Pictures of these please otherwise it didn't happen.

Ok let's just end this discussion entirely with this....This game is MMORPG gear had always, and I mean always mattered in the RPG genre which originated from D&D. Ask any old school D&D player and gear has always had stats in it. That's what set one tank apart from the other, one healer from the other etc etc. I'm sorry you don't want to grind for gear, but the true MMORPGer will and doesn't mind to do so. And that kind of person is what will keep this game going as he will keep subing each month. OP what you want or need to do is play a MMO that won't have much of the RPG aspect like planet side 2 or GW2. Companies have realized that most casual gamers are mostly for one thing (look of armor without stats, less grind, easy to pick up and play) and they have started making these games. And companies also know the hardcore gamer/ D&D fan wants to hunt for that specific gear with look and stats and doesn't mind the time it takes. That's actually why MMORPGs were created because the hardcore RPG fans were tired of games coming out that they could burn through in 2 or 3 days. Now we have games that keep adding content and have strong communities. So long story short Gear with stats is here to stay in MMORPGs.

Agree! They already made MMOs easy as is to bring more in for money. I say we start progressing back. Item drop on death PVE or PVP, you see posts were people complain about other chars sucking at FPs and Ops and just rushing in. Well IDD will make people actually try and leant to quit rushing, and learn how to play their char. But I don't care just trying to give a solution and end another useless complaint.

Ok I really get tired of this "I only have 1-2 hours to play" excuse to an argument. No offense but I hardly ever see any one play just 1-2 hours ever. Most casual players I see on for minimum 4 hours. And let's be honest you can't get much done in MMOs with just 1-2 hour a day, every other day, so on and so on. If you can honestly sit their and say you play minimum 1-2 hours a day or every other day, the only way I would Belive that is of you had no char close to 30 by this point. You can spend an hour alone collecting the quests to go complete and that doesn't include the hour you used checking the GTN for new supplies and what not. And why shouldn't you have to deal with that as far as losing items? What's the reward for PvPing out of Warzones? What's the negative effect as well? There would actually be less knuckle heads out there ganking if they knew they had a chance to get bum rushed themselves. In the old days it was uncommon in MMOs to see alot of people flag PvP in non PvP servers unless they had actuall skill. And the few PvP severs there were you only joined if you knew what the hell you we're doing. But I digress if people must complain about a game and still play it 4-5 hours a day and pay so be it.

Ok I kinda feel your pain to some extent. However when you die in PvP you gain no negative effects I.E armor does not take damage do repair costs are out. The most neg is just the frustration and time, it happened to me in Nar Shadaa once during bonus series. My group got glitches flagged and jumped while questing by higher group of Sith so we just bailed the quest for a few and went somewhere else and quested for a bit then went back about 30 mins later and then Sith moved on (most likely those ADD kids you were talking about got bored). I know it sucks to get pvped when you don't want to but like I said he negative effects arnt there like the old days. Picture this getting killed on a glitch PvP like that not expecting it and loosing half your bank, and half your most precious armor. This was the days of Asherons Call before the binding system and also getting rid of item drop on death. The new system makes it more appealing for that little kid to run around pvping other folks as there is no loss to him of he loses expect maybe some pride? My only real suggestion is if you absolutely don't want to move on to another quest either get some friends to come back you up, or lure the little punks close enough to a faction base till he gets tired of getting pwnd by you with he back up of champion NPCs. That trick worked for me onetime and I guarantee the other 3 Sith punks were pissed because they did suffer armor damage as it was the NPCs killing them and not me.

Ok guys/gals just wanting to make a plea lets start using the Hutt Cartel Exchange on Nar Shadaa a bit more. If y'all did not know the Hutt cartel exchange is like your factions GTN except both sides can trade goods. So for you republic players who get that Schematic that requires a Sith class to wear the piece or use the weapon post it on the HCE instead of the GTN. Same goes for the Imperials. I think we can get a far better market going if we use both. Plus it is a waste to have 8 pages of synthe weaving or armor mech schematics that are for Sith class stuff on the republic GTN. Also guys let's stop posting those greens (unless it can be reengineer for crafting items I guess). Just vendor the damn thing it's a waste of your time and ties up your money while it sits to most likey never be bought. It also creates more things I have to go through (yes I know I can filter it out but really this is just simple advice to players who don't understand greens are noob junk). Another tip the color crystals are nice but would like to see more power crystals and Artifact fragments for sale as well, Archaelogy does provide both and the ability to gather both. Same goes for fabrics, your metals are wanted but those fabrics will bought as well (at reasonable prices) just show your synthweavers some love to guys. And lastly let's be realistic on some of these prices, some stuff may be warranted in asking for 25k, but dude some of y'all don't even check the market before you post. On several occasions I see a piece of purple or orange armor for say 45k?!! When there is 3 of the same listed by 3 diff people for 10-15k? The only way to achieve a constant and thriving market or markets is to properly list items were they belong and also have reasonable prices, oh and variety I crafting items. So to sum up this article, use both your factions GTN as well as the HCE, be reasonable on asking prices (greed doesn't always win) and look at what items are scarce and farm those to sell if you wish to make more money.

See and that's my point, when ever this subject is usually brought up in forums you get the enablers out there who say "well you can't them harder cause people won't play cause they can't get stuff done of they die all the time". But what happened to learning how to get better at something? I mean it seems people who play now just wanna storm in, and if hey get killed they give up and go do something else or complain till its nerfed. Now I am not asking for the death penalties to be added back necessarily, I think I'm just asking for the games to be a bit tougher to cap again or find a item so that when I eventually achieve that goal I feel ok with the time I spent on the game. And on a second note are we not at a point that MMOs have been out for the masses long enough to understand what to do tht maybe we could progress back to the difficulty ? Like some have pointed out WoW put the traing wheels on, and instead of the MMOs after that slowly removing them its like they added more wheels, wrapped everyone in pillows, and force ya to ride on mattresses. But I digress, I guess it will just be a wait process and see if the masses join the Orginal MMORPGers and ask or harder.

When I started this post I expected alot of trolls to be honest, but I have read some great responses and oppinions. And I will agree the majority does rule so I kinda understand why the MMOs of today are made the way they are. But like someone pointed out earlier you don't always have to make a game that appeases the majority to make money, for example EVE, it charges more, is still going with no signs of shutting down anytime some. Same with Asherons Call it is still going 12 years later, still maintains a p2p status and has some people going back from time to time to relive those memories. So that being said, yes you make a game that appeases to the masses you make a bunch of money, but most will eventually tire and move on. You make a game that requires a bit more skill, and takes a bit more to complete it will last alot longer and turn out to be a stronger investment. Also I think alot of people forget another reason MMOs were created, it was a game you could play with/against friends and that you couldn't beat in a weekend like most console and PC games. The old schools you wouldt see cap for a year or more, and even of some was to try to race cap a chat it took 4 or more people taking 4-8 gifts lvling the same char, and that would still take a few months. Also I know some have mentioned why want to play a game you have to work at, or why play a game that takes hours to do, but I know from exp if you plotted out what you were going to do (raids, grinding for items) on the guild website you could do alot in a 3-4 hour span. And I know some will most likely post " I don't even have 3-4 hours to give" well BS to that cause I have seen caual gamers who log more hours than I would nowadays. The time part is an excuse, and a few posters hit it on the button of the kids/adults who are playing now are the "give it to me and give it to me now". There isn't a game today tht doesn't show yo exactly where to go. Game build Now: pick up all your quests head out, complete, turn in, pick up , head out, complete, turn in. Games of old you either had to find the dungeon based on the coords given or find someone on who was willing to guide or give directions. Now I am sorry if that seems tough to you (which it usually wasn't and took no less than 15-30 min to do) but if you can't handle that Game makers shouldn't have to appease to your laziness or lack of thinking. In final even if the Devs please that sort of crowd they still won't be the ones on years down the road. So maybe it's time we get back to appeasing the groups that will invest for years, create programs, and move to the sequel when time comes. Instead of making a game for a person who will give up because they are still getting passed on LvL and can't find people to group with.

When I started this post I expected alot of trolls to be honest, but I have read some great responses and oppinions. And I will agree the majority does rule so I kinda understand why the MMOs of today are made the way they are. But like someone pointed out earlier you don't always have to make a game that appeases the majority to make money, for example EVE, it charges more, is still going with no signs of shutting down anytime some. Same with Asherons Call it is still going 12 years later, still maintains a p2p status and has some people going back from time to time to relive those memories. So that being said, yes you make a game that appeases to the masses you make a bunch of money, but most will eventually tire and move on. You make a game that requires a bit more skill, and takes a bit more to complete it will last alot longer and turn out to be a stronger investment. Also I think alot of people forget another reason MMOs were created, it was a game you could play with/against friends and that you couldn't beat in a weekend like most console and PC games. The old schools you wouldt see cap for a year or more, and even of some was to try to race cap a chat it took 4 or more people taking 4-8 gifts lvling the same char, and that would still take a few months. Also I know some have mentioned why want to play a game you have to work at, or why play a game that takes hours to do, but I know from exp if you plotted out what you were going to do (raids, grinding for items) on the guild website you could do alot in a 3-4 hour span. And I know some will most likely post " I don't even have 3-4 hours to give" well BS to that cause I have seen caual gamers who log more hours than I would nowadays. The time part is an excuse, and a few posters hit it on the button of the kids/adults who are playing now are the "give it to me and give it to me now". There isn't a game today tht doesn't show yo exactly where to go. Game build Now: pick up all your quests head out, complete, turn in, pick up , head out, complete, turn in. Games of old you either had to find the dungeon based on the coords given or find someone on who was willing to guide or give directions. Now I am sorry if that seems tough to you (which it usually wasn't and took no less than 15-30 min to do) but if you can't handle that Game makers shouldn't have to appease to your laziness or lack of thinking. In final even if the Devs please that sort of crowd they still won't be the ones on years down the road. So maybe it's time we get back to appeasing the groups that will invest for years, create programs, and move to the sequel when time comes. Instead of making a game for a person who will give up because they are still getting passed on LvL and can't find people to group with.

Enjoy the input guys, actually some decent posts out there instead of lots of Trolling. Some god points made as well, and some I wouldn't tottally agree with. And as far as he casual gamer, or making a MMO so "your Mom could play" well just wanna say my own mom who had never played a video game was able to pick up Asherons' Call and understand it and actually keep up with the "hardcore gamers". And neither of us had to play 12 hours aday. The old MMOs were kinda rough to some extent, but just think about this games like AC and EQ are still running and p2p. I even drop in on my old AC account from time to time. So it shows the Older/Orginal MMOs have the ability to make money, it's just WoW did what no other MMO did before MARKETING. Well I am gonna go back to enjoying SWTOR.

First I would like to state please do not take this as a complaint against the game in anyway because I think it is a great game and BW has done a great job. Now that said I started MMOs back when I was 15 with Asherons call in 1999. And in that wonderful game I remember the untold hours of grinding and questing, crafting, and even some crazy PvP (pking oldskool). I remember how fun it was, yes it was a little work here and there, but it felt neat when you had that epic gear and such. I remember many of group wipes even when you were req LvL or higher, or hunting in a Lugian Citadeal and some early day Leroy Jenkins aggroing the entire dude to the tunnel where several players were just waiting for a spawn they could handle only to be swarmed by 40 or so Lugians and the crew wiping. Then in 2007 I join WoW and I notice some cool new ideas here and there. And of course there was full raid wipes still in this game, but didn't seem as often, and you could also learn tricks to not wipe. And I've tried several others over the years nothing to hold my attention though. But each one I've played just seems to get easier and easier over the years nothing like the early days of EQ, AC, or UO. I have made it to 40 and have only had a full crew wipe twice, both times on mid boss of Mandalriaons while in the 20's. Soy question to fellow MMO vets, do MMOs seem to be made easier and easier, or has it just becoming easier over the years with the experience. IMO you just don't seem to get Mobs like you used to anymore, and I know what you are thinking "why would you want to have a wipe?" but that's not really what I'm getting at. I think I just miss the excitement and tense situation of "Man are we gonna make it?" or the old Monty pythons quest for the holy grail "Run away! Run away! Run away!". It's those moments that seemed to make finishing the dungeon, or surving a full dungeon pull more exciting, and like you actually completed something. For the AC old heads out there you remember that feeling when your grouped snuffed the ol' white rabbit in the early years of the game, and that's what I'm talking about. Now I know there is hard modes on the Lock-outs and I'm looking forward to see if it can bring the same thing as the original MMOs. So let me know what ya think, MMO Vets and MMO noobs.

Ok I write this wondering are the people post complaints, *****es, moans and groans actually playing and making valid complaints? No I don't think they are I believe they are afraid for the first time a MMO is on the block to TKO WoW. No i don't believe it will happen within the next few months, but this game has very high potential, give Bioware time they got a strong foundation just wait till they start tweeking and adding new content. I honestly believe that alot of the negative posts are from people trying to put negative feed out there hoping to deter new people from coming to this game in hopes that numbers will stay high on WoW so it doesn't shut down and they lose all their hardwork. Well listen up you Trolls Bioware is here, SWTOR is here, and the majority loves it and it won't be long but WoWs time has come ( Thank god cause who wants to see a dorky *** Kung Fu Panda) So post your thoughts, I know I'm not the only one who thinks this way cause I still see lots of full/heavy servers. 2012 The year World of Warcraft fell?!

And just like WoW bored from other MMO's before it. And to respond on another post work 80+ hours a week myself and have a family. The point of MMOs was to pla D&D based games with friends and give you a game that keep going instead of spend $60.00 on a game that lasted 2 days and had no replay. Yea and I play maybe 2-3 hours every other nite and would enjoy the game if it was harder but nice try.

Ok first of all tired of hearing about WoW, this isn't WoW, shut up about WoW, if you want WoW the leave and go play it. WoW made MMOs to easy so they could make more money by getting everyone to play. There was a time when you had to actually work at a MMO and you could feel joy of the hard work and people would ohhh and ahhhh at the gear you had or trophies from Large Raids. If you doubt then go ask those who started MMOs with some of the originals like Everquest, Asherons Call etc. (any feel old school MMOers please post examples) Yes WoW added some good features, but so did other MMOs (which WoW took ideas from, and also WoW did not have some of the great Ideas like houses and guild mansions). So in short Enough about WoW just play SWTOR or leave and quit posting gripes about How the nerfed slicing (posting is more time you waste instead of hunting and questing to make money) and quit posting about how WoW did this and WoW did that you are wasting forum space for SWTOR fans!

So Ive noticed there really isn't really a variety of looks for the Jedi Shadow vs Jedi sage. I am up to 290 in synthweaving and the stats of course are different in the armor based on which class you are but the look I feel is kinda off. My main issue is in the beginning you do find a few modable light armor robes with a hood, but the purples I can make have better stats so of course im gonna upgraded versus worrying about the style. I think my main issue is I would like to run around with a hooded robe and pants like he Knight classes. I mean the shadow is kinda like a stealthy assassin, would like to look different than the sage. So does anyone know if this is a issue that will be fixed on a patch down he road. Also if you look at several websites (db.darthhater.com) the recipe list shows certain items in light armor with hoods like the padded battle robes. I feel like it was a glitch overlooked that the Jedi Robes took on the same look as the Jedi Vestmates. Guess im just wondering if anyone else agrees and also has any info. Other than that great game looking forward to years of great game play awesome job Bioware keep up the good work.