MrGrizzly Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 People ARE the issue. If you don't love/like this game it's okay. Find the game you do love/like and put all your money, effort and heart there. Life is too short to have these first world problem rants and debates on why you hate game X but keep playing and paying because you WANT to like it. This is the way the game is...Bioware isn't going to change it over vocal ranting. This is a business for them and they have a bottom line that they need to worry about in order to get a return on investment. That means they are going to do what is most likely to get them the best return on their investment. That's what they are SUPPOSED to be doing. It's okay if the game doesn't do it for you or you don't like the direction Bioware is going with it. Right now you have so many other options to check out to see if there is a better game out there for YOU. And if you change your mind later or the direction of TOR goes a way that you feel is more in line with your desires, you can come back. This isn't life or death, it's just a choice you make about how you spend your precious free time. You have all the power in this situation; embrace it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackardin Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) Actually i'm a CPA Accountant who retired at 42 after investing in China's demand for resources back in 2001. I know a great deal more than your articulate way of saying a great deal while actually saying nothing other than to attempt to insult others as a means of denegrating their arguement. Your post shows absolutely no indication that you are either educated or experienced. No you are not. You are a noxious cube on a message board.....and you should know better then to make wild accusations with no data to back them up. .....and I'm batman btw. ;p Edited August 2, 2012 by Blackardin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Perhaps it is the devs that are responsible. What I mean is, take EVE Online for instance. It's a niche game that would only appeal to a certain group of people How does that relate? I get the impression that Bioware tried hard too appeal to every corner of the MMO genre: a grind for PVP gear for the hardcore players, voice overs for the "oooooo shiney" crowd, and an insanely easy single player mode for the casual gamer. However, trying to appease all, while have a game with unaddressed bugs, shallow gameplay etc, you will alienate everyone. Really, you can't blame the people completely. The people didn't put in a rail shooter masquerading as space combat. The people didn't decide to make the bulk of your gaming experience corridors and set paths. The people didn't demand to have all the class stories revolve around the same on or two themes. The people didn't fail to deliver promised fixes and added content. The people didn't ship the game with three pvp warzones with in inability to choose what you wanted to play. The people didn't decide to include seperate pvp gear with the expertise stat. The people didn't decide to put armors in the game that look straight out of an Elder Scrolls game. The people didn't decide to ignore everything that made KOTOR great and sell out for a quick buck. Cant argue with facts ^^ Though there are some here who will try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorellianWannabe Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Been 20 here, and I can verify that there has been a very steep downward spiral in the player base. Back then people were far more knowledgeable, had degrees and experience in the particular fields that they were speaking of in relation to the game. They were far more qualified, far more respectful, far more reasonable. Today, they are just angry drama queens that ramble on about things they know very little about and fire off angry conjecture as if it were viable. The worst part is their inability to see how unreasonable and uniformed they actually are, "I want an alternate universe of lifelike proportions for the cost of 1/3 of my morning coffee, and I'll show you how to do it." LOL Let's see- that wouldn't have anything to do with the complete failure of this generation finally aging enough to be able to play these games would it? Spoiled kids become spoiled man-children. Face it, millenials (or whatever cute label they have) are the worst generation yet and they're infesting the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) No you are not. You are a noxious cube on a message board.....and you should know better then to make wild accusations with no data to back them up. .....and I'm batman btw. ;p Wouldnt suprise me in the slightest, a caped crusader fighting a losing cause. Edited August 2, 2012 by NoxiousAlby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrGrizzly Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 .....and I'm batman btw. ;p Okay that literally made me LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorellianWannabe Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Case in point. Knows nothing about marketing, finance, or game design so randomly pulls something from his small knowledge base and attempts to reason based on that. In short, he is correct, but all the educated, experienced "clap-trappers" are wrong. LOL So if the game still had 1.7 million subs or had even grown it would still have gone f2p since that's the future? Why wasn't the game sold that way in Dec if it's such a good model and one that companies are foolish not to adopt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrGrizzly Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 So if the game still had 1.7 million subs or had even grown it would still have gone f2p since that's the future? Why wasn't the game sold that way in Dec if it's such a good model and one that companies are foolish not to adopt? If your question is sincere: I would say probably because even six months ago the f2p model was just starting to play out and a game and a company that started developing infrastructure for a sub model wasn't about to go to their investors and say "Sorry but we have to hold off deployment while we re-tool the game, payment systems and support to have a f2p model in addition to the sub model". They made a good chunk of money of those will (and are still willing) to stay on the sub model and now they are realizing there is probably more money to be had by adding the F2P model. If you like the sub model, stay in the sub model. If you don't want the stuff in the sub model, play the game for free. How is this bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidpop Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) If all this is true then explain why EVE-Online has a stable community around 350K-400K subscribers for 8 years. And exception to the rule is not an answer. Because CCP is doing what MMO devs should do, make the game you want to make, not the game you think gonna get the most subs, you cant please everyone so there is no point in trying. Edited August 2, 2012 by davidpop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agamemnon- Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Because CCP is doing what MMO devs should do, make the game you want to make, not the game you think gonna get the most subs, you cant please everyone so there is no point in trying. Yes, I agree. You also stated your point a bit more clearly than I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 really ?? is that why there are still people playing the first MMOs like UO and AC1 ? Don't make up reasons, just accept the fact that SWTOR failed big time, and it is admitted by EA. Oh and, never blame the customer for a ****** meal. Ever heard of over-marketing a bad product ? People get frustrated and feel cheated by companies. That's why disappointment turns into hate. Before you come up with such conclusions, learn to search threads from different pages on these forums. You will see why this "precious" game failed, they deserved this for continuously lying to people with fake promises. Cannot be happier lol. The thing is though, and this is what you can't understand is that the game isn't a ****** meal. I know you think it is, but I don't. I'm not saying it's perfect but I think it's definitely a great game that I have fun playing. Also I didn't make the game, so all of you are not my customers. I can post whatever opinions I want about the horde. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) Perhaps it is the devs that are responsible. What I mean is, take EVE Online for instance. It's a niche game that would only appeal to a certain group of people How does that relate? I get the impression that Bioware tried hard too appeal to every corner of the MMO genre: a grind for PVP gear for the hardcore players, voice overs for the "oooooo shiney" crowd, and an insanely easy single player mode for the casual gamer. However, trying to appease all, while have a game with unaddressed bugs, shallow gameplay etc, you will alienate everyone. Really, you can't blame the people completely. The people didn't put in a rail shooter masquerading as space combat. The people didn't decide to make the bulk of your gaming experience corridors and set paths. The people didn't demand to have all the class stories revolve around the same on or two themes. The people didn't fail to deliver promised fixes and added content. The people didn't ship the game with three pvp warzones with in inability to choose what you wanted to play. The people didn't decide to include seperate pvp gear with the expertise stat. The people didn't decide to put armors in the game that look straight out of an Elder Scrolls game. The people didn't decide to ignore everything that made KOTOR great and sell out for a quick buck. I hear what you are saying and I agree. I definitely don't think the people are the only problem, but I think play a larger role than they think in many of the problems with MMO's at this time. Edited August 2, 2012 by spacerobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agamemnon- Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 I hear what you are saying and I agree. I definitely don't think the people are the only problem, but I think play a larger role than they think in many of the problems with MMO's at this time. As posters above have alluded to; sometimes you just have to pick a segment of the population and go with them. You cannot blame the playerbase because you decided to make a game to try to appeal to everyone, a game filled with too many turn offs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 Why isn't everyone gone then? If this game is so bad and it failed what is everyone still doing here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTHC Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Why isn't everyone gone then? If this game is so bad and it failed what is everyone still doing here? Over 2,000,000 boxes sold. Some unknown number of free-to-15 accounts tried. "Over 500,000" but under 1,000,000 subscribers. "Everyone" here is the minority. There's always the niche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agamemnon- Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Why isn't everyone gone then? If this game is so bad and it failed what is everyone still doing here? The fact they have bled subs to the point that EA is going to implement F2P only 8 months after release would show that "everyone" is not still here. Besides, it is a forum, and on a forum people will voice their opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Why isn't everyone gone then? If this game is so bad and it failed what is everyone still doing here? The remainder are either happy with the game as it is or those waiting and hoping that BW would fix what has been alluded to as being broken and willing to give BW time to deliver on their promises. But the announcement of F2P has players questioning whether anything will be fixed & promises delivered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 The remainder are either happy with the game as it is or those waiting and hoping that BW would fix what has been alluded to as being broken and willing to give BW time to deliver on their promises. But the announcement of F2P has players questioning whether anything will be fixed & promises delivered. I'm both happy and waiting to see what comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbenomix Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 The fact they have bled subs to the point that EA is going to implement F2P only 8 months after release would show that "everyone" is not still here. Besides, it is a forum, and on a forum people will voice their opinions. i agree completely...which is why this abusrd f2p system will not change anything....real gamers want the full features not the ***** *** nerfed mode of swtor... we all kno free mode is gona be really limited....... instead of bleeding subs at 15 make IT CHEAPER and still give evryon everything....... ppl who thought 15 was too much will still LEAVE...... becuae what u give them for free is not enough ppl are still gona want the full access...in which case they gota pay up which clearly wasnt working for this game seeing as how there was massive departures of player bfore year one concluded....f2p gains nothing but may lose everything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agamemnon- Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 promises delivered. In a nutshell, why the people aren't the sole problem (not even a large problem). EA/Bioware just failed to deliver the product they said they would. Not the fault of the people. A consumer will hold a company responsible if there are legitimate problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 i agree completely...which is why this abusrd f2p system will not change anything....real gamers want the full features not the ***** *** nerfed mode of swtor... we all kno free mode is gona be really limited....... instead of bleeding subs at 15 make IT CHEAPER and still give evryone everything....... ppl who thought 15 was too much will still LEAVE...... becuae what u give them for free is not enough ppl are still gona want the full access...in which case they gota pay up which clearly wasnt working for this game seeing as how there was massive departures of player bfore year one concluded....f2p gains nothing but may lose everything I talked to two people I work with that played SWTOR at launch and dropped their subs. (Not that two people mean anything on this scale), but both said that they will definitely be playing again when it goes F2P. Both liked the game but with all the other monthly subs they were balancing, Hulu, netflix, web hosting etc. They just couldn't take on another sub. They are hoping they sell quest content packs similar to LOTRO. So they can pay as the play without a monthly sub commitment. My point is that if a lot more people feel that way this could turn out not so bad for all of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Corew Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Why isn't everyone gone then? If this game is so bad and it failed what is everyone still doing here? I wouldn't be suprised if less then half the playerbase have heard the news yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 In a nutshell, why the people aren't the sole problem (not even a large problem). EA/Bioware just failed to deliver the product they said they would. Not the fault of the people. A consumer will hold a company responsible if there are legitimate problems. What did they not deliver? In all seriousness I would like to know what you are thinking on this. Obviously full 3d space combat isn't in, swoop racing and pazaak, but what else was supposed to go in that hasn't so far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerobot Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) Just to clarify I am not saying the game is totally perfect and people have no reason to criticize it. There are things I go back and forth on with this game. One thing that bothers me is that it does feel claustrophobic. In my mind the big reason for that is that there is no open planet to traverse zone to zone with a continued flow. BUT how could it be since we are visiting different planets? So I like the ability to visit so many planets, but I also think that because of that everything needs to be instanced with makes it all tight and claustrophobic. I'm hoping in the future they add a giant planet that is made up of a bunch of zones that are joined together to give it more of an open world feel. It's not perfect, but it isn't a failure either. Edited August 2, 2012 by spacerobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feeblezak Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 This game had one of the worst communities i have ever seen outside of the RP servers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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