AP in 1.4 for PvE.

[Kothakk]

Advanced Prototype

•Prototype Flame Thrower: Each stack now causes 20% additional damage. This can stack up to 3 times.

•Stabilized Armor now additionally reduces damage taken from area effects by 15% per point. Damage reduction while stunned has been increased to 15% per point.

 

With the above changes to AP, Im really interested in trying this out for PvE.

 

Would this be a viable option DPS-wise compared to the new Pyro changes?

 

The question comes from someone who has played Shield tech / Pyro since December. I find the new AP changes very appealing (I still think the graphics for Immolate to be the best ingame graphics of an ability).

 

Any experienced AP-PT's that could shed some light on the above question?

 

This is the spec I've been pondering for PvE http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/bounty_hunter/powertech/?embed=1&lock=1#::fef5ef5ef7e3fe7de6f2ef16

 

Any input on a possible rotation considering the new changes?

 

Atm Im geared like this for PvE (Im currently pyro): 285 Accuracy, 235 crit and 285 surge. How would this need to be changed? Im thinking of dropping accuray for more crit as I've read on these boards that my 34.6% tech crit change (ive substracted the 3% from burnout here) will not be sufficient. I have 967 power. And also using BM Eliminator.

 

Is the BM Combat tech the only option for PvE?

 

Any light shed on this would be greatly appriecated.

 

Regards

Kothakk

Edited September 13, 2012 by Kothakk

[INIne_IBreaker]

The only problem you'll come across is uptime DPS in some cases for ops but that is it. Pyro and AP have always been viable for PvE and they will continue to be after 1.4 hits.

 

With the lower stack x3 PFT at 60% vs x5 PFT at 50%, it will be substantially easier to maximize damage with less work more often. With that said, TheOpf's AP guide has a solid rotation I think will be the standard anyway because of the 15 seconds we have to wait for flamethrower to get off cooldown.

 

For PvE specs, you don't have to take Stabilized Armor or any damage debuff. I find it much more useful having 2 points in Hitman but what you posted certainly is the blueprint for maximizing PvE DPS.

 

Gear wise I'm too lazy to change over mods to the BM Combat Tech set and I do not think it will improve potential DPS by much at all. It looks like you have your stats on target but a little more crit and surge can be helpful if you can manage it.

Edited September 13, 2012 by INIne_IBreaker

[Kothakk]

The only problem you'll come across is uptime DPS in some cases for ops but that is it. Pyro and AP have always been viable for PvE and they will continue to be after 1.4 hits.

 

With the lower stack x3 PFT at 60% vs x5 PFT at 50%, it will be substantially easier to maximize damage with less work more often. With that said, TheOpf's AP guide has a solid rotation I think will be the standard anyway because of the 15 seconds we have to wait for flamethrower to get off cooldown.

 

For PvE specs, you don't have to take Stabilized Armor or any damage debuff. I find it much more useful having 2 points in Hitman but what you posted certainly is the blueprint for maximizing PvE DPS.

 

Gear wise I'm too lazy to change over mods to the BM Combat Tech set and I do not think it will improve potential DPS by much at all. It looks like you have your stats on target but a little more crit and surge can be helpful if you can manage it.

 

Thanks for the input.

 

Im just wondering if the need for that much accuracy is needed for a railshot that you only do once every 15 seconds. Hmm I will just have to do some testing later on

[Suryi]

Uptime-wise AP is favored post 1.4 I think because now they have the same skillset >10m range with the difference that AP has HO; so if anything an AP will get in DPS range faster then Pyro. The problem is (still) wether or not AP can outdps Pyro. Sure they're both viable but if Pyro does more and you're doing progression raiding, well, that kind of takes AP out.

 

TheOpf mentions that AP is only 10% (close to that) behind Pyro which fits with the numbers I got while parsing AP vs Pyro (1.7k vs 1.9k) note that I didn't use CT set bonus for AP. Now when I did that parse I remember using Flamethrower off-CD even if it didn't have 5 stacks (most of the times it had 4); after playing my VG on pts and parsing AP it was (no suprise here really) very easy to have the 3 stacks ready every 15 seconds. Bottom line here is that not only will you be able to use Flamethrower off-CD but it will always be on 3 stacks. Add to that how it will deal 10% more damage and I think we may have a winner.

 

Still need 1.4 on live so I can parse but it kind of looks promising with mobility AND dps going in favor of AP. Yay, different buttons to presssss

[nDjiin]

If I continue to use my PT as my main, I will be using AP (Assuming they go ahead and make the Pyro tree worthless). My only issue is the amount of mods / enhancements I will need to swap out -as I was stacking a lot of power (for the DoTs on the pyro build).

 

Can anyone give me an idea of how much crit I will need to be stacking to make the AP build effective?

[DacRycar]

Can anyone give me an idea of how much crit I will need to be stacking to make the AP build effective?

 

Same as before: aim for 25-30%, surge around 75% or more. Augment for Aim.

[INIne_IBreaker]

TheOpf mentions that AP is only 10% (close to that) behind Pyro which fits with the numbers I got while parsing AP vs Pyro (1.7k vs 1.9k) note that I didn't use CT set bonus for AP.

 

Those are exactly the numbers I am parsing on the Operations dummy. Makes me wonder if we are missing something with our rotations.

[Suryi]

Always a possibility on account of not playing AP that much But in 1.4 AP rotation will be much smoother and easier with only 3 stacks to build. Can't wait to start parsing

[thrakkemarn]

For DPS post-1.4 I'm thinking of running the same AP build for max PVE dps. Maybe drop the point in Hitman for 1 point of Powered Armor, depends on new Operation mechanics.

 

The increased movement speed (flat 15% with 30% more on CD) and the reduction in AoE damage taken just make AP too appealing. Additionally the 60% damage on FT (which will always be up when FT is off CD) should go a LOOONG way towards bridging the gap between AP and Pyro dps.

 

Honestly, even on existing fights in EC, the 30m IM and TD provided a lot of DPS when out of melee range (which happens on every single fight bar none) and allowed a lot of pre-loaded damage on bosses ... even on bosses such as the walker/kephess who have phases of immunity or bombers out of range ... think of all the times you are out of melee!

 

While Pyro might still outdo AP on a dummy, I'm convinced AP will match Pyro on real fights due to additional time on target, and take less damage, due to both having damage reduction and being able to move faster to avoid damage.

 

I too am a little worried about how my current gear will fare as AP though. I think the PvE Combat Tech set will actually be pretty good, as 8% extra RS damage on guaranteed crits will be niice. And I'm running the 285 surge/accuracy split with 235 crit. It should still be a good stat spread. I hope.

[Kothakk]

For DPS post-1.4 I'm thinking of running the same AP build for max PVE dps. Maybe drop the point in Hitman for 1 point of Powered Armor, depends on new Operation mechanics.

 

The increased movement speed (flat 15% with 30% more on CD) and the reduction in AoE damage taken just make AP too appealing. Additionally the 60% damage on FT (which will always be up when FT is off CD) should go a LOOONG way towards bridging the gap between AP and Pyro dps.

 

Honestly, even on existing fights in EC, the 30m IM and TD provided a lot of DPS when out of melee range (which happens on every single fight bar none) and allowed a lot of pre-loaded damage on bosses ... even on bosses such as the walker/kephess who have phases of immunity or bombers out of range ... think of all the times you are out of melee!

 

While Pyro might still outdo AP on a dummy, I'm convinced AP will match Pyro on real fights due to additional time on target, and take less damage, due to both having damage reduction and being able to move faster to avoid damage.

 

I too am a little worried about how my current gear will fare as AP though. I think the PvE Combat Tech set will actually be pretty good, as 8% extra RS damage on guaranteed crits will be niice. And I'm running the 285 surge/accuracy split with 235 crit. It should still be a good stat spread. I hope.

 

Well I was thinking about the BM CT gear for the 0.5 extra sec on stun, 15 sec of reduced CD on your anti CC, and of course the 15% extra crit on your rocket punches.

[Suryi]

I think he means PvE like in the title.

 

PvE CT is better I think with 8% RS on an autocrit that pierces 60% armor as opposed to +15% crit chance on a kinetic attack that gets fully mitigated. Not to mention PvE CT has a mildly useful 2set as opposed to PvP

[Kothakk]

I think he means PvE like in the title.

 

PvE CT is better I think with 8% RS on an autocrit that pierces 60% armor as opposed to +15% crit chance on a kinetic attack that gets fully mitigated. Not to mention PvE CT has a mildly useful 2set as opposed to PvP

 

Hmm, time to use all those rakata pieces for some CT I guess.

[sumuser]

I just re-spec'ed to AP (from pyro) on a whim tonight (was bored). Looks like that was the right move with the IM and TD nerf. The main thing pyro had going for it over my mara was it had so much more versatility... Now a good chunk of that has been taken away. What a stupid move by BW/EA.

 

15m is the lowest IM or TD should be imo. 10m is too short.

Edited September 24, 2012 by sumuser

[-NovalGaraint-]

Dont suppose Suryi has done any new parsing for AP post 1.4 yet!?!?

[thrakkemarn]

I'm still parsing ahead on Pyro, but that's possibly due to a lack of experience with AP.

 

Wish I had time to actually try it out, but I'm 1 of 2 tanks currently in my guild so I am never allowed to DPS

[Suryi]

I did parse AP post 1.4 and got something on the lines of 1.8k if I recall correctly.

 

Sims over at mmo-mechanics.com say that AP with the right set bonus should parse around 1.85k, as opposed to Pyro 8/5/28 which is 1.94k; this is pretty much what I'm getting as well. So sadly Pyro is still the way to go it seems, not only because of the higher DPS but also because the extra mobility of AP doesn't really add any significant uptime in the new content (not sure about last boss though since I haven't gotten to it; haven't really PvEd). In fact, all but the 3rd boss move around and can hinder your 3 stacked PFT

 

All in all, 8/5/28 is the way to go

[Kothakk]

I did parse AP post 1.4 and got something on the lines of 1.8k if I recall correctly.

 

Sims over at mmo-mechanics.com say that AP with the right set bonus should parse around 1.85k, as opposed to Pyro 8/5/28 which is 1.94k; this is pretty much what I'm getting as well. So sadly Pyro is still the way to go it seems, not only because of the higher DPS but also because the extra mobility of AP doesn't really add any significant uptime in the new content (not sure about last boss though since I haven't gotten to it; haven't really PvEd). In fact, all but the 3rd boss move around and can hinder your 3 stacked PFT

 

All in all, 8/5/28 is the way to go

 

Ok, tanks alot mate.

 

[Powrtech]

I Play AP PvE 1.4 with the full bonuses of the PVE CT, it's pretty viable and the time off cooldown you have between flamethrowers is good time for added dps, but this is where i also have a question. In the downtime I have about 5 seconds of free time to use abilities. During this time I usually already have done Rocket Punch and Railshot. Im wondering what else i should do. Flame Burst does about 1-1.2k for me costing 16 heat. Explosive Dart does about 1.3-1.5k damage but it has about a 2-3 seconds activation time, so should I use flame burst for immediate dps or explosive dart for more dps but later? Also i know it's off topic but in pvp with AP i'm getting an average of 8-12 medals per game with no War Hero gear yet. And I know on some fights the movement cancels out effectiveness of Flamethrower, but in most cases for me it hasnt been a problem.