Bioware: Allow Advanced Class Respec!

[Carthil]

What's sad about this whole argument is that it's not actually based on people's like or dislike of a specific class, but more specifically that they don't find that class effective at endgame. I see so much hate back and forth, but what it boils down to is two common complaints:

 

People don't find the sentinel/marauder to be effective at endgame. People don't find operative effective at endgame (unless healing).

 

This is not a problem with the class. Clearly you leveled to 50 and didn't hate it, or you would have stopped around 15 or 16 and started over. This is a problem with balance and with endgame content. And this is something that will change. As soon as you get your AC switch and flip flop all over the place, Bioware will add new content in which the class you changed from suddenly has an advantage, or they will adjust class abilities to make the "ineffective" class more effective. This has always been the way of MMOs.

 

Regardless, if you've learned anything from other MMOs, it should be this. At endgame, ranged dps are always desired over melee. Classes with healing or tanking specs will always be preferred over those without (unless they are ranged dps). If you roll a class that can't tank, heal, or ranged dps, you should expect to rely on guild groups as you will never be in demand. And that's really what most of these people are complaining about.

[DRocck]

NO. The class isn't determined till you reach the ADVANCED CLASS.

 

Level another character if you want to swap classes. You are given cheap respec's to provide options for how you want to play. You can not simply "CHANGE YOUR CLASS".

 

If you pick a priest in WoW, you have 2 healing specs and a dps one through talents. It may not be the top dps, but it is a dps spec. What your asking is basically allow you to roll a mage even thou you chose a priest.

 

This is NOT going to happen.

[MalignX]

NO. The class isn't determined till you reach the ADVANCED CLASS.

 

Level another character if you want to swap classes. You are given cheap respec's to provide options for how you want to play. You can not simply "CHANGE YOUR CLASS".

 

If you pick a priest in WoW, you have 2 healing specs and a dps one through talents. It may not be the top dps, but it is a dps spec. What your asking is basically allow you to roll a mage even thou you chose a priest.

 

This is NOT going to happen.

 

Can I get a quote from a Developer saying this is NOT going to happen?

[aznthecapn]

Agreed. No one has to justify their want for something simply because YOU want them to give you a reason you'll find valid. Their wanting it is reason enough. I find it hilarious that the Anti-AC respec crowd feels they deserve some sort of explanation, when they feel the Pro-AC respec crowd doesn't deserve the option to switch. Until there is some sort of official Developer's stance on the subject, I reserve the right to continue bumpin' this thread, regardless of all of what others think.

 

You may not think you need a reason but Bioware clearly remains unconvinced of your want since its still not in game and they have not reversed their current stance on it not going in at this time. Its them you should be working to convince - not us. And for that you DO need justification.

 

No, playstyle is not a reason because it does not define the AC's as "separate classes" as they share abilities, have the exact same stories and have no effect on the surrounding game whatsoever. It's exactly the same as saying you can't respec from Sage heals to Sage dps. And what, so because RP'ers will have a "reduced quality", which I still don't understand how since they can choose -not- to respec, then the rest of us should suffer? Do you realize how few people actually RP? These arguments make no sense at all.

 

They share less than 30% of skills. You keep saying "they share skills!" but its so minimal its enough to warrant being two different classes. All tank classes have a taunt - are they all the same class because they "share abilities"?

 

So if you share the same stories, you are the same class? Like how 80% of the stories in the game are ALL classes so they are all the same class?

 

Neither of these are playstyle reasons. Playstyle is how your character interacts with your opponent be it melee or caster or healer or tank. Its nothing at all like respec which is already a part of the game.

 

So because few people RP we should ignore them entirely? Does that mean that, since so few people WANT to change ACs we should ignore them too?

Edited February 6, 2012 by aznthecapn

[Innocentone]

You may not think you need a reason but Bioware clearly remains unconvinced of your want since its still not in game and they have not reversed their current stance on it not going in at this time. Its them you should be working to convince - not us. And for that you DO need justification.

 

 

 

 

It's replies like this that fuels me to keep bumping and responding. Ac change is needed

[MalignX]

You may not think you need a reason but Bioware clearly remains unconvinced of your want since its still not in game and they have not reversed their current stance on it not going in at this time. Its them you should be working to convince - not us. And for that you DO need justification.

 

 

 

They share less than 30% of skills. You keep saying "they share skills!" but its so minimal its enough to warrant being two different classes. All tank classes have a taunt - are they all the same class because they "share abilities"?

 

So if you share the same stories, you are the same class? Like how 80% of the stories in the game are ALL classes so they are all the same class?

 

Neither of these are playstyle reasons. Playstyle is how your character interacts with your opponent be it melee or caster or healer or tank. Its nothing at all like respec which is already a part of the game.

 

So because few people RP we should ignore them entirely? Does that mean that, since so few people WANT to change ACs we should ignore them too?

 

Thanks for all your opinions. If someone can show me a Developer's post that states this will never be implemented, I'll quite bumpin' this thread asking for it.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Zilrota
removed trolling remark

[Innocentone]

Ac respec needed XD. Having to start over could cause people to get bored of the game and move on. Not to mention ac respec is good in case one side gets a bad nerf to that class.

[MalignX]

Ac respec needed XD. Having to start over could cause people to get bored of the game and move on. Not to mention ac respec is good in case one side gets a bad nerf to that class.

 

Agreed.

[aznthecapn]

This isn't spam. ;P Ac is needed . It adds more to the game and gives players a chance to feel both ac's out . Already for some classes if you respec your talents you can switch from heals to dps or from dps to tank. Sages can heal or dps, shadow can dps or tank. Scoundrel can heal or dps , etc. The argument against ac switching is not valid.

 

Allowing switching on a limited basis while leveling so you can see which class you prefer is fine. Allowing it at max level is not. Allowing it because your chosen class got nerfed is not. Switching roles between skill trees is not the same for half the classes in game. The argument against it is very valid, you're choosing to ignore it.

[MalignX]

I've leveled a Jugg and a Mara to 50 and found very little difference in play style, not to mention the exact same storyline for the base class. This should have been just a simple matter of respeccing AC. You have all the time in the world to level one of each, more power to ya.

 

Edit: Never got an answer to whether there was a Developer's post about their stance on this?

Edited February 6, 2012 by Vastalee
removed quote

[aznthecapn]

I've leveled a Jugg and a Mara to 50 and found very little difference in play style, not to mention the exact same storyline for the base class. This should have been just a simple matter of respeccing AC. You have all the time in the world to level one of each, more power to ya.

 

Smuggler ACs, Inquisitor ACs, Agent ACs and Consular ACs all called and wanted you to know they all feature dramatically different playstyles. Time shouldn't be a factor unless you know you won't be alive for much longer or won't have access to internet eventually (i.e. deployment) since you can level one at your leisure. You want one "now" and not be bothered to take the time it requires to level it. Odds are good you have ample time you just don't want to spend it.

[MalignX]

Can't seem to find an official post concerning this subject anywhere. Edited February 6, 2012 by MalignX

[Vlacke]

I've leveled a Jugg and a Mara to 50 and found very little difference in play style, not to mention the exact same storyline for the base class. This should have been just a simple matter of respeccing AC. You have all the time in the world to level one of each, more power to ya.

 

Edit: Never got an answer to whether there was a Developer's post about their stance on this?

 

You wont find a developer stance on this because it is pretty clear that the system is good and working as they intended it to work.

 

Also you are wrong on so many levels when you say there should be a simple AC respec, it is not a talent tree to be respecced, it is a completely DIFFERENT CLASS, with different play style and with different gear or gear stat priority.

 

And to say that a heavy armor Juggernaut tank has almost no difference when compared to a medium armor dual wielding pure DPS Marauder?!

Come on...

[MalignX]

You wont find a developer stance on this because it is pretty clear that the system is good and working as they intended it to work.

 

Also you are wrong on so many levels when you say there should be a simple AC respec, it is not a talent tree to be respecced, it is a completely DIFFERENT CLASS, with different play style and with different gear or gear stat priority.

 

And to say that a heavy armor Juggernaut tank has almost no difference when compared to a medium armor dual wielding pure DPS Marauder?!

Come on...

Thanks for your opinion, but if there's not a official developer's post on whether or not this is going to be a possibility, I think I'll continue askin.

 

Edited February 6, 2012 by Zilrota
removed trolling remark

[aznthecapn]

Thanks for your opinion, but if there's not a official developer's post on whether or not this is going to be a possibility, I think I'll continue askin.

 

 

Georg Zoeller, Principle Lead Combat Designer:

 

Mainly interface improvements that reduce the chance for players to make the wrong choice. Including the ability to preview skill-trees.

 

It's been testing favorably internally for a while and we've just started rolling this out to more broad testing.

 

This is a topic we will constantly evaluate as the game matures. It's very possible that somewhere down the line we find that we want to give people the flexibility of switching ACs, but for launch, this will not be possible.

 

Logical reasoning indicates that they had it in during beta to resolve issues with players accidentally picking the wrong one. When they added ways to inspect talent trees and explanations of what each AC does they took the ability out of the game and do not have plans to add it back in at this time.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Zilrota
removed quote

[MalignX]

Until this idea is "officially" shot down, anyone have any interesting ideas on how AC respeccing could be implemented? I'd be cool with it being a option at character creation, because as I've stated, the little two second quest to choose your AC seems a bit superfluous.

 

Edited February 6, 2012 by MalignX

[MalignX]

How about I get the idea ball rolling then?

 

1) Instead of just Sith Warrior (example), you get Juggernaut or Marauder at character creation?

2) A paid service. Not a fan of these from WoW but even a paid function would be preferable to no function.

3) A in-game cost, that scales up considerably each time.

4) A legacy perk.

 

Any of these would be fine.

 

Edited February 6, 2012 by Zilrota
removed trolling remark

[aznthecapn]

1) Pick your AC at level one. You don't get access to it until level 10. I still like how its a story driven choice.

 

2) Limited, controlled changing as you level to determine which AC you prefer. Stops at level 50.

 

3) A Legacy perk giving you a level 10 of the opposing AC once you get the other to 50.

[MalignX]

How about I get the idea ball rolling then?

 

1) Instead of just Sith Warrior (example), you get Juggernaut or Marauder at character creation?

2) A paid service. Not a fan of these from WoW but even a paid function would be preferable to no function.

3) A in-game cost, that scales up considerably each time.

4) A legacy perk.

 

Any of these would be fine.

 

5) You could be required to do some sort of quest? Perhaps put the quest in a Flash Point, whatever tickles your fancy.

6) Make a schematic for "Wonderous AC Nullifier"!

7) Hell make it a group quest.

 

C'mon and bounce this idea ball with me.

Edited February 6, 2012 by MalignX

[MalignX]

While I am a huge fan of my own opinions, surely there are others with constructive ideas.

[Innocentone]

The devs had good idea with the cost being increased to a high number of credits for any respec for AC. Elevating costs would help keep it under control.

[MalignX]

The devs had good idea with the cost being increased to a high number of credits for any respec for AC. Elevating costs would help keep it under control.

Agreed, I feel like just having the option a handful of times would let you really figure out the one ya like better. Shouldn't be too much more difficult than switchin' talents.

[MalignX]

19,000 views. Hot topic.

[Reaperchris]

Alright give us a AC Respec but make it only a one time thing.

[MalignX]

Alright give us a AC Respec but make it only a one time thing.

 

Feel like that'd defeat the purpose, seeing as if you respec and don't like the other better than the first, you're back to square one. But appreciate your input!