Vanguard hybrid spec PVP focus

[spootoo]

So I set out to make a tank/utility build for a vanguard. So far I'm level 29 and have most of my points in assault, but I kinda want to at least try something other than an obvious spec.

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801rMhrdMbRZZfhMrzh.1

 

Plasma Cell active, maximum spammage of HIB/stockstrike, storm/smoke grenades for runners and whatnot

 

viable or will i just be gimping myself? c&c greatly appreciated!

[aRtFuL]

I think it is very problematic to go shield/assault hybrid because the problem is ion cell and plasma cell are mutually exclusive here and you can't switch cells fast in this game to take advantage of both snare effects.

 

Plus, ion pulse/PC snare imo is a lot easier to spam than stockstrike/IC snare. You would probably ended up using PC most times and forgot about IC.

 

There seems to be very little synergy between Shield and Assault.

Edited January 4, 2012 by aRtFuL

[ironzerg]

Yep, you're gimping yourself. Without the extra chance for the shield to proc for Ion Cell, you'll get littl to no benefit out of those talents that proc based on shielding.

 

Essentially, your build does less damage than a straigh Shield or Assault build, with less survivability.

 

Ulitmately, if you're going deeper into the Shield tree, you're going to need Ion Cell to be effective.

[bglodt]

Yep, you're gimping yourself. Without the extra chance for the shield to proc for Ion Cell, you'll get littl to no benefit out of those talents that proc based on shielding.

 

Essentially, your build does less damage than a straigh Shield or Assault build, with less survivability.

 

Ulitmately, if you're going deeper into the Shield tree, you're going to need Ion Cell to be effective.

 

 

 

This. This guy is right on. Its hard to go hybrid with shield spec because you need Ion Cell to make it effective. The most you can hybrid with shield spec and still be effective, and not waste points, is to grab gut in tactics tree. Some people have asked about going into Assault to grab incendiary round, which by the way is an AWESOME ability, but you end up wasting talent points on things that only effect plasma cell... which if you are going more than the first 2 tiers in the shield tree is a no no. Thus unfortunately the only really viable shield "hybrid" i have found and tested is the one that grabs gut. once you get past that again you end up wasting talent points on abilities that wont synergize well, or at all with Ion cell.

 

Just for your on SA, i have played both. I love the assault tree for DPS and pvp, racking up those kills, but I have pretty much settled on shield spec with gut at level 45. in Pvp my survivability is nice, and i can 1v1 any equally geared class (not that I always win, but if i dont its at least pretty close). Unfortunately you typically wont be topping the damage charts unless you have a pocket healer, or run with a good group. All those people who are saying vanguard tanks are topping all the dps charts are 1. either very geared and their ratings will change as others catch up, 2. run with a healer buddy or another fast dps class to burn through enemies very quick, or 3. exceptionally skilled (which i apparently am not... maybe slightly above average... but no where near exceptional).

 

So its really up to your preference. The only bad thing about running pure shield is that in pve, you either tank... or you do pretty cruddy dps, comparitively. If you go assault, and i have done this before, you can off tank a bit.... but not great. I have actually switched to IC at the very end of boss battles when the tank dies and the boss only has a little health left. Dont get me wrong, you CAN NOT effectively tank as assault tree, but sometimes in dire situations you can come through in a clutch.... for a very limited amount of time... burning all your cooldowns.... and using a medpac.

 

Sorry this is so long. Hope it helps bud.

Edited January 4, 2012 by bglodt

[Guurzak]

Disregard the negative responses. Your build is pretty close to a standard PVP hybrid build that several experienced players have been very happy and successful with. However, the more common version of this build uses Ion Cell rather than Plasma, and builds in more synergies for Rail Shot. Also, skip Charge.

 

Yes, some points are "wasted" due to speccing Plasma talents you are not using, but that's a philosphical problem not necessarily a practical one: if the build is effective and enjoyable then no points are truly wasted. Take a look at this revised version:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801rRGbbMboZ0MZbIbbdh.1

[bbqsauced]

Disregard the negative responses. Your build is pretty close to a standard PVP hybrid build that several experienced players have been very happy and successful with. However, the more common version of this build uses Ion Cell rather than Plasma, and builds in more synergies for Rail Shot. Also, skip Charge.

 

Yes, some points are "wasted" due to speccing Plasma talents you are not using, but that's a philosphical problem not necessarily a practical one: if the build is effective and enjoyable then no points are truly wasted. Take a look at this revised version:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801rRGbbMboZ0MZbIbbdh.1

 

Was about ready to post, the OP was on to something, just needed some tweaking.

 

My question though is:

 

Is Focused Impact better than Static Surge?

 

How much of a survivability hit do you take without having Counterattack, Ion Shield, and Power Armor?

 

Right now I've been using full Shield Spec with great results in PvP due to my survivability, but this spec intrigues me a bit.

[bglodt]

wow... first dont disregard the comments... take them for what they are opinion. The OP asked a question and people answered it with their opinion. It' up to him or her to decide what to do once he/she has read and evaluated the merits of the arguments.

 

As far as my OPINION, and it seems that of most others, skill points are at a premium so "wasted" points are just that, wasted. With the above spec you have points in both IC and PC dependent skills... ask youself, how often are you going to be switching between the cells, given that it takes 1.5 valuable seconds to switch in pvp. If you switch a lot more power to you, most people don't. Not saying it cant be done, just that it is difficult, and not many people do it for a reason. Additionally you'll probably be running in PC since it looks like your going for dps. If thats the case why put points in Ion Overload in shield cycler instead of topping off intimidation (especially since Incend round, Ion Pulse, and PC are elemental dmg), rebraced armor, and smoke grenade? and if your going to go plasma cell you should probably consider taking ionized ignition as well as sweltering heat (which almost a must have if your going that deep into assault and running PC) for the guaranteed PC proc and slow vs super heated plasma which only increases the likliehood of a PC proc by 6%. Yes it leads to High Friction bolts which is an awesome ability, especially with IR, but again, points are at a premium. If you are ok with RNG at least take the points out of focused impact and put them into sweltering heat for the slow, since you will be kiting with this spec.

 

Anyways.... to the OP, take what everyone has said, and make your own decision based on your playstyle. There is no real "cookie cutter" build yet, so experiment around. There are always people who use some "strange" or "different" spec in PvP and do well, but that has more to do with their personal play style and ability vs the spec being "the best out there" (which by the way i dont think there is).

[Guurzak]

Is Focused Impact better than Static Surge?

 

It's a bit of a coin toss with a slight lean towards Focused Impact- the whole build is designed about HIB synergies, and Static Surge probably loses some of its interest as you gear up with more Surge. But if you like big stockstrikes (and you cannot lie) then take SS and don't worry about it.

 

How much of a survivability hit do you take without having Counterattack, Ion Shield, and Power Armor?

 

In a very close fight you'll miss them, but realistically most PVP fights don't come down to your last few percent of health.

 

Right now I've been using full Shield Spec with great results in PvP due to my survivability, but this spec intrigues me a bit.

 

Yep, there's absolutely nothing wrong with a classic 31/8/2, but this is probably the first thing I'll do with dual spec once it's patched in.

[Seigenn]

Shield spec is the way to go for Vanguards imo. I am constantly on the top of the charts. Now I am not fool enough the think its b/c I put out better damage than others, its just I last longer. Little tip for all the Vanguards out there. Tanking gear does nothing pre 50.

[airrazr]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801uMhrdMbRZZfhbbdh.1

 

i have been using this with great success. You don't NEED ion cell for anything other than: neural overload, ion overload, supercharged ion cell, and ion shield. Which i didn't take anyways. Everything else does NOT require ion cell.

 

with my build you get bonus survivability, mobility, and a touch of damage from shield tree. And get some good damage from the assault.

[Guurzak]

You also need ion cell for Guard and for a big chunk of your shield chance.

[ururururu]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801uMhrdMbRZZfhbbdh.1

 

i have been using this with great success. You don't NEED ion cell for anything other than: neural overload, ion overload, supercharged ion cell, and ion shield. Which i didn't take anyways. Everything else does NOT require ion cell.

 

with my build you get bonus survivability, mobility, and a touch of damage from shield tree. And get some good damage from the assault.

 

why would you get charge instead of static surge or high impact? or sweltering heat for that matter..

 

I don't like this build, there's wasted points.

[aRtFuL]

Disregard the negative responses. Your build is pretty close to a standard PVP hybrid build that several experienced players have been very happy and successful with. However, the more common version of this build uses Ion Cell rather than Plasma, and builds in more synergies for Rail Shot. Also, skip Charge.

 

Yes, some points are "wasted" due to speccing Plasma talents you are not using, but that's a philosphical problem not necessarily a practical one: if the build is effective and enjoyable then no points are truly wasted. Take a look at this revised version:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801rRGbbMboZ0MZbIbbdh.1

 

You realise that your tweaked build is vastly different to the OPs even though it only tweaks one or 2 talents in the assault tree, right?

 

By not picking and not using plasma cell and its snares and advantages in assault, yours is an essentially a shield centric with assault compliments build (even though you spent almost half the point in it).

 

If that's the case of course it can work, even though I still don't think it will necessarily be better than any other popular builds. However that's not what essentially the OP was asking.

Edited January 5, 2012 by aRtFuL

[Guurzak]

You realise that your tweaked build is vastly different to the OPs even though it only tweaks one or 2 talents in the assault tree, right?

 

Right.

[spootoo]

Wow, thank you all for the responses.

 

This information is quite helpful. It seems like there are definitely viable hybrid specs out there, it's just a question of testing and playtime. It will likely come at expense of lots of credits and hours of "wasted" playtime trying out fail builds. This something that I will most likely end up doing, but I think it would be wise to stick to a conventional build while leveling up.

 

I think this thread has helped me decide to play fully in the tank line for now, stick to the tried and true for PvE, and not worry too much about theoretical PvP builds until I have reached 50, twinked myself out, and learned the ins and outs of the class.