Combat Zen Use Question

[Enexemander]

Hello everyone,

 

Simple question: When in Zen with Combat, is the best use to just spam blade rush or should one alternate blade rush and slash?

 

Similarly, I know in pvp to jump in with Precision Slash and use Blade Storm during Combat Trance, but is there a way to reliably get Opportune Attack in there as well?

 

What abilities should I prioritize after the initial burst?

[thepilk]

is there a way to reliably get Opportune Attack in there as well?

 

 

There is no way to control opportune strike. The tooltip is mislabled, its a 30% chance to happen, not 100% as it reads. (the sith maurader version reads the ability properly)

[Bejarid]

Blade Rush spam, I think, is the way to go with Zen; I'd honestly never thought to alternate with Slash, and it's a good theory since it's tooltip reads as higher base damage. However, BR guarantees the Ataro proc, which, in turn, guarantees Combat Trance, and offers the chance for Opportune Attack. The benefits of BR, to me, outweighs what's lost with Slash.

[Mal-Sharran]

Hello everyone,

 

Simple question: When in Zen with Combat, is the best use to just spam blade rush or should one alternate blade rush and slash?

 

Similarly, I know in pvp to jump in with Precision Slash and use Blade Storm during Combat Trance, but is there a way to reliably get Opportune Attack in there as well?

 

What abilities should I prioritize after the initial burst?

 

Ensure you have at least 6 focus, pop Zen, then 6 Blade Rushes in a row. Slash has a higher base damage, however, the talent Saber Storm increases your surge for Blade Rush by 30%, as well as your Ataru damage. I've seen my Ataru crit for as much as 1k (with Precision up). Not to mention Slash is just pure damage, and Blade Rush is damage, guaranteed Ataru proc (and that Ataru proc can proc a second Ataru proc, I've witnessed it myself) and the chance to proc Opportune Attacks and Combat Trance. Slash should be removed from your bar and replaced by Blade Rush, never to be used again.

 

Once again to emphasize, always try to line up Zen with Precision Slash, Zen, 6+ Focus, then 6 Blade Rushes in a row. Nothing else will utilize Zen better. It should go like this:

 

Ensure that you have at least 9 focus

Pop Zen

Precision (now you're down to 6, and each Blade Rush will consume 1)

BRx6

 

You should get 3-4 of the 6 Blade Rushes out within the 6 second window from Precision, depending on stutter and latency. Blade Rush animation is broken right now, making it a pain to chain them together at times.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Mal-Sharran

[Bejarid]

Ensure that you have at least 9 focus

Pop Zen

Precision (now you're down to 6, and each Blade Rush will consume 1)

BRx6

 

You actually should have ten focus to start this chain, as, during Zen, Blade Rush costs two but invisibly returns one for a net loss of one focus; I've tried to BR during Zen with one focus and it just doesn't work. Sure, you can theoretically count on a Combat Trance from one BR or another to bring you that last bit to finish up, but better to be prepared than to lose that last point of Zen.

[Venan]

Ensure you have at least 6 focus, pop Zen, then 6 Blade Rushes in a row. Slash has a higher base damage, however, the talent Saber Storm increases your surge for Blade Rush by 30%, as well as your Ataru damage. I've seen my Ataru crit for as much as 1k (with Precision up). Not to mention Slash is just pure damage, and Blade Rush is damage, guaranteed Ataru proc (and that Ataru proc can proc a second Ataru proc, I've witnessed it myself) and the chance to proc Opportune Attacks and Combat Trance. Slash should be removed from your bar and replaced by Blade Rush, never to be used again.

 

Once again to emphasize, always try to line up Zen with Precision Slash, Zen, 6+ Focus, then 6 Blade Rushes in a row. Nothing else will utilize Zen better. It should go like this:

 

Ensure that you have at least 9 focus

Pop Zen

Precision (now you're down to 6, and each Blade Rush will consume 1)

BRx6

 

You should get 3-4 of the 6 Blade Rushes out within the 6 second window from Precision, depending on stutter and latency. Blade Rush animation is broken right now, making it a pain to chain them together at times.

I keep getting different answers to this.

 

I've always done the following:

 

Precision Slash - Zen - Blade Rush - Blade Storm - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush. This gives Blade Storm a 100% chance to crit, which I am SOMETIMES told IS affected by Precision Slash and sometimes told is NOT.

 

Which is true? Am I wasting Precision Slash time by popping that Blade Storm? Should I wait until after the 6th Blade Rush to pop it?

[Bejarid]

I keep getting different answers to this.

 

I've always done the following:

 

Precision Slash - Zen - Blade Rush - Blade Storm - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush. This gives Blade Storm a 100% chance to crit, which I am SOMETIMES told IS affected by Precision Slash and sometimes told is NOT.

 

Which is true? Am I wasting Precision Slash time by popping that Blade Storm? Should I wait until after the 6th Blade Rush to pop it?

 

Blade Storm IS effected by Precision Slash, and you should use it after the first Blade

Rush during Zen; you've got plenty of time and, if you plan right, plenty of focus. Blade Storm deals kinetic damage, which is mitigated by armor, which Precision Slash removes from any target for six seconds. You always want to try and time a PS for use with a BS crit and keep it ready for Zen and Master Strike - and that's not really as tough as it sounds, due to the different cooldown lengths.

[Venan]

Blade Storm IS effected by Precision Slash, and you should use it after the first Blade

Rush during Zen; you've got plenty of time and, if you plan right, plenty of focus. Blade Storm deals kinetic damage, which is mitigated by armor, which Precision Slash removes from any target for six seconds. You always want to try and time a PS for use with a BS crit and keep it ready for Zen and Master Strike - and that's not really as tough as it sounds, due to the different cooldown lengths.

 

Okay, I thought so. So I HAVE been doing it properly. Excellent. Thank you.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Venan

[Mal-Sharran]

I keep getting different answers to this.

 

I've always done the following:

 

Precision Slash - Zen - Blade Rush - Blade Storm - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush - Blade Rush. This gives Blade Storm a 100% chance to crit, which I am SOMETIMES told IS affected by Precision Slash and sometimes told is NOT.

 

Which is true? Am I wasting Precision Slash time by popping that Blade Storm? Should I wait until after the 6th Blade Rush to pop it?

 

Since Zen is off the GCD, you can do it in that order, but I find it best to pop Zen before you initiate the focus dump, instead of after, just to avoid ANY wasting of the Precision buff (Zen lasts 20 seconds so there is no chance you're going to waste it by popping it early). The INSTANT the GCD is over after Precision Strike, you want to dive right into your Blade Rush spam. Blade Storm is an acceptable replacement for one Blade Rush during Zen, due to the guaranteed crit. However a crit Blade Storm with Precision doesn't hit a whole lot harder than a crit Blade Rush + Ataru, AND Zen doesn't cover Blade Storm, so if you only have 6 Focus going into Zen, you might not want to include it (also, you don't get the 0.5 sec GCD reduction on Blade Storm, so you you might get 2 BR and 1 BS off with Precision, instead of 4 BR).

[Mal-Sharran]

You actually should have ten focus to start this chain, as, during Zen, Blade Rush costs two but invisibly returns one for a net loss of one focus; I've tried to BR during Zen with one focus and it just doesn't work. Sure, you can theoretically count on a Combat Trance from one BR or another to bring you that last bit to finish up, but better to be prepared than to lose that last point of Zen.

 

Theoretically, 6 Blade Rush attacks in 6 seconds, the first one should proc Combat Trance, so you'll have one extra focus by the end. But yes, 10 is safer than 9.

[Venan]

Since Zen is off the GCD, you can do it in that order, but I find it best to pop Zen before you initiate the focus dump, instead of after, just to avoid ANY wasting of the Precision buff (Zen lasts 20 seconds so there is no chance you're going to waste it by popping it early). The INSTANT the GCD is over after Precision Strike, you want to dive right into your Blade Rush spam. Blade Storm is an acceptable replacement for one Blade Rush during Zen, due to the guaranteed crit. However a crit Blade Storm with Precision doesn't hit a whole lot harder than a crit Blade Rush + Ataru, AND Zen doesn't cover Blade Storm, so if you only have 6 Focus going into Zen, you might not want to include it (also, you don't get the 0.5 sec GCD reduction on Blade Storm, so you you might get 2 BR and 1 BS off with Precision, instead of 4 BR).

 

I tend to only ever activate the rotation at full focus, or nearly full; not just six. That said, I do tend to pop Zen first but never thought to why.

[Mal-Sharran]

I tend to only ever activate the rotation at full focus, or nearly full; not just six. That said, I do tend to pop Zen first but never thought to why.

 

That isn't a bad habit to be in, but you honestly don't need full focus when you start. Talented, BR requires 3 focus, refunds 1. Under Zen, 2 focus, refunds 1. So with 6 focus...

 

Zen (6 focus)

BR (5)

BR (4)

BR (3)

BR (2)

BR (1)

BR (0)

 

Now the 6th BR would need 2 to activate at this point, but your Combat Trance from your initial BR would provide it. The absolute most Focus you need before you start your 6 BR spam is 7 to be safe. If you interweave a BS in there, 9 to be safe, 8 otherwise. I wouldn't though, really, for the reasons I stated. It's slower, and getting off 4 BR under Precision is better than 2 BR and 1 BS, even with the guaranteed crit.

 

Zen (9 focus)

BRush (8)

BStorm (6)

BR (5)

BR (4)

BR (3)

BR (2)

BR (1)

 

So as you can see, waiting until you're topped off with Focus is unnecessary to getting the most out of Zen.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Mal-Sharran

[Bejarid]

Theoretically, 6 Blade Rush attacks in 6 seconds, the first one should proc Combat Trance, so you'll have one extra focus by the end. But yes, 10 is safer than 9.

 

Combat Trance only grants its focus after its six second duration; so your Zen spam would really take about 6.5~7 seconds to accommodate CT finishing its duration to get the focus for your sixth and final Blade Rush. Mathematically, 10 is required for Zen spam with Precision Slash; practically, however, it is entirely likely that you'll have CT rolling already.

[Mal-Sharran]

Combat Trance only grants its focus after its six second duration; so your Zen spam would really take about 6.5~7 seconds to accommodate CT finishing its duration to get the focus for your sixth and final Blade Rush. Mathematically, 10 is required for Zen spam with Precision Slash; practically, however, it is entirely likely that you'll have CT rolling already.

 

Well, when you get 6 BR attacks off in exactly 6 seconds, you let me know. Until then, I'll keep playing on this flawed, laggy thing called the Internet, where latency factors in