Petition, straight and simple.

[Levity]

The crafting thing isn't all known.

 

Cybertech has gotten a lot of awesome stuff. The Grade 7 stuff, the Campaign-level Droid stuff, the grade 26/27 Armorings and Mods, and people love the 'nades. It's understandable that at level 55, there will be more ship parts, more droid parts, greater grenades, more armorings, mods, earpieces, and so on; same with Artiface with crystals, enhancements, and off-hands.

 

Not everything needs to be adaptive. No one said it would be. That's why there's 3 RE Crits at Blue and 6 at Purple. You just reverse-engineer until you have what you want.

 

I'll just say that there's about no point in ever being artifice. And end game mods, enhancements, and armoings are not going to be able to be crafted. The crafting system in this game is really limp, while the end game goodies shadows it for now. But in 2.0 it will go back to the simple "be a biochem or go home" mentality which is very abundant already. For you to defend that the crafting is well rounded among every profession just shows that you are arguing just to argue since the crafting needs a hell of a good amount of work.

[Drew_Braxton]

I've played a few MMO's and none are without the pay option of some sort. Even if it's not obvious to most some game leave open certain advantages to those spending a lot of real money (multiboxing, etc.). Some are low population games financed mostly by a few that spend a lot. I've seen people drop $10,000 on a game without blinking. As long as real money doesn't give a competitive advantage I don't mind since more $ = more resources and interest by a company to continuing to invest in, grow, or continue to support a game. As long as the CM continues to stay with cosmetic gear, toys, pets, and mounts more power to them.

[Koyaanisqat]

I'll just say that there's about no point in ever being artifice. And end game mods, enhancements, and armoings are not going to be able to be crafted. The crafting system in this game is really limp, while the end game goodies shadows it for now. But in 2.0 it will go back to the simple "be a biochem or go home" mentality which is very abundant already. For you to defend that the crafting is well rounded among every profession just shows that you are arguing just to argue since the crafting needs a hell of a good amount of work.

 

I find plenty of use in my artifice in crafting foci, generators, shields, enhancements, and crystals for my leveling alts.

 

"End Game" is a silly definition of a relative position that's always and consistently changing.

[Andryah]

Crafters can't compete.

 

Generally, in MMOs... crafters cannot compete with all the gear available in an MMO. Crafters find their niche and they work it... balancing against competition from other crafters as well as from the game.

 

Now, from a practical standpoint.... I don't see a business that is run for profit giving away things that undercut their sales and since this is now a freemium business model with a CCM, that is exactly what would happen. I know.. you aren't asking for everything.. just something... but It's still against their interests to enable crafters to undercut sales in the CCM.

 

I get the frustration that crafters experience. I've been there in other MMOs. Which is why I quit crafting in MMOs about 4 years ago. Too much work, not enough interest on my part. I gather, but I don't craft. I leave crafting to other players who actually enjoy it and treat it as a minigame within the game.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Andryah

[JMCH]

Experience from past mmo games I've been playing, appreciation from the community loses to money, big time.

 

Same pattern here, give it a year and game's gonna be p2w

Not only this... how many kids and gambling addicts will be abused by such a system?

 

When at first I saw the simple fact you could "buy" this reputation with cartel packs only, I was unhappy... then, I saw the increased weekly cap "just for this one", that's seriously too much.

 

On top of it, it seems the whole thing shouldn't even exist since cartel certificates are about as rare as the items purchaseable in the first place, but it's probable said "old" packs will be removed soon enough.

 

 

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure.

 

By the way, the whole "reputation" system is horribly implemented, at first I thought we were going to see "factions" as we know them in other MMOs, with various implications (vendors availability, ennemy factions cross-dependencies...), instead, we have some stupid useable items and a vendor lost in the middle of each zone with not so "exclusive" products, except legacy Force weapons which only use was transfering hilts for RE which soon will have ZERO value. Sure, there are goodies... but eh, goodies are just that.

 

[Levity]

I find plenty of use in my artifice in crafting foci, generators, shields, enhancements, and crystals for my leveling alts.

 

"End Game" is a silly definition of a relative position that's always and consistently changing.

 

So how much money have you actually made as artifice? How have you actually made money in the game? I know guys who have 8-12 characters and have every profession in the game and they will tell you it's almost pointless to go any route except the guys who makes augments(can't remember the prof.) and biochem for profit. Sure your crafters supply your alts. Whoopdy doo. Crafters are about being useful. When almost every profession is useless then there's no reason to even have it.

 

I don't really care for arguing about the rep. bs anymore. But for you to act like the crafting system is a balance between all trades, perfect world simulator of awesome ingeniusness, you need to rethink that answer. Because it's not. It's one of the areas that is lacking in this game. As I said you are arguing to argue.

[theUndead]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I could give a flying squirrel's genitals about the implementation of anything in the game that gives neither a statistical nor time advantage to any player that is created exclusively via money expenditure.

 

This is my line of thinking as well. But I have to wonder with all te people that are unhappy with the rep system, do you really think agreement on a couple of pages on a thread is going to change a thing?

 

See from the way I see is that although the forums are the only place to protest they do not represent the majority of players actually playing the game. Furthermore, it would seem that this majority are quite content to the way things are or they simply don't care. It is with this reasoning that I think if you truly want a voice it has to come from players playing right now not the few who are on the forums. Also my final two cents is, while I personally think the CM is just cosmetic things I know many others do not share that view as such the best way to make your voices heard is to actually not support it.

[Tachenko_Yuri]

But I have to wonder with all te people that are unhappy with the rep system, do you really think agreement on a couple of pages on a thread is going to change a thing?

 

If you don't try you'll never know, but at least I know that I attempted to rally the community in what possibly is tor's darkest hour. The moment in which monthly loyal subscribers become 2nd citizens to people that are being turned into gambling addicts due to a couple of vendors unlockable only via expenditure of cold hard cash.

[TheNevet]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure.

[Koyaanisqat]

So how much money have you actually made as artifice? How have you actually made money in the game

 

A lot, actually. My Artifice has reverse-engineered to purple every crystal and mod in-game, and working on the enhancements.

 

High end crystals and hilts to sell. Some people just really like plain colors, like red, blue, and Magenta.

[theUndead]

If you don't try you'll never know, but at least I know that I attempted to rally the community in what possibly is tor's darkest hour. The moment in which monthly loyal subscribers become 2nd citizens to people that are being turned into gambling addicts due to a couple of vendors unlockable only via expenditure of cold hard cash.

 

Fair enough. It is your right to express your dissatisfaction but the one point I disagree with is that I do not believe a game like this turns people into gambling addicts.

 

In fact I tend to believe that people will spent their money as they see fit. For example if they have plenty of disposable income and they wish to spent it on coins it is their right. However, if they are on a strict budget they will not spent a cent more than they are able. I think you are generalizing people by assuming they would all turn into gambling addicts because that would mean everyone who spends money is in danger.

 

I'm sorry but I don't think that is fair as I have spent quite a bit on the CM but I do not spend my rent money or my money for books on the cash shop. The reason is I am responsible and I tend to believe most people are as well.

[Rafaman]

If you don't try you'll never know, but at least I know that I attempted to rally the community in what possibly is tor's darkest hour. The moment in which monthly loyal subscribers become 2nd citizens to people that are being turned into gambling addicts due to a couple of vendors unlockable only via expenditure of cold hard cash.

 

Darkest hour? LOL! Really? I think, maybe you missed a few dark hours during the layoffs.

 

Second class citizens because you can't get what exactly... a bit of fluff? There are plenty of advantages in being a sub well beyond the CM.

 

Gambling addicts? Yup... cartel packs will do that to you... First it's the cartel packs, then slot machines, and the next thing you know you are panhandling for cash in Vegas so you can get another shot at the craps table. Cartel packs are a gateway gamble.

 

Hysteria is hysterical. LOL!

Edited March 14, 2013 by Rafaman

[tekhiun]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure.

 

 

Subscription wont renew until they fix this.

[GalaxyStrong]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure.

[Blackavaar]

And it's a non-issue. People are still going to need mods, armorings, enhancements, augment kits, and augments for the adaptive stuff. Not everyone's tastes are going to be the same. Some people will prefer either not purchasing Cartel Stuff, or just obtaining easier and cheaper crafted items or items achieved via commendations or missions. As it is, I use my armormech, synthweaver, artifice and cybertech to equip other alts of mine, making my legacy more of a self-sufficient corporation, never relying on outside resources like the GTN to operate.

 

So, crafters can still put their Armorings and Mods and Enhancements and Hilts and Barrels on the GTN. Yeah, that's just as good as having new sets every once in a while.

 

You know what? You'll never understand this because you don't want to understand it. You want to continue to try to twist my words around to make it seem like I am overreacting. Well, anyone who actually reads my posts will know differently. So, just forget it, Koya. I'm done trying to explain my point to you.

 

[saremun]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure. Edited March 14, 2013 by saremun

[Tachenko_Yuri]

 

Second class citizens because you can't get what exactly... a bit of fluff? their are plenty of advantages in being a sub well beyond the CM.

 

 

I don't *expect* , nor *ask* to have stuff handed over in a silver plate. What I refuse is this system that to unlock the vendors you must buy packs = spending money, but for subscriber, seeing stuff locked, it is quite a pain, specially if those vendors are basically sending this message to the subbers:

 

" hey cool story by being subbed to the game but to get our stuff you must spend even more "

 

why do I have to spend even more if I'm already keeping up the game with my $15 monthly?

 

Once again, me and I'm guessing quite a few others would like a daily quest system for this new reputation, while buying the packs can be the easy/quick way to do it, although that still wouldn't solve the gambling issue.

[AzuthTheHighOne]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I APPROVE OF the implementation of any Cartel Market items that DO NOT NEGATIVELY AFFECT MY GAMEPLAY.

[OldRepJedi]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure.

 

Add me to the list

[Rafaman]

I don't *expect* , nor *ask* to have stuff handed over in a silver plate. What I refuse is this system that to unlock the vendors you must buy packs = spending money, but for subscriber, seeing stuff locked, it is quite a pain, specially if those vendors are basically sending this message to the subbers:

 

" hey cool story by being subbed to the game but to get our stuff you must spend even more "

 

why do I have to spend even more if I'm already keeping up the game with my $15 monthly?

 

Once again, me and I'm guessing quite a few others would like a daily quest system for this new reputation, while buying the packs can be the easy/quick way to do it, although that still wouldn't solve the gambling issue.

 

Fair enough, as others feel differently. But really I was commenting your exaggerations. They add to the hysteria but add little to the debate.

[Koyaanisqat]

So, crafters can still put their Armorings and Mods and Enhancements and Hilts and Barrels on the GTN. Yeah, that's just as good as having new sets every once in a while.

 

You know what? You'll never understand this because you don't want to understand it. You want to continue to try to twist my words around to make it seem like I am overreacting. Well, anyone who actually reads my posts will know differently. So, just forget it, Koya. I'm done trying to explain my point to you.

 

 

The whole point of cybertech and artifice and armstech is to craft those parts of adaptive weapons and armor.

 

I'm not twisting anything. You just refuse to acknowledge the invalidity of your claims. So, of course, your only reaction is to become intentionally obtuse.

[Blackavaar]

The whole point of cybertech and artifice and armstech is to craft those parts of adaptive weapons and armor.

 

I'm not twisting anything. You just refuse to acknowledge the invalidity of your claims. So, of course, your only reaction is to become intentionally obtuse.

 

So, all of those crafting schematics for modifiable gear weren't the point of crafting? Oh how deluded I was. You have opened my eyes.

 

Show me the Armoring and Mods that Armormechs can craft! What about the Enhancements and Hilts that Sythweavers can craft?

 

Yeah, there are NONE, so obviously that was not the effing point with those crafting professions was it? So, you specifically avoid mentioning those two professions to make your side of the argument seem more valid. Is it? No.

 

Now who's being intentionally obtuse?

 

Edited March 14, 2013 by Blackavaar

[Antipodes]

/not signed

 

This is a way for people who a lot of money on the Cartel Market to get more consistent Cartel Items.

 

Any arguments against the new changes apply to the Cartel Market as a whole (i.e crafting is less valuable). Nothing has changed.

[Darslk]

As a customer or Star Wars: The Old republic, I do not approve the implementation of a reputation system based exclusively on money expenditure.

[mothear]

/not signed

 

This is a way for people who a lot of money on the Cartel Market to get more consistent Cartel Items.

 

Any arguments against the new changes apply to the Cartel Market as a whole (i.e crafting is less valuable). Nothing has changed.

 

Then have the packs only drop certificates and keep the vendor. There's no need for a rep.