DeeDawg Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) Im the tank for a group of 3 that play often together but not always (healer/dps are other 2 obvi). I've got my build up to 23/0/0 and I'm quite happy with it. The next 2 points in darkness are unimpressive, but Harnessed Darkness looks like its a fight changer for the heal (I still do a fair amount of solo). In the madness tree, Raze also looks amazing. I use Crushing Darkness as my opener (not sure if im supposed to or not, but Im a big fan of dots), and even use it midfight (i know im not supposed to) after an electricute. If I want Raze, then my darkness talents stop at 23. Im clearly a casual, as Im level 33 now on my main, but my purpose of pve is to improve my character for pvp. pvp is my endgame, but not at the sacrafice of pve yet so i dont fall too far behind my group (they're a few levels up as it is). I think im awesome @ the 3 turret warzone, and bad at the other 2. Given that, wheres my next talent point go? Will I like Raze or Harnessed Darkness better?I had Deathfield early on, and was unimpressed by it. Never made it to Wither in the beta. Edited January 5, 2012 by DeeDawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texel Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The sticky post for Darkness is next...http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=78826 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeDawg Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) The sticky post for Darkness is next... http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=78826 Im well aware of the builds... Theres 2 options, darkness to 31, or darkness to 23. Im at 23 and looking for advice. My thoughts are darkness to 31 is only needed if you're a high end tank, for the 5% damage debuff. My thoughts are Madness tree is important for pvp. But thanks for reading the post subject and responding solely to that. Edited January 5, 2012 by DeeDawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethroin Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) Im well aware of the builds... Theres 2 options, darkness to 31, or darkness to 23. Im at 23 and looking for advice. My thoughts are darkness to 31 is only needed if you're a high end tank, for the 5% damage debuff. My thoughts are Madness tree is important for pvp. But thanks for reading the post subject and responding solely to that. This is exactly right. You will have an awkward time keeping thread on many mobs without Whither. This is only important in Operations. 23/0/18 can tank Flashpoints well enough as long as your DPS is clear about what they should be hitting when and how hard. Death Field out of Madness is a decent AE pickup but isn't sufficient for prolonged AE fights (again really only applies to operations). This is a very strong control-based PVP spec with instant Whirlwind, any-time Spike and force pull on top of your base-line CC you can position and control fights very well. It isn't faceroll easy, and should not be. If you are mostly doing PVP and rarely Solo-Tank operations you should be able to keep your spec between tanking flashpoints and PVP. I run this exact spec in the manner outlined. I do however change out of my willpower/crit/surge DPS gear into my endurance/defense tank gear for flashpoints. Edited January 5, 2012 by Hethroin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeDawg Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) This is exactly right. You will have an awkward time keeping thread on many mobs without Whither. This is only important in Operations. 23/0/18 can tank Flashpoints well enough as long as your DPS is clear about what they should be hitting when and how hard. Death Field out of Madness is a decent AE pickup but isn't sufficient for prolonged AE fights (again really only applies to operations). This is a very strong control-based PVP spec with instant Whirlwind, any-time Spike and force pull on top of your base-line CC you can position and control fights very well. It isn't faceroll easy, and should not be. If you are mostly doing PVP and rarely Solo-Tank operations you should be able to keep your spec between tanking flashpoints and PVP. I really hated on Deathfield when I had it (i was level 20ish). Does it get better? Knowing that Wither isn't all that important (not an op tank)...I think it comes down to Raze vs Harnessed Darkness. Raze is useful pve and pvp (though that sticky that i just read 11 pages in to make sure i wasnt making a fool of myself says it doesnt proc enough), HD is obviously useful pve, any good in PVP? I want to say Harnessed Darkness > Wither > Deathfield, but haven't a clue where Raze comes in. Edited January 5, 2012 by DeeDawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethroin Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 If you rarely, if ever, are channeling Force Lightning on someone in PVP self imposed root with low-ish DPS is not what you want to do, and in the long run thrash*2 is greater mileage. It procs Auto-Crit Shocks and Raze (you hit 2 times per Thrash so it's not that bad). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texel Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) Im well aware of the builds... Theres 2 options, darkness to 31, or darkness to 23. Im at 23 and looking for advice. My thoughts are darkness to 31 is only needed if you're a high end tank, for the 5% damage debuff. My thoughts are Madness tree is important for pvp. But thanks for reading the post subject and responding solely to that. I apologize if my reply came off harsh. To be honest I read your entire post, I too had the exact same questions and found all the answers I was looking for in the two sticky threads. Based on what I've read, I would suggest darkness to 31 for PvE hard-mode flashpoints/operations. If you plan to PvP more, then a split to Madness is a better choice for sure. Edited January 5, 2012 by Texel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkshow Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I don't PvP so my answer is strictly for PvE. From what I read, you can tank regular FPs with 23/0/18 built. Someone above mentioned that you should let your dps know when/who to dps, I agree The benefit of this hybrid built over 31/0/10 is that it is a little faster at leveling. I'm only level 23 and I'm leveling deception atm, so don't take my word on it Once you want to do hard modes and Ops, switching to 31/0/10 seems to be the way to go in tanking. I have a feeling they might eventually buff the threat of Death Field, to turn assasins into Aoe Paladin/Death Knight tanks, for those of us with WoW background... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeDawg Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) looking at how my lowbies numbers break down, I'm looking at a raze proc per 10ish melee attacks. Does Thrash count as 2? No worries about your reply. It did its job, as there were some newer posts I hadn't seen, and they soured me on Raze quite a bit. Edited January 5, 2012 by DeeDawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 looking at how my lowbies numbers break down, I'm looking at a raze proc per 10ish melee attacks. Does Thrash count as 2? No worries about your reply. It did its job, as there were some newer posts I hadn't seen, and they soured me on Raze quite a bit. Yes Thrash counts as 2, and Saber Strike would count as 3. Force Lightning would count as 4 if it was melee (it's not). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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