Hydrain Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 The other night in General a couple people were saying that commandos are getting a new ability that is suppose to balance them in pvp out a lot and dish out some serious damage. Has anyone head anything about this? If you haven't, is there any ability that you could think of that could throw commando dps back into the game? For the longest time people have asked for an interrupt and a interrupt free Full Auto, I feel that would be a step in the right direction. Also, if they made it so that Reactive shield would also make you immune to grapples & knockbacks that would be a nice way to balance us out too. What do you guys think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchangelLBC Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Hold the Line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSideTOR Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Hold the Line would be awesome, and go a long way to help us in PVP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchangelLBC Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Hold the Line would be awesome, and go a long way to help us in PVP. I feel this point needs to be make early and often until BW wises up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoomazir Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 The other night in General a couple people were saying that commandos are getting a new ability... Link? Also, it is true? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaoskyx Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 HtL would be great, and I'd also really like a snare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaceen Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 HtL would be great, and I'd also really like a snare. Cover Fire and Sweltering Heat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSideTOR Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Cover Fire and Sweltering Heat Ok let me rephrase his question for him, We'd like a snare that doesn't rely on a random chance proc. Vanguards get a talented 100% chance to proc it. The snare on Full Auto in the Gunnery tree is downright stupid. You have to stand still for the duration of FA so even if the snare procs for a couple of seconds, the enemy is still moving towards you. If your reply is going to be "well you knock them back when they close the gap" now you've given them a full bar of resolve, good luck staying alive while trying to cast Grav Rounds. You'll be interrupted into oblivion by any non brain-dead player and have no way to get away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaceen Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Ok let me rephrase his question for him, We'd like a snare that doesn't rely on a random chance proc. Vanguards get a talented 100% chance to proc it. The snare on Full Auto in the Gunnery tree is downright stupid. You have to stand still for the duration of FA so even if the snare procs for a couple of seconds, the enemy is still moving towards you. If your reply is going to be "well you knock them back when they close the gap" now you've given them a full bar of resolve, good luck staying alive while trying to cast Grav Rounds. You'll be interrupted into oblivion by any non brain-dead player and have no way to get away.that's all well and good, but i wasn't giving some snarky reply or even making any sort of argument whatsoever, just giving information. he said he really wished we had a snare; i merely pointed out that we have 2 (and i even forgot to include concussion charge, so that's three). anything beyond that, i can't say what he did or didn't mean, or how i feel about it, and i don't know why you would assume what my reply would be considering how little i posted as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaoskyx Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) that's all well and good, but i wasn't giving some snarky reply or even making any sort of argument whatsoever, just giving information. he said he really wished we had a snare; i merely pointed out that we have 2 (and i even forgot to include concussion charge, so that's three). anything beyond that, i can't say what he did or didn't mean, or how i feel about it, and i don't know why you would assume what my reply would be considering how little i posted as well. Why so defensive? Anyway, DarkSideTOR's correct, I'd like a reliable, instant snare that doesn't fill resolve. Edited August 26, 2012 by Chaoskyx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchangelLBC Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Cover Fire and Sweltering Heat He means a baseline snare like Consulars and Sentinels get (smugglers get a baseline ROOT). Covering Fire is actually pretty terrible, but then gunnery is pretty terrible for PVP. Sweltering Heat is a little RNG based because we can't get a guaranteed proc on Plasma Cell. Concussion Charge is unfortunately on the resolve bar (and the snare is short lived compared to the cool down). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaceen Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) Why so defensive? Anyway, DarkSideTOR's correct, I'd like a reliable, instant snare that doesn't fill resolve. um... i wasn't being defensive? i was merely explaining my post (as i'm having to do again... a lot gets lost through text. it's really not a big deal) but now that people have explained their points, i can comment, and i agree to an extent. given that the purpose is keeping melee away from us, instead of a snare, i would rather have a root. and i think cover fire should be a root as well as it's pretty useless except for slowing the ball carrier in hutt ball. i can't see the logic behind rooting oneself only to slow another person down. i think with the cover mechanic for gunslingers, the developers felt that they were rooted in place more than commandos and that's why they gave their knockback a root mechanic (and a baseline root) and ours a snare. i still think that ours should benefit from a root (or, as ArchangelLBC said, a longer snare), since we're very stationary as well. we don't have to go into cover to use our abilities, but we still have to stay rooted in place and cast our basic bread and butter skills. and gunnery has no method of kiting whatsoever. i also think leap immunity of some kind or an escape should be given to commandos. snares and roots don't do much good when someone just leaps to you. smugglers can at least dirty kick and run away with an increased speed boost. the knockback on stockstrike is actually a hindrance since it's quite useless on its own and fills resolve. as far as vanguard's 100% sweltering heat, i think it's used entirely different from commandos. ours is used as a kiting tool, theirs is used as an anti-escape considering that theirs is only 100% within 10m and they get the most benefit from their dps within 4-10m (along with having a grapple and a leap, they're not concerned with escaping). Edited August 27, 2012 by oaceen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchangelLBC Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 but now that people have explained their points, i can comment, and i agree to an extent. given that the purpose is keeping melee away from us, instead of a snare, i would rather have a root. and i think cover fire should be a root as well as it's pretty useless except for slowing the ball carrier in hutt ball. i can't see the logic behind rooting oneself only to slow another person down. i think with the cover mechanic for gunslingers, the developers felt that they were rooted in place more than commandos and that's why they gave their knockback a root mechanic (and a baseline root) and ours a snare. i still think that ours should benefit from a root (or, as ArchangelLBC said, a longer snare), since we're very stationary as well. we don't have to go into cover to use our abilities, but we still have to stay rooted in place and cast our basic bread and butter skills. and gunnery has no method of kiting whatsoever. I agree with this 100%. Cover fire SHOULD be a root and we should also be given a baseline root, and I also think the snare on Concussion Charge should be a root (or at least talented to a root). It speaks volumes though that at this point I would very gladly just take a baseline snare. Gunslinger is an example of a ranged turret done RIGHT because while in cover they can't be leapt to or interrupted, and have roots to keep people at range. i also think leap immunity of some kind or an escape should be given to commandos. snares and roots don't do much good when someone just leaps to you. smugglers can at least dirty kick and run away with an increased speed boost. the knockback on stockstrike is actually a hindrance since it's quite useless on its own and fills resolve. Yep I agree with this as well, which is why I keep asking for a version of Hold the Line high in the Gunnery tree. The commando version should make us immune to leaps and interrupts (NOT movement controlling effects though so we can still be rooted) and still give the speed boost so it can form as an escape ability. 8 seconds of leap/interrupt immunity every 30 seconds will still be more tactical than a Sniper's to reflect our (arguably) better mobility, but it will give us the opportunity to get our setup done unmolested in preparation of the burst (8 seconds is long enough for three grav rounds AND a full auto). as far as vanguard's 100% sweltering heat, i think it's used entirely different from commandos. ours is used as a kiting tool, theirs is used as an anti-escape considering that theirs is only 100% within 10m and they get the most benefit from their dps within 4-10m (along with having a grapple and a leap, they're not concerned with escaping). Well here's the thing. Roots and Snares are both kiting tools to keep enemies away, and anti-kiting tools to keep enemies in melee range and if you look at the tools some of the classes get (especially the melee range classes) a pattern starts to emerge. Sentinels are pretty much restricted to melee range outside of one ability. They get a baseline snare, and their leap roots for two seconds allowing follow at least follow up ability. In Watchman their roots are the biggest part of their damage and of course those keep going even as distance is created, and their leap is 0m min range and on a shorter cool down so they can close any kind of distance created every 12 seconds. Combat requires them to stay in range to keep their damage up so they can spec into a 1 second longer root on leap, a 3 second root on their one channeled ability, and a 3 second root on a 10m ranged ability so they're really good at anti-kiting. Focus spec of course has the second leap (I don't know that much about this spec since I haven't played it). Infiltration shadows need to be in melee range for a lot of their stuff so they get access to a spammable 15s CD incapacitate. Hybrid and Balance shadows, along with Vanguards, have quite a lot of abilities as a major part of their rotation that are in the 10m range so they don't need to stay right on their targets so they only really need snares which both classes have access to (baseline snare for Shadows and the best talented snare in the game for Vanguards). I'm pretty sure this applies to DPS operatives as well actually but I admittedly know less about their class. Finally both Sniper's and Sages are meant to keep the enemy at range so they get the roots and snares to keep the enemy there. Sages can then run away with force speed and Sniper's have the aforementioned utility. In all cases the utility of these classes vis a vis movement impairing effects is directly related to the need for them to keep their enemies at range. The more leeway they have the lesser extent of the tools they have. It's commando that is really glaring in this aspect as the one ability they get to keep enemies at range is really bad at it and is on a 30s baseline cooldown vs 15s on snares and leaps given to other classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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