MorgonKara Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 And that's FINE! It's always a damn wizard. However, that's besides the POINT. I'll reiterate it since this one person keeps conjuring up irrelevant nonsense after irrelevant nonsense. A smuggler, the one you can create, killing not one, but three, dark council members in rather rapid successsin in a straight up fight with no deus ex devices is ridiculous in the confines of the universe. They weren't distracted, on the rag, drunk, old, blind or anything. They drew their Lightsaber in anticipation for an attack from a dude with a blaster and a smart mouth. That is the essence of what I'm trying to say here. I'll give you that one. Although I will say that Legacy could suggest that your Smuggler is exceptional. I know mine has both Force Valor and Force Might. just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorgonKara Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 By crossing the beams, obviously. I thought you said never cross the beams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jandi Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 I'll give you that one. Although I will say that Legacy could suggest that your Smuggler is exceptional. I know mine has both Force Valor and Force Might. just saying. My smuggler can call an orbital bombardment, shoot fire, project debris, choke, use force lightning and... umm... sweep. Those are game mechanics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jandi Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 I thought you said never cross the beams? The chances of the universe imploding are inconsequential next to a giant marshmallow dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 And that's FINE! It's always a damn wizard. However, that's besides the POINT. I'll reiterate it since this one person keeps conjuring up irrelevant nonsense after irrelevant nonsense. A smuggler, the one you can create, killing not one, but three, dark council members in rather rapid successsin in a straight up fight with no deus ex devices is ridiculous in the confines of the universe. They weren't distracted, on the rag, drunk, old, blind or anything. They drew their Lightsaber in anticipation for an attack from a dude with a blaster and a smart mouth. That is the essence of what I'm trying to say here. A top level smuggler by the time of Corellia, and he did it just like many non force users defeated strong Jedi/Sith in the SW universe. EVEN in the movie, Jango Fett killed a high council member with 3-5 shots, Ki-Adi-Mundi put his lightsaber up but got killed quickly by like 4-5 clone troopers. And not just blasters, the smuggler also have other equipments and various methods to attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosmicKat Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 My smuggler can call an orbital bombardment, shoot fire, project debris, choke, use force lightning and... umm... sweep. Those are game mechanics. You would think that in a universe with orbital bombardments, the dudes with the swords would be extinct pretty quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielHex Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Isn't the Emperor like some kind of spirit that possesses host bodies? How you gonna kill a spirit? You don't. NEither does the Jedi. Lord Vitiate has transcended the Corporeal/Tangible reality and exists more of a Galactic Spanning Intelligence, capable of possessing and using bodies to act as his voice rather than his own. No one really knows where his physical body is, but for Lord Scourge, whom guarded him for over three centuries to even be unaware of what Vitiate is, let alone what he looks like, shows a real lack of understanding for all parties in what they're dealing with in the Emperor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorgonKara Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 (edited) My smuggler can call an orbital bombardment, shoot fire, project debris, choke, use force lightning and... umm... sweep. Those are game mechanics. Game mechanics meant to suggest that your Smuggler comes from a Force-user lineage. (and a janitorial one) Edited November 27, 2012 by MorgonKara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosmicKat Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 You don't. NEither does the Jedi. Lord Vitiate has transcended the Corporeal/Tangible reality and exists more of a Galactic Spanning Intelligence, capable of possessing and using bodies to act as his voice rather than his own. No one really knows where his physical body is, but for Lord Scourge, whom guarded him for over three centuries to even be unaware of what Vitiate is, let alone what he looks like, shows a real lack of understanding for all parties in what they're dealing with in the Emperor. So in other words... he's the Eye of Sauron? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Coleman Trebor was a Jedi High Council member but he got killed by Jango with less 6 shots. And he did block the first 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielHex Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 So in other words... he's the Eye of Sauron? More like Melkor/Morgath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 More like Melkor/Morgath Sidious is stronger than him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorgonKara Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 More like Melkor/Morgath ahh yes Morgoth, the dissonance amidst harmony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Again, this nonsense has to stop. In the EU numerous non force users have defeated/killed strong Jedi/Sith. In the movie we saw Jedi council members got killed quickly by blasters. So the game was simply showing the movie/EU had been showing, powerful Force users are strong but not invincible. I'm not sure with the smuggler story but call the most elite agents of the Empire "normal person" surely means he/she didn't pay enough attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenzali Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 (edited) Discussions about "Mary Sue" never get anywhere. "Mary Sue" has no definition anymore - it's simply a word people throw around to describe anything they dislike or perceive as unoriginal. I find it a bit ridiculous to criticize a story as "Mary Sue" for having a hero. Same with having Force (or magical) powers. Is Frodo a Mary Sue? Is Harry Potter a Mary Sue? Is any story with a hero Mary Sue? What about Beowulf, etc.? It might be possible to take this discussion seriously if you said something like "The Jedi Knight is lacking meaningful character flaws" but that would be debunked since it depends on how you roleplay your character. Edited November 27, 2012 by Jenzali Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senden Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Lol chapter 4, I think the WoW servers will close down before EA invest that sort of money into the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Discussions about "Mary Sue" never get anywhere. "Mary Sue" has no definition anymore - it's simply a word people throw around to describe anything they dislike or perceive as unoriginal. I find it a bit ridiculous to criticize a story as "Mary Sue" for having a hero. Same with having Force (or magical) powers. Is Frodo a Mary Sue? Is Harry Potter a Mary Sue? Is any story with a hero Mary Sue? What about Beowulf, etc.? It might be possible to take this discussion seriously if you said something like "The Jedi Knight is lacking meaningful character flaws" but that would be debunked since it depends on how you roleplay your character. I think Mary Sue is A character who had too much "hero traits", the law of the story's universe would break for him/her, almost never have any big setback, and people he/she react all like him/her for no reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jandi Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 y but call the most elite agents of the Empire "normal person" surely means he/she didn't pay enough attention. The Agent gets insta-killed by Jadus wihtout the ability to even defend yourself if you trash talk him when you meet him and that's the most reasonable outcome. I don't know why you keep bringing up irrelevant scenarios like with Jango. The Jedi was obviously anticipating an attack from Dooku and was taken off guard by Jango. I also don't understand your anger. I have nothing against non-force users. I prefer to play my BH and Smuggler but it just doesn't make sense to me to be able to do the things you can do. If they can't kill a smuggler with no special training then what is the point? I mean, the Agent is TRAINED to kill Jedi so yeah, that's not quite the same scenario as with a smuggler. The smuggler isn't some elite operative, he/she is just a privateer, a hired gun with a lot of skill to be sure, but skill doesn't equate magic, the force does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jandi Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 I think Mary Sue is A character who had too much "hero traits", the law of the story's universe would break for him/her, almost never have any big setback, and people he/she react all like him/her for no reason. You can be the greatest saint, putting mother Theresa to shame, as a smuggler. Everything always works out. The only people who even remotely dislike you as a smuggler are the antagonists, and even they respect you. So, again, what's the problem again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 The Agent gets insta-killed by Jadus wihtout the ability to even defend yourself if you trash talk him when you meet him and that's the most reasonable outcome. I don't know why you keep bringing up irrelevant scenarios like with Jango. The Jedi was obviously anticipating an attack from Dooku and was taken off guard by Jango. I also don't understand your anger. I have nothing against non-force users. I prefer to play my BH and Smuggler but it just doesn't make sense to me to be able to do the things you can do. If they can't kill a smuggler with no special training then what is the point? I mean, the Agent is TRAINED to kill Jedi so yeah, that's not quite the same scenario as with a smuggler. The smuggler isn't some elite operative, he/she is just a privateer, a hired gun with a lot of skill to be sure, but skill doesn't equate magic, the force does. No I picked that decision, he shocked you to a coma, but at that time 1. The agent just became the Cipher, had not experienced those operations to become even stronger. 2. He/she didn't have much knowledge of Jedi/Sith at that time. Just like Ventress got 1 shot by Dooku the first time but improved later because she was aware of the Force Lightning. 3. Publicly attack the superior is surely a treason, it's different than refuse to kneel before him. He was able to block the first 2 shots, so it's no longer ambush, but a third shot still hit him and more shots killed him. Again the character is a top level smuggler like the BH, he/she also had his/her companion alongside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 (edited) You can be the greatest saint, putting mother Theresa to shame, as a smuggler. Everything always works out. The only people who even remotely dislike you as a smuggler are the antagonists, and even they respect you. So, again, what's the problem again? I didn't play the smuggler so I don't know the quality of the story well, maybe it's bad like you said. From the 4 Empire classes I've played, they are not Sue, not even the Sith Inquisitor which has the worst story. I just don't agree with powerful Sith Lords could not be defeated by elite non Force users. Edited November 27, 2012 by Slowpokeking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jandi Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 No I picked that decision, he shocked you to a coma, but at that time 1. The agent just became the Cipher, had not experienced those operations to become even stronger. 2. He/she didn't have much knowledge of Jedi/Sith at that time. Just like Ventress got 1 shot by Dooku the first time but improved later because she was aware of the Force Lightning. 3. Publicly attack the superior is surely a treason, it's different than refuse to kneel before him. You are fully trained to kill Jedi at that time. so saying "not much knowledge" is just plain dumb. You keep making up facts and random examples that are irrelevant due to completely different circumstances. It's pathetic and I can't be bothered with you anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jandi Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 I just don't agree with powerful Sith Lords could not be defeated by elite non Force users. I DON'T AGREE EITHER! It's the CIRCUMSTANCES of the act that make the DIFFERENCE to everything you keep bringing up. Now you admit to not even knowing what I'm talking about? Why the **** are you even arguing then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 You are fully trained to kill Jedi at that time. so saying "not much knowledge" is just plain dumb. You keep making up facts and random examples that are irrelevant due to completely different circumstances. It's pathetic and I can't be bothered with you anymore. Jedi does not use Force Lightning, thx. You are trained but you haven't really fought/killed many Jedi, experience makes a person stronger, and Jadus is not some random Jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 (edited) I DON'T AGREE EITHER! It's the CIRCUMSTANCES of the act that make the DIFFERENCE to everything you keep bringing up. Now you admit to not even knowing what I'm talking about? Why the **** are you even arguing then? I know the Republic quest chain of Corellia and viewed the Smuggler's info, just could not judge the quality of the story since I didn't play it. He is a top elite who hunt down the Voidwolf and met by the Supreme Chancellor herself. So what's wrong for him to defeat the 3 dark council members? Edited November 27, 2012 by Slowpokeking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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