DPS MERCS and SORC GO AWAY

[Macabrae]

I am seeing ALOT more Mercs, in fact, I see more Mercs now days then PT actually. I asked a friend about it who plays both and (he is playing his merc and does very well) he told me alot are going Pyro on the Merc side for DPS cause of it being mostly Ranged. Ialso see many Sorc in WZ and just about everyone does extremely well in WZ.

[Never_Hesitate]

I have a degree in psychology and human behavior. So ty for the advice, but i don't need it.

 

I'm just not looking to make friends on the internet.

 

No, one cares.

And if you're not looking to make friends, then don't go there.

[BurnsTwoThree]

Sounds more like a "They killed me in PvP, so I am mad"

How? I think the point of the OP is more along the lines of "They didn't kill anything, caused us to lose and I am mad"

 

Not sure you fully understood the topic.

[Occu_lus]

Well you're using a different font which is similar to the ones that the CMs use to stand out and get the attention of other players. You are participating in most conversations telling people you are the best, telling them "L2P" instead of just ignoring these threads and moving on with your life. You refuse to even attempt to be constructive.

It seems pretty important to you that the entire community knows that you have achieved a high rating otherwise I doubt you would repeat that over and over again.

So let me rephrase the question:

Why is it so important to you that everyone knows that you have accomplished something in SWTOR?

 

BTW

Most of what is stated in these forums is not representing the game balance - the sample is too small and most of the threads are based on negative experiences some players have made.

Why is it so hard for you to accept their opinions?

[Maxkardinal]

I have a degree in psychology and human behavior. So ty for the advice, but i don't need it.

 

I'm just not looking to make friends on the internet.

 

Then you must know that before consulting practice psychologists should use services of their collegs. And you also should know why.

 

And of course you must know that your words says alot more to a people who have a degree in psuchology.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Maxkardinal

[Dmasterr]

Why is it so hard for you to accept their opinions?

 

I have no problem accepting other players opinions.

 

I do have a problem when they state them as facts, and start a whining crusade based on them in an attempt to force Bioware's hand.

 

Because as you previously have seen, whining works..... regardless if you are right or not.

 

Think of me as someone who does, damage control... and reality checks.

[Never_Hesitate]

I have no problem accepting other players opinions.

 

I do have a problem when they state them as facts, and start a whining crusade based on them in an attempt to force Bioware's hand.

 

Because as you previously have seen, whining works..... regardless if you are right or not.

 

Think of me as someone who does, damage control... and reality checks.

 

And we have a problem with your attitude of:

"I'm the best. Everybody else L2P.

There are no issues with this game."

[Dmasterr]

And we have a problem with your attitude of:

"I'm the best. Everybody else L2P.

There are no issues with this game."

 

Don't associate yourself with everybody else. There are plenty of other good players.

 

And the game has issues, but nowhere close to the extent forum criers are suggesting. And said issues are not insurmountable.

 

And i don't see how my attitude has any bearing upon game mechanics.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Dmasterr

[Helig]

I have a degree in psychology and human behavior. So ty for the advice, but i don't need it.

 

I'm just not looking to make friends on the internet.

 

Bachelor isn't a degree worth mentioning.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Helig

[Never_Hesitate]

Don't associate yourself with everybody else. There are plenty of other good players.

 

And the game has issues, but nowhere close to the extent forum criers are suggesting. And said issues are not insurmountable.

 

I don't consider myself a skilled player and as this is my first MMO I still have to L2P but to understand the game mechanics and to see what is broken, you don't need to be the most skilled player you just have to have common sense.

 

And i don't see how my attitude has any bearing upon game mechanics.

 

Your attitude does produce a lot of hate against you, even if your point was right people will not take you serious.

[Dmasterr]

I don't consider myself a skilled player and as this is my first MMO I still have to L2P but to understand the game mechanics and to see what is broken, you don't need to be the most skilled player you just have to have common sense.

Common sense is often wrong by definition because it is based on knowledge already acquired, and used in situation where there are many unknowns. But true, you don't need to be the most skilled player, because that requires you to put said knowledge of game mechanics into practice. But you still require that knowledge.

Your attitude does produce a lot of hate against you,

And that is relevant to game mechanics..... how?

even if your point was right people will not take you serious.

That is entirely their problem.

[SwordofSodan]

Bioware should just revert everything back to pre 1.2 and DPS Mercs/Sorcerers would be viable in pvp again. This is a result of past nerf whining, mostly about "1 button grav round/tracer missile spam" whines from pre 1.2. This will get a lot worse as time go's on with other classes as well, as long as kids continue to whine while developers continue to listen and then act.

[Never_Hesitate]

And that is relevant to game mechanics..... how?

 

Where did I say it's relecant to the game mechanics?

 

My intention was to tell you:

If you're just here to tell others they're noobs, their thoughts are worth nothing and who disagrees with you is automatically wrong because, you're the overlord, go back to the game and don't visit the forums again, we don't need such people here.

[Never_Hesitate]

Bioware should just revert everything back to pre 1.2 and DPS Mercs/Sorcerers would be viable in pvp again. This is a result of past nerf whining, mostly about "1 button grav round/tracer missile spam" whines from pre 1.2. This will get a lot worse as time go's on with other classes as well, as long as kids continue to whine while developers continue to listen and then act.

 

Yes, they were op then, so were the sorc and then bioware overnerfed them.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Never_Hesitate

[Maxkardinal]

Common sense is often wrong by definition because it is based on knowledge already acquired, and used in situation where there are many unknowns. But true, you don't need to be the most skilled player, because that requires you to put said knowledge of game mechanics into practice. But you still require that knowledge.

 

You do realise that such statement shatters all what you have said on this forums about classes ballance in team fights, don't you?

 

Thats funny indeed!

Edited July 11, 2012 by Maxkardinal

[Dmasterr]

You do realise that such statement shatters all what you have said on this forums about classes ballance in team fights, don't you?

 

 

Why?

 

5char

[lpsmash]

Solo queue normal WZ are very serious business. No fun allowed, you can't play what class you want or his mom is going to ground you.

 

and lol at that guy who writes in yellow and argue in most threads he posts in, keep it up, buddy! someday, you'll be the very best of them all

Edited July 11, 2012 by lpsmash

[Occu_lus]

Because as you previously have seen, whining works..... regardless if you are right or not.

 

The "good players" are like 3-5% of the subscribers. There is loads of terrible players playing this game. However, they are the majority, those people generate the revenue. If BW does not keep those players happy they will quit, regardless if the changes are justifyable or not. You should know that.

 

Think of me as someone who does, damage control... and reality checks.

You are not doing any damage control. You are just as insignificant as pretty much everyone in this forum. BW cares about the majority, not the aforementioned 3-5%. To BW you are no more than any of these whiners, you are 1 in 1.2m subscribers with a slightly higher pvp rating, that's about it. I don't get why you think your opinion counts in any way whatsoever. The majority generates the revenue, not you. Don't let your rating get to your head.

This is not meant to be insulting, it is just supposed to give you a reality check.

 

Like Helig said before: "[bY]ou're basing your thesis on subjective perception and the preconception that it is absolutely objective."[/b]

 

Best example for that is your statement about your team being the best in Europe. There is no data suggesting that the players on TOFN are better than other PvPer on French or German servers. How is that an objective thesis? Pretty much on every server there are 2-3 guilds that are dominating the servers and the casuals are pretty much only feeding them. Over and over again. That's how guilds currently get that high ratings. The rating system does not work properly and that's why 2.3k rated teams play against 1.3k rated teams multiple times. They get hardly any points for a win, however, that does not make them the best! They are just playing more often.

 

Also I would really like to see a screenshot of your setup, just to prove that you are not class stacking (and you are not just defending nodes) either as that would shatter your entire argumentation.

[Maxkardinal]

Why?

 

5char

 

You deny arguments, based on subjective opinion by using your subjective opinion as a proving force.

 

You use common sense to fill your subjective opinion with power of objectivity, and then state that common sense is wrong by definition.

 

And you asking why it shatters foundtion of your words?

Edited July 11, 2012 by Maxkardinal

[Dmasterr]

You deny arguments, based on subjective opinion by using your subjective opinion as a proving force.

.

People ratings and achievements are not opinions.

 

Game mechanics and class limitations are not opinions. Player skill can not violate game mechanics, and all players are subjected to the same game mechanics.

You use common sense to fill your subjective opinion with power of objectivity, and then state that common sense is wrong by definition.

 

I don't rely on common sense for anything. I deal with reality as it is, and will change my mind, and correct my stance when proven wrong.

 

Sadly, not everyone changes his mind when confronted with reality and his statements /ideas /etc are wrong.

 

Several times players said (think was in another thread) that class x can not get high rating or is unfit for high level pvp, and that is the reason they can not get out of 1200 rating or no rating at all.

 

I gave examples that proved them wrong. They did not change their mind, but instead came up with excuses.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Dmasterr

[Darth_Philar]

People ratings and achievements are not opinions.

 

Game mechanics and class limitations are not opinions. Player skill can not violate game mechanics, and all players are subjected to the same game mechanics.

 

 

I don't rely on common sense for anything. I deal with reality as it is, and will change my mind, and correct my stance when proven wrong.

 

Sadly, not everyone changes his mind when confronted with reality and his statements /ideas /etc are wrong.

 

Several times players said (think was in another thread) that class x can not get high rating or is unfit for high level pvp, and that is the reason they can not get out of 1200 rating or no rating at all.

 

I gave examples that proved them wrong. They did not change their mind, but instead came up with excuses.

 

Two problems with your argument there:

1. The argument that it is impossible to reach high rankings was not being made by the majority of the people but by a few hyperbolic outliers. The actual argument was that it is much more difficult to achieve high rankings as a particular class. You responded to an argument that was not really being made (a strawman logical fallacy).

 

2. Taking some examples of exceptional players succeeding is an example of cherry picking, another logical fallacy. It also distracts from the actual argument again (making it a red herring logical fallacy).

 

Is it possible to succeed playing with an underpowered class? Yes.

Does that make it ok to leave them underpowered? No.

[Maxkardinal]

I don't rely on common sense for anything. I deal with reality as it is, and will change my mind, and correct my stance when proven wrong.

 

I don't have good enough English language knowledge to start writing appropriate answer, and making you see where you wrong isn't worthy goal to use google tranlater that often.

 

You contradict yourself too oftem from post to post. Is your purpose to "look" right no matter what, or you just can't stant when someone thnks you are wrong, i don't know. And don't care.

 

You are most likely good player but the art of argumentation isn't your strongest.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Maxkardinal

[Jaiyne]

Here's your sign Bioware.

[ArchangelLBC]

I agree with OP for Mercs/Commandos in terms of ranked warzones. All of you join me in boycotting them until we're extinct in Rateds. Then maybe BW will finally show us some utility love, and we can come out of nowhere and crush people.

 

 

Give gunnery hold the line, make charged bolts an instant cast with a 2s cooldown. Make talent specced concussion charge and Full Auto apply roots instead of slows.

 

Those changes would make Merc/Commando a real force to be reckoned with in competitive PVP.

[Dmasterr]

Two problems with your argument there:

1. The argument that it is impossible to reach high rankings was not being made by the majority of the people but by a few hyperbolic outliers. The actual argument was that it is much more difficult to achieve high rankings as a particular class. You responded to an argument that was not really being made (a strawman logical fallacy).

Different classes have a different skill curve required to play to their maximum capability. True.

2. Taking some examples of exceptional players succeeding is an example of cherry picking, another logical fallacy. It also distracts from the actual argument again (making it a red herring logical fallacy).

Are those players able to transcend class limitation within game mechanics? No.

Is it possible to succeed playing with an underpowered class? Yes.

Does that make it ok to leave them underpowered? No.

 

Class power is measured at class potential, not an arbitrary level on the skill curve attained by a random number of players possessing a random level of skill

 

You have a problem with class skill curve. AKA class performance when handled by average players. And it is impossible to balance a game around that.

 

"You" should start threads similar to "class x is to hard to play properly compared to class y" , and not threads regarding game balance.