Dharagada Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 To each his own, I suppose. Never played a PT/Vanguard, but having a 50 Commando, I find heat management, in any spec, far easier than rage/fury management. For a Pyro PT (which really is the only spec that has any serious heat issues) it's not hard to manage heat it's just annoying because heat venting is dependent on RNG, so if you don't get procs of rail shot you have to remember to weave in extra rapid shots. 1.2 may actually make things worse in that department but guess have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxdragonragexx Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 We still have camo, it can now be broken on damage (which is still hard to do). It's not a huge nerf at all, it's very minor, especially because many Maras didn't use Phantom. DOTs will take away the stealth. Maybe in premades where there are dedicated healers, it is not such a big deal but pugging relies heavily on escape abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coramac Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Mainly their best attacks are Massacre, Gore, and Force Scream. Take away Gore and their burst takes a massive hit, especially now that Ataru procs are weapon damage. How does Ataru procs doing weapon damage change burst? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitsuo Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 How does Ataru procs doing weapon damage change burst? Because if Gore is down then it hits much less, if Gore is up then it hits much harder opposed to the energy damage one. If you can work around their Gore, Anni will beat Carnage easily Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruxe Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 How does Ataru procs doing weapon damage change burst? Weapon damage is affected by mitigation and shield, where it was previously not. It's actually a significant decrease in DPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dharagada Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 How does Ataru procs doing weapon damage change burst? There afraid that weapon damage will be more easily mitigated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dharagada Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) Flipping a coin to decide which way to start rolling your face on the keyboard isn't a complicated rotation. Let's be reasonable here if anni mara and watchmen sent are face roll then there are no words to describe and ridiculously easy other classes are. Edited March 22, 2012 by Dharagada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixion Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 if they take away that vanish from muraders its a good thing, every class don't realy need a vanish keep it with the rogues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da_krall Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) They'll realize that Anni wasn't buffed, Carnage/Rage was. If they're Anni, 95% will have no clue what they're doing, and a clueless Marauder is the easiest class to kill. If they're Carnage, once I stun/Camo through Gore they will be absolute sitting ducks. If they're Rage, it's the easiest thing in the world to avoid a Smash and hit back. Marauders have a complicated rotation compared to PT Powertechs or Sorcerers (I.E. Reactionary piano playing), and a lot of PvP-ers that I witness cannot handle it. I cant wait for them all to get their so people reliease the MARA.SENT ARE NOT HARD TO PLAY. OMG PRESS BUTTONZ WHAT...HARD..... I know you wish to propagate the myth that these classes are in someway hard to play (which is only true if you have never touched a computer at all and are missing 4 fingers from each hand) so that you can justify the class overpoweredness by saying 'its hard to master - bad ones are really bad only good players can play a mara' and at the same time insinuate that you are infact better than anyone else playing another class because it is 'hard'. You class isnt hard, you are not a better pvper than anyone else, you have an OP class. People who do well with Snipers are good at PvP, everyone else your average. Edited March 22, 2012 by da_krall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coramac Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Because if Gore is down then it hits much less, if Gore is up then it hits much harder opposed to the energy damage one. If you can work around their Gore, Anni will beat Carnage easily /facepalm... You do realize energy damage is mitigated by armor? This changes nothing in terms of damage mitigation.... You do realize you're using a lightsaber and your "weapon damage" is energy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitsuo Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 Flipping a coin to decide which way to start rolling your face on the keyboard isn't a complicated rotation. That's what I understand these new Marauders will be doing, super easy prey My starting rotation is the same Charge>DS>Battering>Rupture>Assault(Or Force Choke depending)>Annihilate. After that I mix in VS's along with my defensive CD's, Offensive CD's, and I keep my Rage above 5 for the next Anni. I hit Ruptures and DS's when they come up and make sure the Ruptures don't clip, BA when I'm 5 rage or under, Smash in AoE, build Fury with SS. I try to coincide 3 stack DS+Rupture+Berserk+Force Choke if I can for extra damage with no chance of it being dispelled. It's not really hard, but it is complicated and changes with each situation. More-so than a lot of the faceroll classes I've played in this game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitsuo Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 /facepalm... You do realize energy damage is mitigated by armor? This changes nothing in terms of damage mitigation.... You do realize you're using a lightsaber and your "weapon damage" is energy? If so then my apologies, I misunderstood the tooltip. Doesn't change that lolGore is easy to work around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da_krall Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 That's what I understand these new Marauders will be doing, super easy prey My starting rotation is the same Charge>DS>Battering>Rupture>Assault(Or Force Choke depending)>Annihilate. After that I mix in VS's along with my defensive CD's, Offensive CD's, and I keep my Rage above 5 for the next Anni. I hit Ruptures and DS's when they come up and make sure the Ruptures don't clip, BA when I'm 5 rage or under, Smash in AoE, build Fury with SS. I try to coincide 3 stack DS+Rupture+Berserk+Force Choke if I can for extra damage with no chance of it being dispelled. It's not really hard, but it is complicated and changes with each situation. More-so than a lot of the faceroll classes I've played in this game Wow really, you mean like ANY OTHER CLASS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AstralProjection Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 How does Ataru procs doing weapon damage change burst? He was saying that losing the ArPen in Carnage/Combat would kill the DPS in the spec - as it is one knockback after the debuff and you lose a chunk of your dps - you can still get off the crit Blade Storm/Scream, but not the Master Strike/Ravage or Blade Rush/Whatever you normally work into the combo. It takes an ArPen debuff to get Carnage/Combat's "big hit" up to 2.5-3.5k. I think what he was thinking was that Ataru Procs doing weapon damage would be hurt even harder by losing the ArPen debuff on your target, but really Force/Weapon damage is mitigated by armor the same way IIRC, it's just that weapon damage is subject to evasion. Marauders/Sentinels are one of the least "bursty" classes in the game, IMO, they just do great steady damage, and tend to get more beastly the longer you leave them alive. I don't think it's too much of an issue because after healers they're probably the most focused class in the game. With a great healer keeping them up they can be pretty insane, though. I don't know how I feel about the "unlimited resource" thing. I can see both sides of the argument there, but I can tell you from playing every class that Marauders seem to run into resource issues more frequently than most of the other classes, and have no resources frontloaded, which is a disadvantage in a lot of situations, though it can be pretty easily overcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitsuo Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) Wow really, you mean like ANY OTHER CLASS. Haha.....sure Edited March 22, 2012 by jitsuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticoccus Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Annihilation/Watchman was not buffed true, but not nerfed either. And the way I see it, it's still going to be more fun to play. Especially due to the 50% snare on inflame finally making it WORTH those two points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoKiei Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Marauders will still perform below Sins/Shadows, which is the real FOTM right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VoidSpectre Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 since when are maras FOTM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coramac Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Annihilation/Watchman was not buffed true, but not nerfed either. And the way I see it, it's still going to be more fun to play. Especially due to the 50% snare on inflame finally making it WORTH those two points. It was buffed. The Force Camo change is great for the spec. Ataru procs should hit harder if devs can be trusted (which I grant you is no certainty). Force got nerfed bad with the change to Inner Focus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitsuo Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 Wow really, you mean like ANY OTHER CLASS. Sorcerers FL spam to get mana up, CL/CD at procs. Use knockbacks and defensive CD's as needed, nothing needs to be managed. PT's hit FB and RP to proc RS, stay below 40% heat. There is managing that needs to be done but nothing needs to be kept track of (besides heat and MAYBE IM) Mercs are lolspam in Assault, now they will have back-up abilities but nothing to keep track of. Sins keep track of HD and their force regain is a pain to work around, but it's still hitting their best buttons when they come up. I will be 100% honest, I'm not familiar with ops/snipes so I can't speak for them. You can play well as a Mara just pressing buttons as they come up. You'll be beaten every time by a Marauder that knows how to manage each dots and combine his best shots as they come up for pseudo burst. In basically every other spec, you don't need to sacrifice using a damaging ability for using a utility due to rage (except maybe Assassin but they're definitely not respeccing), and there are many ability combos that Anni has that other classes do not. I main Anni, alt PT Pyro. I have a lower level Tankasin and a shelved 50 Sorcerer (he was boring). Does this make me an expert on everything? Of course not. But I do know that the reactive abilities are more than any other class. Like I said, not hard, just complicated. Also ITT People who never played Mara but feel they should comment because they know how it works Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruxe Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 It was buffed. The Force Camo change is great for the spec. Ataru procs should hit harder if devs can be trusted (which I grant you is no certainty). Force got nerfed bad with the change to Inner Focus. Annihilation doesn't use Ataru. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VoidSpectre Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 It was buffed. The Force Camo change is great for the spec. Ataru procs should hit harder if devs can be trusted (which I grant you is no certainty). Force got nerfed bad with the change to Inner Focus. ataru form is carnage not annihilation. force camo is 100% now with talents in anni so it got nerfed to 50, and we had a talent to increase predation to 80% speed instead of 50, that is now in carnage. so all in all anni got nerfed a little. i don't know what people are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coramac Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 It takes an ArPen debuff to get Carnage/Combat's "big hit" up to 2.5-3.5k. Burst damage rarely about a "big hit." I think what he was thinking[snip] I know what he was thinking and he was wrong. Marauders/Sentinels are one of the least "bursty" classes in the game, IMO, they just do great steady damage, and tend to get more beastly the longer you leave them alive. I don't think it's too much of an issue because after healers they're probably the most focused class in the game. With a great healer keeping them up they can be pretty insane, though. Well, your opinion about the burst is just flat out wrong. I don't know how I feel about the "unlimited resource" thing. I can see both sides of the argument there, but I can tell you from playing every class that Marauders seem to run into resource issues more frequently than most of the other classes, and have no resources frontloaded, which is a disadvantage in a lot of situations, though it can be pretty easily overcome. It's just different. Overall, it's not better or worse than any other class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jitsuo Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 It was buffed. The Force Camo change is great for the spec. Ataru procs should hit harder if devs can be trusted (which I grant you is no certainty). Force got nerfed bad with the change to Inner Focus. I hate the Force Camo change, I'm neutral to Predation. I probably still won't be taking Seeping Wounds, anything that needs to be slowed gets hit with a CS anyway, which lasts twice as long and has no CD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticoccus Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) Annihilation doesn't use Ataru. Exactly, we use Juyo. And we were the only spec that had force camo damage immunity before. The movement speed buff nerf may cause people to switch however, but I'm fine with 50% personally. Especially seeing as I can now have 2 50% snares, one passive on one of my core skills. Edited March 22, 2012 by Morticoccus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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