2 Best Dps PVP Builds

[Arlanon]

This is interesting. Shatter and Impale have redundant function, so replace Shatter with Obliterate, which makes Scream free. Then knock 3 seconds off the cooldowns.

 

DPS is my offspec, but I will definitely be trying this out next time.

Edited March 9, 2012 by Arlanon

[bizcuits]

Veng spec FTW that hybrid spec is a joke btw.

 

Indeed, I often wonder how people assume a hybrid build of any kind would out preform a build specific to the 31 talent point abilities which are designed to be primary attacks....

 

It's like making an ARMS warrior in WOW, but not getting Mortal Strike....

[Arlanon]

Talents are a lot like Magic the Gathering creatures. Your deck full of 8 mana cost power monsters would end up failing to a deck full of stuff that costs 2 or 3 mana apiece.

 

Don't view the trees as separate entities, although they are presented as such. Certain combinations of lower tier abilities can often be more powerful than a single higher tier ability.

 

Another analogy could be that the different talent trees represent the different colors in Magic. You could have a pure White deck, or a pure Blue deck, but a deck that was White+Blue could have a lot more potential.

Edited March 10, 2012 by Arlanon

[Dracosz]

I'm going to be frank, the second spec isn't that good at all. It might have some interesting chain combinations with scream, but when it comes down to it, the rage generation is simply not there. A theorycrafted rotation (charge as part of the rotation? Really?) isn't going to cut it when you're on a target. Potentially, dropping huddle might help if you grab enraged sunder in immortal (or whatever the hell it's called) but that just defeats the point of speccing into vengeance imho.

 

I've said it once, I'll say it a thousand times. You need to optimize your gear to make vengeance work, not doing so simply weakens the spec's damage output since it has such high requirements.

[IronScarlet]

I'm going to be frank, the second spec isn't that good at all. It might have some interesting chain combinations with scream, but when it comes down to it, the rage generation is simply not there. A theorycrafted rotation (charge as part of the rotation? Really?) isn't going to cut it when you're on a target. Potentially, dropping huddle might help if you grab enraged sunder in immortal (or whatever the hell it's called) but that just defeats the point of speccing into vengeance imho.

 

I've said it once, I'll say it a thousand times. You need to optimize your gear to make vengeance work, not doing so simply weakens the spec's damage output since it has such high requirements.

 

This made me lol and the wow guy above him ; Unyielding in full vengeance and hybrid help both out a huge deal in pvp for rage. If the rage generation is not there how are you suppose to do it in full vengeance with higher costing powers such as shatter and no free 6 sec force scream.

 

 

Listen to what you are saying, if it’s not for you buddy fine but consistently have spam able rage costing powers with 10m range, I am happy playing this and I do just fine.

Edited March 11, 2012 by IronScarlet

[Dracosz]

This made me lol and the wow guy above him ; Unyielding in full vengeance and hybrid help both out a huge deal in pvp for rage. If the rage generation is not there how are you suppose to do it in full vengeance with higher costing powers such as shatter and no free 6 sec force scream.

 

 

Listen to what you are saying, if it’s not for you buddy fine but consistently have spam able rage costing powers with 10m range, I am happy playing this and I do just fine.

 

If you're relying on unyielding for rage generation, then you're playing the juggernaut class wrong . I love the rage from it, but in no way do I rely on it to generate the rage I need to kill people.

 

Shien form refunds the rage cost by 1, what I'm getting from this post is that "I don't like hitting rage generators". As full vengeance with shien form (and subsequently enraged sunder) I will ALWAYS have the rage I need to use any ability save for shatter on swaps due to the sunder requisite (if I'm not swapping, then shatter will be up). A full vengeance 7/34/0 build or variant (7/31/3 and 9/31/0 have been popping up lately) will ALWAYS outdamage this if the player behind the character knows what they are doing.

 

Let me be more clear, this spec relies solely on the "rotation" and does not have the means to generate sufficient rage to go outside the rotation for abilities such as vicious throw, it's always about the free screams which just doesn't have a lot of lasting damage power without shien or the 30% crit boost from rage. It's constantly at 0-4 rage which stifles it's effective capacity to make effective use of a juggernaut's full set of damaging abilities. Enrage gives you SOME leeway, but that's on a minute cooldown and not at all "reliable"

Edited March 11, 2012 by Dracosz

[VegasMith]

It's already been said.. but that 2nd (hybrid) spec is a steaming pile of ----.

 

wuwu

[SamuraiLeo]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101crhfzMZhZGr0rdbM.1

 

this is my hybrid and im usually top of the room for wz and im a great off tank for operations

 

use war leader gear and soresu form for best results

Edited March 11, 2012 by SamuraiLeo

[IronScarlet]

If you're relying on unyielding for rage generation, then you're playing the juggernaut class wrong . I love the rage from it, but in no way do I rely on it to generate the rage I need to kill people.

 

Shien form refunds the rage cost by 1, what I'm getting from this post is that "I don't like hitting rage generators". As full vengeance with shien form (and subsequently enraged sunder) I will ALWAYS have the rage I need to use any ability save for shatter on swaps due to the sunder requisite (if I'm not swapping, then shatter will be up). A full vengeance 7/34/0 build or variant (7/31/3 and 9/31/0 have been popping up lately) will ALWAYS outdamage this if the player behind the character knows what they are doing.

 

Let me be more clear, this spec relies solely on the "rotation" and does not have the means to generate sufficient rage to go outside the rotation for abilities such as vicious throw, it's always about the free screams which just doesn't have a lot of lasting damage power without shien or the 30% crit boost from rage. It's constantly at 0-4 rage which stifles it's effective capacity to make effective use of a juggernaut's full set of damaging abilities. Enrage gives you SOME leeway, but that's on a minute cooldown and not at all "reliable"

 

 

To the highlight; Hell ya, because I do not need subpar damage when I am trying to compete against trooper/ sorc spamming grav round and lightning. Never did I say rely on unyielding

 

Charge and throw are the best pre rage builders, Now with unyielding, do I rely upon it no, but it does show itself very noticeably , and at times with pocket healers I can’t dump enough rage.

 

I can usually go through 2 rotations with 1 sunder. To say I never use sunder that would be crazy talk it is all situational but I can tell you 50% of the time they fall without me using one sunder. This leads me to my next point, Warzone GROUP PVP. Anything can happen and it not just damage that gives you power it is tool /utilities and RANGE. No one smart enough is going to stand still. The landscape change as you move, a melee needs to be 90% on target. Letting you stay in Melee and expanding your range is what this build does best with heavy consistent damage

 

We can fight all day who likes what, as I said in original post play what you want. Out damage is all on the player not the build and how they use it first off. To those who hate the build fine to those who love the build ok, I don’t care. To say it can’t hold its own over any other I will defend. It can compete with any you just posted and more.

 

 

 

Ps. I use Vicious Throw, its magic lol

 

Really stop number crunching on paper and try it out. Cant use visous throw is that a jk?

Edited March 12, 2012 by IronScarlet

[Arlanon]

I played around with the hybrid spec a bit this weekend and I have mixed feelings about it. Pure Venge has a flow to it that the hybrid really lacks. In pure Venge, I almost have more Rage than I know what to do with. In the hybrid spec, it is a constant struggle for Rage, as well as setting up for the free crit Scream.

 

Scream comes up twice as often than Obliterate, which means that half of your Screams will cost Rage. Between Obliterate, Impale, Rage-cost Screams, the lack of Enraged Sunder, and running in Shii-Cho Form, there were times when Force Scream was available, but I wasn't ready to use it until 1 or 2 GCDs later. What did I have to resort to in the interim? Assault.

 

Whereas in pure Venge with Shien Form, I hardly, if ever, use Assault at all. Obliterate is nice to have, and the hybrid spec IS manageable, but it is rather clunky. I prefer to have the survivability and control that unchanneled Force Choke, Backhand, Intimidation, Unleashed, Sonic Barrier, and Guard provide.

 

This is all coming from a main spec Immortal though, so take it as you will.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Arlanon

[ethnogeek]

I use http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#1010MZI0kZRrRbdrMbGR.1 in pvp and, not to boast just make a point, I manage to come in top in damage, medals, and even protection as often as not, not to mention getting the 5k dmg annihilator medal most every wz.

 

There is a video floating around these forums detailing this spec by a guy who claimed to get over 9k crits pre-surge nerf.

Basically, 2 points for enraged sunder since most of your abilities cost 3 rage, and that makes a single hit generate 3 rage so your good to smash now.

Itemization is key - buy a couple smuggler champion pieces and pull out the advanced adept enhancement ignore crit rating since you get guaranteed crit on smash. use champion earpiece instead of bm. Aim for 200-250 surge rating, since dr kicks in around then - and stack power every chance you get.

 

Rotation should be thought of as "optimal starters" in my opinion. Ideal starter is Force throw, enrage, force crush nearest target, then pop relic and charge into a big cluster of enemies and smash - make sure you have 4 piece bonus from vindicator gear for +10% dmg after charge for 5 seconds - and in that 5 second window hit 5 pubs for 4-6k dmg.

Intimidating roar and intercede a teamate, pick new victim and try to get a choke off using some form of line of sight obstacle. Charge back in and finish them off.

 

fun as hell! and I stream on twitch and will happily link an example vid. sorta long but plenty of examples http://www.twitch.tv/ben_tv/b/312462576

Edited March 23, 2012 by ethnogeek

[Lacedemon]

Very similar to my Rage build. The video your referring to is Luciela's.

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#1010MZI0MZRrRbddMdGR.1

 

I drop the free scream on the grounds that unless it crits its not all that useful, and therefore doesn't really add to the burst. That said when stacking buffs and it does crit you can be looking at 9k-10k dmg easily from a smash + scream crit.

 

 

Also having the SSM and the other talents I get instead make all the other crap I do when i am not smashing much much more effective. Likewise Gravity + Enraged Sunder balance out rage building and spending nicely as well

 

While I love rage and my character along with a Jedi called Brutalos made a name for ourselves using Rage really effectively on our server; I have started to drift away from it and back towards Vengeance. While I still love it when Op's pop you from stealth expecting an easy kill only to find your bursting them down faster than them or the marauders who make the same mistake.

 

I am finding that while Shatter is pissing me off (I use sunder on a target but it still says i need to apply a sunder), It is much much better vs the very very good snipers and marauders on my server.

 

As for using other stances I find I was more effective as rage in Soresu guarding a healer than when Vengeance spec'd doing the same. It is much much easier to pull off a 350k dmg and 200k protection game as rage in Soresu than Vengeance doing the same.

 

Noticed an explosion of Rage/Focused spec'd players recently on Frostclaw, sadly 99% of whom are utter naff and cannot for the life of them hit for over 5k (Brutalos and I was doing this pre getting BM on well geared 50's). In fact my smash record was set when I was doing the final WZ grind to 60.

 

Using this Vengeance build because I am lazy and taking the +3% Acc allows me to re-purpose a lot of my Rage itemised gear (which is all Deft Mods and Adept Enhancements) while I build a 2nd set of BM:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101crZIhRRruddMR.1

Edited March 30, 2012 by Lacedemon

[ethnogeek]

The video your referring to is Luciela's.

ty for credit for Luciela, i couldn't find the video again for the life of me.

 

Likewise Gravity + Enraged Sunder balance out rage building and spending nicely as well

 

I find the single point in unyielding (vengeance tree) to be more useful in pvp than gravity, since your are constantly being stunned/knocked down. That may change in 1.2 though

 

As i understand the itemization w/ out 3/3 in accuracy is 105% for special attacks, significant DR on crit multiplier @ 75% critical multiplier under melee attack stats, power and strength. However i'm still unclear on the exact bonus from power vs. strength - i.e. 2 strength is equal to 1 power in terms of overall dmg or 1.5 strength to 1 power. At what time should you equip the Advanced Deft Mod 25a (61 str, 37 end, 11 power) over the Advanced Deft Mod 24 (45 str, 27 end, 34 power.

 

Obviously this is for Rage pvp spec - assuming your at surge & accuracy cap and don't need to worry about crit, is 16 strength more useful than 23 power? Or do you use it for the added endurance?

Based on my test swapping out one for the other, i see 687.9 bonus dmg w/ deft mod 25a and 690 bonus dmg w/ deft mod 24 in my head slot.

Edited March 30, 2012 by ethnogeek

[Lacedemon]

My preferred mod is the standard Deft Mod 25 (48 str, 29 end, 37 pwr) rather than the 25a. It would appear based on what I did with a guildy is that at around 1550/1600ish give or take that when even with the 6% talent to strength power becomes the stat to stack over str.

 

The difference between the 25 and 25a is minor in how it shows up in the tool tips so arguably the 25a is probably the no1 choice due to how easy it is to get hold of compared to the 25. I have only ever got it from HM raid drops; I have only had it drop twice

 

Fully itemised in my stuff my bonus damage is pushing the 800 mark and my melee dmg is well into the 900's. When rage spec'd Accuracy is never a stat I was overly fussed over. I had a bit here and there on implants/ear's/offands but that was it. I never had an issue with it sitting about the 95% mark for melee and 105% ish for force.