Kanharn Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 can we trade some of these kids who cry about everything, for some real mmo players? thanks. ha ha, this wins the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannic Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 (edited) What conflict am I looking for? I've posted something constructive and you choose to attack me on the grounds that I disagreed with a guy who called me a whiner. Like him, instead of refuting my points you choose to focus on me. How's about returning to the topic at hand? Ignore it. That poster likes to bombard people with absurdities, and then declare that he has roundly bested you in a battle of wits. He reminds me of Vizzini in Princess Bride. Edited January 30, 2012 by Mannic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selaik Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 What conflict am I looking for? I've posted something constructive and you choose to attack me on the grounds that I disagreed with a guy who called me a whiner. Like him, instead of refuting my points you choose to focus on me. How's about returning to the topic at hand? Ok , I agree there needs to be more features that make this game more open more group friendly , I don't think it needs to come at the cost of the story , And I also understand that this being an "MMO" it is never finished patches will come new things will be added , I am sorry some need everything now , no MMO as ever been released fully finished its an evolving media that will constantly change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krinaman Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Did I say those games were better? You say you want it more "MMO like". I'm just trying to figure out which MMO is actually like what you are describing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanharn Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 For story, I'll read a book. If I'm hungry, I'll eat food. These things are logical to me. Everything being solo in an MMO is illogical to me. I enjoyed FFXI as my favorite game of all-time and I was subbed to that game for 6 years. I felt like a part of the community, I made friends, and enjoyed my gaming experience. I'm not saying that type of game is for everyone, but it certainly was the best game for me, and the people that I played with. To get anything accomplished you really needed people to play with, because the content was so difficult that it wasn't soloable. That made it feel like an MMO to me. All the games that come out now that call themselves MMO's are anything but. yeah because this game is so different to other MMO's. You quest solo until you need to team up for heroics and instances. What kind of MMO would ever make you do that, must be a solo player game ROFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanharn Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 As much as I enjoy the class quests, I can assure you that as a long time MMO player, two minute cutscenes of a guy explaining why I need to go kill an arbitrary number or people and click on an arbitrary amount of glowing blue items is the LAST thing I wanted out of a "next gen" MMO. How about more features that encourage socialization and large scale exploration and combat? You know, like MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER kind of suggests. If you bothered to read up on the game before purchase, you would know it was pitched as a story based MMO. http://www.swtor.com/info. Maybe research what you are buying next time to stop any confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalex Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Ok , I agree there needs to be more features that make this game more open more group friendly , I don't think it needs to come at the cost of the story , And I also understand that this being an "MMO" it is never finished patches will come new things will be added , I am sorry some need everything now , no MMO as ever been released fully finished its an evolving media that will constantly change. Never said I need everything now, or else I would hit the unsub button and move on. I am willing to wait. The changes need to be drastic however, and what worries me is the framework is set in place to make such changes incredibly difficult. It's not incredibly easy to shift focus from creating content that is very story oriented to content that is MMO oriented, the philosophy needs to be changed. Now that they've made every quest voice acted, they will take flak for making some quests not voice acted. The latter is what they should do, as that will let the budget go to more important things, but if they do it they will take a hit from people that get too used to them. The thing is, those people don't make an MMO survice. Even if everyone of them rolls all 8 classes and plays through to 50 (which is highly unlikely), they will be done and leave. Real MMO players need some more incentive to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShonaChaos Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 yeah because this game is so different to other MMO's. You quest solo until you need to team up for heroics and instances. What kind of MMO would ever make you do that, must be a solo player game ROFL. So you solo to level cap with no idea about group mechanics, simply to run dungeons with people you've never seen before and don't care about hoping to get a drop you can win a roll on... ya, great game mechanic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selaik Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Ignore it. That poster likes to bombard people with absurdities, and then declare that he has roundly bested you in a battle of wits. He reminds me of Vizzini in Princess Bride. lol ok The greats sin of Blizzard was to introduce on line gaming to the "Boom Head Shot" crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowanThursday Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 No way, on taking out the voice-conversations in quests. Getting to see my character 'as a person', expressing emotion and communicating with others... is what makes this game so much fun. Stalking back into a base after a mission that became a lot messier than it sounded at the outset, confronting the quest giver and threatening them with extreme violence if they ever give me such a silly quest again... sheer joy. I'm at a loss to see how you think removing that innovative and fun feature would get anywhere toward your goal of beefing up the MMO aspects, really... can we not have both? Again, to reiterate what others have said... it's a bad idea to 'force' community, and it doesn't work. Community will come with time. Right now, an awful lot of players are playing through the story for the first time, in a whole new world. When we're on our second or third character, *know* the rules, *know* the world... that's when people will start talking to each other more. At least, they will so long as they don't feel they're being bullied into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Comments like those made by the OP astound me, Swtor is the most group orientated rpg I have played in 15 years. You have heroic quests, flashpoints, warzones, and Operations, what more is needed? Sure due to instanced planets it appears as though there arent many people around but as far as grouping goes if you dont do it you get to see less than 25% of the game. I want more solo material, I want to be able to run heroic quests with 3 companions, I do not want to be forced into grouping with virtual strangers. As far as a solo friendly game, that Swtor claimed to be, it is nothing short of a failure. As an RPGMMO the game is incredibly amazing............BW show some love for people who have no interest in pretending to be interested in anonymous internet personalities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smartalectwo Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I don't quite grasp why the phases are so much of a problem. The phases for class quests are solo for story reasons, but folk don't seem to have a problem with that. The phases for group missions and the like, the people in there are in a group so they've got company, and if you're not in that cave with company of your own, you wouldn't see them anyway as they're in a building or cave or whatever. As for the group quest instances that are easily solo'd, they don't last long. I've been seeing plenty of people running around in quest areas, still. Not saying there aren't problems, but phasing doesn't seem to be one of them, to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selaik Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Never said I need everything now, or else I would hit the unsub button and move on. I am willing to wait. The changes need to be drastic however, and what worries me is the framework is set in place to make such changes incredibly difficult. It's not incredibly easy to shift focus from creating content that is very story oriented to content that is MMO oriented, the philosophy needs to be changed. Now that they've made every quest voice acted, they will take flak for making some quests not voice acted. The latter is what they should do, as that will let the budget go to more important things, but if they do it they will take a hit from people that get too used to them. The thing is, those people don't make an MMO survice. Even if everyone of them rolls all 8 classes and plays through to 50 (which is highly unlikely), they will be done and leave. Real MMO players need some more incentive to stay. again I agree with your hypothesis , the problem is they are 6 years deep in making the game different by using "voice acting" it will be very hard for them to turn on a dime, I believe a balance can be struck but it will take time . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShonaChaos Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Comments like those made by the OP astound me, Swtor is the most group orientated rpg I have played in 15 years. You have heroic quests, flashpoints, warzones, and Operations, what more is needed? Sure due to instanced planets it appears as though there arent many people around but as far as grouping goes if you dont do it you get to see less than 25% of the game. I want more solo material, I want to be able to run heroic quests with 3 companions, I do not want to be forced into grouping with virtual strangers. As far as a solo friendly game, that Swtor claimed to be, it is nothing short of a failure. As an RPGMMO the game is incredibly amazing............BW show some love for people who have no interest in pretending to be interested in anonymous internet personalities. I had to quote this... It's funny you think this is a great "MMO" and it fails as a solo-friendly game! lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I had to quote this... It's funny you think this is a great "MMO" and it fails as a solo-friendly game! lmao It's funny you use the term lmao............why do the youth butcher the english language? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalex Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 No way, on taking out the voice-conversations in quests. Getting to see my character 'as a person', expressing emotion and communicating with others... is what makes this game so much fun. Stalking back into a base after a mission that became a lot messier than it sounded at the outset, confronting the quest giver and threatening them with extreme violence if they ever give me such a silly quest again... sheer joy. I'm at a loss to see how you think removing that innovative and fun feature would get anywhere toward your goal of beefing up the MMO aspects, really... can we not have both? Again, to reiterate what others have said... it's a bad idea to 'force' community, and it doesn't work. Community will come with time. Right now, an awful lot of players are playing through the story for the first time, in a whole new world. When we're on our second or third character, *know* the rules, *know* the world... that's when people will start talking to each other more. At least, they will so long as they don't feel they're being bullied into it. It is a bad idea to force community, 100% agree with you there. The community is however necessary and needs to be there from the onset of the game. I've also never said to completely remove the story of the game, but there needs to be some balance. The story pillar should not overshadow the exploration, combat and progression pillars. The progression pillar is of incredible importance. It is the so called carrot on a stick that keeps MMO players playing. You cannot change it for story and as seen here, there is no more story at some point. The game can't be just rerolling all the other classes as alts. When those people see how easy it is (and by god is it ever way too easy to lvl in this game) to get to 50 without talking to anyone, they won't group. When they as you so put it, *know the world* and that world has no need for any grouping, they won't group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShonaChaos Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 It's funny you use the term lmao............why do the youth butcher the english language? I need to be a youth to use a common internet term? I guess if you want to get into butchering grammar and spelling, is it proper to use a dozen periods? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorddaviess Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 (edited) The last thing I want is force grouping. Playing LOTRO, most of the time, force grouping, even for the story quest, was a pain in the neck. Partly because I live in the East Pacific, which means my servers are always, next to empty. So I for one don't want force grouping, but do I still group? Yeah, its fun. Edited January 30, 2012 by Lorddaviess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalex Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 It's funny you use the term lmao............why do the youth butcher the english language? I'm sorry that his response wasn't quite tactful as your post deserved, but I sincerely need more explanation. Are we playing the same game here? Not sure, you are looking for an MMO the way you are describing TOR. A heroic 4 mission can't be you and 3 companions, or else why have other players there? That game already exists, and its made by Bioware too, also in space too. This game isn't supposed to be a RPGMMO (not sure what that is), it's advertised as a AAA MMORPG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StonySpider Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 It is a bad idea to force community, 100% agree with you there. The community is however necessary and needs to be there from the onset of the game. I've also never said to completely remove the story of the game, but there needs to be some balance. The story pillar should not overshadow the exploration, combat and progression pillars. The progression pillar is of incredible importance. It is the so called carrot on a stick that keeps MMO players playing. You cannot change it for story and as seen here, there is no more story at some point. The game can't be just rerolling all the other classes as alts. When those people see how easy it is (and by god is it ever way too easy to lvl in this game) to get to 50 without talking to anyone, they won't group. When they as you so put it, *know the world* and that world has no need for any grouping, they won't group. Wrath of the Lich king. Going from 70-80, was an absolutely terrible click fest. The whole Warcraft mythos interests me and the characters and factions are cool, but I got to the point where I was just like; "Just get me through this so I can get to the fun stuff." As opposed to SWTOR, where leveling is actually an enjoyable experience. When you get a quest, and someone tellls you, verbally, exactly what they want you to do and why they need you to do it, it's just on a whole other calibre than looking for that yellow question mark, clicking through all the dialogue and leveling as fast as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkilledSeeker Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Comments like those made by the OP astound me, Swtor is the most group orientated rpg I have played in 15 years. You have heroic quests, flashpoints, warzones, and Operations, what more is needed? Sure due to instanced planets it appears as though there arent many people around but as far as grouping goes if you dont do it you get to see less than 25% of the game. I want more solo material, I want to be able to run heroic quests with 3 companions, I do not want to be forced into grouping with virtual strangers. As far as a solo friendly game, that Swtor claimed to be, it is nothing short of a failure. As an RPGMMO the game is incredibly amazing............BW show some love for people who have no interest in pretending to be interested in anonymous internet personalities. Why are you playing an MMO when you hate everything MMOs are supposed to stand for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StonySpider Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Why are you playing an MMO when you hate everything MMOs are supposed to stand for? Right, because WoW, the standard by which all other MMOs are measured, is so terrible for solo-ing. Like all the questing areas aren't total ghost-towns and you play with other players ALL THE TIME outside of running random dungeons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeseer Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I'm really curious. What MMO are you wanting to trade for? You said why you don't like the story. What do you want in its place? More grinding? More punishment for making mistakes? Seriously, I want to know. Because the MMOs I've played, if they weren't story based, were simply based on the gear treadmill and large raids. And this game has both of those things, in addition to the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surakis Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Yes, I'm sure in your dualistic universe, there are only lovers and haters, and nothing in-between. You'll need a few million more years of evolution before you reach the point of "nuanced thought." "Good, I can feel your anger. I am defenseless. Take your weapon. Strike me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalex Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Wrath of the Lich king. Going from 70-80, was an absolutely terrible click fest. The whole Warcraft mythos interests me and the characters and factions are cool, but I got to the point where I was just like; "Just get me through this so I can get to the fun stuff." As opposed to SWTOR, where leveling is actually an enjoyable experience. When you get a quest, and someone tellls you, verbally, exactly what they want you to do and why they need you to do it, it's just on a whole other calibre than looking for that yellow question mark, clicking through all the dialogue and leveling as fast as possible. The Warcraft mythos interests me too and the direction they eventually took it dissapoints me greatly... Especially starting with Wrath, which as you say was a major clickfest. The thing is though, TOR is just disguising the same quests we did in WoW with cut scenes and attempts to slow down the leveling process, because there is nothing at the end to keep you playing your main character for more than a few weeks. I'm one of the few people that actually enjoyed reading those quests in WoW. At least in Vanilla you actually needed to read them to know where to go. The game was also not as linear as this one where I'm literally doing the same planets in the same order all the time. Even in WotLK I could decide where to level at least. Here I outlevel the zone I'm in so incredibly fast that the quests get almost all gray before I'm done with a planet. Even then getting to 50 is so incredibly quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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