MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) Tank companions really need a way to get health back out of combat, and fast. As it is, they take far too much damage to really be useful, save healing them yourself. No matter how fast you kill the target or how well yourself or the companion is geared, their health just plummets super fast. Perhaps make your self heal, heal them up many times faster than it does yourself. Or give them out of combat health regen that brings their health to full in a couple second. The problem isnt that they are dying to a single enemy. It is that the player is forced to either 1. heal them manually using healing abilities during combat, 2. dismiss/let them die and resummon them, 3. using your out of combat self heal or 4. mount up and dismount to bring their health to full. Hitting 3 or more enemies without doing one of these methods, means a dead companion. Edited July 7, 2012 by MouseNoFour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 On my 50's, whose tank companions are very well geared, their tank companions take almost as much damage as a companion and character at mid level with just mission reward for gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyvan Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I play a sith sorc healer and if my comp is geared properly i never have trouble with him dying. I also play a sniper and have had to let Kaliyo die a couple times, but I just use my out of combat health regen after combat and she heals up super fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) I play a sith sorc healer and if my comp is geared properly i never have trouble with him dying. I also play a sniper and have had to let Kaliyo die a couple times, but I just use my out of combat health regen after combat and she heals up super fast. Please re-read what was said. Thanks. I specifically stated the problem was not that they were dying, rather that it was inefficient to use them when they just dont self heal without the player doing so. And no, out of combat heal does not ''heal up super fast" as i also have multiple max levels. Here is how - allow your companion to reach 1/3 health, and then use your out of combat heal to bring them back to full. You will notice it takes most of your channel time to do so. Edited July 7, 2012 by MouseNoFour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) Out of combat heal needs to heal them back to full in 1-2 'ticks' or have the companion auto-regen back to full in only a couple seconds whilst out of combat. Anything longer and your better off using a non-tank companion. (healer like Mako/Quinn/Talos/Lokin or damage dealer like Ashara/Gualt/Vette/etc) REMEMBER - We are talking OUT OF COMBAT, meaning BETWEEN the last enemy and the next. If i am engaging a new enemy every 5-10 seconds, the tank companion should be relatively close to full every time - WITHOUT the player's direct help. The fact that it isnt makes using tank companions very inefficient. Edited July 7, 2012 by MouseNoFour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RendValor Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 What keeps you from using Recuperate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) What keeps you from using Recuperate? Notice the word i used. ''Inefficient''. Please remember that word. Here is why it is inefficient. With a damage dealer, your killing the enemies faster than they can deal much damage to you or your companion. You end up killing enemies and taking less than 10% damage yourself or your companion. With a healer, your making your damage the most whilst they keep you at 100%. You end the fight and whilst moving to the next enemy, your brought back to full before engaging them. It isnt as efficient as using a damage dealer, but you last longer due to constant heals. Tank companions require constant attention for them to be useful. Be it heals for them, using stuns and the like to reduce damage they take, and healing them back up after every fight as they simply dont have the abilities and ''intelligence'' that a player does. (moving out of fire etc). Since they dont auto-heal to full between enemies, eventually after 3 or so enemies faced (or packs), without manually bringing them back up, your forced to do so or risk them dying mid fight. Edited July 7, 2012 by MouseNoFour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somethingwow Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Even if that is so, i never really had a problem with that, i have a sage and a sorce, and i have a higher armor rating with them. Khem is the best tanking companion that i have used. but if there main role is tanking, they need to have a higher armor rating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmegaMayhem Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Notice the word i used. ''Inefficient''. Please remember that word. Wow, you have some snotty responses to what is actually a stupid request. It takes less than 10 seconds to fully heal yourself and your companion if HP is low. How impatient can you be? And you have poorly geared your tank if you need to heal them after every fight. Lrn2play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SajmanPeetee Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 What keeps you from using Recuperate? It takes a long time as he says. For whatever reason Recuperate doesn't scale with high prescence, it takes me almost 2 full Recuperates to bring my Qyzen with 451 prescence to full health. I agree with OP, companion out of combat regen needs a buff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 The point being - they need auto-regen or much much faster heal-per-tick for ''recuperate'' or equivalent out of combat heals. It isnt about being impatient. Its about being efficient. You need to think about longer than one, two or three fights. Think of 10 levels worth of time. If you used recuperate for ON AVERAGE 3 seconds of time (meaning 2 seconds for this enemy, 4 seconds for the next) for every single enemy faced - add that up and it will equal a huge amount of time wasted simply healing your companion. Now if you choose to dismiss/re-summon your companion, that is AT MINIMUM 2 seconds. .5 seconds to dismiss and 1.5 seconds to summon. Add that up for every single enemy faced just for a single level, and we are talking longer than a crew mission at mid level. If your using a healer companion, add ~20 mins per level to just stand there doing nothing. That is the equivalent of using a tank companion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThroneOfOP Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) Yeah.. our tanks should have some out of combat self heal so we can be as efficient as example.. Sentinal/Guardian + Doc i don't mind having stimpaks SOLELY for our companions which they can auto use once out of combat I use the Speeder trick but rather have a more efficient way doing it. EDIT: perhaps stimpaks are too cumbersome.. so a super Regen pill would suffice Edited July 7, 2012 by ThroneOfOP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 The speeder trick requires being outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Really ? this is a problem for people, recupe takes to long. real world problems here people take cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 Yeah.. our tanks should have some out of combat self heal so we can be as efficient as example.. Sentinal/Guardian + Doc i don't mind having stimpaks SOLELY for our companions which they can auto use once out of combat I use the Speeder trick but rather have a more efficient way doing it. EDIT: perhaps stimpaks are too cumbersome.. so a super Regen pill would suffice Perhaps have medpacks purely designed for companions, with a cooldown roughly the same length of time it takes to whittle down a tank companion over 3-4 enemy packs. Lets say it takes a minute to mow through 3 packs (just say that it does) so have the cooldown on this 'companion only' medpack being roughly a minute or 45 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 Really ? this is a problem for people, recupe takes to long. real world problems here people take cover. Yes it is a problem. Why? Very few players use tank companions BECAUSE of this problem of keeping them healthy ENOUGH to constantly mow through enemies without having to stop. It is simply easier to use a healer and never bother using any other companion. For example, on my new Mercenary, i leveled ONLY with Mako. Why? Because i think i healed myself in combat maybe 3-4 times level 10-40. And recuperate is almost always used, not to replenish health, but to dissipate heat. Using my newest companion Blizz, means that i either have to keep bringing his health back up BETWEEN ENEMIES constantly or risk him getting too low, dying and having to face whatever is left on my own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Yes it is a problem. Why? Very few players use tank companions BECAUSE of this problem of keeping them healthy ENOUGH to constantly mow through enemies without having to stop. It is simply easier to use a healer and never bother using any other companion. For example, on my new Mercenary, i leveled ONLY with Mako. Why? Because i think i healed myself in combat maybe 3-4 times level 10-40. And recuperate is almost always used, not to replenish health, but to dissipate heat. Using my newest companion Blizz, means that i either have to keep bringing his health back up BETWEEN ENEMIES constantly or risk him getting too low, dying and having to face whatever is left on my own. My god you mean you have tactics defined by the balance you take when choosing companions. /faints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 My god you mean you have tactics defined by the balance you take when choosing companions. /faints. It is all about efficiency. The quicker you can down enemies, and more of them, the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThroneOfOP Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) Really ? this is a problem for people, recupe takes to long. real world problems here people take cover. Well definitely don't want you solving real world problems. How are real world problems gonna be solved if their is no discussion. We are talking about efficiency.. not trying force anything down anybodies throats. Your space concept.. should i throw all your ideas out too? Edited July 7, 2012 by ThroneOfOP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 It is all about efficiency. The quicker you can down enemies, and more of them, the better. Yes your right, so lets redesign companions so this can take effect for efficincy of about ow 20 seconds, how shall we do this. Shall it just be tanks that recoup or all comps, will we cut off our recoup to theres, should we increase there recoup over ours, should we complain when we realise they they recoup faster then us. Or we chose the pros and cons of using specific companions, having better protection whilst fighting means you have to look after that companion more, companions that self heal you dont have to worry about, dps companions share the brunt of the battle with you so when you regen they regen. Like i said, real world problems here people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) Well definitely don't want you solving real world problems. How are real world problems gonna be solved if their is no discussion. We are talking about efficiency.. not trying force anything down anybodies throats. Your space concept.. should i try all your ideas out too? You can do what the hell you want with the topic linked in my sig, as they arnt my ideas, its a compilation of all the space suggestions in one place, even SR said he liked them so fill ye boots tonto. Ow and read my previous reply. Edited July 7, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 You can do what the hell you want with the topic linked in my sig, as they arnt my ideas, its a compilation of all the space suggestions in one place, even SR said he liked them so fill ye boots tonto. Ow and read my previous reply. Im sorry you disagree with a well known problem with tank companions. But no, its a problem for everyone im afraid. Though i dont believe there is a need for damage dealing and healer companions to gain any regeneration or out of combat health replenishment. The main focus is on tanking companions. The ideas i mentioned were only that, ideas. It is by no means a solution to the problem, but by all means you can offer up your opinions and ideas on how best to solve it. Until the problem is addressed, it will continue to a be a problem for every player. And sadly, this problem means to companions we want to use will mostly be the companions the game mechanics force us to use (or suffer an efficiency penalty). It is not bad design, it is just a very minor oversight. A small one at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vojinsa Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 (edited) 1. most outside areas and some inside areas you can use the speeder trick that requires 2 sec. 2. you can dismiss and summon your tank and it requires 1.5 secs. Edited July 7, 2012 by vojinsa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouseNoFour Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 1. most outside areas and some inside areas you can use the speeder trick that requires 2 sec. 2. you can dismiss and summon your tank and it requires 1.5 secs. I have already cited these methods in my original post. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aricus Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Even if that is so, i never really had a problem with that, i have a sage and a sorce, and i have a higher armor rating with them. Khem is the best tanking companion that i have used. but if there main role is tanking, they need to have a higher armor rating. This... Companion tanks need more armor rating that's about it really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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