originaltodzilla Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 I know I sound like a broken record when it comes to talking "DPS Commando", but it seems like there is a wide variety of "theories" on what's best. I guess mathematically it can be calculated (and maybe someone did, or maybe I should) to determine what truly is the best "Damage Per Second" on this class. My concern isn't the debate of "Assault vs Gunnery", this post only deals with Gunnery and how it pertains to PvP and PvE. For this debate, I want to concentrate more on PvP, because IMO PvP translates better to PvE, than the other way around. Also keep in mind the OBVIOUS things such as good placement, team strategy (healers and tanks) are implied and assumed, along with being lvl 50. First since we are talking Gunnery lets make it easy by assuming we are going to pick the ENTIRE gunnery tree, then say what we are "removing". Also assume we'll stick with the theory "Alacrity is bad", so all those skills are ignored as well. I'm also assuming that Grav Round, Full Auto and Demolition Round are the primary attacks as well (along with Armor-piercing Cell). Gunnery 0/2 Reserve Round (Reduces the cooldown of Concussive Round by [7.5 / 15] seconds and Reserve Powercell by [15 / 30] seconds.) 0/2 Cover Fire (Full Auto has a [50 / 100]% chance to slow the target's movement speed by 50% for 2 seconds.) 0/2 Tenacious Defense (Reduces the cooldown of Concussion Charge by [5 seconds / 10 seconds] and Tenacity by [15 seconds / 30 seconds].) 0/2 Concussive Force (Concussion Charge's Knockback effect is stronger and pushes enemies [2 / 4] meters further away.) 1/2 Advanced Tech (Increases healing received by [1 / 2]% and all healing done by [1 / 2]%.) Combat Medic 0/2 Cell Capacitor (Recharge Cells now immediately recharges [1 additional cell / 2 additional cells].) 0/3 Field Training (Increases ranged and tech critical chance by [2 / 4 / 6]%.) Assault Specialist 0/3 Target Lock (Increases ranged and tech accuracy by [1 / 2 / 3]%.) 0/3 Soldier's Endurance (Increases Endurance by [ 1 / 2 / 3]%.) My thoughts: Reserve Round, I personally don't spam the Reserve Powercell that much nor do I use Concussion charge in PvP. In PvE, I just have to wait to use it as CC. Cover Fire. Does it really slow PvP targets down? I prefer Cryo Grenade. I do not have any points in this skill at this time, but will switch for my new build. Tenacious Defense. No skill points yet, but it does look attractive as I do like using knockback in PvP. Will be in my next build. Concussive Force. Once again if you had to choose, would you have a bigger knockback vs a faster cooldown? Or both and sacrifice something else? Advanced Tech. I personally have 2 points in this as I like receiving healing, but does 1% make a diff?. May go down to 1 point. Cell Capacitor, this is a no brainer I think. When you are out of ammo, faster is better Field Training. Again it's assumed the crit and tech chance are important. Target Lock. Again assumed tech accuracy counts. Soldier's Endurance. Debatable. I like the feeling of having more endurance, but in the end this is a DPS class, not a Tank class, so I say this one can be let go. Another thought is anything that is a "stat" can always be improved by gear, which leaves the logic that stats like crit and endurance don't matter "as much" as the ACTUAL skills you get to execute. In the end this is what I went for, but I'm always up for trying something else: My Gunnery Build. The only thing in question was Tenacious Defense as I figured I could probably live with the 5 second cooldown... What are your guy's thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
originaltodzilla Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 Anything? I was hoping at least to get the feel for if the tech bonuses were better to have than the actual skills in the gunnery tree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meuwdy Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 My current spec is almost identical to the one you've posted. The only difference is I went 2/2 in Tenacious Defense and didn't put any points into Advanced Tech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiphere Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Anything? I was hoping at least to get the feel for if the tech bonuses were better to have than the actual skills in the gunnery tree. You lost me at "better pvp makes better pve". That's wholly inaccurate. Especially for "DPS" because DPS in PVP is nothing like it is in PVE. In PVE you want sustained, manageable DPS with optimally the ability to throw some heavy burst after doing a long amount of sustained DPS. In PVP you want the ability to blow some one up as fast as possible and have mobility. Those two things aren't mutually exclusive but they are very different and building for them greatly diversifies your damage, mostly in the sustainment category. I'm a merc primarily (I have a trooper but my merc is my main) so I can speak to it from my darker side. Optimal DPS even for PVE is going to differ depending on the content you're going for. If you're raiding you're going to need the ability to do heavy single target DPS, manage threat, and maintain a long fight with potential burst. For flashpoints you have a lot of 'groups' of mobs and AE DPS is viable and useful if you have a solid tank. If you're just questing.. well it doesn't really matter so I'll skip over that. The Gravround build (tracer missle for merc) appears to be, on paper at least, the superior "raid" spec because your debuffs benefit the group and save other classes from having to use their armor debuff abilities so they can focus on a higher DPS rotation/priority system since we 'have' to throw TM/Grav out there to do optimal DPS. It gives you more single target DPS options and provides you with more options for lining up a little burst. In PVP it's very dependant on playstyle. A tracer/grav build will be very turret oriented. You don't get a lot of on the move abilities so if you're the type of person who likes to hide up on a ledge or run up in range of the melee mash and pick targets to blow up it'll be better. If you need mobility you go gunnery/pyro as they have more instants and more 'dot' damage which allows for more mobility and with the snares more kiting options (which you'll need because it offers less burst options). The pyro build focuses more on dots btu DOES have some burst, however, because of the dots you can spread your damage around very well, less important to overall team success but looks great on the stats board at the end of the game because you can effectively DPS multiple targets and really crank up that damage total. Especially if you get enough dots off before you die you have the advantage of doing damage even while you're in the respawn area. Pyro builds have some burst so they're not worthless in PVP and the added mobilty is a huge plus to some people. Instants can't be interupted or LOSed so people generally feel more effective in those specs in PVP. As far as the pyro style build for PVE, it doesnt offer the same utility to the raid as the TM/Grav build but I believe it can offer similar DPS for the merc/trooper themselves. it falls behind in overall usefullness because while you're DPS may be on par with the merc/commando beside you the raids DPS will not be as good if you're pyro/gunnery vs if you were tm/grav build because of the reasons I stated above. We 'have' to throw our debuff out there to get the procs we need for optimal DPS so we're gonna throw the debuffs whether we want to or not. Other classes who would usually handle that role can do other attacks now which are more effecient/higher DPS + everyone benefits from our debuff which makes the entire ops DPS go up. While ours may be comparable to other merc/com builds that TM/Grav build offers more to the raid than the pyro/gunnery. That said, I expect to see grav/tm adjusted in the future. Not that i think it needs it, but when the community barks and *****es as much as it is about something the company usually notices and does something to try and shut them up. it'll be a mistake imo, Merc/Commando in TM/Grav spec flows well, has a good synergy of abilities at high levels but people at lower levels are seeing the 20-30 mercs/commandos spamming TM thinking it's a 1 button class. For 10 levels it is pretty effective to just spam grav/tm, after you get a few more talents to prop up unload and railshot it suddenly becomes the 'thing you do between cooldowns on your good abilities' but people don't see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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