Charged Bolt vs Grav Round

[Jenel]

I'm sure this has been discussed before but I can't find anything on the forums using the search feature, yes I suck at searching.

 

I'm a Commando 42 with Gunnery spec obviously, and since I got Grav Round I can't remember the last time I used Charged Bolts, I've not even had it on my toolbar for about 15 levels now.

 

From what I can see, they both do almost the exact same damage, have the same cast time, same cooldown but Grav Round has the added debuff and the Charged Rounds stack. Am I missing something here and should I still be using Charged Bolts to trigger something else as for the life of me I'm just not seeing any reason to use the ability other than maybe in PvP when Grav Round is interupted.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Jenel

[Eihnlazer]

Charged rounds is pretty much the best dps a commando can do outside of gunnery specced grav rounds if you use it in conjunction with combat support cells.

 

 

You can pop overcharged plasma ability (which requires 30 charges of combat support cell) and fire off charged bots for free for 10 seconds. Depending on your alcracity rating, this should get you about 6-7 free shots at 10% increased damage.

 

With my crit rate of 35% i'll get 2 or 3 crits out of the 7 shots i get so im putting out about 11.2k damage in 10 seconds. Considering im heal specced, this is pretty good.

[smerkle]

I'm sure this has been discussed before but I can't find anything on the forums using the search feature, yes I suck at searching.

 

I'm a Commando 42 with Gunnery spec obviously, and since I got Grav Round I can't remember the last time I used Charged Bolts, I've not even had it on my toolbar for about 15 levels now.

 

From what I can see, they both do almost the exact same damage, have the same cast time, same cooldown but Grav Round has the added debuff and the Charged Rounds stack. Am I missing something here and should I still be using Charged Bolts to trigger something else as for the life of me I'm just not seeing any reason to use the ability other than maybe in PvP when Grav Round is interupted.

 

There's no reason to ever use grav round as gunnery outside of either making them blow an interupt or using it while grav round is interrupted, the entire gunnery tree is built around it.

[whataboutbob]

I'm sure this has been discussed before but I can't find anything on the forums using the search feature, yes I suck at searching.

 

I'm a Commando 42 with Gunnery spec obviously, and since I got Grav Round I can't remember the last time I used Charged Bolts, I've not even had it on my toolbar for about 15 levels now.

 

From what I can see, they both do almost the exact same damage, have the same cast time, same cooldown but Grav Round has the added debuff and the Charged Rounds stack. Am I missing something here and should I still be using Charged Bolts to trigger something else as for the life of me I'm just not seeing any reason to use the ability other than maybe in PvP when Grav Round is interupted.

 

Ive used CB after I got my 4 GR debuffs on the target. This is in the middle of using FA and I use CB to trigger the instant CD of FA. Spamming GR will work on a inexperienced player or one destracted. Its when you get experienced players that its not spamable because, they usually converge on you with interupts.

 

I like the HS, CB and FA as my main attacks with only a GR to keep their armor weak. The rapid hitting of rounds normally make them run away or panic. Yeah CB and FA can be interupted but when they are I just use one that wasnt interupted.

 

Granted Im talking about War Zones, heck in PVE anything will really work.

[Sevonn]

I have it on my quickbar, simple in pvp and some mobs in pve likes to interupt grav rounds so you don't stand there jumping around till you can start to spam it again switch to charged bolt.

[Legius]

There's another advantage Grav Round has: it's a tech ability, so it has a higher inherent accuracy -- Charged Bolts is a ranged ability, it can get deflected, dodged, or miss.

 

If GR gets interrupted generally I'd use that time to throw out a Sticky Nade + HIB instead of trying to hit them with a CB.

[LeonidasSith]

Like everyone else said, Grav Round replaces Charged Bolts in all scenarios, UNLESS you're interrupted and locked out of tech shots, in which case you can use Charged Bolts.

 

Good players use Charged Bolts as a fake, to get someone to burn their interrupt on the wrong ability.

[navydudeogika]

Ive used CB after I got my 4 GR debuffs on the target. This is in the middle of using FA and I use CB to trigger the instant CD of FA. Spamming GR will work on a inexperienced player or one destracted. Its when you get experienced players that its not spamable because, they usually converge on you with interupts.

 

I like the HS, CB and FA as my main attacks with only a GR to keep their armor weak. The rapid hitting of rounds normally make them run away or panic. Yeah CB and FA can be interupted but when they are I just use one that wasnt interupted.

 

Granted Im talking about War Zones, heck in PVE anything will really work.

 

 

 

The reason someone spams grav round over CB is because Grav round is an energy attack, while CB is weapon damage. CB, like full auto, can be shielded, dodged, deflected ect.

 

imo, full auto is the best source of damage, but since it has JUST been fixed, people had no reason to really use it. if you got attacked you would lose 1 hit everytime.

[Jenel]

Well, I don't do a huge amount of PvP simply because I suck at it, did in WoW do here too.

 

When solo levelling and I come across an elite mob or champion, or even in flashpoints, I usually open with 3 Grav Rounds for the full debuff and then use HiB and then FA only using a Grav Round when the debuff is about to drop off to refresh it. I've found that my Hammer Shot is doing around 800-1000 damage in total as I crit regularly with it so I usually spam that while waiting for cooldowns, using Demo Round whenever it's off cooldown.

 

So as Gunnery, I can only see a use for CB in PvP if interupted.

 

Thanks for the advice guys.

[Furiel]

Well, I don't do a huge amount of PvP simply because I suck at it, did in WoW do here too.

 

When solo levelling and I come across an elite mob or champion, or even in flashpoints, I usually open with 3 Grav Rounds for the full debuff and then use HiB and then FA only using a Grav Round when the debuff is about to drop off to refresh it. I've found that my Hammer Shot is doing around 800-1000 damage in total as I crit regularly with it so I usually spam that while waiting for cooldowns, using Demo Round whenever it's off cooldown.

 

So as Gunnery, I can only see a use for CB in PvP if interupted.

 

Thanks for the advice guys.

 

Couple tips from what you were saying about your rotation, by 42 you should have both Curtain of Fire and Charged Barrel talents and it sounds like you aren't taking full advantage of them.

 

Full Auto is your highest damage per ammo when curtain of fire is up, so you should be using that whenever curtain of fire procs. Each cast of Grav Round has a 30% chance to proc curtain of fire, which finishes the cooldown on FA and also increases it's damage, so you should be spamming GR whenever possible.

 

Grav Round also builds stacks of Charged Barrel, which for each stack increases HiB damage by 6% (stacks up to 5) so if you are using it after 3 GR then you are losing 12% damage on HiB each time you use it.

 

Ultimately how it plays out for me in the field is GRx3 to get the debuff up to full, then Demo round, hammer shot x2 to regen some ammo then going forward I alternate Grav Round and Hammer Shot for the rest of the fight while mixing in HiB when I have 5 stacks of charged barrel and also Full Auto on every Curtain of Fire proc.

 

It takes a little getting used to as far as monitoring your buff bar to watch for the different icons while still maintaining awareness of what is going on around you, but once you get the hang of it you should see a nice increase in your damage output.

[Jenel]

So it's better to wait for Curtain of Fire to proc and have FA ready to use than use it as soon as it's up? I'll give your rotation a try, to be honest mine is pretty similar but I'm not paying attention to my buff bar which I guess I really should be doing.

 

Edit: Ok, just reading through the talents again, Curtain of Fire procs from Grav Round and CB which finishes the cooldown on FA and increases damage on the next FA. So I want to be using FA whenever I can but spamming Grav Round while it's on cooldown to proc CoF? Obviously mixing in the other stuff such as HiB and Demo Round where possible.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Jenel

[badatt]

There's another advantage Grav Round has: it's a tech ability, so it has a higher inherent accuracy -- Charged Bolts is a ranged ability, it can get deflected, dodged, or miss.

 

If GR gets interrupted generally I'd use that time to throw out a Sticky Nade + HIB instead of trying to hit them with a CB.

 

This.

[GrimMage]

So it's better to wait for Curtain of Fire to proc and have FA ready to use than use it as soon as it's up? I'll give your rotation a try, to be honest mine is pretty similar but I'm not paying attention to my buff bar which I guess I really should be doing.

 

Edit: Ok, just reading through the talents again, Curtain of Fire procs from Grav Round and CB which finishes the cooldown on FA and increases damage on the next FA. So I want to be using FA whenever I can but spamming Grav Round while it's on cooldown to proc CoF? Obviously mixing in the other stuff such as HiB and Demo Round where possible.

 

Not whenever possible, but at specific times. Do NOT just use those abilities when theyre off CD.

 

Demo Round should only be used when you have 5 stacks of Grav Vortex on the target (thats 3 shots of grav round). (note that Demo Round wont use up those stacks)

 

High Impact Bolt, should only be used when you have 5 stacks of charged barrel

Edited February 15, 2012 by GrimMage

[FoxyWar]

I use HiB on every CD just like demo its free damage every 15s with 4 part set bonus. As for charged barel cant tell if it realy works as it should but it looks to me it isnt allways. And its hard getting 5 stackes of it up in the CD time with FA procs.

 

As a not spam GR as much as you can when othr stuff is on CD and ammo is over 60% use Hammer Shot only when you need to regain some ammo. As GR is more damage in 1.5s than Hammer

[Rambuster]

Ive used CB after I got my 4 GR debuffs on the target. This is in the middle of using FA and I use CB to trigger the instant CD of FA. Spamming GR will work on a inexperienced player or one destracted. Its when you get experienced players that its not spamable because, they usually converge on you with interupts.

 

I like the HS, CB and FA as my main attacks with only a GR to keep their armor weak. The rapid hitting of rounds normally make them run away or panic. Yeah CB and FA can be interupted but when they are I just use one that wasnt interupted.

 

Granted Im talking about War Zones, heck in PVE anything will really work.

 

the only problem of not using grav round as your main attack, is your loosing out on the 30% dmg increase of high impact bolt. which can do more dmg then grav round and is instant cast. Also grav round cost less ammo to use then CB. Its the same for Arsenal Merc's. if your not using grav round/tracer missile your hindering your own dmg.

[Javlarmate]

Most things have already been said so I'd just like to add that I use CB versus Shadows/Assassins that have popped their resist vs Force/Tech CD.

[uziforyou]

Couple tips from what you were saying about your rotation, by 42 you should have both Curtain of Fire and Charged Barrel talents and it sounds like you aren't taking full advantage of them.

 

Full Auto is your highest damage per ammo when curtain of fire is up, so you should be using that whenever curtain of fire procs. Each cast of Grav Round has a 30% chance to proc curtain of fire, which finishes the cooldown on FA and also increases it's damage, so you should be spamming GR whenever possible.

 

Grav Round also builds stacks of Charged Barrel, which for each stack increases HiB damage by 6% (stacks up to 5) so if you are using it after 3 GR then you are losing 12% damage on HiB each time you use it.

 

Ultimately how it plays out for me in the field is GRx3 to get the debuff up to full, then Demo round, hammer shot x2 to regen some ammo then going forward I alternate Grav Round and Hammer Shot for the rest of the fight while mixing in HiB when I have 5 stacks of charged barrel and also Full Auto on every Curtain of Fire proc.

 

It takes a little getting used to as far as monitoring your buff bar to watch for the different icons while still maintaining awareness of what is going on around you, but once you get the hang of it you should see a nice increase in your damage output.

 

Wow, a lucid and accurate explanation of how gunnery commandos work without flaming the person being talked to?!

 

Highly unusual for these parts.

[Proksham]

As armor increases, wouldn't grav round (A tech ability) perform better in the long run? I guess I could be wrong but I believed CB was white (weapon) damage, therefor checking against armor while always encumbered by a lower accuracy rating

[alltooeasyactual]

I only just noticed this tonight...

 

But yeah, Grav Round replaces Charged Bolt, and the way the talent tree is setup there is no advantage to not taking Grav Round.

 

As I was saying, I only noticed tonight that Grav Round was giving the defensive buff, so I did a quick Google and found this forum to confirm my suspicions.

[Llama-Eight]

Most things have already been said so I'd just like to add that I use CB versus Shadows/Assassins that have popped their resist vs Force/Tech CD.

 

This & if you've been interrupted when casting GR & can't use it for 4 seconds.

 

CB isn't bad, I'd just like it if there were a benefit to using it over GR, maybe additional armour penetration for CB, or higher damage or something?

Edited July 31, 2012 by Llama-Eight

[LagunaD]

As armor increases, wouldn't grav round (A tech ability) perform better in the long run? I guess I could be wrong but I believed CB was white (weapon) damage, therefor checking against armor while always encumbered by a lower accuracy rating

 

Whether damage is mitigated by armor does not depend on the attack type (Ranged/White or Tech/Yellow), but the damage type. Kinetic and Energy damage is reduced by armor. Internal and Elemental damage is not.

 

Both Grav Round and Charged Bolts damage is mitigated by armor (but of course Grav Round reduces the target's armor).

[DeevBach]

I have started putting Changed Bolts back into my rotation. I don't use it a lot, but it does fit my rotation now and then. Charged Bolts has a chance to proc Curtain of Fire. If I find myself with HIB, Full Auto, and Demo Round all in CD, then I might throw in a Charged Bolt to get Curtain of Fire to finish the CD for Full Auto. Edited August 2, 2012 by DeevBach

[Kytea]

I have started putting Changed Bolts back into my rotation. I don't use it a lot, but it does fit my rotation now and then. Charged Bolts has a chance to proc Curtain of Fire. If I find myself with HIB, Full Auto, and Grav Round all in CD, then I might throw in a Charged Bolt to get Curtain of Fire to finish the CD for Full Auto.

 

Grav round in CD?

I can repeat GR without any CD delay. I don't understand what you mean.

Edited August 2, 2012 by Kytea

[Jherad]

Probably talking about getting it interrupted.

 

CB has a prominent place on my hotbar for PvP, even as full gunnery. I'll switch to it when GR is interrupted (if FA is on cooldown), and it makes a reasonable filler against shadows/assassins who have popped their tech shield.

[ArchangelLBC]

Probably talking about getting it interrupted.

 

CB has a prominent place on my hotbar for PvP, even as full gunnery. I'll switch to it when GR is interrupted (if FA is on cooldown), and it makes a reasonable filler against shadows/assassins who have popped their tech shield.

 

Also not bad for baiting an interrupt. I just don't have enough keybinds to keep it keybound most of the time >=(