Obi-Wan Kenobi vs Kyle Katarn

[BrandonSM]

Who wins?

[mefit]

Obi-Wan

He Beat Vadar 2times

He beat Maul

 

Just cannot mess with the Wan !

[MaybeEvil]

Going to go with Ben on this one. He put the hurt on Anakin in Episode 3 so i'm assuming he would probably lay a beating on Katarn as well.

 

Also took down Maul, which although not as noteworthy as beating Grevious or Anakin, is certainly worth mentioning.

[BrandonSM]

Obi-Wan

He Beat Vadar 2times

He beat Maul

 

Just cannot mess with the Wan !

 

When did he beat Vader 2 times?

 

 

And that was Maul's fault.

[BrandonSM]

Well....

 

Katarn would have a close duel with Obi but I think Obi's superior tactics in dueling using Soresu best Katarn's Djem So.

 

But Force Battle, I'd give it to Katarn. He used both sides of the force, Dark Side Lightning and he was a master of telekinesis. He used powerful Light Side abilities like Force Absorbtion, Protection and he had tremendous raw Force Power enough for Darth Caedus to acknowledge it.

[mefit]

When did he beat Vader 2 times?

 

 

And that was Maul's fault.

 

 

1 Obi-Wan beat Anakin ("Titled DarthVadar") at the end of Ep.3

Argue all you like but Obi-wan walked away and Vadar had to be carried

 

2 At the end of Ep4 , really you could say the same I said up ^ , but it was a pretty Draw fight until Obi gave his life so Luke and friends could get away .

I will give it to Obi-Wan , Sithlord Malgus killed his master for letting the Jedi and crew get away in "RETURN" .

 

 

Ok now onto Maul ! fault or not Obi-wan again WALKED AWAY while no one knows yet because the Canon of Maul is just being told through "Clone Wars" season 4. We will learn how Maul lived past being Cut in half by a wet behind the ears Jedi

 

 

Jedi aren't trying to kill anyone , they are attempting to do things peacefully as possible . Only Sith are out to kill everything .

Obi-Wan could have tossed Anakin into the Lava but he loved him as a bother . But it was Obi-Wan who walked away unscratched Phyically , while he might have been hurt emotionally by doing what he did to anakin.

 

Obi-Wan by far is not the greatist Jedi or the Greatist Force User , but when it came down to doing what he had to he always came out on top . Reason ? Because he was wise and smarter .

Not Palpitine Smart or Yoda Wise but just enough to make it to the finish line . Not to mention Obi-Wan helped train the Greatest EU Jedi Master ...........Luke Skywalker .

 

In the end , Obi-Wan was a EPIC Figure for being destined to meet and train the people he did . That is alot more than Most figures in EU or Movie can say !

[Rayla_Felana]

2. At the end of Ep4 , really you could say the same I said up ^ , but it was a pretty Draw fight until Obi gave his life so Luke and friends could get away.

 

That was nothing like an actual battle, Both Obi-Wan and Vader knew any serious confrontation then would end quickly in favour of Vader, besides, that wasn't the point of the 'duel' Kenobi was keeping Vader distracted, not only that but he wanted to show Luke the true meaning of the force and what sacrifice was.

[mefit]

That was nothing like an actual battle, Both Obi-Wan and Vader knew any serious confrontation then would end quickly in favour of Vader, besides, that wasn't the point of the 'duel' Kenobi was keeping Vader distracted, not only that but he wanted to show Luke the true meaning of the force and what sacrifice was.

 

And that is why I said it was a win for Obi-Wan . Sometimes making a moment that builds into something greater is more worth it than the true win .

 

I am sure Vadar would have eventually won , I can admit that but Obi-wan at time new cards were better stacked in Luke and he was right !

[BrandonSM]

Obi didn't win against ep. 4 and it wans't a draw. Like Raayla said, it was a distraction.

 

 

 

Jedi aren't trying to kill anyone , they are attempting to do things peacefully as possible . Only Sith are out to kill everything .

Obi-Wan could have tossed Anakin into the Lava but he loved him as a bother . But it was Obi-Wan who walked away unscratched Phyically , while he might have been hurt emotionally by doing what he did to anakin.

 

If it wasn't for the harsh enviroment, Anakin would have beaten Obi-Wan.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not Palpitine Smart or Yoda Wise but just enough to make it to the finish line . Not to mention Obi-Wan helped train the Greatest EU Jedi Master ...........Luke Skywalker .

 

A couple months of training... Luke IMO is 90% self-taught and learns about abilties on his travels and adventures.

 

Answers in bold.

[mefit]

Obi didn't win against ep. 4 and it wans't a draw. Like Raayla said, it was a distraction.

 

 

 

 

Answers in bold.

 

BrandonSM you are about would haves and might have beens , saddly what happened is Obi-Wan beat Anakin because Anakin ("My Favorite Character / Obi-Wan being my second"") was aggressive and not thinking anyone could beat him because he believed his own Koolaid.

 

Would haves didn't happen , what Happen is Obi-wan without a scratch on him walked away from both Anakin fight and Maul Fight . Both Emotionally Damaging I am sure to him but nothing Physical .

 

So we can always say in a second fight or if the area was changed with everything including our own history and wars that happened in Real Life . All that matters in the End is what happened . Anakin lost to Obi-wan and was on deaths door . Palpitine put him in a suit that caused him to be weaker in the force compared to what he would have been if he didn't fight Obi-Wan .

 

Obi-Wan is a Defensive fighter

Anakin was aggressive

Vadar was Defensive mostly and most likely due to Obi-Wan fight where he learned his final Lesson from his master Obi !

 

Luke I like to think was mostly Aggressive but did not have the issues Anakin had .

 

What Happen is all that

 

Matters !

Edited February 21, 2012 by mefit

[BrandonSM]

 

Would haves didn't happen , what Happen is Obi-wan without a scratch on him walked away from both Anakin fight and Maul Fight . Both Emotionally Damaging I am sure to him but nothing Physical .

 

Considering Anakin was beating him and driving him back the entire fight. I'd say what would have happened in a different enviroment does count in this sort of arguement.

 

 

 

 

So we can always say in a second fight or if the area was changed with everything including our own history and wars that happened in Real Life . All that matters in the End is what happened . Anakin lost to Obi-wan and was on deaths door . Palpitine put him in a suit that caused him to be weaker in the force compared to what he would have been if he didn't fight Obi-Wan .

 

 

 

If we put Kyle Katarn and Obi-Wan in a plain field, The Anakin vs Obi-Wan fight doesn't matter unless your saying Anakin would have destroyed Obi-Wan.

 

 

Obi-Wan is a Defensive fighter

Anakin was aggressive

Vadar was Defensive mostly and most likely due to Obi-Wan fight where he learned his final Lesson from his master Obi ! Vader was defensive and offensive making him a deadly opponent.

 

Luke I like to think was mostly Aggressive but did not have the issues Anakin had . Luke was both as well.

 

Answers in bold.

[mefit]

Brandon it is my belief that you argue to see yourself type.

 

Could haves

 

Palpitine could have "JUST" went into kill Luke instead of "PLAYING" with him and trusting Vadar !

 

Palpitine "COULD HAVE" Left Anakin to die after the fight with Obi-Wan and went on to find another Apprentice

 

Count Dooku "COULD HAVE" went for the DEATH kill on Obi-Wan instead of just trying to pin him down , when he was fighting Anakin in the begining of Ep3 .

 

Count Dooku "Could Have" Killed Anakin at the end of Ep2 if Yoda didn't show up

 

Mace Windu "Could Have" said NO to Anakin being allowed to train with the Jedi

 

I mean the list of "COULD HAVES" just go on and on but "WHAT HAPPENED" is what happened and nothing can change that short of Lucas allowing for a time altering change in the timeline . But that will never happen because Lucas is happy with the Story he told and What Happened defined the story of Anakin including his loss to Obi-Wan .

 

You could say Obi-Wan / Anakin fight is what made Vadar what he is and it was the way it was ment to happen .

 

And Obi-wan did not choose the Area they fought and he even warned Anakin what would happen . So no matter Anakin lost to a man in a preventable action that he knew was gonna happen because he was told .

 

Obi-Wan > Anakin and more than likely Obi-Wan > Kyle Katam

Obi-Wan waits for you to mess up and takes advantage of your mistake . That just makes him smarter than everyone else , sorry . Most real life fighters including Lucas's own daughter will tell you that is just how a good fighter works ,

 

Argue all day everyday , in the end you cannot change WHAT HAPPENED . If it was on Tatoonie and dust got in Anakin's eyes you would be claiming the area still . There is always taht factor

 

Obi-Wan wins

Fatality !

[BrandonSM]

mefit I think you just ignored what I said.

 

Since Anakin was driving Obi-Wan Back and winning throughout the entire duel. If Obi-Wan didn't get lucky and found the opening for the high ground things would have been way different. My point something like that would not happen in the fight Obi vs Kyle. I said the fight would be in a plain field, no enviroment problems no nothing. Therefore the arguement Obi-Wan vs Anakin doesn't count.

 

 

And Anakin was Obi-Wan's better IMO. Obi-Wan was smarter, but Anakin had greater skill. If you don't want to go by that fight Obi vs Anakin, lets look at some other fights. Dooku bested Obi-Wan within Seconds, in the first fight. Dooku was surprised to see Anakin hold out longer than his master. And in the third fight.. well Dooku died with Obi-Wan wounded in the half-way point of the duel. Thats one I can think of at the top of my head.

[TheAlmightyPoe]

Who wins?

 

i assume you mean young obiwan (as in master of anakin young, not pupil of quigon).

 

Which katarn? Just defeated jarec? or battlemaster?

 

if battlemaster katarn: katarn wins hand down. He is known for being able to use everything in the environment as a tool.

 

 

if just defeated jarec: toss up, imho. Although obiwan has the advantage by having more force battle experience.

[mefit]

mefit I think you just ignored what I said.

 

Since Anakin was driving Obi-Wan Back and winning throughout the entire duel. If Obi-Wan didn't get lucky and found the opening for the high ground things would have been way different. My point something like that would not happen in the fight Obi vs Kyle. I said the fight would be in a plain field, no enviroment problems no nothing. Therefore the arguement Obi-Wan vs Anakin doesn't count.

 

 

And Anakin was Obi-Wan's better IMO. Obi-Wan was smarter, but Anakin had greater skill. If you don't want to go by that fight Obi vs Anakin, lets look at some other fights. Dooku bested Obi-Wan within Seconds, in the first fight. Dooku was surprised to see Anakin hold out longer than his master. And in the third fight.. well Dooku died with Obi-Wan wounded in the half-way point of the duel. Thats one I can think of at the top of my head.

 

Wasn't luck

Was stupidity on a Boy who would not listen.

 

Luck is something that happens without anyone really knowing what would happen.

Obi told Anakin and Anakin leeped into it. Game over

 

Nothing you can say can change that no matter what you look at our go back on, because it happened by skill.

Obi-Wan was skilled , Anakin wasn't . Like you Anakin did not want to listen to FACTS and that is why Anakin had to live in a suit for the rest of his LIFE , while Obi-Wan grew old. Obi-wan gave his life to save others , he didn't die swinging or into something he did not know was gonna happen . He was SMARTER than Anakin and thus is the reason he beat him.

 

You are never gonna win because I have a MOVIE of the VERY FIGHT that everyone seen , including you . It ends with Anakin near DEATH , not Obi-wan ! FACTS BUDDY !

[TheAlmightyPoe]

Wasn't luck

Was stupidity on a Boy who would not listen.

 

Luck is something that happens without anyone really knowing what would happen.

Obi told Anakin and Anakin leeped into it. Game over

 

Nothing you can say can change that no matter what you look at our go back on, because it happened by skill.

Obi-Wan was skilled , Anakin wasn't . Like you Anakin did not want to listen to FACTS and that is why Anakin had to live in a suit for the rest of his LIFE , while Obi-Wan grew old. Obi-wan gave his life to save others , he didn't die swinging or into something he did not know was gonna happen . He was SMARTER than Anakin and thus is the reason he beat him.

 

You are never gonna win because I have a MOVIE of the VERY FIGHT that everyone seen , including you . It ends with Anakin near DEATH , not Obi-wan ! FACTS BUDDY !

 

 

you're not getting what he said.

 

anakin was STRONGER. Obiwan won off of skill and experience alone. The deadly environment in which they fought gave obiwan the advantage.

 

A straight lightsaber duel, without the running around, would end in anakins favor. But because of obi-wans tactics, within the environment, anakin lost. No one is doubting it.

 

All that he is saying is looking deeper into that duel. It isnt just that HE WON. it was, HOW HE WON.

[mefit]

The Problem with What IFs , is they never happened. Maybe Obi loses to Kyle , Maybe not ......

Everyone Argues about Revan and Vadar, I for one believe Revan over Vadar , skill wins all. You can be richest man on the planet and spend it all till you're broke or with knowing how to make money you can use it in making more .

 

Obi-Wan was not the most powerful or skilled Jedi by far , but he knew how to use what he had and he did it well when the moment he had too .

 

Anakin had the most power and could not use it because he was foolish and damaged himself before he knew anything .

 

Having something does not make you the best at it, Palpitine was the best at almost everything because he first learned how to use it and do it. Palpitine was old before he made himself known, spent all his life mastering everything he could. Planning out everything from the possible to impossible, and when he came out he was powerful for it.

 

You can be the strongest man on the planet and get beat in a fight by the weakest man , if that weaker man is more skilled at fighting .

 

Obi-Wan was a weaker man more skilled at fighting than Anakin.

 

You see Anakin backing Obi-wan up most teh fight , most defensive fighters do that . You also see Anakin and Obi-Wan try to force throw eachother and the both equally knock eachother back.

Obi-Wan is skilled and would probably won not matter, after all it was destined to happen.

[mefit]

you're not getting what he said.

 

anakin was STRONGER. Obiwan won off of skill and experience alone. The deadly environment in which they fought gave obiwan the advantage.

 

A straight lightsaber duel, without the running around, would end in anakins favor. But because of obi-wans tactics, within the environment, anakin lost. No one is doubting it.

 

All that he is saying is looking deeper into that duel. It isnt just that HE WON. it was, HOW HE WON.

 

In a room with 4 walls and no way out . yea but that is a WHAT IF not WHAT HAPPENED . Obi-Wan did not pick the fighting area, he came there trying to find Anakin . I do not think he ever really thought the 2 would fight .

 

So in every Theory Obi-Wan was ment to win . It had all to do with skill, not power.

 

In my opinion if Anakin would have had the time to MASTER and AGE a little more , and learned Patiance not like he had to with Obi-Wan , he would have been Everything people could imagine.

 

His love for Padme blinded him and Palpitine pumping his ego through the rough made him think he was unstoppable . He payed for it all in the end and lost everything ! As a father myself , I love the story as I can relate to Anakin as a Human . I cannot speak for all fathers but I could never hate my children and you see that when Vadar finally dies !

[BrandonSM]

Wasn't luck

Was stupidity on a Boy who would not listen.

 

It was lucj. He found an opening to get to. Hence the quote, "I have the high ground."

 

 

 

 

Luck is something that happens without anyone really knowing what would happen.

Obi told Anakin and Anakin leeped into it. Game over

 

Obi finding the gatewya to get away wasn't predicted. Or did I miss something?

 

 

Nothing you can say can change that no matter what you look at our go back on, because it happened by skill.

 

He had experience. Anakin has more skill than Obi-Wan. It would be foolish to deny that.

 

 

 

Obi-Wan was skilled , Anakin wasn't .

 

Like I said beofe, Obi-Wan has more experience than Skill and Anakin was more skilled than Obi-Wan.

 

Like you Anakin did not want to listen to FACTS and that is why Anakin had to live in a suit for the rest of his LIFE , while Obi-Wan grew old. Obi-wan gave his life to save others , he didn't die swinging or into something he did not know was gonna happen . He was SMARTER than Anakin and thus is the reason he beat him.

 

Post-Mustafar, Vader was better than Obi-Wan in his prime and was completely smarter. Obi-Wan was a distraction but Vader didn't even know about Luke. And all that stuff until ESB.

 

 

 

You are never gonna win because I have a MOVIE of the VERY FIGHT that everyone seen , including you . It ends with Anakin near DEATH , not Obi-wan ! FACTS BUDDY !

 

 

Anakin was winning throughout the entire fight! WE SAW THAT IN THE MOVIE! Obi-Wan was lucky! Anakin has more skill and power than Obi-Wan. It was Luck, he found the opening to get out of the duel.

 

 

Answers in bold.

Edited February 21, 2012 by BrandonSM

[mefit]

Brandon you keep saying luck.

 

If I tell you my closet if full of stuff and if you open the door that stuff is going to fall out and you do it anyways , than it no longer is a simple mistake.

 

Obi-Wan: Anakin I have the high ground game over

 

Anakin : I am too stupid to understand that , let me leep at you anyways even though you told me the outcome

 

Obi-Wan: 18years of training and you are still stupid, oh well time to go work on my tan in Tatoonie

 

 

^ There is no luck in that, Anakin leeped into it and got what he was told would happen.

If he was willing to do that than he would have done it anywhere on any situation.

 

Obi-Wan told him and he ran into it like a dummy ! Obi-wan didn't need luck when the person coming at him could not think .

 

Brandon skill is experience , you gain skill from being experienced . Experienced by doing it.

 

LUCK HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH ANAKIN GETTING OWNED, STUPIDITY IN NOT LISTENING HAD EVERYTHING TO DO WITH IT !

 

Obi-Wan > Anakin ..........it happened , its canon , its history . Don't need what ifs because it HAPPENED !

 

What was luck is Anakin was able to do that whole fight without tripping over his own feet .

 

Obi-Wan stood toe to toe in a force push move that neither were better .

 

A DEFENSIVE FIGHTER BACKS UP

A OFFENSIVE FIGHTER MOVES FORWARD

 

OBI-WAN was backing up because that is what his fighting style did , you never seen aggressuve Obi-Wan other than the Maul fight and I am guessing he learned Aggressive did not work for him in that fight being he almost lost !

 

OBI-WAN Beat ANAKIN and MAUL .................IDC what any of you fanboys say , that makes Obi-Wan EPIC .

 

You should no Starkiller vs Vadar topic next , I see you like the WHAT IFs and do not like to admit you are wrong lol.

Starkiller > Vadar x2 btw , any situation !

[mefit]

There is no luck in finding a Opening , it is SKILL that he found it. He was looking for it the entire fight. More than likely the fight would have gone on forever until a opening happened because Anakin was not gaining anything in his offense either.

 

By your theory , Anakin was waiting for luck to get a hit in . News for you , it was never gonna happen.

 

Obi-Wan trained Anakin and spent his life around him . He was old enough to know how to find all Anakin's weaknesses , it was bound to happen .

I am a older brother to 2 younger brothers, one is stronger than me but I beat him at most things we do . I know from watching him grow and seeing how he works what he will do in almost anything we do.

These are traits of someone who pays attention to people around them.

 

Anakin did not worry about people around him, he was fearless of people he fought . He believed he was unbeatable even though he was beat before. Refused to listen !

Vadar was largely unbeatable other than against Starkiller . He was fearless but now defensive and I bet he looked before he leaped !

Edited February 21, 2012 by mefit

[BrandonSM]

mefit I think were at a miscommunication. I said it was luck when Obi-Wan had jumped. When he found the opening for him to jump of the platform and get on the "high ground." Not the part where he cut Anakin.

 

I consider the end of the duel when Obi jumps off and then starts speaking to Anakin.

[BrandonSM]

There is no luck in finding a Opening , it is SKILL that he found it. He was looking for it the entire fight. More than likely the fight would have gone on forever until a opening happened because Anakin was not gaining anything in his offense either.

 

By your theory , Anakin was waiting for luck to get a hit in . New for you , it was never gonna happen.

 

Obi-Wan trained Anakin and spent his life around him . He was old enough to know how to find all Anakin's weaknesses , it was bound to happen .

I am a older brother to 2 younger brothers, one is stronger than me but I beat him at most things we do . I know from watching him grow and seeing how he works what he will do in almost anything we do.

These are traits of someone who pays attention to people around them.

 

Anakin did not worry about people around him, he was fearless of people he fought . He believed he was unbeatable even though he was beat before. Refused to listen !

Vadar was largely unbeatable other than against Starkiller . He was fearless but now defensive and I bet he looked before he leaped !

 

No he wasn't. His method for the fight was to wait out Anakin, tire him out. Since that was one of Anakin's weaknesses. But that wasn't working. Anakin was getting the best of him. And then Obi-Wan found the piece of land to jump on.

 

I can get out the book if you want me to.

[mefit]

mefit I think were at a miscommunication. I said it was luck when Obi-Wan had jumped. When he found the opening for him to jump of the platform and get on the "high ground." Not the part where he cut Anakin.

 

I consider the end of the duel when Obi jumps off and then starts speaking to Anakin.

 

Maybe , words being typed are often misunderstood.

 

I think we both can aggree to a love for the character Anakin . Only if he was cloned instead of Starkiller and Palpitine :/

[BrandonSM]

Maybe , words being typed are often misunderstood.

 

I think we both can aggree to a love for the character Anakin . Only if he was cloned instead of Starkiller and Palpitine :/

 

Damn. If Anakin or anyother Skywalker was cloned, good god and we think Luke is god.

 

Since Cloned Force Users usually become more powerful than the one before them, imagine the clone at its full potential.

 

No, 1st Imagine Anakin at his full potnetial 100% more than Luke's full ptoential. Now imagine that increased.

Edited February 21, 2012 by BrandonSM