Radiatonia Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) I see. So because we don't agree with each other, and continue to disagree I should be banned from the forums? All I can say is I'm considering the same thing myself after the "knock it off" remark. However, I won't because the only reason I'm posting here to begin with is because I care about paying customers (like you) who could potentially be hurt by this. You're ignoring my post. Again. And trying to make appeals to caring about my well-being as a debating method. Just stop dude. Seriously. To get back on topic, I am never going to camp a single chest spawn for 7-12 hours. Because that would be stupid of me. Not only do I have better things to do with my life, but it's counter-productive for me. I'm not in the game to find "haxx exploits" to get ahead. I'm here to have fun. Sitting in front of a chest on a barren ice world all day does not exactly fit my description of "fun". I'm pretty sure most of the rest of the player-base is the same way. They're playing the game to have fun. Not find the best way to break it. The problem is people who do do that. Typically they aren't doing it for fun, but profit. Or rather, they are doing it for fun, but just consider the "breaking" of the game a necessary bit of tedium to get to the fun part---Steam-rolling everything else because they have godlike amounts of money and gear. Sometimes it can be fun to cheat in a single player game and become godlike, or close to it. But it's never acceptable to do it in a multi-player game where other people are playing along-side you. There's a reason why most games disable cheats in multi-player mode. No one wants to be that guy stuck in the match with some guy with god mode, a wall hack, and infinite ammo on. Edited January 3, 2012 by Radiatonia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shem Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 wow i read most of the replies and you people are stupid. first off the illum thing was people exploit the slicing/safes by double logging. no one is being banned for looting. secondly they are not banning people for farming and playing the ah, they're banning credits farmers. you're not going to get banned for farming things and selling them. a lot of this was already discussed in reddit. i feel bad for bw because they're trying to do the right thing and quell the drama as it pops up. it's nice to see them become so involved in their game from the start. too bad their dealing with illiterate wow players who probably read the reply's to the post and not the op. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niennnasil Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I seriously lolled hardly... Whatta fail.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 You're ignoring my post. Again. And trying to make appeals to caring about my well-being as a debating method. Just stop dude. Seriously. To get back on topic, I am never going to camp a single chest spawn for 7-12 hours. Because that would be stupid of me. Not only do I have better things to do with my life, but it's counter-productive for me. I'm not in the game to find "haxx exploits" to get ahead. I'm here to have fun. Sitting in front of a chest on a barren ice world does exactly fit my description of "fun". I honestly don't understand how I ignored your post. Literally the posts just above us are exactly what I was discussing five pages ago and tried to continue to discuss with Jeramie and others . People are still discussing it, as well as myself. Why are you targeting me here exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monegames Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 For every one of you that say "they could restrict it mechanically", there is someone else whose only interest is crafting that will say that they can't play the game at all because they cannot progress their craft. If you completely lock down a game to prevent credit farming, you lock out crafting and even some credit accrual. actually they could have done so in this case since the planet rewards are ment for 40+ or what ever level players either restricted the planet or restricted the specific chests to being only unlocked by 40+ players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 wow i read most of the replies and you people are stupid. first off the illum thing was people exploit the slicing/safes by double logging. no one is being banned for looting. secondly they are not banning people for farming and playing the ah, they're banning credits farmers. you're not going to get banned for farming things and selling them. a lot of this was already discussed in reddit. i feel bad for bw because they're trying to do the right thing and quell the drama as it pops up. it's nice to see them become so involved in their game from the start. too bad their dealing with illiterate wow players who probably read the reply's to the post and not the op. I believe most of the concern was that its unclear what exactly determines if your a "credit farmer?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monegames Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 wow i read most of the replies and you people are stupid. first off the illum thing was people exploit the slicing/safes by double logging. no one is being banned for looting. secondly they are not banning people for farming and playing the ah, they're banning credits farmers. you're not going to get banned for farming things and selling them. a lot of this was already discussed in reddit. i feel bad for bw because they're trying to do the right thing and quell the drama as it pops up. it's nice to see them become so involved in their game from the start. too bad their dealing with illiterate wow players who probably read the reply's to the post and not the op. I have read the OP and every post since and now where did i see Bioware explain taht they were doing what you say they were doing. and i have said it multiple times, if they were then that is fine but Bioware should come out and say that they were doing that without explaining how and the issue would be over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 actually they could have done so in this case since the planet rewards are ment for 40+ or what ever level players either restricted the planet or restricted the specific chests to being only unlocked by 40+ players. I won't argue against that. It's certainly a plausible solution for the future. In fact, it's probably a large reason why slicing was nerfed. But it did need nerfed, anyway. However, BioWare's action to temporarily pause some gameplay to keep the economy from breaking, as it stands, was a good one. After all, a few days of not playing a game never killed anyone... Hell, I just got back from a 2 week hiatus, and I survived...though I had the shakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I have read the OP and every post since and now where did i see Bioware explain taht they were doing what you say they were doing. and i have said it multiple times, if they were then that is fine but Bioware should come out and say that they were doing that without explaining how and the issue would be over. This is where some measure of trust has to come in. There's some personal information you're asking to be divulged. It simply won't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I have read the OP and every post since and now where did i see Bioware explain taht they were doing what you say they were doing. and i have said it multiple times, if they were then that is fine but Bioware should come out and say that they were doing that without explaining how and the issue would be over. This was my exact concern as well. As soon as people started saying it was for botting/ bug exploiting I was only asking for proof and continue to do so. If they are botting or exploiting "bugs" then yes they need to be banned, obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 This was my exact concern as well. As soon as people started saying it was for botting/ bug exploiting I was only asking for proof and continue to do so. If they are botting or exploiting "bugs" then yes they need to be banned, obviously. Banned =/= suspended Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) Banned =/= suspended If they aren't botting / bug exploiting then they shouldn't be suspended either. We've been over this jeramie Edited January 3, 2012 by humpacactus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monegames Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 This is where some measure of trust has to come in. There's some personal information you're asking to be divulged. It simply won't happen. no personal info would be divulged since they would not have to divulge any to simply say that the ones suspended were infact glitching the chest spawns. no names or personal info would be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 If they aren't botting / bug exploiting then they shouldn't be suspended either. We've been over this jeramie And a few days of "very few" subs being paused to keep from HUGE damage is not much collateral damage, I'm sorry to say. It just isn't, when you look at the big picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) no personal info would be divulged since they would not have to divulge any to simply say that the ones suspended were infact glitching the chest spawns. no names or personal info would be used. It specifically says in the OP Post: "By comparison, the number of accounts that were warned or temporarily suspended was considerably lower than the number of accounts banned for 'credit farming'." So yes, players had been at least temporarily banned for credit farming. People just want to know the details because generally credit farming is a legitimate thing for most MMO's. Edited January 3, 2012 by humpacactus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monegames Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 It specifically says in the OP Post: "By comparison, the number of accounts that were warned or temporarily suspended was considerably lower than the number of accounts banned for 'credit farming'." So yes, players had been at least temporarily banned for credit farming. People just want to know the details because generally credit farming is a legitimate thing for most MMO's. i think the "credit farming" part to = the gold sellers that they spoke of in earlier in the post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 no personal info would be divulged since they would not have to divulge any to simply say that the ones suspended were infact glitching the chest spawns. no names or personal info would be used. If I gave you some information that was deemed "personal" by some authoritative contract or government, I would be liable, even if YOU don't recognize the information as personal. If someone told you something I specifically did, but never told you my name, it's still personal information. And make no mistake, the most MUNDANE pieces of information are considered liable. This case included. Besides, other details, which may not be personal, would only lead to further erroneous speculation without the divulgence of said personal information. It's a slippery slope. Or, I suppose it's proper to say, it's a sarlaac pit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiatonia Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) I honestly don't understand how I ignored your post. Literally the posts just above us are exactly what I was discussing five pages ago and tried to continue to discuss with Jeramie and others . People are still discussing it, as well as myself. Why are you targeting me here exactly? You cherry-picked part of it. Meaning you replied to the parts that best built your own defense. This is going to be my last post to you. You seem to have taken up a habit of asking me to repeat myself. Which is like talking to a brick wall. Furthermore, I am not "targeting" you. You're the only one to throw around insults these past few pages at the people who disagree with you. When people disagree with you, you call them a fanboy. Then, you call them trolls a few pages later. Then you go back to fanboy again. That's no way to act amongst people talking about a topic. Especially since you phrase the things you say to try and incite responses. To get back on topic again. A credit (or gold) seller is someone who attempts to sell credits. The "definition" of one is fairly varied. But having known and worked with people who had to deal with the head-ache of dealing with them in the past, they do do some common things nowadays. That includes spamming chat with a link to a (probably keylogger and virus infested) web-site. Sell in-game money for credits. Steal accounts to assist with the farming of credits. And destabilize the server economy. Which makes it easier for them to sell more credits, and steal more accounts since some people end up getting desperate and decide to chance it, eventually. These are all pretty much bannable things, going by the TOS. And gold sellers are very bad for the game. It's no exagerration to say that they've ruined some games and servers economies beyond any hope of repair in the past. I've already gotten two emails from gold sellers since release occured. I reported both of them. Both of them appeared to have actual names, so I assume they stole the accounts of the people that were sending the emails. Credit farming is the act of grinding out credits. This is typically done by camping a location and monopolizing access to it so no other players can take advantage of the area. When done in a game like WoW, TOR, or other game with "pre-designed" open world content, that means that not only are they making alot of money, they're actively denying people the same usage of that site without heavy competition. What's not clear is if this was "FFXI" style legit farming, or good old fashioned "found a chest that had a ton of loot in it, way over the normal amount, with easy access to it" exploit farming. From the tone of the OP, however, it's pretty obviously indicating the latter, however. Never mind details that have popped up on several other web-sites over the past few days. Edited January 3, 2012 by Radiatonia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 i think the "credit farming" part to = the gold sellers that they spoke of in earlier in the post Ya that seems to be the case. Either way you're exactly right questioning what " systematically and repeatedly" means. Clearly it doesn't mean botting or they would have said third party app/botting. So the question still remains... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightmanSpider Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 "Second, a smaller number of accounts were warned or temporarily suspended for exploiting loot containers on Ilum. To be completely clear, while players may choose to travel to Ilum earlier than the recommended level (40+) and may loot containers if they can get to them, in the cases of those customers that were warned or temporarily suspended, they were systematically and repeatedly looting containers in very high numbers resulting in the game economy becoming unbalanced." Ilum has a RECOMMENDED level of 40+, why should anyone be punished for going there early if they're willing to take the risk for gathering resources there? And if it is such a big problem, WHY can't you just lock the crates to a certain level, like 35+ or something? Come on BioWare, use your resources to fix exploits. Don't leave them there and keep banning people who do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 It specifically says in the OP Post: "By comparison, the number of accounts that were warned or temporarily suspended was considerably lower than the number of accounts banned for 'credit farming'." So yes, players had been at least temporarily banned for credit farming. People just want to know the details because generally credit farming is a legitimate thing for most MMO's. Credit farmers that were banned were those proven to be SELLING credits. All other accounts were "WARNED or TEMPORARILY SUSPENDED". Now, I'm going out on a limb here, but I'm willing to bet my life savings that those that were temporarily suspended were probably warned first, but kept doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 "Second, a smaller number of accounts were warned or temporarily suspended for exploiting loot containers on Ilum. To be completely clear, while players may choose to travel to Ilum earlier than the recommended level (40+) and may loot containers if they can get to them, in the cases of those customers that were warned or temporarily suspended, they were systematically and repeatedly looting containers in very high numbers resulting in the game economy becoming unbalanced." Ilum has a RECOMMENDED level of 40+, why should anyone be punished for going there early if they're willing to take the risk for gathering resources there? And if it is such a big problem, WHY can't you just lock the crates to a certain level, like 35+ or something? Come on BioWare, use your resources to fix exploits. Don't leave them there and keep banning people who do it. Don't even temporarily ban them. This is exactly what I've been trying to say from the start. Yes, I've defended myself along the way, like most others here as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 "Second, a smaller number of accounts were warned or temporarily suspended for exploiting loot containers on Ilum. To be completely clear, while players may choose to travel to Ilum earlier than the recommended level (40+) and may loot containers if they can get to them, in the cases of those customers that were warned or temporarily suspended, they were systematically and repeatedly looting containers in very high numbers resulting in the game economy becoming unbalanced." Ilum has a RECOMMENDED level of 40+, why should anyone be punished for going there early if they're willing to take the risk for gathering resources there? And if it is such a big problem, WHY can't you just lock the crates to a certain level, like 35+ or something? Come on BioWare, use your resources to fix exploits. Don't leave them there and keep banning people who do it. Read it again. NO ONE IS BEING PUNISHED FOR GATHERING THERE!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monegames Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 If I gave you some information that was deemed "personal" by some authoritative contract or government, I would be liable, even if YOU don't recognize the information as personal. If someone told you something I specifically did, but never told you my name, it's still personal information. And make no mistake, the most MUNDANE pieces of information are considered liable. This case included. Besides, other details, which may not be personal, would only lead to further erroneous speculation without the divulgence of said personal information. It's a slippery slope. Or, I suppose it's proper to say, it's a sarlaac pit. they have already done that then since they mentioned it earlier in the thread. doing what i said would only take their vague explanation of what happened and make it less vague. and it would not be what they specifically did if they said what i mentioned only that they did something that caused the respawn timer to reset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humpacactus Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Read it again. NO ONE IS BEING PUNISHED FOR GATHERING THERE!!! It says in the quote that a small number had been warned or temporarily suspended/banned (or basically punished). Am I really missing something obvious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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