@ Op I believe what our fellow Sorcerer's are trying to say is that... basically your wrong. I've seen your videos, you and your team have excellent skill no one should question that. However that being said there are no "viable" Sorcerer builds in any PvP situation. Now let us first examine "viable." I am sure I speak for most of the PvP community when I say a "viable" spec is a talent system you can run in an arena or warzone that you can use in a situation you have built it for with a few utilities to make up for lack of damage or healing, a hot heal for damage based Sorcerer's would be an example. Now if we look at the "FOTM" (which by now I really just consider them the FOTG flavor of the game) you will notice the outrageous gap closers, stuns, instant high hit crits, dots, defensive cool downs so on and so forth. Examine the Sorcerer and you have basically the Dollar General version of what the other classes do. I would like to think BW put some thought into our talent system but as it stands I cannot believe such a thing, however Eric has I believe for most of us restored some faith for those of us that are left that we will be fixed. However we are getting off subject. You say Madness is "viable" no offense but are you really serious? If we are to use your videos as credit to your words then you prove my and a lot of the other posters points... It is easy to shut us down we really don't hit very hard, not many escape tools to account for the stun and high damage and defensive output of the other classes. Now when you look at their instant damage vs ours, ours is so poor that really we pose no threat and are easily killed. Your healers were amazing and kept the Sorc's alive plain and simple. Did it work for you? Judging by the videos of course it did how could it not with incompetent match ups against you and the skills of those heals. I apologize for the massive read but you cannot expect us to believe any Sorcerer spec is a "viable" arena choice. To put it simple we do not put out the damage to compensate how squishy we are nor have the right defensive tools to get ourselves out of a bad situation when our healer needs a break. Force speed and our "Put your hands up" cool down are not enough when being concentrated by one let alone multiple enemies with instant crits we either have to cast for or get lucky with death field. We being nothing to the table another classes does not already have in better form damage and defense. Let alone the CC other classes bring, as Sorcerer's we should all know to well there are to many CC options for other classes. In conclusion, If you even take away everything I posted and put it to the bare bones of the class, just because something works for the low percent does not mean the rest of the player base of that class should suffer because we do not have the friends to play with in arena. Throw skill level in there and it's just not fair the amount of work needed to be put into a great sorcerer to win against an "ok" player of the FOTG class.

I wonder if Bfail has this thread on /ignore they seem more concerned with everything else than any sorc anything. Goes to show most of them play monkeys, PTz, or snips in pvp. I would really pay to see a Bfail employee play a sorc in pvp. Just to hea them go "Oh what he hit me for 10k!? and everything I have has never hit for that even my 1.7sec cast?" NERF! I'd laugh so hard

Thanks a lot for the advice guys really appreciate it. I've Tried the hybrid and I do enjoy it, I still get the feeling melee instants and other dots hit harder than ours. After seeing that I'm trying to figure our exactly what our place is in pvp BESIDES being the healers. On another note, again thank you for the hybrid build. I do miss thundering blast though. I remember the first time I used it in pvp I was thinkin "Oh yea this is guna hurt." -gets the cast off- "...................................................... what?"

Ever watch the Star Wars movies? Looks like a lot of PVP to me

Yea I really don't mean to QQ but seriously why is PVP still like this? We all love star wars and imho most of the players are here because it is star wars.. if it was the same mechanics with a different title I doubt this game would be alive. Bfail has had the better part of a year to address our issues and it looks like we still get the /ignore button.

After reading a few posts I found half the community believes we are fun and have decent burst now and the other half is unsatisfied. So I decided to spend the $$ and see for myself, my main state of mind was "how are we in pvp?" I log'd on got used to the controls and movement again and q'd for a match... Am I doing something wrong? My thundering blast hits for 3.2k max I'm in full WH and getting hit for 10k plus. I know I know BOLSTER system. Just wondering if I'm doing something wrong and this is an L2P issue or did half the sorc community jump the gun on us being viable in pvp again? If anyone has any 55 sorc pvp experience please share it. If its still horrid I'd rather save my money and time.

Had to log in for this.... For you IDIOTS (sorry no other word for it) saying "Oh yea uhh I can pull 300k plus overall in WZ's on my sorc blahblablablah" You must not understand OVERALL dps is not BURST dps which sorcs don't have any of. The arguement isnt we have no overall dps its we have no burst and that's what counts in pvp. Overall dps is for PVE anyone who says otherwise can't pvp. The reason sorcs have high overall dps is because we have to cast more spells to attempt (see what I did there?) to kill someone vs them using 2-3 abilities. Eventually all those kill attempts (lol see?) add up which gives you the overall dps. /rant off

Bahahaha are you joking Dev? You just said so many things that confirms you guys hate sorcs! I think the one that stands out the most is "We dont have any plans on making Static Barrier worse than it currently is." So you admit its bad because I know my fellow sorcs will agree the amount of dmg it absorbs is terrible when compared to how hard we are hit. Lol give our bubble to another class though and when compared to the amount of dmg we do it will absorb it all and we will die before it will pop. I mean seriously BW? Second the OP took his/her time to post very good feedback on what will make the class better and more viable in pvp in tems of survivability and burst damage but all you see is the freaking shield nerf complaint. Out of all that information that is really all you got out of it? That just makes me want to throw up I'm not joking. The sorc community has taken valuable time and money we could be spending and playing on another game to stick with this class and provide constructive and well thought out feedback. What do you do you? Ignore it, this is the first yellow post I've ever seen in a sorc thread and it's jsut about the bubble. A nerf is a nerf is a nerf don't try to hide it this dev pretty much just told us what we already know. Stop trying to hide behind all the other classes and come out and admit sorcs are broken. All that time put into tying to help you Dev's realize this is wrong and sorcs need a good pvp buff all that feedback and information all those notes thought process wasted. You guys completely ignore the feedback and a fine example of it is this Dev's post. Op I'm sorry you wasted your time posting all your thoughts out, to everyone else in the past I am sorry as well BW doesn't care they can't even read the fine print. It's like sorc threads are in Egyptian to them. I'm done doing your job for you BW this is bloody embarrassing trash class belongs in the trash and that's where you've thrown us with the garbage disposal on.

Doomsday? Exactly what has BW done to the sorc that hasn't been a "doomsday" for the class? And you honestly wonder why I jump to conclusions? It's statistics and past facts that BW has done to sorcs that make me jump to "conclusions." Not to mention the idiots complaining that it's op when they all have the highest burst in game. I will bet you money if I went to th pvp threads and complained smash an AOE ability hits me for 5-6k I would not get one BW post on fixing it and would instead get one that says working as intended. I know most of us thought (and I have said this multiple times) that a Sorcerer based class would have high burst dmg and mid survivability. Well BW threw that into the fire now all we are viable (in pvp) for is a healer/support and now BW wants to take a support ability away; that's really all it is because any of us bubble sorcs know the dmg absorb is horrible.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5464257&posted=1#post5464257 Yep say goodbye to bubble

Let me get this straight, people complain about something as (almost useless) as a Sorc bubble and you say you plan on "making changes" to it in the future yet almost every thread on the Sorc class had been literally asking for some dps buffs since 1.2 and you choose to answer this post instead of ours? Why not just say what you are really going to do to sorcs let me translate for you Bioware. Ahem... "Yea we've nerf'd sorcs pretty hard sorry to hear that their bubble absorbs 2k of your damage from your 5k crit we plan on nerfing this as well in the near future." Now I really hate jumping to conclusions but with everything you have done to the sorc class for pvp... hold on I mean everything you haven't done this "future fix" means "future nerf". Sorry for the readers who hate rage but really you all know sorcs are easily kill able and now you want to take our bubble away? Bioware I've been here since the start but one more Sorc nerf and you lose my sub.

Sorc's don't have an "optimal" dps build just one that is not as "crap" as the others are. This vid was awesome though dc what the above P says.

I demand a sexy companion that doesn't complain, does whatever I say, let's me marry them without complaining about the jedi order crap, can turn to the dark side, and I can RP with as my sexy sex slave... gimme darth talon and I'll be happy.

If you read the class feed back and the sorc in pvp these days threads you'll find almost the whole sorc community agrees there is no such thing as a "dps" spec for sorcs. We have been asking for buffs sense 1.2 and have yet to get them. Personally no matte how good the player is if your playing a class with crap abilities your going to lose. So this skill vs class is wrong in this case. Though I will agree in most cases the guy above would be right but here it's not. If you'd like more information go to those threads and you'll find all you need. My advice is if you want a pvp class unless you want to heal don't play a sorc.

/Signed

Nice vid liked seeing a sorc actually get some decent crits in

Burst is important and I thought (as did the rest of us) that when designers are making a "glass cannon" spec it was obvious that that spec has high damage burst and moderate sustained (if not the highest I see no reason other classes with better armor hp and gap closers to do the same dmg we do) It has been a very hard and sometimes rage quitting pace to get my sorc geared and now that he is... my highest hit went from 2.7k to 3.0k and survivability wise........... I really have no comment other than sure against a recruit geared class it's slightly better however they still crit me for 4-7ks (depending on teir class) I'm about fed up with my sorc which is a shame months of game play money guide reading rotation crunching ruined because BW can't figure out what all the other MMO Dev's did.

1. How do you think your Sorcerer spec is perceived by other classes? Healing wise I believe other classes see us as "ok" maybe even good. Damage wise we are laughable, and do not pose any sort of threat, they see glass and no cannon. 2. How do you perceive your own spec? I play a Lightning/Madness hybrid only because there really is no other choice, the lightning tree does not have the damage output to constitute free casting let alone the instants do no more than tickle our opponent. The only reason why people see sorcs at the top of the damage chart is because we have to cast more spells and use more skills to kill our opponent since we have no burst or high crit spells to bring our opponet down as fast as they can us. In short they use less skills for more damage and we us more skills for less damage, it just adds up on the charts more than theirs which as we know in pvp doesn't matter, especially for a glass cannon.

Great vid and I really love your spec. Gave it a try and it's a lot more fun to play than my heal hybrid. One thing though.... I really hope your vid doesn't make BW go "HEY GUYS LOOK! This guy just posted a sorc vid of himself completely owning we may not have to buff sorcs for pvp after all!!!!" You really showed the community a great spec and how to maneuver doesn't change the fact the sorc is broken in a few areas though. I'm sure if we got some decent dmg mitigation and dmg buffs you would just have more awesome added to your sauce.

I haven't found much use for Parasitism just because in pvp I really don't see my dots critting that much and 1% isn't really that much when you take into account your aff may crit twice and your crushing darkness once for a total of 3% health. Even with someone not beating on you it really isn't all that great. I really like the whole double shock thing just because its a little more dmg for only having to push one button. Complicated as the sorc class is to pvp with I like to easy it up a bit.

I'm choosing not to feed the troll. Thanks for the laugh though.

So all of you are saying this guy does nothing but QQ hes bad he needs to L2P and what not. Looks like a lot of you either don't play a Sage/Sorc, or work for BW. I'm sorry but all I read was truth, he hits everything that's wrong with these two calsses on the nose and you people dont even offer constructive feed back all you do is down this guy because he states fact. So he flamed about it and it's not very constructive big deal we've all had our flame moments. You know the other funny thing? BW has shutdown threads that have gotten to the point of no return with other kids making fun of each other but they haven't locked this one... I find that rather strange.

Sorc (wall if text warning) From my own experience I tend to find myself running away more than anything. I love being a caster (obvious why I made a sorc) casters since the dawn of dawn have been hard hitters with low health and armor we all know this as a Glass Cannon. Was that design intent for the Sorc? Sometimes I wonder what our design really is. If we were designed to well... die then I'd say Bioware did a pretty good job. I've had my fair share of MMO experiences and while I'm not an elite on everything I do I like to think with the amount of time I put into my class, gearing it and learning my spec and learning other classes (in pvp you can't survive as a caster unless you know the other classes dmg/defense CD's and such duuuuh) I'm pretty good at what I do. In SWTOR what I do is DoT run Dot run Force Lightning. That's it. I hear the argument for Rock Paper whatever I'm sorry have you played an MMO? This isn't how it works. Melee should beat a caster/ranged if they get close caster/ranged should beat a melee at ranged. In between is where player skill comes into play. At this point it takes no player skill to kill a sorc and if you say it does your either the PVP happy class or a very very elite sorc and I must say congrats on that. Bottom Line- We should be designed to die in a few hits but have some dmg mitigation/escape cds AND put out massive damage. So far we are just designed to die.

A lot of us Sorc's are talking about PVP, I understand here and there some have been talking about PVE wise and while I cannot comment on PVE (because I don't) we are at the "bottom of the barrel" in PVP. And the annoying this is, it won't take much to bring us back as a viable ranked WZ team choice and just simply give us a reason to be target number one because we can actually put out some damage, not because we are easy to kill.

Strictly from PVP standpoint Thundering Blast This ability looks fearsome, death coming toward you. Well looks can be deceiving can't they? I'd like people to fear me getting this ability off. I want them to ignore others attacking them just to stop me from getting this 2sec cast spell off. As it stands most people just sit there and take it and save their interrupt(S) when I pop alacrity or when I try to run and heal. Force Lightning This to me, is our signature. It clearly states "I'm a Sith Sorcerer and the galaxy fears me!" However that is not at all reflected in the damage it does. Since we have to turret for it I would really like to see its damage get a major buff. I would go so far as to argue that even if we were Madness spec'd to have Force Lightning off CD it wouldn't be overpwoered. Bottom line if Force Lightning were to get a major damage buff then I believe (IMO) this would raise our dps pretty freakin' good. Survival wise, we have the lightest armor in the game with the lowest HP. Class MMO and for all that is Star Wars ENTITLED to the class that wears the lightest armor with the lowest HP we SHOULD have damage to be feared and ccs to watch out for and make the other player really think about how they use their CDs instead of Lultraining over us. To be honest I haven't seen 1 class use their get our of cc free card on anything I've used on them. Yes I use my ccs right -.- kind of have to if I want to live long enough to run to the nearest pole to hide behind.