A message from NoTomorrow to Assassin players

[Liryc]

That is the point I was trying to make. They took away the good builds and are forcing you to go full 36 points which are way way way worse than anything we have now. The changes to deception is just idiotic. You build your charges much slower and you must have one to use discharge. Deception was great in quick small scale battles, that is literally what the devs said the class is all about a "lone wolf" build which singles out targets on the battlefield. Now you are flipping that 180 and making it so you need to stay in the fight longer to deal any real damage.

 

just pointless.

 

I may have mis-interpreted.

 

We can definitely forget about ever opening with breach now. Full Infil will be viable, just not as front loaded on damage. I think everyone was hoping for an actual incentive to go 36 points up rather than getting punished by not going all the way up. Either way they accomplished discouraging infil hybrid. It may be safe to say that a 0/27/14 equivalent is dead in 2.0.

 

But the dps tank hybrids will be very much still alive. Especially with the shielding changes. In fact, I'm predicting KC hybrids will get even more complaints on the forums. Look at how many 1st tier tools are available:

Infil tree: upheaval and mind snap/force of will CD reduction, are now 1st tier infil tree skills, so theres 5 points worth putting into. If you go just 2 points more you can have the 15% increased movement speed from misdirection.

Balance tree: 14-15 points in balance for FiB & the DS crit dmg boost. No more insta lift so its not worth going 17 points deep - on the other hand you pick up a 10s CD reduction on stun.

KC tree: 23-24 points in KC - You lose spining kick, but keep pull, insta crit projects, and now kinetic ward is worth getting to for the 20% shield. Guaranteed to be more use of shields, so the internal dmg of breach will be a tad bit more valuable as well.

 

24/7/15 - or some close variation. This could be a highly mobile spec and probably the best huttball carrier. Shield changes almost makes it worth picking up kinetic ward and using a shield full time. Snare/root break on force speed, increased movement speed from misdirection, shorter CD on force of will. again you lose spinning kick, but pick up 10s shorter CD on stun.

 

27/5/14 - if you want more survivability from harnessed shadows, just drop the 15% speed increase.

[MiaRB]

I may have mis-interpreted.

 

We can definitely forget about ever opening with breach now. Full Infil will be viable, just not as front loaded on damage. I think everyone was hoping for an actual incentive to go 36 points up rather than getting punished by not going all the way up. Either way they accomplished discouraging infil hybrid. It may be safe to say that a 0/27/14 equivalent is dead in 2.0.

 

.

 

full infil/decep is only viable in PVE in 2.0. it is a worthless PVP spec as things are now on PTS. they could even undo the changes to projejct, CS and breech and it will still be worthless in PVP because noncrit damage is horrible. unless they undo the changes to critrate DR, the spec is garbage and not even viable in normal WZs. worst PVP DPS in 2.0 of any class/ac in the game( except maybe shadow balance spec ).

 

the only thing the changes have done is it forces anyone who actually played inf spec in PVP to either reroll or switch to DPS geared KC based specs. which will overall be better than they are now after the get a force buff so they will never be force starved and when they get a bit of their armor mitigation back.

 

oh and 2.0 isnt killing shadow/assassin hybrids. all it does is kill some of the current hybrid builds. people are already comming up with new ones. so you will see even less full spec shadow/assasins in PVP than we see on live servers.

Edited February 25, 2013 by MiaRB

[ebado]

Dear Assassin players,

you may have noticed my extremely militant and sometimes outright brutal negativity towards Assassin as a class.

....

I feel that I need to give you an explaination behind this personal vendetta of mine against assassin as a class.

...

my hatred towards assasins has nothing to do with how often i die to them

...

Why bash the class so brutally on every occasion?

...

I hope you forgive me for my negativity and hatred towards Assasins.

....

Sorry for my gloating over the Assassins nerfs.

 

If you are being this self-aware, it's probably best for you to rethink your approach to this game. Moreso than just this post.

Edited February 25, 2013 by ebado

[Liryc]

full infil/decep is only viable in PVE in 2.0. it is a worthless PVP spec as things are now on PTS. they could even undo the changes to projejct, CS and breech and it will still be worthless in PVP because noncrit damage is horrible. unless they undo the changes to critrate DR, the spec is garbage and not even viable in normal WZs. worst PVP DPS in 2.0 of any class/ac in the game( except maybe shadow balance spec ).

 

the only thing the changes have done is it forces anyone who actually played inf spec in PVP to either reroll or switch to DPS geared KC based specs. which will overall be better than they are now after the get a force buff so they will never be force starved and when they get a bit of their armor mitigation back.

 

oh and 2.0 isnt killing shadow/assassin hybrids. all it does is kill some of the current hybrid builds. people are already comming up with new ones. so you will see even less full spec shadow/assasins in PVP than we see on live servers.

 

step back for a second cuz i havn't delved too deep into the crit changes. So as it stands now on PTS, 2.0 will bring greater DR on crit. therefore much lower crit rates overall. correct?

 

We would still have our 3 insta crits on CD, but on sustained play if all classes were being affected equally by the crit changes, would it be as big of a deal? I'm guessing thats not the case since some specs have instant crits as part of the build. Just look at KC with insta crit projects - its always been the preference to stack power, and forego crit. There's just another reason to do a KC hybrid....

[Smashbrother]

Here is something that I posted the other day that myself and other assassins have known for a while about our specs.

 

 

 

 

 

Just about from launch until now there has never been any reason to not go full 31 points for any tree. Bioware has failed to address the issue that we have which is useless top tier abilities.

 

It's not because the sin's 31 point talents sucks, it's because force in balance is too good. That's why nobody really goes full 31 in sin trees.

 

The 31 talent points of most classes aren't all that amazing.

Edited February 25, 2013 by Smashbrother

[ArchangelLBC]

Thanks for this NoTomorrow. It reinforces why I've always respected you on these forums, even when I've disagreed with you.

 

That being said, yeah these changes were totally unwarranted in that what they changed wasn't what the problem was.

 

The nerfs to balance (force management in particular, and project granting a 20% melee bonus damage) were completely nonsensical. They nerfed talents that no kinetic or infiltration hybrid was taking and essentially ruined Balance playstyle for no good reason. Moving the shadowstrike talent, while mistaken, was enough to kill the only Balance heavy hybrids I was aware of, and this could have just as easily been accomplished by moving the surge talent for shadow strike further up the tree while leaving the proc in the bottom so Shadowstrike is a worthwhile skill for ALL shadows as it should be (or as you said, make the proc a baseline thing and make the Infiltration talent simply lower the rate limit).

 

Meanwhile full infiltration is even less worth doing than it ever was. You want to encourage full 36 point builds you make the top talent worth taking. Wasn't that what they said back when they adjusted sniper volley? And yet that isn't what they've done. Yes CS is now necessary to get your 3 stacks to make FB worthwhile in a timely manner, but even at 3 stacks it's pretty lackluster without a crit and that kind of RNG setup (it's a 25% setup and the rate limit is 4.5s so so we're talking at best like 5 GCDs of setup) is just nonviable in PVP, even in normals.

 

In my opinion change FB and CS back to how they always worked and move CS down to the talent that improves whirling blow (same basic tier as MM Snipers get Followthrough, Combat Sentinels get Precision Slash, that kind of thing) and then make that top tier talent something USEFUL. I guarantee you if it's good enough shadows going for an Infiltration heavy build will take it.

 

As it is they've killed Infiltration full play as well. A variant on 0/27/14 might actually be the best now for this spec (I've built a 0/33/13 build that I'll try on PTS as soon as bolster is fixed) just because FiB still gives you more front loaded burst. It's not gonna help with the nerf to crit rates though, which without some kind of crit talent in the tree does effectively kill Infiltration in PVP all on it's own, especially if our main burst is supposed to come from SS now which isn't boosted by Force Potency.

 

That leave kinetic, and sadly there's still quite a lot of possibility for kinetic hybrids, even in DPS gear once they fix force management.

 

All they needed to do to kill a 23/1/17 variant was move instant force lift higher in the balance tree (I maintain balance needs that talent, just put it out of reach of kinetic trees).

 

All they needed to do to kill the infiltration hybrid was make CS not suck (the playstyle of the hybrid was pretty much exactly the same as full infiltration, you just had more burst because FiB > using CSx2 to get a buffed project).

 

*** is wrong you with guys over at BW? I just thought you didn't play Commando. Now I'm starting to wonder if you play the game at all. Unless you're all Pyro PTs and Smash Maras. Those specs are, if anything, stronger now.

Edited February 25, 2013 by ArchangelLBC

[MiaRB]

step back for a second cuz i havn't delved too deep into the crit changes. So as it stands now on PTS, 2.0 will bring greater DR on crit. therefore much lower crit rates overall. correct?

 

We would still have our 3 insta crits on CD, but on sustained play if all classes were being affected equally by the crit changes, would it be as big of a deal? I'm guessing thats not the case since some specs have instant crits as part of the build. Just look at KC with insta crit projects - its always been the preference to stack power, and forego crit. There's just another reason to do a KC hybrid....

 

your critrate is going to be about 10% less( in full top tier 2.0 gear ) than it is in EWH gear on live right now.

 

for inf spec, potency doest give you insta crits. it just gives to +60% critrate. so even when you have potency charges up, you will still crit less than on live servers. inf spec is one of the few specs in the game that gets no passive skills that boost our critrate and we have zero autocrits. but a large number of our skills in the tree depend on critting. we also get no boost to acc, which will also be lower in 2.0 than what you have on live. so you are going to have more misses.

 

you are right. there is no reason at all for anyone to be anything but a KC based build in PVP in 2.0.

[PlagaNerezza]

Dear Assassin players,

you may have noticed my extremely militant and sometimes outright brutal negativity towards Assassin as a class.

I do feel that i owe you an apology.My gripes with the class itself had nothing to do with the players behind it. But due to my agressive posts, some players that i do respect a lot, players like Cycao, ArchangelLBC never deserved this sort of behaviour from me.

 

 

So besides an apology, I feel that I need to give you an explaination behind this personal vendetta of mine against assassin as a class. Contrary to what you may have thought, my hatred towards assasins has nothing to do with how often i die to them. In fact, the kill/death ratio is very much in my favor. I don't know how many, but for my every death by an assassin i do get to kill more than one most of the times.

 

So why all the hate? Why bash the class so brutally on every occasion?

 

Do I feel like Assasins are too powerful against snipers? No way! For the sake of keeping the balance in the game, it's vital that Snipers be countered by Assassins and Operatives, especially by Deception and Concealment. I never had objections towards these match-ups.

 

My problem with the class can be sumed up with two of these points:

1. Class unpredictability - hybrids builds.
   
2. Class versatility
   

 

1. I want Assassins to be more predictable in their builds that they use. I want the class to be more predictable at what it can throw at you. When you are fighting against any other class you see their stance, or take notice of the abilities they are using (for example snipers using Plasma Probe = Engineering), you can accurately predict what they are capable of.

 

When i see somebody in Ataru stance, i know that the class has this, this and this. I know precisely how many roots do they have, what are they vulnerable to, what are the important procs for them and how i can overcome that. I know exactly the conditions he or me need to meet to win the fight. There is a clear line: if you fail at this you die, you have to anticipate this and this. You have to save your CD for this and this or you are going to eat this. Even when you loose to them, or let these guys capture an objective, you know exactly where you messed up.

 

Same can be said about many other classes. I know precisely what to expect form Medicine, Concealment, Lethality, Carnage, Annihilation, Rage, Marksmanship, Engineering, Bodyguard, Arsenal, Pyrotech, Advanced Prototype, Shield Tech. There is no need for me to play the guessing game.

 

Because of this, it's not only fun to be the one that is playing the class and using an ability but it is also fun to be on the receiving end of it, because you know exactly what is happening and what you need to do. Same can be said about many many specs. Do you think Bioware added randomly the class icons above player characters? It was with intentions to promote a clear understanding of what you are dealing with.

 

And then you have assassins, where you cannot predict crap. The tank stance means absolutely nothing. He could be a full tank with tanking gear (there are telling signs of course by looking at their HP pool), he could be a tank in DPS gear, he could be some hybrid. And God knows what hybrid that could be. He could have gone for deception to get some crazy combos of damage reduction, or he could hybrid into madness. And with so many game changing talents, there is no way to know ahead what will happen. Does he have an istacast whirlwind? Does he have root cleansing on his force speed?

 

I am against hybrid builds. I want them to be culled. I support any major buffs to Assassins top tier skills, anything just to guarantee that Assassins will want to play 36 pts builds in 2.0. I want the Assassin stance to provide meaningful information about what I am exactly dealing with.

 

 

2. I want Assassins to be a specialist class, not an universal jack-of-all-trades. The game strives to offer completely different gameplay experiences based on its different classes. Also SWTOR is trying to promote team play between these classes. How do you achieve team play? by making sure that you have specialist classes and they all depend on each other teamplay and support to achieve a common objective or goal.

 

I don't want assassins to be good at more things at the same time than any other class. If you are very good at 1vs1 being able to kill the lone indvididual reinforcements, then i definetely don't want you to be strong in the zerg.

My personal feeling is that Assassins have it much better than other classes on the warzone objectives side. I don't want the Assassins to have the monopoly on node defense, node ninja capture, cutting reinforcements and just general having tons of utility stuff available. II don't want Assassins to be more versatile than any other class because it goes against the principle of having specialist classes and team work. I want other classes to shine as well at grabbing/defending warzone objectives.

 

Yes this could be quite a big exagerration about assasins being universally good or better than other classes people will say that in RWZ they are only good at node guarding. I accept this viewpoint as well. But i feel that this specialist approach needs to be enforced as heavily as possible. Nobody wants to see the outcome of warzones decided by a single class. People want to see team work.

 

That's about it. I hope you forgive me for my negativity and hatred towards Assasins. I have always tried to be consistent with my opinions and not twist my argumentation based on what point of view i needed to defend. Sorry for my gloating over the Assassins nerfs. It was mostly because of me waiting for far too long to see those 2 concepts above brought to asssassin class.

 

I am not saying that the changes in 2.0 are the right way to go. But at least i can see some vague attempt from Bioware to cut down on hybrids. How they do that, it's up to community to convince them.

 

So once again sorry. This should be one of my last posts on assassins.

Cheers.

 

You'll not like my 2.0 assassin. Hybrid spec. You'll see me in some sort of tank stance with deceptions survivability and most likely rocking a 19/27 spec.

 

I'll be shocking you with energized shocks that do 100% * critical damage plus the opportunity to trigger the chain shock. I'll use low slash instead of spike out of stealth to trigger and proc duplicity and I gain a lot of mitigation. You'll see me rocking a shield, shield relic of absorbation and some redoubt/defense to get to mitigate incoming damage.

 

I figure its going to cost me roughly 50 points of weapon/force damage to gain a working shield.

 

I figure with the increased damage outputs and more expertise my shock/maul crits are going to probably lead to a massive cry to nerf assassins. They just made me fight more in melee range, but gave me a massive buff to my defensive skills.

 

Most assassins who roll deception will not like these changes. Those of us who primarily run tank stance dps/node guard or ball carriers are going to see operative like front loaded damage.

 

Simple rotation from stealth Recklessness before opening. electrocute. thrash till procs, shock, maul.

 

Thrash till energize and duplicity proc.

Low slash maul shock

 

Thrash till energize Shock.

 

That will consume your recklessness charges and give your shocks a 100% critical damage increase. Should anyone stand up to that with a 79% surge rating and a guarentee to bypass shielding you let me know. If you want to use spike to open go ahead if you think you can manage the added opener without filling resolve.

 

We should be able to drop tank spec/shielding players like butter. With blood of the sith and dark embrace you should never have energy problems running a shield. At tier 4 its either 2/2 2/3 or 1/2 3/3 depending on how force managment feels and damage mitigation you really need.

 

Meanwhile their is no obvious setup like voltaic slash. You can have me just thrashing away on someone to turn around and just double critical hit someone with a duplicity and energized shock.

 

About all I will miss is force pull. Most of you snipers won't like having to take more accuracy to deal with tanks or hybrid tanks forcing you to drop surge rating. I figure I can get to 25% defense and around 35% shielding chance. Now for a while marksmanship is going to be a gosh darn nightmare. I mean seriously? Who designed that top end tree, If I open on you don't expect much time to counter before your dead and/or I dissappear to reengage. The only thing is now your getting a lot of that non-critical hitting damage mitigated.

 

If in a shielding game, you don't have a shield and don't have a lot of critical hits, your going to see problems with your dps outputs and your survivability.

 

This for a sniper/gs may look really amazing, until you start missing ambush shots or they get absorbed for 50-75% of the damage.

 

Your going to want criticals. You run into the juggie with a shield who can close on you and is redirecting damage back. Force crush/smash/ravage and chilling scream are all very real problems as again you have no shielding mechanism.

 

Once classes realize, hey I can take a shield and defense for little cost it will be a lot of crying as people stack classes that deal burst and try and focus on critical hits. You'll see just how assassins/powertechs/juggies seem op as heck as no other classes will get the mitigation.

 

Everyone will hate assassins due to the nature of the stealth and transport. Any assassin spec that fails to leverage the shield won't be pvp viable.

 

Damage boost goes to 60%? You'd better have plans to a) get critical hits with that. B.) mitigate as much non critical damage as you can.

 

The assassin been nerfed threads are a bit early.

Edited February 25, 2013 by PlagaNerezza

[PlagaNerezza]

your critrate is going to be about 10% less( in full top tier 2.0 gear ) than it is in EWH gear on live right now.

 

for inf spec, potency doest give you insta crits. it just gives to +60% critrate. so even when you have potency charges up, you will still crit less than on live servers. inf spec is one of the few specs in the game that gets no passive skills that boost our critrate and we have zero autocrits. but a large number of our skills in the tree depend on critting. we also get no boost to acc, which will also be lower in 2.0 than what you have on live. so you are going to have more misses.

 

you are right. there is no reason at all for anyone to be anything but a KC based build in PVP in 2.0.

 

Its a +60%. So if you have a 32% critical rating and get a +60% crit rating that is about 92%.

 

"Grants 2 charges of Recklessness, which increases the Force critical chance of your direct attacks and heals by 60% and increases the range of Force Lightning to 30 meters. Each time a direct Force ability critically hits or you activate Force Lightning, you lose 1 charge. Lasts 20 seconds."

 

You also according to the skill don't lose a charge for a non-critical hitting attack unless its force lightning. So yeah. Its a great skill. If you have 79% surge.

[Blasphemerr]

It's neat BioWare had the foresight to nerf infiltration before it became a true problem. Anyone playing that spec min/maxed should have probably understood that having four abilities with the potential to crit for 5k+ is problematic. I do wish hybrids weren't the answer, but it's pretty clear that the best spec in 2.0 will again be a tank hybrid--this time with a shield. Meep meep.

[ArchangelLBC]

It's neat BioWare had the foresight to nerf infiltration before it became a true problem. Anyone playing that spec min/maxed should have probably understood that having four abilities with the potential to crit for 5k+ is problematic. I do wish hybrids weren't the answer, but it's pretty clear that the best spec in 2.0 will again be a tank hybrid--this time with a shield. Meep meep.

 

4 hard hitting abilities sounds awesome until you look at 2.0 health problems and also remember that crit rate in infiltration is going to be pretty sad in 2.0.

 

Besides in terms of total time to do that, PTs can and still will hit you that hard that quickly.

[MiaRB]

The assassin been nerfed threads are a bit early.

 

not really. threads should just clearly say that inf/decep spec shadows/assassins have been completly nerfed out of PVP.

 

as for KC/Darkness based hybrids.... you are right, changes just have made those the ONLY viable specs, not only for rateds but for normal WZs as well.

 

oh and remember KC/Darkness are getting buffed next PTS patch, so you'll never be forced starved in PVP. will also most likly be getting a little armor damage mitigation back before 2.0 goes live.

 

so although 2.0 forces me out of PVP( since i play full inf spec ).. i will get a little bit of satisfaction when 2.0 goes live and all the people gloating about shadow/assassin nerfs finally realize that 2.0 just makes KC/Darkness even more stronger.

[Smashbrother]

4 hard hitting abilities sounds awesome until you look at 2.0 health problems and also remember that crit rate in infiltration is going to be pretty sad in 2.0.

 

Besides in terms of total time to do that, PTs can and still will hit you that hard that quickly.

 

PTs are glass cannons though. I don't know how much more surv they got in 2.0, but they certainly don't have as many ways to live as sins do.

 

But yeah, I dunno why BW changed surging charge and it's discharge around. Like was it seriously a problem? Cause I've never heard anyone complain about dps sins.

[MiaRB]

Its a +60%. So if you have a 32% critical rating and get a +60% crit rating that is about 92%.

 

"Grants 2 charges of Recklessness, which increases the Force critical chance of your direct attacks and heals by 60% and increases the range of Force Lightning to 30 meters. Each time a direct Force ability critically hits or you activate Force Lightning, you lose 1 charge. Lasts 20 seconds."

 

You also according to the skill don't lose a charge for a non-critical hitting attack unless its force lightning. So yeah. Its a great skill. If you have 79% surge.

 

i know how potency works. i was pointing out that it isnt a autocrit skill. its just a flat +60%. so if your base critrate is 10% lower that means your potency charges will not crit 10% more often than now. yes, only lose a charge when a crit happens. but if your 3 stacked breech doesnt crit, you wont have any potency charges up next time you have 3 stacks. so they will be wasted on gimped project/upheavals... or even worse, wasted on a force slow or a stun.

[PlagaNerezza]

It's neat BioWare had the foresight to nerf infiltration before it became a true problem. Anyone playing that spec min/maxed should have probably understood that having four abilities with the potential to crit for 5k+ is problematic. I do wish hybrids weren't the answer, but it's pretty clear that the best spec in 2.0 will again be a tank hybrid--this time with a shield. Meep meep.

 

Yup. Now it will be just 4 damage skills. Maul/Shock/assassinate/thrash to proc.

 

Everything else is CC or defense. With discharge as a throw away. You have to stay out of madness now unless you're going up the tree. That skill tree went from Whirlwind rocks and I get death field? To death field only.

 

You could have done energize with crackling blast before, but lost chain shock, death field and instant whirlwind in the hybrid.

 

You need darkward. Its an amazing skill when combined with the right gear mix.

Edited February 25, 2013 by PlagaNerezza

[foxmob]

I really like deception. they made it much more accessible by not eating the buff with shock, but it's not far off from being a highly competitive melee with 31 into the tree. I guess it's too dependent on crits, but isn't that also true of the darkness/madness hybrid (but for different reasons)? anyway, just make voltaic more of an offensive abil rather than something you do for a proc and the sustained dmg issue should be fixed.

 

I don't have any trouble with snipers in deception, btw. iunno who notomorrow is owning, but I tend to hunt snipers out...kinda like vengeance for my VG, PT and Sent that get torn up by them while trying to melee.

 

edit: the aoe reduction buff deception gets...isn't that the same thing that sents/maras get in the 2nd tier of the middle tree, except the sent/mara buff is constant whereas the deception buff depends on crits? I think that's silly, cuz a sin is just as much in the "muck" as a mara.

 

edit: for 2.0, I haven't played PTS, but looking at it, it seems like deception is supposed to build stacks in order to use an abil that builds stacks in order to get to the point of unleashing the intended attack. that seems a bit much and certainly nerfs the burst potential that they're known for now. no idea how it will actually pan out. as long as stun bubble isn't on every opponent, I'm gonna be happy with any change.

Edited February 25, 2013 by foxmob

[CharterMonkKent]

PTs are glass cannons though. I don't know how much more surv they got in 2.0, but they certainly don't have as many ways to live as sins do.

 

But yeah, I dunno why BW changed surging charge and it's discharge around. Like was it seriously a problem? Cause I've never heard anyone complain about dps sins.

 

this is how I look at it so far...

 

either

1. They wanted to bring sin dps down to that of concealment (maybe to help concealment make rateds?). Instant AOE mezz of oper looks a lot nicer now that insta whirlwind is gone.

 

and/or

2. Prior to these 2.0 changes Waka build didn't require crits to melt a target. You could deathfield, discharge, shock before moving in for melee range, maul/assassinate/low slash/etc (many options depending on situation). Even if 1 of those mid range attacks crit the sin would be in great shape by the time they get into melee. However, more often than not more that one will crit. There are times in wzs on my shadow I will chain 4 crits in a row, we are talking 4-6k even on well geared light/medium armor. I frequently kill people with my shadow strike (maul) before I even need to use spinning strike (assassinate). So what they did was tone this down (too much in my option, but that opinion may change). From that build rotation they have removed deathfield, nerfed discharge in damage and added the need for a stack to use it.

 

and/or

3. They wanted to kill this hybrid burst spec (and most will agree they tried to remove hybrid specs from all ACs)

[PlagaNerezza]

not really. threads should just clearly say that inf/decep spec shadows/assassins have been completly nerfed out of PVP.

 

as for KC/Darkness based hybrids.... you are right, changes just have made those the ONLY viable specs, not only for rateds but for normal WZs as well.

 

oh and remember KC/Darkness are getting buffed next PTS patch, so you'll never be forced starved in PVP. will also most likly be getting a little armor damage mitigation back before 2.0 goes live.

 

so although 2.0 forces me out of PVP( since i play full inf spec ).. i will get a little bit of satisfaction when 2.0 goes live and all the people gloating about shadow/assassin nerfs finally realize that 2.0 just makes KC/Darkness even more stronger.

 

Didn't mean to be rude. I just misread it and thought it was worth clarifying.

 

Deception/inf was never really a good pvp spec. Even if you consider me wrong it was not fixed for very long and frankly, most sins would tell you that it fundamentally lacked the dps other specs in the game produced with a lot more utility. Was it fun? Sure. I dropped Sucktic Slash almost as fast as i could.

 

I do not understand how the top tier skills suck so much.

[MiaRB]

Didn't mean to be rude. I just misread it and thought it was worth clarifying.

 

Deception/inf was never really a good pvp spec. Even if you consider me wrong it was not fixed for very long and frankly, most sins would tell you that it fundamentally lacked the dps other specs in the game produced with a lot more utility. Was it fun? Sure. I dropped Sucktic Slash almost as fast as i could.

 

I do not understand how the top tier skills suck so much.

 

no problem. didnt think you were being rude, was just being a bit more clear on what i was saying.

 

that is what makes these changes so hard to understand. inf/dec specs, while fun to play, were already one of the least wanted DPS PVP spec in the game. but somehow, BW decided that was the spec that needed to be nerfed the most in 2.0.

Edited February 25, 2013 by MiaRB

[Liryc]

You'll not like my 2.0 assassin. Hybrid spec. You'll see me in some sort of tank stance with deceptions survivability and most likely rocking a 19/27 spec.

 

Wow. Whats that going to be...something like 4k instant crits with 5k crits when consuming a force potency charge? (maybe a tad less since you'll have your shield on) You better believe they'll be calling for a nerf. Of course you miss out on FiB, but instacrits will be king.

[PlagaNerezza]

Wow. Whats that going to be...something like 4k instant crits with 5k crits when consuming a force potency charge? (maybe a tad less since you'll have your shield on) You better believe they'll be calling for a nerf. Of course you miss out on FiB, but instacrits will be king.

 

Plus the chance to have it trigger a chain shock. Plus you are synergizing maul's duplicity and its 100% critical hit damage boost through induction, and if you don't have to at all watch your energy in 2.0 your just going to keybind thrash and maul and spam it so that whenever possible you'll maul.

 

So lets say you say 2.0 holds the energy wont matter (highly doubtful) and you want to survive, You could go 15/31 to get entropic field and imposse weakness with magnetism just because you have points to place. Just to ensure when you open on some you are going to OMGWTFWT?

 

Recklessness

Spike (duplicity) Maul, Energize? No?

Thrash

Shock

 

Low Slash (duplicity)

maul

Shock

 

Still have electrocute. dissappear in combat. You've gotten what should be 2-4 massive critical strikes off before the player can react. All from a tank stance all without using your stun. With an ability to just teleport away and dissappear.

 

No offense to smashers, but this sort of single target critical hit bursts represent a significant opportunity for exploitation without any setup require to fire since your going to do the cc move anyways. So just remember.

 

Dark Charge (recklessness)

Energize + Crackling blast. + Chain shock

Duplicity + induction +Imposse Weakness

 

16k? Assassinate to finish. Its going to play like early operatives. Anyone that gets hit by that sort of maul/shock combo that still may have to eat a 4 second stun before using a cc breaker might not be thrilled. Since after that I will likely dissappear to let your resolve cool and reengage you. Still have my defensive mitigation. Who is going to seriously want to 1vs1 that sort of raw critical hitting power?

Edited February 25, 2013 by PlagaNerezza

[CharterMonkKent]

Plus the chance to have it trigger a chain shock. Plus you are synergizing maul's duplicity and its 100% critical hit damage boost through induction, and if you don't have to at all watch your energy in 2.0 your just going to keybind thrash and maul and spam it so that whenever possible you'll maul.

 

So lets say you say 2.0 holds the energy wont matter (highly doubtful) and you want to survive, You could go 15/31 to get entropic field and imposse weakness with magnetism just because you have points to place. Just to ensure when you open on some you are going to OMGWTFWT?

 

Recklessness

Spike (duplicity) Maul, Energize? No?

Thrash

Shock

 

Low Slash (duplicity)

maul

Shock

 

Still have electrocute. dissappear in combat. You've gotten what should be 2-4 massive critical strikes off before the player can react. All from a tank stance all without using your stun. With an ability to just teleport away and dissappear.

 

No offense to smashers, but this sort of single target critical hit bursts represent a significant opportunity for exploitation without any setup require to fire since your going to do the cc move anyways. So just remember.

 

Dark Charge (recklessness)

Energize + Crackling blast. + Chain shock

Duplicity + induction +Imposse Weakness

 

16k? Assassinate to finish. Its going to play like early operatives. Anyone that gets hit by that sort of maul/shock combo that still may have to eat a 4 second stun before using a cc breaker might not be thrilled. Since after that I will likely dissappear to let your resolve cool and reengage you. Still have my defensive mitigation. Who is going to seriously want to 1vs1 that sort of raw critical hitting power?

 

I just started a thread on something similar to this

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=603611

 

http://pts.swtor-spy.com/skill-tree-calculator/jedi-shadow/234/?build=020302031100000000000000000000000322230021112032001022000000000003020000000000000000000000000000&ver=20

[Tankqull]

this is how I look at it so far...

... (and most will agree they tried to remove hybrid specs from all ACs)

 

dont think so - they implemented a really powerfull vanguard/PT hybrid...

[Rylorn]

1. Class unpredictability - hybrids builds.
   
2. Class versatility
   

Cheers.

 

I think that sums up what I like about class builds. No meaningful choices in spec, makes for a boring game. ROCK ON ASSASSINS.

[Monterone]

And yet, 2.0 will bring more hybrids than ever.

 

I can't see myself going for full deception for PvP any more after playing around a while on PTS. Just lost that feeling for Deception, the flow of the rotation. It was beautiful before, and now it's clunky. Shock hits for far less, and proccing a surging charge automatically for 1k damage is supposed to offset that?

 

Madness still has force issues, just like the sorcerer one, and the steep curve on alacrity probably won't allow for huge benefits in force regen, we'll see.

 

Tank + a pick of talents from the 2 dps trees will still be preferred.

Edited February 25, 2013 by Monterone