Kophar Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) I sold a single D3 item, for 4-5 bucks. I got the money. Not Blizzard. Actually they did get a deposit fee when you do sell an item, so yeh... blizz is actually making money from your RMAH Edited August 31, 2012 by Kophar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 They made less money than Paypal on this transaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styxx Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 They made less money than Paypal on this transaction. What`s 15 bucks? Nothing. What are 10 million players? Nothing What are 10 million players paying 15 bucks a year? Still nothing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kophar Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) They made less money than Paypal on this transaction. Still made it, again, blizz is making money from you. Not really seeing where you want to go with this but ok, ill leave it as that. Edited August 31, 2012 by Kophar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Ok guys, if you want to believe that Blizzard charging around a cent for 10$ is the worse thing ever, fine. This said, anyone is willing to consider the issue of eventual PW2 in SW, considering the fact that the last DLC by Bio, ''Leviathan'' is ridiculously OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kophar Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) Ok guys, if you want to believe that Blizzard charging around a cent for 10$ is the worse thing ever, fine. This said, anyone is willing to consider the issue of eventual PW2 in SW, considering the fact that the last DLC by Bio, ''Leviathan'' is ridiculously OP. It doesnt matter if its much or not, it is money theyre taking out from you period. I knew you wanted to reach this stage on the conversation where you and some delusional SWTOR "players" still believe that SWTOR F2P is a p2w and not a freemium model. This type of forum posters just shows the lack of knowledgement or information they have on SWTOR. They are here just for the sake of bad mouthing and ruin some other people pleasure on this game, well, at least try. Just ignore them guys, cause they have absolutelly no ideia of what BW has made, his making and will be making out of this game. Im sick of this, from now on will start reporting everyone thats just trolling around in this forums and ignore them. Really tired of this ..... type of players. @BW - Please by the love of god, start banning them from the forums. I wish that F2P would be here cause they would not be paying a sub so they wouldnt be allowed to forum post but since it isnt, please BW, do something about this. Edited August 31, 2012 by Kophar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalaxyStrong Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 GalaxyStrong I understand where you are coming from, but you can't deny that D3 has implemented some controversial designs that make for good discussion. Simply saying it's horrible is not very constructive. Looking past all your dislikes of the game, the point was valid because if the developer is selling items it is basically an unlimited quantity controlled only by how many people are willing to buy, however when the players are selling, especially in an MMO where items get bound if you use them, the dynamic of limitations based on RNG and lockouts still exist. I know, I know.........I just feel so burned by that game but, your right. I'll shut-up about it!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kashley Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) It doesnt matter if its much or not, it is money theyre taking out from you period. I knew you wanted to reach this stage on the conversation where you and some delusional SWTOR "players" still believe that SWTOR F2P is a p2w and not a freemium model. This type of forum posters just shows the lack of knowledgement or information they have on SWTOR. They are here just for the sake of bad mouthing and ruin some other people pleasure on this game, well, at least try. Just ignore them guys, cause they have absolutelly no ideia of what BW has made, his making and will be making out of this game. Im sick of this, from now on will start reporting everyone thats just trolling around in this forums and ignore them. Really tired of this ..... type of players. @BW - Please by the love of god, start banning them from the forums. I wish that F2P would be here cause they would not be paying a sub so they wouldnt be allowed to forum post but since it isnt, please BW, do something about this. Actually.... BW already said they were going to sell gear w/ stats which basically is P2W. It may not be Pay To Face Roll, however it is still a P2W model and with EA at the helm is bound to get out of control really rapidly. Now, normally I wouldnt even bother responding to your commentary on reporting people but this is a general discussion and people talk about general things. I frankly dont give a d*** if you love this game, however other subscribers have the right to be disgruntled with it and should be allowed to talk about it as well as compare it to other games. If you are incapable of handling reading a forum post without it upsetting you to the point of reporting and begging BioWare to ban people, I am sorry but you have bigger issues. If you love this game so much get off the forums and go play the game. BioWare isn't in need of players to come rescue them from critiscism, they are big boys and girls, they can handle it. Edited August 31, 2012 by Kashley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kophar Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Actually.... BW already said they were going to sell gear w/ stats which basically is P2W. It may not be Pay To Face Roll, however it is still a P2W model and with EA at the helm is bound to get out of control really rapidly. Now, normally I wouldnt even bother responding to your commentary on reporting people but this is a general discussion and people talk about general things. I frankly dont give a damn if you love this game, however other subscribers have the right to be disgruntled with it and should be allowed to talk about it as well as compare it to other games. If you are incapable of handling reading a forum post without it upsetting you to the point of reporting and begging BioWare to ban people, I am sorry but you have bigger issues. If you love this game so much get off the forums and go play the game. BioWare isn't in need of players to come rescue them from critiscism, they are big boys and girls, they can handle it. Get your facts right, theyre selling low-middle level gear ONLY, its not end content gear. NO ITS NOT A P2W MODEL. If you want to debate something start getting more info from the devs themselves and reading what they have said in podcasts interviews and whatever before making posts that just shows your ignorance on the issue. /ignore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kashley Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Get your facts right, theyre selling low-middle level gear ONLY, its not end content gear. NO ITS NOT A P2W MODEL. If you want to debate something start getting more info from the devs themselves and reading what they have said in podcasts interviews and whatever before making posts that just shows your ignorance on the issue. /ignore I've been here since beta, been a follower on these forums since 2009, and have watched more podcasts, mmo gaming news, interviews, E3, ComicCon, Penny Arcade interviews then I can ever possibly recall regarding this game. I know what dev post state, and I am WELL informed about this game and everything relating to it. P2W is any game selling gear and frankly, middle level blues still can swing the balance in 10-49 PvP bracket so yea, its P2W. And lulzy at your o so mature /ignore. Jesus. Lmao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandicus Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I've been here since beta, been a follower on these forums since 2009, and have watched more podcasts, mmo gaming news, interviews, E3, ComicCon, Penny Arcade interviews then I can ever possibly recall regarding this game. I know what dev post state, and I am WELL informed about this game and everything relating to it. P2W is any game selling gear and frankly, middle level blues still can swing the balance in 10-49 PvP bracket so yea, its P2W. And lulzy at your o so mature /ignore. Jesus. Lmao. Ok, so you have a different definition of pay 2 win then what most MMO gamers have. It is misinformative to tell other people that the game has p2win when most likely their standards of p2win are differen from yours. Also bolster largely compensates for gear difference in the 10-49 bracket. Twinking isn't very effective in this game partially for that reason. Blues are readily available from normal questing AND crafting provides far better gear without much time investment. Leveling blues in the cash shop are just that, leveling blues for speed leveling to 50. If anyone wants to twink in the pvp 10-49 bracket they're not going to be doing it in leveling blues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soluss Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) Yup. Calling you out on your opinion. Aside from the generalization, and please correct me if I'm wrong, your sub expired and you shouldn't be allowed to post in these forums any longer by rule. Therefore it is not ok for you to share your own opinion here. I, on the other hand, pay monthly to post my opinions and play the game. So... no, you don't have to agree with me, but again I ask the question, as one who has left the game long ago and how has had his sub expired, why are you here? Why do you feel you are still a part of this community? I really didn't really want to bring this up again. But I want everyone to know that your motivations and intent are not quite what they seem. Seemingly, you have not found greener pastures and your obsession with the inadequacies of this game are beyond helpful criticism. Im here, because I enjoyed the game until the game ended. I come here to see if there are any updates. I paid for the product and Im entitled to do so. My obsession with the inadequacies of this game..... They are beyond helpful because it is already too late for BW. They didnt listen to the people in beta, they didnt list to the people at launch. They arent listening now. People are not going to start comming back just because it went F2P. Sure, you might get some that come back just to finish up the class stories...because they are now free. Thats about it. Why do I post? Well because I wanted the game to be a success. I wanted it to be an MMO. It was a good game that ended way too fast. It was a game that launch with bare minimum and got very little post launch support. I still have hopes they change their tune and actually support the game. With dwindling subscribers, that are not comming back, it is relatively unlikely at this point. I was once an avid defender, like yourself. The difference though.... Is I didnt run around the forums stalking people like you did me. I didnt feel the need to "call someone out" on their OPINION. Thats the most idiotic statement that I have seen, on these forums yet. "CALL YOU OUT ON YOUR OPINION" Think about that for a few minutes. If you still dont get it then think about it longer. I signed up and followed this game from DAY ONE. I beta tested this product for a year. I prepurchased 2 copies of the Collectors Edition for this game. I paid for this game for 9 months. Did I criticize it? I sure did. Because I wanted to see it become better. I sat and hoped for good updating and it never came. I then realized it was never comming and cancelled my sub. I gave this company my support. I fail to see why you need to "call me out on my opinion" Who the hell do you think you are? Edited August 31, 2012 by Soluss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayshuba Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) Band aid? yeah, say that to DDO and LOTRO Someone inevitably always brings this up. As a long time shareholder of Time-Warner (parent of WB) let me enlighten you further. Turbine was forced into sale by their investors because they weren't making money to begin with. If it wasn't for the $47 million investment round a few years prior to the sale they wouldn't have survived. Since the acquisition, they may be doing better (as in not losing as much money) but you will find it interesting that the ONLY division of TW losing money is the games division (-17% and -11% in the last two years respectively). Put another way, if Turbine was making a million a month before the acquisition with monthly expenses $2.5 million and they doubled their revenue to $2 million a month with F2P and maintained expenses at $2.5 million, they are still losing money, just not as much. Most people just hear the "we doubled our revenue" and assume things are completely rosy. They are not. So, Turbine is not the run away success everyone thinks it is, even though as a TW shareholder I really wish it was. Truth is, most F2P titles are barely getting by. If they do turn a profit, it is a small one. That is probably the best that EA may be able to achieve, but I seriously doubt it will be much more than that. As a result, when EA's lofty expectations (yet again) of 3 million players on F2P is not met, support for this title will pretty much go into maintenance mode. Edited August 31, 2012 by Wayshuba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Someone inevitably always brings this up. As a long time shareholder of Time-Warner (parent of WB) let me enlighten you further. Turbine was forced into sale by their investors because they weren't making money to begin with. If it wasn't for the $47 million investment round a few years prior to the sale they wouldn't have survived. Since the acquisition, they may be doing better (as in not losing as much money) but you will find it interesting that the ONLY division of TW losing money is the games division (-17% and -11% in the last two years respectively). That's the thing, though: the F2P model (in all of its various incarnations) has an unfairly tarnished reputation among MMO players because historically, MMOs only switched to F2P after they had already failed. If those products continue to fail after instituting F2P, or if they manage only to eke out a barely-breaking-even existence, then that shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. But it also doesn't follow that F2P is a priori proof that a game is bound for mediocrity, forever. The F2P model may, in fact, be the future for MMOs in general. We live in very volatile times after all, and particularly with respect to tech/entertainment industries. The fact is that Turbine may have not turned their company into a success with F2P, but it's pretty clear that F2P saved them to the extent that they could be saved. Likewise, I don't think any rational observer believes that F2P will turn SWTOR into the WoW-beating-behemoth it was originally hoped to be, but F2P may very well breathe life into this game for years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 No one here is a bit concerned about the fact that Bioware seems to be quite willing to release extremely OP skills and weapons in their DLCs ? I mean, Leviathan Dominate skill is not overpowered. It's almost erotically game killing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandicus Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) No one here is a bit concerned about the fact that Bioware seems to be quite willing to release extremely OP skills and weapons in their DLCs ? I mean, Leviathan Dominate skill is not overpowered. It's almost erotically game killing. Unless I'm wrong the Leviathan DLC skills didn't make it into multiplayer right? Not sure what your point here is, Bioware's single player games are always horribly imbalanced. DA:O, possibly to make a magic immune character on gear alone with something like a 60% dodge rate. DA:A, possible to make a magic immune character with 100% dodge rate with gear alone. Highest difficulty when you're completely invincible? Its a breeze. Edited August 31, 2012 by Vandicus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 No one here is a bit concerned about the fact that Bioware seems to be quite willing to release extremely OP skills and weapons in their DLCs ? I mean, Leviathan Dominate skill is not overpowered. It's almost erotically game killing. I have no idea what you're talking about, honestly. But hey, it took me like two weeks to figure out what the hell people were talking about when they referred to "MoP." Seriously, MMO players are too fond of abstruse acronyms and terminology. (And I'm just as guilty as anyone else.) All I can say is that, if the DLC you're referencing is for a single-player game, then it's not necessarily suggestive of what Bioware will do with the cash shop in an MMO. There will always be a spectre of pay-2-win in any cash-shop MMO, but in my experience most of them handle the matter pretty carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Dominate allow you to mind control ennemy. When fully buffed, it make even the hardest missions on hardest settings a breeze. This is really P2W. When you MC a brute, buff its damage by over 50% and send him crashing other Reavers troops, that's quite hilarious looking and quite imbalanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandicus Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Dominate allow you to mind control ennemy. When fully buffed, it make even the hardest missions on hardest settings a breeze. This is really P2W. When you MC a brute, buff its damage by over 50% and send him crashing other Reavers troops, that's quite hilarious looking and quite imbalanced. Bioware has a history of ridiculously imbalanced single player games. These development teams are separate from the SWTOR ones. Your point here is..... BTW Its not p2win if its singleplayer, any more than including a difficulty setting bar on a single player game is p2win because you bought a game that had a difficulty bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nagidar Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) Yep. Good old Canderous has been pretty strong from the word go, based on what I've heard about other servers. I picked Canderous months ago because I liked the character in KoTOR; I guess a lot of other people did the same. Another hearty yep. I don't understand MMO players' fetish for high subscriber numbers. It's one thing to complain that your server is deserted, because a lack of people on your server can influence your play experience -- but why should you care about the game's sub numbers? Enjoy the game or don't; stay or don't. You're not a stock holder just because you bought a subscription, and although SWTOR certainly has flaws (many, many flaws), and although SWTOR is most certainly not a WoW-style success, there's no reason to believe that the game will shut down any time soon. You should care about the numbers if you enjoy this game, if those numbers drop too much, they will no longer be able to financially support this game and will shut the servers down. Edited August 31, 2012 by Nagidar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOULCASTER Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 You should care about the numbers if you enjoy this game, if those numbers drop too much, they will no longer be able to financially support this game and will shut the servers down. I wish we were that lucky. I can haz SWG back now? Ya know, the good star wars MMOs. K thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 You should care about the numbers if you enjoy this game, if those numbers drop too much, they will no longer be able to financially support this game and will shut the servers down. There's caring and then there's caring. Yes, if you're enjoying the game, any news that presages a game shutdown should concern you. But on a day-to-day basis? I don't understand the seemingly endless fascination on the part of the forum-going population with sub numbers, both verified and wildly speculated. To use an analogy: I enjoy my cable TV service too. It would make me sad if it went away, but I don't keep one eye fixed on the financials for my cable company. I suspect most MMO gamers pay much more attention to the often obscure inner workings of their favorite MMO developers' business than they pay attention to the inner workings of any other business that provides them a product or service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nagidar Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 There's caring and then there's caring. Yes, if you're enjoying the game, any news that presages a game shutdown should concern you. But on a day-to-day basis? I don't understand the seemingly endless fascination on the part of the forum-going population with sub numbers, both verified and wildly speculated. To use an analogy: I enjoy my cable TV service too. It would make me sad if it went away, but I don't keep one eye fixed on the financials for my cable company. I suspect most MMO gamers pay much more attention to the often obscure inner workings of their favorite MMO developers' business than they pay attention to the inner workings of any other business that provides them a product or service. When the numbers drop drastically like this, especially considering how much this game cost to make, you start getting into bad territory, if they feel they cannot make up for the budget and maintenance costs, it will get shut down, that's why people are becoming concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) When the numbers drop drastically like this, especially considering how much this game cost to make, you start getting into bad territory, if they feel they cannot make up for the budget and maintenance costs, it will get shut down, that's why people are becoming concerned. Yes, of course. But people have been speculating about SWTOR's sub numbers pretty much from day one. Now, in this case, it seems that the doomsaying contingent of the subscriber-number brigade was right -- but although hindsight may prove their speculation correct, it still cannot explain their desire to engage in the exercise in the first place. Frankly I've never seen anything like it anywhere else (besides MMO forums). My only point, in any case, was that sub numbers shouldn't interfere with your enjoyment of the game unless the population of your particular server has dropped to discouraging levels. Edited August 31, 2012 by Invictos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayshuba Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Get your facts right, theyre selling low-middle level gear ONLY, its not end content gear. NO ITS NOT A P2W MODEL. If you want to debate something start getting more info from the devs themselves and reading what they have said in podcasts interviews and whatever before making posts that just shows your ignorance on the issue. /ignore Notice they haven't said a thing about end game mods, however. Knowing EA, don't be surprised to see Rating 80 mods as a store exclusive. Then they can say they are not selling stated gear, but yet have the best gear in the store. Sorry, but EAs track record for selling cash shop and DLC stuff pretty much points to P2W. They ALWAYS sell the best stuff at extra cost and if they didn't for SWTOR, then it would be an EA first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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