kbstealer
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Posts posted by kbstealer
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10/31/0 with full combat tech. pwns so hard. just need to get some better enhancements, *** is with all the accuracy on vanguard gear? we have 2 abilites (hammer shot,hib) that need accuracy and only 1 spec (assault) out of 3 that makes 1 of those 2 (hib) a main damage ability.
we need a tactics set that has power/crit/surge in place of the accuracy.
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you can't really compare dpsing in pvp with dpsing a training dummy or a mob. pvp is a 100% fluid situation while pve is a bit of script and far more optimal conditions for crunching numbers.
this. this thread has half the posters talking about pvp and half talking about pve. all of my comments are about pvp.
on a side note, i have tank'd and dps'd with my pvp tactics build in hm flash points. i just swap in hec. maybe its just my ability to manage my ammo but i never had issues.
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I gave up pretty quickly with Tactics. It was too much setting up aoe's that were rarely pulled off. Hated not having storm. I really like hamstring, though. Can't have it all.
tactics isnt about aoe, its all about flame pulse, ion pulse, stock strike and gut. the extra aoe and snare from pulse generator is more of a bonus not central to the tree.
Tactics in 1.2 is the only way to play imo, you just need to use ion cell not high energy cell.
10/31/0 is the way to go imo.
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Is 1.2 some kind of sick joke? Why even play a defense oriented class? My 8000 + armor seems to be completely useless as of today, compared to only moderately useless yesterday. Played about 15 war zones tonight, might as well just removed my armor and gone naked for all the good it did. My expertise is around 750 and I was getting face-rolled by nearly every imperial class. Dots from sorcerers and assassins just eating me alive, operatives you can forget it I'm like free valor for them. Isn't a tank supposed to be difficult to kill? Are we nothing more than guard whores? I'm valor 63 so I'm no newb to PvP with a Vanguard, I just don't see the point of playing a class which has weak damage, weak survivability and no heals.
i'm 10/31/0 spec (ion cell), full bm combat tech with 1100 res. I destroy people. If you're havn vanguard problems i feel bad for you son, i've got 99 problems but my class aint 1.
i regularly crit for over 3k and i can take one hell of a beating. there is nothing wrong with the vanguard.
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The fact that you're using ion cell shows that you aren't playing the same spec as what we're talking about. Removing Gut and HiB would still benefit you though with faster stacks of PG for much higher DPS.
8 points of a build with maximised HiB can be moved into other talents. That's a a lot of talent points for a crit on a 15s CD.
That build has terrible mobility and terrible ammo problems. You'd be much better off playing an Ironfist spec.
A full tatics spec kills anything but a healer with guard and taunt or lots of cross healing. If you manage to get the healers in one area (happens all the time on voidstar) you can destroy them.
i have 0 mobility or ammo issues with my spec in pvp. tactics is ammo friendly even without the regen from hec.
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Yes, how dare they make the crafting professions other than Biochem useful for pvp...
It's an MMO, there are supposed to be social and community aspects to the game, such as working with other players to get the best gear you can (through pvp/raiding/crafting/etc).
there is nothing wrong with being useful, there is however an issue (like biochem used to be) of having a mandatory profession to pvp.
if they just gave armormech/synthweavers the ability to make augment slot addon items so you can add an augment slot to w/e u wanted then there wouldnt be an issue. the way that it is set up now, to be at the top you MUST use crit crafted gear.
you shouldnt HAVE to use any profession to be at the top.
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Shields proc more than you want to think in PVP. Everyone uses their "auto" attack, and especially against Snipers and Marauders/Juggs you get a lot of white damage, more so than most seem to believe. Tank spec Vanguards should have a shield generator on at all times in order to take advantage of Shield Cycler and Static Shield. It might not proc all the time, but it procs enough to be a huge help.
Sorcs and BH's will tear you to shreds no matter what armor/shield you have because of the force and tech attacks, but whether you want to admit it or not the Snipers and Marauders are the highest damage classes in the game. Your defensive stats and mechanics will help you greatly against them.
so out of 8 AC's you're saying that the shield helps against 2 which is reason enough to take it?
if it doesnt help me vs. the majority of what i'm gonna encounter then its not worth it imo.
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I just hope the damage is no longer delayed by half a second or so.
i was testing this last night on live, fire pulse isnt really delayed damage per se, its an attack that has travel time. i used it point blank and it insta hit, any range increases the time for the attack to go off.
what i'm assuming they are doing in 1.2 is making the animation show a ball of flame of some sort traveling to the target and exploding for damage.
i have not been able to test this on PTS so i may be wrong about 1.2
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yes taunts add to protection in wz, both single target and aoe taunts
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Kind of like gear? Progression shouldn't be allowed either, amirite?
OT: I'd really love mouse-over functionality.
I'd also love a non-awful UI, but at least they're working on that.
gear is part of progression for the game, macros are not progression they are to make difficult things simpler.
the people who complain about not having macros think that they should be just as good as the people who dont use them and still kick their ***. you want a non level playing field that u can show people and tell them how level it is.
if you cant keybind your abilities and use them intelligently you deserve to lose, you dont deserve to have the game start playing for you.
to the person who said that they have so many abilites that they cant pay attention to the action cuz they are always looking at their bars:
ITS NOT THE GAMES FAULT YOU CANT LEARN YOUR OWN KEYBINDS.
i have a multiple level 50 toons, being not stupid i set up their keybinds exactly the same and then put like abilities in the corresponding keybind. ie. i use the letter R for snare, irregardless of toon R is always snare so i dont have to hunt for my snare.
people who want macros need to use their brains a little more and their mouths (typing fingers) less.
this whole issue is a L2P one
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So I'm a bit confused how you can hold off 4 people for a decent amount of time =/
because i use ion cell (tank cell) not the cell for the tactics tree. with assault you can run with ion cell now but in 1.2 you wont be able to whereas tactics will still work perfectly fine with ion cell.
My tactics build for use with ion cell:
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I don't understand why your HIBs are crit'ing for so little. I consider my HIB to be light, and I crit for no less than 35-3600 in PvE. I've been up to 4100, and that is still light compared to some of the other troopers I've talked to.
in assault i can crit upto 5200 with hib, thats the max i've seen on a squishy lowbie. in tactics u lose 9% damage from burning, 30% crit damage, 30% armor pen.
back to the main topic, i dont pve with tactics as dps i ot as tactics. i'm mostly a pvper and as such i cannot give up hib.
its plain to see that most of you are dead set in your opinion of hib for tactics. all i can say is that from personal experience of owning pretty much anything cept full heal spec healers (cuz my burst isnt high enough as tactics) hib cannot be discarded.
*DISCLAIMER* if this whole thread was about tactics pve damage rotations and removing hib from that then i withdraw all my arguments. i have no experience doing ops/hm fp as tactics dps, i dps solely in assault.
My Current tactics pvp build:
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801hMGZMsrrobfkds.1 (using ion cell)
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It actually lowers your DPS because it requires gut and you lose 2 stacks of PG. Add in the fact that PG stacks are also currently increasing damage on Mortar volley and sticky grenade and it is a no brainer that you want to build stacks ASAP. A crit HiB barely hits harder than a crit ion pulse and takes 6 talent points. The chances of having a guaranteed crit every 15s if you aren't spamming gut (why the hell would you?) are very bad.
I've removed it completely from my talent build and game-play and have no noticeable drop in killing power or DPS, if anything it's better because I have 5 stacks faster and more often.
what?
you're tryn to say that PG stacks are better than hib? people can run out of pulse cannon, you can get stunned while using or knocked back or pushed. you cant stop hib with a kb or a push.
pulse cannon is also very situational, hib is 30m range instant cast.
you can try to rationalize yourself but i play tactics, i own hard with it, hib cannot be given up, its just not a main attack.
i'd love to show you the error of your ways, but as that is not possible you just need to take my word for it, HIB = must use even for tactics.
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AP/Tactics is a good spec to use, i love it. I was pyro/assault until very recently and i can say pretty confidently that AP/Tactics is fine. What people seem to forget is that pyro is squishy rdps and ap is tanky melee dps. you lose burst/damage and gain survivability and mobility enhancements.
The tradeoffs are fine for what you get, its just a different playstyle. I lost on avg about 150k+ worth of damage per wz switching from pyro to ap and in return i can hold off upto 4 people for a decent amount of time instead of getting bursted down fast.
I like it, it works for me because i make it work, yes pyro is more damage but damage doesnt always win wz, staying alive however does win wz.
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Take a look at the Research. You lose time on your biggest hitters by using HiB.
you cannot give up hib, as tactics it is just not a main ability. using hib right after fire pulse = nice burst. if you think removing it gives u a dps boost you're crazy.
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while shields aren't effective. they are for tanks adding that extra survivability.
shields only activate on normal (white) damage in pvp. my vanguard tactics spec has 2 abilities that use white damage (hammer shot, hib) and 6 that dont (fire pulse, ion pulse, sticky grenade, stockstrike, gut, pulse cannon). if you were to fight me using a shield the chance that you would have it trigger is very very very low.
a shield in pvp adds really no extra survivability, get a power generator for pvp, shields are for pve tanking untill they make them able to proc on tech/force attacks in pvp.
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tactics is different than assault.
Personally i ran assault till very recently when i decided i wanted to get used to the spec i'm gonna use in 1.2.
I can no longer burst tank sins down, without going below 50% hp, but i also can no longer be killed by ops who try to stun you to death. also tanks are easier to kill since 95% of my damage comes from tech abilites now that hib isnt my primary damage dealer.
tactics needs more attention payed to each fight to get everything out of the spec, assault is just watch for procs and then hitting hib.
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Regarding which pieces to buy, since you're looking for advice, I'd recommend all off-set pieces be the DPS versions, except use the supercommando offhand shield.
shields are useless in pvp, dont get the shield.
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Interesting, thanks for sharing. I was thinking along the lines of this (at 50).
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801ZMsMroZfhMrzGhMc.1
Almost a full assault build but with these changes
31 assault talent traded for gut
2 other assault talents traded for reduced interupt cooldown
assault is a med-long range tree, gut is going to force you into melee a lot more often for you to justify the points spent to get it.
burst from AP (31 assault) > gut
personally i dont think gut is worth taking if you want to go assault. for a tactics or shield spec build i think you need it.
really tho, the best way to find out if its worth it is to play with it for a couple of days. dont get it, lose 1 wz and switch. you need to see all sides with it before you determine what your next move is going to be.
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personally i'd get the offhand first and get the champ gun, greatest stat boost for ya.
the bm gun is only marginally better, but the 81power and 52 surge on the offhand is just amazing.
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spec i used with both:
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801hMhZMsr0oZfhbrzG0M.1
Assault:
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801hMbZ0cZfIobzGhrs.1
Tactics:
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801hMGZRsrrobfkbs.1 (ion cell)
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801hMhZMsrzRrfkbsZb.1 (high energy cell)
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i've used a spec with both, its terrible. it looked really good on paper and in my head but in practice i wasted tons of ammo for very little benefit.
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also, @kbstealer: Stop stealing my killing blows~!
nevar!!
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is there a reason 90% of the vanguard/powertech community needs someone else to think of builds for them?
I keep seeing people referencing Taugrim's selection of builds as if they are the only viable ones out there.
I've looked at all of his builds and none of them are ones i use, some are similar but none are the same.
I already know what build i'm going to be using in 1.2 and it doesnt have a name. (its either going to be 8/31/2 or 10/31/0, figure out what i took by experimenting)
Seriously, people need to open up a skill calculator or their ingame tree and figure out what they want to do and what points where let them do that. If you are only using someone else's builds then you dont really understand why points were put where they were and therefore done really understand the class (not that there is really all that much to understand to begin with).
Keep making new specs and see if they perform as you wish, if they dont, go and tweak it.
Mar/Sents
in PvP
Posted
i've gone toe to toe with the best mara's on my server with my vanguard. the fights are always random with who wins since we both have always (since 1.2 hit anyway) finished with less then 10% hp each. they do hit harder, but so does everyone, give it a couple of days so you can get used to the new pace of action and you'll all stop complaining.
fighting mara/sent is the same as it was before imo.