rotatorkuf Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 (edited) We need to set up a day, that from there on out, we will commit to NOT play mercenary (regardless of how much time we've invested into it, I have about 20+ days played on mine, but i'm ready to make a stand). May 10, 2012, or whichever day ASAP, we completely stop playing our mercenaries as a last ditch effort in hopes that Bioware will notice they're hurting a huge community right now. As it currently stands, they are not responding to any of our sincere threads (where we're not telling them off, or threatening unsub). And after this patch where they don't even acknowledge the current bugs (arsenal barrage, heat sigs), it's looking really grim for mercenaries. Especially the lack of dev involvement in at least trying to make us understand all the changes / hot fixes / 'bugs'. This is probably the only real last stand we have as mercenaries, just to completely shelve away this AC. +1 If you agree (or +1 /5char) Edited May 1, 2012 by rotatorkuf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yazule Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 We need to set up a day, that from there on out, we will commit to NOT play mercenary (regardless of how much time we've invested into it, I have about 20+ days played on mine, but i'm ready to make a stand). May 10, 2012, or whichever day ASAP, we completely stop playing our mercenaries as a last ditch effort in hopes that Bioware will notice they're hurting a huge community right now. As it currently stands, they are not responding to any of our sincere threads (where we're not telling them off, or threatening unsub). And after this patch where they don't even acknowledge the current bugs (arsenal barrage, heat sigs), it's looking really grim for mercenaries. Especially the lack of dev involvement in at least trying to make us understand all the changes / hot fixes / 'bugs'. This is probably the only real last stand we have as mercenaries, just to completely shelve away this AC. +1 If you agree (or +1 /5char) there are plenty of mercs with no other toons. I personally have a raid healing sorc so i rarely play my BH atm unless needed for raid dps for some reason. They are listening, trust me, just because they do not post means nothing just keep up the QQ your broke me's and it will get fixed. fyi either I am a god or my rauders in raid are doing something wrong. I am competing for top dps in raid (and we are on nighmare mode without enrage timers). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuadul Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 fyi either I am a god or my rauders in raid are doing something wrong. I am competing for top dps in raid (and we are on nighmare mode without enrage timers). 2 things; 1. If you're doing nightmare mode you are doing old content and makes any argument about our validity in pve invalid. 2. if you're competing for top dps, yes your other classes are doing it wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cegenaus Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 ive already shelved my merc for my mara. as soon as i get him to 50 it will be bye bye merc until he is fixed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizbanic Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 We need to set up a day, that from there on out, we will commit to NOT play mercenary (regardless of how much time we've invested into it, I have about 20+ days played on mine, but i'm ready to make a stand). May 10, 2012, or whichever day ASAP, we completely stop playing our mercenaries as a last ditch effort in hopes that Bioware will notice they're hurting a huge community right now. As it currently stands, they are not responding to any of our sincere threads (where we're not telling them off, or threatening unsub). And after this patch where they don't even acknowledge the current bugs (arsenal barrage, heat sigs), it's looking really grim for mercenaries. Especially the lack of dev involvement in at least trying to make us understand all the changes / hot fixes / 'bugs'. This is probably the only real last stand we have as mercenaries, just to completely shelve away this AC. +1 If you agree (or +1 /5char) The lack of communication on their part does not mean they have not heard and are not listening. Considering that people make post after post which is full of whining and threats etc... I don't blame them for not responding. You know how tiring that is? I have 3 kids, there are times when one will come ask for something, then he goes off and another comes and asks the same thing, which they already know the response but still try. and then the third. No matter how they answer, you will get someone down the road asking the same question, or not understanding the answer. When you get someone that doesn't see the answer you then get people trolling on that person to use search etc... When it is someone that doesn't understand then you need to go over it a few times so they will understand and in that another question will pop up or just as in the telephone game, the answer will change near the end and just screw the understanding up. Want proof, spend time reading on the boards and you will see it everywhere. I'm glad they haven't answered, they have better things to do then really waste time answering and going over their answers with a fine tooth comb so that everything is understood. Not shelving my merc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yazule Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 (edited) 2 things; 1. If you're doing nightmare mode you are doing old content and makes any argument about our validity in pve invalid. 2. if you're competing for top dps, yes your other classes are doing it wrong. we are doing both old and new content, nighmare mode does not in any way invalidate pve content, there is only one new raid zone after all and people still need recipies from the old zones. Nowhere did I argue for or against our validity in pve, I just made a general statement about my reality, making any point about any argument that did not happen both pompous and egotistical Edited May 1, 2012 by Yazule Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yazule Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 ive already shelved my merc for my mara. as soon as i get him to 50 it will be bye bye merc until he is fixed yay! welcome to the fotm club where you get to change toons every 2 months when they break something. ENJOY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deinoscz Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 (edited) Iam up for this but i dont think more ppl will join. I swiched to my sniper and i got a lot more better dmg untli they fix it i will play only sniper Edited May 1, 2012 by Deinoscz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuadul Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 yay! welcome to the fotm club where you get to change toons every 2 months when they break something. ENJOY! Nothing is broke. Those that bail are the ones not skilled enough to play BH well. Those who are, adapt and overcome. Simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deinoscz Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Nothing is broke. Those that bail are the ones not skilled enough to play BH well. Those who are, adapt and overcome. Simple as that. Yea so we just cant adapt play as weakest class in game really clever NEXT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidkjames Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 (edited) The lack of communication on their part does not mean they have not heard and are not listening. Considering that people make post after post which is full of whining and threats etc... I don't blame them for not responding. You know how tiring that is? I have 3 kids, there are times when one will come ask for something, then he goes off and another comes and asks the same thing, which they already know the response but still try. and then the third. No matter how they answer, you will get someone down the road asking the same question, or not understanding the answer. When you get someone that doesn't see the answer you then get people trolling on that person to use search etc... When it is someone that doesn't understand then you need to go over it a few times so they will understand and in that another question will pop up or just as in the telephone game, the answer will change near the end and just screw the understanding up. Want proof, spend time reading on the boards and you will see it everywhere. I'm glad they haven't answered, they have better things to do then really waste time answering and going over their answers with a fine tooth comb so that everything is understood. Not shelving my merc. But they haven't answered anything, that's the point. And saying nothing is wrong, working as intended is an insult to any person with an IQ of 50. Georg Zoeller usually at least says something hateful and reaffirms how much he hates his job when enough people complain but even he is being quiet on this one. Which tells me 1 or 2 things, either they honestly have no idea what is broken or they know what is broke and they aren't going to fix it. Neither one of those are acceptable and it's why every single Merc should file a /bug report once a day until they give us an official response. Edited May 1, 2012 by solidkjames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuadul Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Yea so we just cant adapt play as weakest class in game really clever NEXT There will always be, numbers wise, a "weakest class" in the game. If there wasn't everyone would do the same dmg and same healing and nothing would be interesting. That's exactly what we don't want, class homogenization. My comment wasn't meant to be clever, just fact. If you're skilled you can and will continue playing a BH healer and continue to see and clear all end-game content this game has to offer. If you're not, then you will get frustrated and go play something with a lower skill cap, or threaten to unsub or what-have-you. Nobody is blaming you, but there are people still playing this class at end game and doing it well. Obviously my point of view is pve and not pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuadul Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 it's why every single Merc should file a /bug report once a day until they give us an official response. Cause all of us acting like children screaming for attention is the answer? No thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidkjames Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Cause all of us acting like children screaming for attention is the answer? No thanks. Or following the advice of SWTOR's very own twitter page. If it's a big enough issue it will be addressed. Flaming and trolling threads does nothing but giving constructive bug posts from a large pool of pvper's and pve raid mercs certainly does. The only children I've seen are the people screaming their going to quit if they don't get their way etc. I'm just telling you, I'm going to be heard, there is a huge difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotatorkuf Posted May 1, 2012 Author Share Posted May 1, 2012 There will always be, numbers wise, a "weakest class" in the game. If there wasn't everyone would do the same dmg and same healing and nothing would be interesting. That's exactly what we don't want, class homogenization. My comment wasn't meant to be clever, just fact. If you're skilled you can and will continue playing a BH healer and continue to see and clear all end-game content this game has to offer. If you're not, then you will get frustrated and go play something with a lower skill cap, or threaten to unsub or what-have-you. Nobody is blaming you, but there are people still playing this class at end game and doing it well. Obviously my point of view is pve and not pvp. i agree with most of this i still think mercenaries are useful, if only because they still provide damage/healing, currently it might require more skill to perform well than other classes, but whatever when it comes to the big picture of things, it's been well documented how lacking the numbers are for mercenaries and group utilty/buffs when it comes to PVE/PVP end game more often than not, in end game content you will be able to complete it, but at the cost of having other classes/players fill in the gaps for your classes lack of production you can also easily come back to my last statement by saying, well, more of than not other players will fill in the gaps for your lack of skill, which is true both ways, BUT there shouldn't be a situation where a group should have to place a priority on what classes to bring in order to efficiently complete end game content, we pay to play, and because we pay them money, we should be able to roll whatever class we want without being subjugated to class prejudices Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diddley Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 (edited) "There is always a weakest class in game" is a fallacy. BW themselves said each class should perform within 5% of each other so it was clearly not their intentions to make mercs this way. They got it wrong with arsenal in the recent patch. Edited May 1, 2012 by Diddley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuadul Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 "There is always a weakest class in game" is a fallacy. each class should perform within 5% of each other How is it a fallacy when the bottom performers of that 5% you mentioned (in a perfect BW game situation), would technically be labelled the worst performing. Min/maxers would still use that as a reson to re-roll if the content was hard enough to warrant such a move. Also, since there is currently NOT the 5% scenario you mentioned my point is valid and still stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macroecon Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Nothing is broke. Those that bail are the ones not skilled enough to play BH well. Those who are, adapt and overcome. Simple as that. This is what is happening. What you failed to understand is that this self selection process then causes further nerfs to the class as the survivors bias class meta averages higher. This process does not end until the best BH players have productivity equal to average Mara/Sent players. At which point the best BH players will have dps about half that of the best Mara/Sent players. Don't believe me? This type of double nerfing is exactly what happened to Concealment Operatives. And it just happened again to Merc Arsenal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gattiman Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Nothing is broke. Those that bail are the ones not skilled enough to play BH well. Those who are, adapt and overcome. Simple as that. Your posts are just aweful. Might as well say "lolz l2p nub" its not constructive and just plain false. I pvp plenty and you know how many arsenal mercs I tear through as a Pyro merc? Pyro merc isn't even a strong build and i can beat a arsenal with full health when I'm at 60%. The tree is garbage and yes it is factually broken. If you had any clue what you are talking about you would know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diddley Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) How is it a fallacy when the bottom performers of that 5% you mentioned (in a perfect BW game situation), would technically be labelled the worst performing. Min/maxers would still use that as a reson to re-roll if the content was hard enough to warrant such a move. Also, since there is currently NOT the 5% scenario you mentioned my point is valid and still stands. Well BW said so, and creating balance is difficult enough without making unbelievably stupid decisions. And the difference isn't 5% is it? Otherwise there would be fluctuations in dps top output between classes. The difference is consistently huge, way bigger than that. Therefore BW got it wrong. Just because they f*cked up several classes in 1.2 (sorcs and marauders included) does not mean they have a different "weakest class" agenda. Edited May 2, 2012 by Diddley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cegenaus Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 yay! welcome to the fotm club where you get to change toons every 2 months when they break something. ENJOY! im sure mara, jugg, and assassin will stay untouched through the end of the year. if not then yay for you since i probably wont be here for that long Nothing is broke. Those that bail are the ones not skilled enough to play BH well. Those who are, adapt and overcome. Simple as that. who are you trying to fool? nerfs and bugs are nerfs and bugs, you cannot deny that. regardless if you are good or bad at said class damage reductions affects all, you may still be good at your class but if your class sucks you arent gonna beat anyone personally im tired of being called bad because people are carried by their class and im working my *** off to stay mediocre. some classes just have more tools and are on better ground than others. if you wanna stay with a bad class then by all means go for it, ill hop on a better class and stay competitive with everyone else whos class didnt get nerfed into unplayability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizbanic Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 But they haven't answered anything, that's the point. And saying nothing is wrong, working as intended is an insult to any person with an IQ of 50. Georg Zoeller usually at least says something hateful and reaffirms how much he hates his job when enough people complain but even he is being quiet on this one. Which tells me 1 or 2 things, either they honestly have no idea what is broken or they know what is broke and they aren't going to fix it. Neither one of those are acceptable and it's why every single Merc should file a /bug report once a day until they give us an official response. You missed it, why bothering answering once, when they know that answer is going to confuse someone and then more questions? Where did they state that it is working as intended, or are you assuming that any lack of answer constitutes a working as intended attitude? 1 or 2 things, you need to exercise that mind of yours a bit, as you said he usually posts with some "I hate my job", did it occur to you that maybe someone higher up said they prefer that he does not post in that style again? Maybe there was some negative feedback concerning this style of posting coming from one of their employees. There could be any or no reason why he has not stated anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrestle Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I retired my Merc and the game. Thank you Tera Online! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gattiman Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 You missed it, why bothering answering once, when they know that answer is going to confuse someone and then more questions? Where did they state that it is working as intended, or are you assuming that any lack of answer constitutes a working as intended attitude? 1 or 2 things, you need to exercise that mind of yours a bit, as you said he usually posts with some "I hate my job", did it occur to you that maybe someone higher up said they prefer that he does not post in that style again? Maybe there was some negative feedback concerning this style of posting coming from one of their employees. There could be any or no reason why he has not stated anything. This is a paid service. When something is very wrong in your service you usually tell your customers. Your logic of a dad talking to children really doesn't fit. Saying nothing to me means a fix is miles away or they don't intend to fix it both make me want to unsubscribe. Saying hey we know there's an issue and we are working on it would atleast tell me a fix is coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidkjames Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 You missed it, why bothering answering once, when they know that answer is going to confuse someone and then more questions? Where did they state that it is working as intended, or are you assuming that any lack of answer constitutes a working as intended attitude? 1 or 2 things, you need to exercise that mind of yours a bit, as you said he usually posts with some "I hate my job", did it occur to you that maybe someone higher up said they prefer that he does not post in that style again? Maybe there was some negative feedback concerning this style of posting coming from one of their employees. There could be any or no reason why he has not stated anything. Actually I am using my mind and offering solutions of how the merc community can be heard. As for have the devs stated anything, if you read the dev tracker and see where they stand on class balance, yes the devs do not think anything is wrong with merc dps and have no intention of looking at it. That is why countless others have provided solid concrete numbers to show that something is not adding up. Thanks for your support and be sure to file your bug report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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