightly faster and unlike the last match they can survive much longer allowing them to move the ball even easier. Especially with the likes of Kenobi on their side who I really see as the muscle of the republic team his soresu mastery was known to be incredible and while vader would defeat him as he wouldn't fall into a trap I don't know that any one else on the empire team can and he doesn't have to win a fight just hold the ball till his team is in position or just stay in the middle and hold it something he can do greatly being how insanely skilled in soresu he was and with the mobility of his team mates to back this up its the same perfect storm while the empire like the rebels of the last one just have to power and unlike the last one they don't have it to the same degree nor do they have the tactical or mental advantage its the same fight only with the republic gaining much of the advantages the rebels had last match while still keeping the perfect storm that gave the seps their victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZahirS Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 if she doesn't have it Beni made the match already "won" by Empire really Vader has it btw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 if she doesn't have it Beni made the match already "won" by Empire really Vader has it btw So wait your idea of the empire winning is putting their strongest member sitting in the middle of no where trying to mess with the heads of his opponents and bolstering his team..... Battle meditation is not an insta win it doesn't make people able to do stuff they aren't normally able to do it just makes people more coordinated and with vader just sitting some where the power of the team shifts drastically in favor of the republic this battle is to small scale for battle meditation to be effective at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZahirS Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) So wait your idea of the empire winning is putting their strongest member sitting in the middle of no where trying to mess with the heads of his opponents and bolstering his team..... Battle meditation is not an insta win it doesn't make people able to do stuff they aren't normally able to do it just makes people more coordinated and with vader just sitting some where the power of the team shifts drastically in favor of the republic this battle is to small scale for battle meditation to be effective at all. Its not only that Vader could at any time control the ball trayectory by the force alone, boostering his team while he does it, that means every team member would be more agile, fast and with high morale to boost Edited May 7, 2013 by ZahirS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Its not only that Vader could at any time control the ball trayectory by the force alone, boostering his team while he does it, that means every team member would be more agile, fast and with high morale to boost any one could do that with telekentics and I always figured that was illegal it seems like it would be and again its according to everything I have read its just better coordination and morality it doesn't increase any ones actual abilities it just means every one is in sync with one another and having the most powerful person on your team sitting there doing that severely weakens the empire more so then actually having him fight to the point where that extra coordination will be completely worthless since now its 3 on 4 the republic still being slightly faster which will be off shot by the newfound coordination vs lack of coordination so all and all speed is the same but now it comes down to the republic has the power advantage though so doing this means you just forgoed every strength the empire had. they don't have a power advantage and they don't have a speed advantage its way more detrimental to have vader not fight he would never use battle meditation in such a small scale fight its pointless and is more detrimental then him walking into the battle himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 Since when does Vader have Battle Meditation? As far as I am aware he does not. And while yes, Vader can grab the ball with the Force, so can other players - although admittedly not to such great an effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Since when does Vader have Battle Meditation? As far as I am aware he does not. And while yes, Vader can grab the ball with the Force, so can other players - although admittedly not to such great an effect. It wouldn't have to be using telekentics on the ball in this group would probably be a bad idea since a push while some one (regardless of who) is trying to grab it will send the ball just about any where as the extra force will easily change the trajectory of the ball and disrupt the force of the person trying to grab it so I think it would just be used to stabilize and not really mess with the trajectory of the ball as in not grab it and bring it to themselves just throw it and make sure it hits its intended target and this would be true for every one here..... again same as last match in the regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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