Watchman Sentinels, not snipers, should have the +30 levels of stealth detection

[Carter_Mathis]

What about mercs?

 

Mercs can also get +6 levels of stealth detection per stack of Juyo form

[ArchangelLBC]

Mercs can also get +6 levels of stealth detection per stack of Juyo form

 

You mean +5. Juyo stacks 6 times now

[Caeliux]

More escapes, immunities for other classes, nothing for watchman, more mobilty for rage/focus (leap from root), higher ramp up time for sustained dmg, less healing from dots due to crit nerf.

 

 

So your saying with a straight face focus is better locking down a healer?

 

Your saying combat is the healer killer of all 3 sent trees?

 

I play all 3 and very well, but I am way more scary on watchman than both trees far as locking down a healer.

 

Sure I post 500k or more when playing focus, my smashes are 5k or more, so yea great damage overall, but in grand scheme of things I don't and can't lock down a healer with focus.

 

Sure with combat I can lock down a healer, and the burst is good and steady, not to mention trans is wonderful and when I pop zen and do my rotation I burn people down.

 

Do I think combat is better equipped? Yes I do.

 

Do I think it has better burst than watchman, no I don't.

 

Do I think the extra dots matter, the slows matter, the dots after choke matters, yes.

 

Do I think merciless slash is better than anything in combat? Yes.

 

Also the ramp up time coming in 2.0, is this coming from you playing watchman, or a pts?

 

Just wondering.

 

Right right, people on PTS have no clue what they're talking about, but YOU, you know it's gonna be just as good or better.

 

I know its going to be better due to the fact sent is geting another move which will add damage, watchman is geting another slow meaning more of a threat.

 

No to mention bolster, not to mention level 55 meaning more damage.

 

Again and I will say this again, in the hands of a good player any spec can work.

 

Any dps spec in rank can work, any healing spec can work, and any tank spec can work.

 

Biased team comps and biased opinions of things not working means they didn't make it work, but others will testify it can and will.

 

Having a optimistic mind is a gift, I think some here have a one track mind and don't think outside the box.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Caeliux

[ArchangelLBC]

I know its going to be better due to the fact sent is geting another move which will add damage, watchman is geting another slow meaning more of a threat.

 

No to mention bolster, not to mention level 55 meaning more damage.

 

Again and I will say this again, in the hands of a good player any spec can work.

 

Any dps spec in rank can work, any healing spec can work, and any tank spec can work.

 

Biased team comps and biased opinions of things not working means they didn't make it work, but others will testify it can and will.

 

Having a optimistic mind is a gift, I think some here have a one track mind and don't think outside the box.

 

Because your mind is any less one track than you accuse ours of being? Except our opinions have some actual bearing on reality

 

Also other specs have also gotten better. Some have gotten better than others. This isn't hard.

[biowareftw]

So your saying with a straight face focus is better locking down a healer?

 

Your saying combat is the healer killer of all 3 sent trees?

 

I play all 3 and very well, but I am way more scary on watchman than both trees far as locking down a healer.

 

Sure I post 500k or more when playing focus, my smashes are 5k or more, so yea great damage overall, but in grand scheme of things I don't and can't lock down a healer with focus.

 

Sure with combat I can lock down a healer, and the burst is good and steady, not to mention trans is wonderful and when I pop zen and do my rotation I burn people down.

 

Do I think combat is better equipped? Yes I do.

 

Do I think it has better burst than watchman, no I don't.

 

Do I think the extra dots matter, the slows matter, the dots after choke matters, yes.

 

Do I think merciless slash is better than anything in combat? Yes.

 

Also the ramp up time coming in 2.0, is this coming from you playing watchman, or a pts?

 

Just wondering.

 

 

 

I know its going to be better due to the fact sent is geting another move which will add damage, watchman is geting another slow meaning more of a threat.

 

No to mention bolster, not to mention level 55 meaning more damage.

 

Again and I will say this again, in the hands of a good player any spec can work.

 

Any dps spec in rank can work, any healing spec can work, and any tank spec can work.

 

Biased team comps and biased opinions of things not working means they didn't make it work, but others will testify it can and will.

 

Having a optimistic mind is a gift, I think some here have a one track mind and don't think outside the box.

 

You are going to have to use that charge to get back to rolling op's, and immune sages (break target then go back on target). It is currently used as a interrupt. You are losing that. You also have a higher ramp up time to get even COME CLOSE to combat/carnage burst.

 

As far as annihilation/watchman having more burst then carnage/combat? L O L. What game are you playing. Oh wait. That's right! You use the sentinel pvp set. Try getting the jug one and seeing what a charge gore ravage forcescream does, followed by a 30 stack unlimited massacre spam.

 

Then again? If you are wearing the wrong set? You probably aren't min maxed and are rocking like 35 percent crit Oh look you said you do 5 k SMASHES. That is INTENSE MAN. I think I am done with this discussion. Annihilation/watchman has really good sustained after a short ramp up CURRENTLY. Comparing it to the burst of a combat/carnage, MM sniper, Pyro PT is just freakin laughable.

 

You are geared wrong and min maxed wrong and THAT is why you have the opinion you do. It is of course wrong, but whatever. I can't continue this discussion anymore. It is like arguing with a lamp post.

[Caeliux]

Except our opinions have some actual bearing on reality

 

 

You think your opinions are reality, or just biased?

 

Answer: Biased

Oh wait. That's right! You use the sentinel pvp set

 

Saying the same thing over and over when I said it was a mistake only makes you look like a fool, so please the jokes are over its time to at like adult.

 

Comparing it to the burst of a combat/carnage, MM sniper, Pyro PT is just freakin laughable.

 

Again with your comparing, I don't care what other classes are doing, we are talking about watchman.

 

Watchman is and will be viable come 2.0.

 

It is of course wrong, but whatever. I can't continue this discussion anymore. It is like arguing with a lamp post.

 

And arguing with you is like arguing with a one line comic, the same jokes are just old and tired.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Caeliux

[ArchangelLBC]

Trolololol

 

Whatevs dude. Enjoy whatever you want in regs.

 

Let me know when your ranked team is using Watchman Sent and Commando DPS though. Be sure to record it. I can always use a good laugh.

 

 

But yeah when we form opinions based on what testing we're able to do we have biased opinions which are completely invalidated by just the acronym PTS.

 

When YOU have opinions you are a special little snow flake who is the only person capable of thinking outside the box, and only you realize that all classes and specs are ranked viable.

 

[Caeliux]

 

Whatevs dude. Enjoy whatever you want in regs.

 

Yea god forbid actually enjoying the game.

 

Let me know when your ranked team is using Watchman Sent and Commando DPS though. Be sure to record it. I can always use a good laugh.

 

I always laugh at biased people like yourself, I pity people who are not optimistic.

[PerinnAybara]

Yea god forbid actually enjoying the game.

 

 

 

I always laugh at biased people like yourself, I pity people who are not optimistic.

 

You gave me biased opinions about 2.0 notes and a pts.

 

You know who's biased about the effectiveness of Penicillen? Alexander Fleming. Know who is also right about it's effectiveness? Alexander Fleming. So... what's your argument other then there is an inherent bias in the following statement.

 

Fellow A wanted to know the class balance and the coming state of PVP in game update 2.0. So what does fellow A do?

 

Fellow A rolls a toon on the PTS, and PVP's for a while. Comes to an "informed" conclusion. Post said conclusions on a forum.

 

Here comes uninformed, untried, fellow B who has never been to the PTS. Refuses to hear any feedback given by people from who tested out the PTS, and calls all of the people who experienced what the Developers had ready for us at the time, Biased.

 

Oh, and he comes to conclusions without any "information" other than his own experiences on Live. Which could hold up, if he showed superior performance and understanding of his class, however that does not hold up.

 

Fellow B calls Fellow A Biased, and thus his opinion doesn't matter. While Fellow B thinks everyone should believe his opinion since he's so awesome and unbiased since he never even tried out the PTS.

 

Sorry to break it to you fellow B, you're more biased since you have no actual "information" or "experience" to counter the bias.

[PerinnAybara]

Yea god forbid actually enjoying the game.

 

 

 

I always laugh at biased people like yourself, I pity people who are not optimistic.

 

Lol. Optimism isn't a sort of bias?

[Caeliux]

Fellow A wanted to know the class balance and the coming state of PVP in game update 2.0. So what does fellow A do?

 

Fellow A rolls a toon on the PTS

 

I stopped at PTS, the PTS was a buggy experience and bolster made everything ****ed up.

 

I don't care really what you so called Watchman players say, the spec always and will be viable in PVP.

 

Yes combat is more useful and will be 2.0, and yes I will be rolling a combat and watchman come 2.0.

 

Lol. Optimism isn't a sort of bias?

 

bi·as [ b əss ]

preference: an unfair preference for or dislike of something

 

and

 

op·ti·mis·tic [ òptə místik ]

with positive attitude: tending to take a hopeful and positive view of future outcomes

 

Disliking and having a positive attitude and being hopeful don't mix sorry.

 

I am optimistic about Watchman, others are biased about it.

 

See what I did there.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Caeliux

[PerinnAybara]

I stopped at PTS, the PTS was a buggy experience and bolster made everything ****ed up.

 

I don't care really what you so called Watchman players say, the spec always and will be viable in PVP.

 

Yes combat is more useful and will be 2.0, and yes I will be rolling a combat and watchman come 2.0.

 

 

 

bi·as [ b əss ]

preference: an unfair preference for or dislike of something

 

and

 

op·ti·mis·tic [ òptə místik ]

with positive attitude: tending to take a hopeful and positive view of future outcomes

 

Disliking and having a positive attitude and being hopeful don't mix sorry.

 

I am optimistic about Watchman, others are biased about it.

 

See what I did there.

 

You proved my statement true with logic.

Edited April 5, 2013 by PerinnAybara

[JediMasterSLC]

Watchman is my favorite spec, always has been. No serious team runs one in ranked, since around 1.4/1.5. Even when the teams have pre-established a no bubble/no smash agreement, it's still very rare. I'm pretty much the only sent/mara who does it in ranked on my server (only if no bubble no smash), and only if there's another sent running combat, and never in huttball or civil war. Stealth detection with Juyo stacks wouldn't solve the spec's issues, though it would be pretty cool, and I applaud the OP for their creativity. Was really hoping I would get to play watchman in ranked but it looks like it'll be the same ol combat and focus for me. My heart goes out to the ppl defending watchman's viability. I really wish you were right. PLZ GIVE WATCHMAN PVP SOME LOVE BW, the concept of "this is the pve tree and this is the pvp tree" is terrible. Devising an appropriate check against cleansing would be a little challenging but certainly doable. Also, I want my l33t heals back, even though it wouldn't really solve the problem. I know it was a pve nerf, but how hard is it to put in the tooltip for merciless zeal: "heals for 2% per tick if used on a player target". Like srsly, simple things like this could solve some of the problem of balancing both pvp and pve.

 

Anyway In 2.0 there'll be more variety and numbers of ranged dps- gs will be even more common, and we might see some more dps sorcs and mandos. For sents, I'd be surprised to see a team running 2 sents anymore, and the ratio of ppl running combat to focus will increase. Oh and no more bubble stun (mostly).

 

Speaking of which, ppl saying combat is/will be only viable sent spec, and that guardian smash is better than sent ... i mean, in regs maybe, but do any of you play ranked? Few comps have a dps guardian, except for sometimes on voidstar offense. Guardians are too squishy-they don't have camo or guarded- this seems like only a minor con but it ends up being huge in team fight maps like novare and hypergate. Guardians can obvi do several useful things a sent can't, but it's fragility outweighs them all. I have a rage jug too (and a 50 of every AC), not saying this cuz I'm a sent fanboy. You can argue the pros and cons all you want but fact is that focus sents are 10x more common in ranked than focus guardians, and for good reason.

Edited April 5, 2013 by JediMasterSLC

[JediMasterSLC]

bump watchman i mean buff