Why do people feel that everything should be easy to obtain?

[Kailthir]

You know, it is possible that times have changed, and more "casual" players play these games nowadays, and that the companys making these games realise this, and are acting accordingly. It is possible you're in a minority, and you may have to face up to gaming evolution. Has that thought occurred to you? I'm not saying this is the case, but it is possible, no? The fact you had to give an old game as an example of what you have fun doing says alot.

And one other thing, I really wish your type would stop trying to keep the rpg genre to themselves, and realise times change.

 

I disagree. If it was as you say it may be, there wouldn't be a vocal majority all over the place (internet, friends, family, aquaintances, game forums, etc) complaining about the dumbing down of gaming content. Just because something is old dosen't make it irrevelent. I would rather have a late 60's early 70's muscle car over anything they are currently making today. they just built them better back then.

 

Same with games, just because something is newer dosen't mean better. Times change, tis true but, if something isn't broken... don't muck with it. Games need to be challenging else people think they have wasted their money, and get angry. $50-60 is a desent chunk of change coupled with $15 a month fee to play it... it better be a challenge, else there is no reason for me and most people to play the game.

[deathbykarma]

Easy! This is a game and not a job... I work most of the day and have only a couple of hours to play, sometimes none at all... so i don't want to get out from one job to get into another...

 

So you should automatically deserve to get everything in the game? LOL sorry doesnt work that way, if you want free stuff, go hold up a sign infront of wal-mart.

[Knightsire]

I disagree. If it was as you say it may be, there wouldn't be a vocal majority all over the place (internet, friends, family, aquaintances, game forums, etc) complaining about the dumbing down of gaming content. Just because something is old dosen't make it irrevelent. I would rather have a late 60's early 70's muscle car over anything they are currently making today. they just built them better back then.

 

Same with games, just because something is newer dosen't mean better. Times change, tis true but, if something isn't broken... don't muck with it. Games need to be challenging else people think they have wasted their money, and get angry. $50-60 is a desent chunk of change coupled with $15 a month fee to play it... it better be a challenge, else there is no reason for me and most people to play the game.

 

Those 60's and 70's muscle cars don't get the same mileage as the new economy class foreign makes nowadays. People want different things. I understand your opinion, but SWTOR is the MMORPG that made me return to online gaming just because of the fact that I didn't have to grind like I did in DAOC, which is the last MMORPG I played before I finally said forget this insane grind. I never got into WOW. I started on MMORPGs since Ultima Online. Times have changed and for the better I think.

 

SWTOR offers me a great storyline, tolerable grind (in my opinion) at least until end game, and this is the first time I've really gotten into PVP in an MMORPG since the RvR in DAOC. I don't mind a challenge, but grinding/work is not fun. Challenge to me means clever gameplay design that forces you to become a better gamer. I think SWTOR did this for me. The warzones have taught me how to play better since I started.

Edited June 18, 2012 by Knightsire

[Kailthir]

Those 60's and 70's muscle cars don't get the same mileage as the new economy class foreign makes nowadays. People want different things. I understand your opinion, but SWTOR is the MMORPG that made me return to online gaming just because of the fact that I didn't have to grind like I did in DAOC, which is the last MMORPG I played before I finally said forget this insane grind. I never got into WOW. I started on MMORPGs since Ultima Online. Times have changed and for the better I think.

 

SWTOR offers me a great storyline, tolerable grind (in my opinion) at least until end game, and this is the first time I've really gotten into PVP in an MMORPG since the RvR in DAOC. I don't mind a challenge, but grinding/work is not fun. Challenge to me means clever gameplay design that forces you to become a better gamer. I think SWTOR did this for me. The warzones have taught me how to play better since I started.

 

Better gas millage dosen't make it a better sports car. Performance makes it better. Ease of mechanical work, upgradeability and customization, horse power etc. Dodge charger superbee that Richard Petty drove got banned from nascar. Still holds the records. It performed so much better then any other car, better than todays cars. But that is irrevelent. My point is new dosen't mean better.

 

I wasn't talking about grind. Everyone hates grind, but we all know that some grind is necessary. What I am talking about is just content in general. Especially most boss fights. There is really no fear of failing. No adrenilin rush when fighting a mob. No worry at all really. No sense of accomplishment. When everything is easy mode, it feels like you are just going thru the motions. And that feeling leads to unsubbing. Not good for the game at all.

[thomasmeadows]

You are not entitled to everything in a game. You should not be able to get everything in a game. I have everything in this game because it is easy. I also have nothing that makes me unique. Everyone else has the same garbage I have. And as someone with 4 lvl 50's with 90+ days played on all my characters, I don't feel any different than the people we just got full rakata geared last night in HM EV/karagaa.

 

Yes meditating was a dumb time sink. Getting your bodies was a dumb time sink. Which equated to the risk of death which made the game harder. Making sure everything was done perfectly made the game difficult. Else you spend 1-3 hours recovering corpses.

 

Atleast when you played eq you could tell the difference between the fresh 50's and the ones that had time put in the game. In EQ people did not finish all of the high level content until the next expansion was ready to be released. You were unique if you were part of the group that finished all of the high level content before anyone else. There were usually only 1 or 2 guilds that made it to kill all bosses before the next expansion. Each expansion had 3x the number of high end bosses as the previous expansion(atleast for the first 3-4). Star wars announces there expansion with 1 new op? really?

 

EQ had 4 high end ops/raids at launch(nagafan, vox, plane of fear, plane of hate). SWOTR had 2(EP/karagga). EQ added 3 high end raids with the first expansion. SWTOR is adding 1.

 

Nothing makes me feel epically better than anyone else in swtor. Nothing in this game makes me feel proud of what I have. Everything is a /yawn to conquer. I could count on my hand how many people had an item that dropped from each different end game boss in EQ.

 

When the expansion is released and me and 200 other people have HK on launch day. I will still not feel special. It will not be something that is unique. When the other 400 casual players finally get him it will be even less unique.

 

When will swtor add something that only a couple people on the server are able to get thats way cooler than anything else in the game? Thats what swtor is missing. Those items are what make people want to keep playing the game.

 

Should you punish someone who can't spend 40 hours a week playing swtor? no. But you shouldn't reward them for the time they didn't spend playing the game and earning rewards(like when everyone was just given battlemaster gear). After that people were also just "given" high level valor. Now people earn 3x as much valor in war zones as they used to. What about the people that had already grinded 70 levels of valor before the valor nerf? What swtor is doing is punishing the people who worked hard for items. Next patch they will give away war hero gear for nothing and piss off the people who took the time to grind out a set of war hero gear. This way they can run off the current generation of PVPers. Why not just give people bags of war hero when they start pvping?

 

SWTOR needs to analyize there Risk vrs Reward and Grind vrs Reward policies. Honestly this is the least grindy game I have ever played. The dailys in this game are ok, but need more rewards. The way this game works from 1-50 is great and is a great base platform. The high end game and high end pvp is total garbage though in this game. Heroic quest are totally pointless until you reach level 50(the rewards need to be increased on pre lvl 50 heroic flashpoints or people will never do them).

 

People actually need REAL rewards for the legacy system. I mean really for all the grinding you have to do to get to legacy 50. Its ridiculous how lousy the rewards currently are.

Edited June 18, 2012 by thomasmeadows

[Talarchy]

Easy! This is a game and not a job... I work most of the day and have only a couple of hours to play, sometimes none at all... so i don't want to get out from one job to get into another...

 

I'm with you on that one, that's what killed the game for me to be honest.

 

I don't care much about the HK droid companion, but the 3-5 hour raids I just can't stand. I am happy to sit and play a game for 5 hours, but not being stuck playing a game for 5 hours, its not a job ffs.

[Aehgo]

Not that hard to level a 50..can get it done in a week if you just quest..

[thomasmeadows]

I'm with you on that one, that's what killed the game for me to be honest.

 

I don't care much about the HK droid companion, but the 3-5 hour raids I just can't stand. I am happy to sit and play a game for 5 hours, but not being stuck playing a game for 5 hours, its not a job ffs.

 

You were in the wrong guild if any raid you were on took more than 2 hours. Or you just really really sucked. If things go perfect it is less than 1 hour for an operation.

[Razdek]

I'm not trolling, I want to have a serious discussion.

 

For example, the HK-51 companion coming out is probably going to require both a lvl 50 imperial and a lvl republic character on the same legacy to get. People all of a sudden start to complain about how they "don't feel like leveling an opposite faction character" and "Bioware messed this one up I'm quitting". I happen to like the requirement because not everyone is going to get it, it's fun to experience leveling a character on both sides, and it's not another one of those freebies to come in the mail. We have to work for it. People in this game feel they are entitled to get everything that comes out in this game, and if they don't feel like doing it, it becomes "unfair" and "bad business Bioware".

 

I think some people fail to realize that this is not a single player game. You aren't going to get everything handed to you. In MMOs a lot of the successful players have things the other don't because they put in more effort. This isn't even a diffcult requirement anyway. I applaud Bioware for making this awesome companion at least a little difficult to get. I'm not trying to disparage anyone, I'd really like to know why people feel that if they don't like to do something then it shouldn't be a requirement to get a cool companion. I know some people have filled all their charact6er slots but have like a lvl 40, a lvl 20 and six lvl 1-10 characters. You can afford to delete one of them to level a republic guy if you want HK-51. It is your choice whether to fulfill the requirements or not.

 

Can we at least have a somewhat civil discussion for once? I have a feeling it's going to be too much to ask.

 

Congratulations... You like the idea of the cross factuon requirement. But many people dont. I hate the idea. I like one faction.... But im happy to work for my companion. If they want two 50s to meet the requirement that is fine... But why do they have to be on both sides. What difference should it make if i have 2 imps at high level or 1 imp and 1 republic. I still put in the exact same game time and effort... This is biowares way of saying "we screwed over the republic and now we have to force players to play that side to fix the problem." they are trying to be subtle about it by saying its for a reward, but the players arnt stupid.

 

If they want us to play the republic then fix their bad/unimaginitive animations, rubbish looking space ships and overall terribly boring story lines.

[utio]

Not that hard to level a 50..can get it done in a week if you just quest..

 

No you can't.

[Razdek]

No you can't.

 

You can if you have no life, no girlfriend, no job and just plain suck at life in general.

[_Liquid_]

You are not entitled to everything in a game. And as someone with 4 lvl 50's with 90+ days played on all my characters

[/url]

 

Wait...you have 90 days played on a game that has been out for 180 days? That is....interesting. I'm not a math major, so correct me if I'm wrong. You've played an average of 12 hrs a day since the game was released?

 

I, for one, am glad this game does not cater to someone with your playstyle. Unlike you, I don't care about being unique or cool in a mmo. I don't care if someone looks at my character and is impressed or thinks I'm a ******. I log in a couple times a week to shoot the **** with my RL friends while we casually progress through content.

 

If BW ignores people like me, who I believe are the majority, in favor of someone like you who has played 90 days out of 180 then you will be the last one left on the server. Then who is going to look at you and be impressed by your shiny sword of coolness?

Edited June 18, 2012 by _Liquid_

[cool-dude]

Easy! This is a game and not a job... I work most of the day and have only a couple of hours to play, sometimes none at all... so i don't want to get out from one job to get into another...

 

That.

Not everyone can play 24/7

I'm against nerfing the game because of noobs and casual players, but making it more convenient for those who have Jobs and other priorities I'm all for.

Edited June 18, 2012 by cool-dude

[Kanana]

Not easy to obtain, but FUN to obtain.

Slashing a million mobs in the same dailies to grind credits is not so fun... or is it just me who thinks that?

 

You're not alone. Making something "Hard" to obtain by making it not fun to get - which fits most repetitive grinds in game - is wrong.

[PanthersSolo]

Easy! This is a game and not a job... I work most of the day and have only a couple of hours to play, sometimes none at all... so i don't want to get out from one job to get into another...

 

Then dont worry about the new companion. I agree with the OP. Some things in this game should require a little effort. There are not many things that do.

 

I am not complaining about it and I also dont have enough time to obtain the new companion. That just means that others will have it and I wont unless I dedicate some time and effort towards it.

[Razdek]

Then dont worry about the new companion. I agree with the OP. Some things in this game should require a little effort. There are not many things that do.

 

I am not complaining about it and I also dont have enough time to obtain the new companion. That just means that others will have it and I wont unless I dedicate some time and effort towards it.

 

There is a big difference between doing something that requires effort and doing something that requires effort but is also fun. To me having to roll a republic toon is not fun... Yet i am more then happy to put in the same effort and roll two 50s on the imp side. How can you argue against that? It requires the exact same effort... And to me is much more fun.

[Lovia]

Wait...you have 90 days played on a game that has been out for 180 days? That is....interesting. I'm not a math major, so correct me if I'm wrong. You've played an average of 12 hrs a day since the game was released?

 

I, for one, am glad this game does not cater to someone with your playstyle. Unlike you, I don't care about being unique or cool in a mmo. I don't care if someone looks at my character and is impressed or thinks I'm a ******. I log in a couple times a week to shoot the **** with my RL friends while we casually progress through content.

 

If BW ignores people like me, who I believe are the majority, in favor of someone like you who has played 90 days out of 180 then you will be the last one left on the server. Then who is going to look at you and be impressed by your shiny sword of coolness?

 

When will ppl accept that not every game is designed with them specificly in mind?

They didnt design, train simulator for me, i will never buy it ro play it, they didnt design wii-ironing for me, they didnt design platform games for me.

MMO's have content for ppl with the 12h/day play style and they arent designed for the ppl that play wii-ironing and train simulator.

Choose another game if you have to do everything in this game while you OCD yourself to do so and you cant put the time in.

[Razdek]

When will ppl accept that not every game is designed with them specificly in mind?

They didnt design, train simulator for me, i will never buy it ro play it, they didnt design wii-ironing for me, they didnt design platform games for me.

MMO's have content for ppl with the 12h/day play style and they arent designed for the ppl that play wii-ironing and train simulator.

Choose another game if you have to do everything in this game while you OCD yourself to do so and you cant put the time in.

 

Did you stop to think while writing this post that they didnt design thegame for you... The 12 hour a day players? Just a thought.

[_Liquid_]

When will ppl accept that not every game is designed with them specificly in mind?

They didnt design, train simulator for me, i will never buy it ro play it, they didnt design wii-ironing for me, they didnt design platform games for me.

MMO's have content for ppl with the 12h/day play style and they arent designed for the ppl that play wii-ironing and train simulator.

Choose another game if you have to do everything in this game while you OCD yourself to do so and you cant put the time in.

 

The thing is, this game is already designed for people with limited play time. So when will people who want to have the fact that they play 12 hours a day mean something move on to something else? BW wants to make as much money as possible, and catering to the handful of folks who play 12 hours a day isn't where the money's at.

 

There are plenty of other options, but they are becoming more niche as time goes on. Most adult MMO gamers do not have 4 hours a day to play, every day, let alone 12. Come on now. If you want to be Joe Awesome with the Unique Sword of Pwnage go play some niche game. BW clearly isn't rewarding you for 12 hrs a day here.

 

Personally I'm just starting out in life as I am in my late twenties. I am not retired, I am not 13 years old. Everyone I know who plays also works, is married or has a GF, and has other hobbies outside the game. 20 hours a week seems to be about average for us. Luckily BW has designed a game here that presents enough "grind" to make things require a little work but not so much that they exclude a majority of players who want to pay them for their game.

Edited June 18, 2012 by _Liquid_

[Sarfux]

I'm telling you...

 

They should put in an "epic" button after you select your faction! Then if you hit this "epic" button you will be instantly epic and be level 50! Then you can brag to everyone about how awesome you are!!

 

lol

 

Ooorrrrr..people who can't play the game for what it is should just leave. I don't think things in games should be easy. I want to work for something. I don't want it handed to me on a silver platter.

[_Liquid_]

I'm telling you...

 

They should put in an "epic" button after you select your faction! Then if you hit this "epic" button you will be instantly epic and be level 50! Then you can brag to everyone about how awesome you are!!

 

lol

 

Ooorrrrr..people who can't play the game for what it is should just leave. I don't think things in games should be easy. I want to work for something. I don't want it handed to me on a silver platter.

 

As sarcastic as you are being, and as retarded as it is, It would be better than having to spend 12 hours a day at the PC for 6 months straight in an attempt to have an item that identifies you are "elite" so you can run around and be "cool" in an MMO. lol is right. Hilarious actually.

Edited June 18, 2012 by _Liquid_

[TKMaster]

You can if you have no life, no girlfriend, no job and just plain suck at life in general.

 

haters gonna hate

[Razdek]

I'm telling you...

 

They should put in an "epic" button after you select your faction! Then if you hit this "epic" button you will be instantly epic and be level 50! Then you can brag to everyone about how awesome you are!!

 

lol

 

Ooorrrrr..people who can't play the game for what it is should just leave. I don't think things in games should be easy. I want to work for something. I don't want it handed to me on a silver platter.

 

Well that completely missed the point. People arnt asking for handouts or i win buttons... They are asking for realistic expectations for people who have a life.... And unfortunatly for 'hardcore players' like urself... You are now a minority in the game flooded world where the average working joe now plays... Who previously were ousted from games because the elitest community shunned them. Luckily we have just been through a gfc and companies are desperate for money... So to survive they realised tey needed to stop listening too the elitests because they are only a teeny weenie part of the overall community. Sucks to be an elitest nowadays

[_Liquid_]

Well that completely missed the point. People arnt asking for handouts or i win buttons... They are asking for realistic expectations for people who have a life.... And unfortunatly for 'hardcore players' like urself... You are now a minority in the game flooded world where the average working joe now plays... Who previously were ousted from games because the elitest community shunned them. Luckily we have just been through a gfc and companies are desperate for money... So to survive they realised tey needed to stop listening too the elitests because they are only a teeny weenie part of the overall community. Sucks to be an elitest nowadays

 

Absolutely. I am not against people who have more time to play than myself advancing faster. That is life and is part of the game. It will always be a fact of life for me. What I am against is making things so restrictive and so prohibitive based on time that they become impossible for anyone except the 60 hour a week player to accomplish. I understand there are people who want it that way. Luckily for me it makes very little sense from a business perspective.

 

This game has made it so anyone who puts forth a REASONABLE amount of effort can accomplish their goals. Now Johnny Elite doesn't like that because Johnny Elite wants to run around and have us "scrubs" look at him and say wow I wish I could be that cool. Too bad I have to level up my real life today or else I could make 1/100th progress towards being Johnny Elite Jr. Maybe I'll murder my family, quit my job, stock up on mountain dew, and just go for it. It is totally worth it. Then the next scrub JediKnight495 will look at me. Maybe even send me a whisper and say I'm his idol.

 

Seriously though. Apparently BW realizes that this western MMO is full of real life Americans and Europeans who have **** to do. Kudos to them. We don't have to rearrange our lives to advance in this game. End of story. There are plenty of other mmo's to choose from for those who like to do so.

Edited June 18, 2012 by _Liquid_

[utio]

haters gonna hate

 

He has a point though. Anyone playing this game for 12 hours a day should genuinely have a think about their life. It's not healthy.