ZapBrannagan Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 So what now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natharon Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Boom head shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightchrome Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 How exactly is "making surge work the same as everything else" a nerf? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natharon Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 How exactly is "making surge work the same as everything else" a nerf? Well when you take something, and then you make it less than what it was, that is a nerf. :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightchrome Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Well when you take something, and then you make it less than what it was, that is a nerf. :| So what you're saying is that you want the system to remain broken in your favour? That sounds fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niaoru Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 So what you're saying is that you want the system to remain broken in your favour? That sounds fair. It is fair. It works in everyone's favor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyrantLeader Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 It is fair. It works in everyone's favor. It is unfair to others that don't use the surge rating since their rating is lower by 10 percent... BUT it is UNFAIR to smugglers because supposedly we got balanced by nerfing shootfirst & fletchette but are now getting a 10 percent broad nerf to bring us below others without giving something back. SO either their balancing process has an error rate of 20 percent or they can't add. everyone shake your head and walk away & roll sorc imp because bw is the child that got left behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Prime Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 every class uses surge. It's less of a nerf and more of an indirect buff to tanks since damage will be *slightly* decreased. Truly not a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utuwer Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Flechette armor pen down 50% to 30%, Shoot First dmg was reduced 20%. Now Surge dmg down 10%. For a dps class relies heavy on crit+surge like sco, it is really really big deal. BW does not like burst. Ok, i can deal with it! But where is our sustain dps in compensate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeoLager Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 every class uses surge. It's less of a nerf and more of an indirect buff to tanks since damage will be *slightly* decreased. Truly not a big deal. If you understand concealment/scrapper pvp, its actually quite a big change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raice Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 It is unfair to others that don't use the surge rating since their rating is lower by 10 percent... BUT it is UNFAIR to smugglers because supposedly we got balanced by nerfing shootfirst & fletchette but are now getting a 10 percent broad nerf to bring us below others without giving something back. SO either their balancing process has an error rate of 20 percent or they can't add. everyone shake your head and walk away & roll sorc imp because bw is the child that got left behind. I brought all of this stuff up into my thread I wrote. I spoke about this VERY thing - Critical Damage. I was right on point with it. No one listened. Now they are seeing the bigger picture, because Surge (Critical Amplifier) is also effecting Healing - which is a massive problem. Our job as Scrappers was to take those guys out. Once they nerfed us, we were no longer able to keep healing in check. So everyone is going nuts with it. They should have nerfed Surge before they did ANYTHING. Now, you have 2 mirror AC's that were nerfed for no reason (we all knew it, and shame on those people who said we needed it - you know who you are) and 2 more mirror ACs that got buffed, and didn't need it. They're going to have to undo all of that. There's no way around it. The problem with Heals is going to be somewhat reduced because the other AC's will be able to deal with it... but we will literally be hosed. We're already the worst class... this is going to put us in the coffin. I'm pretty sure BW is coming around though... they've caught the real problem. They'll have to buff us. Let's hope they do the right thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antiviolence Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 every class uses surge. It's less of a nerf and more of an indirect buff to tanks since damage will be *slightly* decreased. Truly not a big deal. If you actually play a Scoundrel/Operative then you'll know how important surge and burst is to the class. We have gone from the class people aim for because of fear to a class that people aim because we're easy prey. This, apart from the earlier 20% opener dmg and 20% armor pen nerf, is going to hurt us more than any other class. From what it seems, BW is just taking the easy way out by nerfing everyone's surge. Sure, grav round/tracer will seem less painful on crit, maybe a JK/SW cleave won't hurt as much but c'mon that isn't the way to do things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VertisReaper Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) by nerfing...you mean bringing it in line with other stats so that surge is not the end all stat of choice for 90% of the classes/specs in the game? Edited February 10, 2012 by VertisReaper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offbeatpaladin Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Everyone knew surge was the problem from the get go. All I can say is, bout time? Maybe we can get our armor pen and shoot first damage back now? People were saying how broken surge was even in beta. As usual, no one listened, and this class is going to suffer for it. It's nice that it's a broad nerf to everyone instead of just us this time, but with our previous nerfs already it poops on us more than everyone else. How about they nerf 20% on Projects, shadow strikes, force sweeps, tracers/heatseekers/gravs/demo rounds/railshots/HiBs, etc so the other classes can see the position that we're in so they can see what we're complaining about. I'd say hey just buff us to compensate, but I doubt that'll happen. Espeically with the sophisticated 'metrics' that bioware uses in their 'balancing act'. Just to be clear, I think the surge nerf is a fantastic idea. This is what should have happened BEFORE the shoot first nerf, before the Flechette Round nerf. Should have happened with the consumable nerf and absolutely no one would be whining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapex Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) The change to surge is a consistency change, nothing more and nothing less. Edited February 10, 2012 by Mapex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyrantLeader Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Everyone knew surge was the problem from the get go. All I can say is, bout time? Maybe we can get our armor pen and shoot first damage back now? People were saying how broken surge was even in beta. As usual, no one listened, and this class is going to suffer for it. It's nice that it's a broad nerf to everyone instead of just us this time, but with our previous nerfs already it poops on us more than everyone else. How about they nerf 20% on Projects, shadow strikes, force sweeps, tracers/heatseekers/gravs/demo rounds/railshots/HiBs, etc so the other classes can see the position that we're in so they can see what we're complaining about. I'd say hey just buff us to compensate, but I doubt that'll happen. Espeically with the sophisticated 'metrics' that bioware uses in their 'balancing act'. Just to be clear, I think the surge nerf is a fantastic idea. This is what should have happened BEFORE the shoot first nerf, before the Flechette Round nerf. Should have happened with the consumable nerf and absolutely no one would be whining. Their balancing method seems to be retarded... Obviously surge is important to some classes more then others.... so flat out cut without giving something back seems illogical. I wish we had combat log etc so we can provide them with numbers and math because clearly they can't do it. Also give up hope of ever getting anything back. BW seems to be want to have everyone play sorcerors and run around bubbling each other. Of all the classes that got buffed the watchman spec for jk was retarded. Off to roll a sage with a guildy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WallyRez Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 by nerfing...you mean bringing it in line with other stats so that surge is not the end all stat of choice for 90% of the classes/specs in the game? What would you rather me use as scrapper accuracy or alacrity? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyrantLeader Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 What would you rather me use as scrapper accuracy or alacrity? lol +1... if you didn't want people to take the surge mods from their duplicate token gear and put them into their pvp gear BW you are retarded... why wouldn't you allow us to optimize our gear. Did you want everyone to just wear the same gear they get with same base stats... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutchmrchurch Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 if your stacking surge over power>crit then your severly mistakin about the scoundrel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WallyRez Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 if your stacking surge over power>crit then your severly mistakin about the scoundrel The way stats work its go with more End or more Cunning. Go with more Crit or more Power Go with more Surge or more Acc or Alacrity. I cant trade in my Crit/Surge or Power/Surge enchantments for Crit/Power ones... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHoppa Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Actually have a look at the way it reads. It does not state that it will lower your base surge, so it will remain at 50%. "It will lower the per point contribution by 10%". That reads to me, that if i have enough surge (about 220 surge points give or take) to reach 80% (giving a bonus of 30% surge), those 220 surge points will provide 10% less surge. That means instead of getting 30% bonus, i will get a 27% bonus. This is not that big a nerf guys, and it affects everyone. They obviously felt that surge was a little too easy to stack, so are making a small change that affects all classes. It you want high surge, it will still be easily attainable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalexkhan Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 The way stats work its go with more End or more Cunning. Go with more Crit or more Power Go with more Surge or more Acc or Alacrity. I cant trade in my Crit/Surge or Power/Surge enchantments for Crit/Power ones... Exactly... But apparently bringing the reality of gear choices up around some people is a "mistake" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutchmrchurch Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The way stats work its go with more End or more Cunning. Go with more Crit or more Power Go with more Surge or more Acc or Alacrity. I cant trade in my Crit/Surge or Power/Surge enchantments for Crit/Power ones... myt bad i was reffering to healing scoundrel forgot to post htat in my comment lol my bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leLoir Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) Since there is a softcap on Surge, in fact this change will be relatively beneficial for us scrappers. Since we can't trade surge for crit or power, and don't give a **** about alacrity/accuracy, we ended up with TOO MUCH surge. We can definitely take this nerf without any problem. The nerf will be felt more by classes who were stacking both surge and ala/accu. Edited February 11, 2012 by leLoir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldin Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Yeah. If it works by softening up the cap on Surge, we should come out ahead. Hopefully that's the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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