oholyknight
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Posts posted by oholyknight
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Hi there!
We recently had to remove some posts in this thread. Please remember that the topic of this thread is to discuss the Feb 24th Q&A Blog. It is understandable that you may want to express disappointment in questions which were not answered. However, we ask that if you would like to discuss these topics in detail to please do so elsewhere.
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Just give me notice when you plan on implementing this, so I can move on to another game.
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Will you please be different and remove the difference between pvp and pve gear, all we need is gear period. I like to do both, but like many people, I dont have the time to spend on both. I would like to go from raiding to pvp and be competitive due to skill, strategy, and some good old team work. That would be better then getting beat down by gear. Pvp gear serves no purpose, except to give an advantage, if you have to win by an unfair advantage....well you get my point.
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Glad to see this thread. I just hit 50 on my Shadow, and decided to try PVP because I'm pretty tired of quests/PVE.
Then I discovered this whole expertise thing. As far as I can tell, without PvP gear I'm pretty much just a free kill for the enemy. That also means I'm an obvious disadvantage to my team.
That sucks, Bioware. It's as if the whole system was designed as some kind of weird hazing process. "You must get rolled X times before you can participate in a meaningful way."
Whats worse then that, is how long it will take and how much you have to endure to get some where close to the gear the original 50's of the game have. Some are valor rank 70 now, do you have any idea how much you have to pvp to reach that?
Basically, if you did not start pvping on Dec.13th and pretty much 23/7 (giving one hour a day for showers and food) pvp then you have no chance of participating effectively.
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PVP gear and its expertise rating is an artificial barrier that this game doesn't need.
Yes, why give an "artificial" advantage which in turns just makes people not want to play. I love to pvp as well as other aspects of the game but the only way I will pvp in TOR atm is an alt pre 50. Which is silly for a person paying to play to be limited like that.
For a change, just make gear.....Let PVP be about skill, strategy, team work and most importantly, FUN. Also, why in the world do you have to always reform grp and are not even able to make a full guild grp. Your pvp part of the game will suffer if you don't change these things, which will mean the game as a whole will suffer. Which of course means, the money will suffer.
I am already seeing people in the guild leave the game, we quickly went to 150 members but are sliding back closer to 100. Not to be too technical about it but that is almost 1/3, or 30%, pretty nasty falling away.
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Other games have proven that even a tiny tiny advantage on gear will drive most people to go after it.
There doesn't need to be such a huge disparity.
I just dont see the point in letting gear make me a better player. If gear is the reason I win then....well I guess I pretty much suck. I mean really I can see two equally skilled players that the gear should make the difference but one or two shotting folks, there really isnt time to determine that. But even then why do raiders get the bum end of the stick just because a portion of their gaming time is spent in a raid versus warzone?
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Lol, I just posted on another thread...
Why must there be pvp gear and pve gear? Pvp gear's only purpose is to give a person an advantage over some one who does not have it. So, gear makes the player...Thought we were gonna be different here Bioware.
If you wanna know what pvp is suppose to be then pvp naked. That way pvp is actually a battle of skill and strategy, not who has the most gear....
I will never understand why I can not go straight from killing a boss in a raid to having a bit of fun in a War zone and expect to be competitive.
So your pvp team with "pvp" gear beats mine because we don't have "pvp" gear and that makes you feel like a winner. Silly.
You could actually be different here Bioware and have different avenues to get same gear and make everything balanced. This would be an original idea and I bet you it would make a lot of us people who enjoy both but cant put that much time in both, very happy.
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I would say that being to late may not be the issue as much as not being enough. I am looking at pvp atm and thought Bioware was going to be different. However, imo it is a lot worse, once again we have pvp gear, that makes all the difference. Why do you even need pvp gear? Just to make less skillful players powerful? everyone pvp naked and see what pvp is suppose to be...a battle of skill and stratergy not gear.
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Is there work on more of the creature comforts ingame that some of us are use too? (raid calendar, being able to invite from guild roster, being able to shift click a persons name and see info like level, guild, a better network for selling, loot drop info system, guild bank and of course ALOT LESS LAG.)
This stuff is not new to industry, coming up with something new is hard but repeating shouldnt be that hard.
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Sorry we havent checked in sooner, but we were all getting settled in and we have several new folks come on board. I am very pleased with the guild's progress and the membership we have. Check out our website, for some of the progress. As of this posting I do not have all the pictures up.
I hope everyone is enjoying their time in TOR. We are on the Juyo server which for the most part seems to be a good place to call home. PVE, est. time server.
http://knightsofthecross.jediportal.com/Guild.aspx?GuildID=413910&TabID=3513617
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If it's one thing i've learned is if you see someone write down their adventures and put themselves on a pedestal it's usually because they lack and immature. It is what it is man so listen to yourself, and as for the main question at hand Mandalorian raiders. You are going to loose aggro anytime you got good dps which is a good thing. Step up and do your research. Make efficient decision which mob takes highest priority because you can not tank all range and melle at the same time as JK unless they come stacked already. It's easy for us to tank as many melle adds as possible but multiple range will give you problems but nothing a force push cant help you with.
I would comment but really with what you said....I see no point.
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At no point did I say it was designed to be this way. Ever. The very closest I came was telling someone to learn to play within its limitation as opposed to simply trolling the thread with "this discussion is useleess, the class is broken, we should not play it and ***** at the devs instead". That kind of thinking is clearly counter-productive, and I didn't appreciate it in the least. I also pointed out that this is how it works right now and players should adjust. It still works.
I am personally tired of people like oholyknight who repeatedly derail these forums whining that things don't work the way they think they should. I am not going to join him and other people in responding to every question about Guardians with "this crap is broken, wahhh, we should all whine at the devs".
Bioware knows that Guardians, and JK's in general need adjustment. They've admitted to it and have promised that tweaks will be coming soon after launch. In the meantime, the class is what it is. I expect people to learn to play within those limitations or choose another class. This is not unreasonable.
In the end you agree with my assessment that as it currently stands, pre-emptive taunts are necessary and by using them we can do our jobs as tanks. If you took any other meaning from my posts you were mistaken, and we can chalk it up to a misunderstanding.
HA, you have done more whinning then I have even in this post. I see a problem and have an opinion and I share it. I have that right. You dont see a problem and enjoy others doing your job. Leave it at that, but no. You keep going because as others have pointed out you are wrong. Sorry, that everyone doesnt agree with you. My orginal thoughts are its broken, you said it wasnt. Now you retract your comments and try to make it sound like you know it is. Just go away, I am interested in getting it fixed so I and all the other JK long time hopefuls can move on with the class they have waited so long to play.
Oh btw I have now main tanked the guild through most content, We had SOA(the infernal one) down on the floor with 20% left but ran out of time before we had a successful attempt. My stand still stays the same its broke.
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freakunacy, your idea that "Taunt is a part of our rotation" is patently false. I have a level 40 Shadow I leveled as full Kinetic, and I'm now leveling a Guardian to tank. Shadow has no problem keeping single target threat and keeping taunt in reserve for traditional aggro-loss situations, like what is supposed to happen. Powertech/Vanguards also do not have this problem.
If what you were spouting off was true, all three tank classes would have to use their taunts in their rotations. All three tank classes do not, therefore you're wrong.
Do Guardians/Juggernauts tank currently? Sure. Do they need a slight threat boost? Absolutely.
My Shadow has 0 problem maintaining threat on a single mob. In Flashpoints after the boss hits 60% life I can ignore it and not lose aggro. If a tank is losing aggro while actively building threat it's not working.
I like this guy
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Taunt puts you on top of the aggro table for six seconds and causes the target to ignore threat generated by other players during that time frame, exactly as you described.
This is how taunt has always worked, everywhere. It seems people expect it to erase the aggro table completely? Is what I'm gathering from previous posts. This would be OP and IMO quite broken.
I really think people just aren't paying attention to their abilities properly. Soresu form gives a Guardian an immediate threat bonus up to 150% of normalized damage. There are then two further abilities that generate an additional bonus equal to 200% of normalized damage. With the exception of the threat bonus that should be applied to Sunder stacks, this is exactly the same as the original iteration of "that other game" before they buffed threat to first 300% and then 500%. I personally believe a tweak to threat generated by sunder stacks is the only change that needs to be made to balance Guardian tanking.
People are currently spoiled by being able to basically smack a mob and go make a sandwich in WoW. It's a little bit more difficult here, and with the current cd's on the bonus-threat abilities you are going to lose aggro on a mob in packs of three or more and be required to throw out a taunt. Hence why taunt is on such a short cd with such a long range, along with the AOE shout. I don't mind "re-thinking" a little bit in terms of how I use my taunts and mitigation CD's. Most other tanks don't either.
There's just a few who in one breath shout that this game is a wow ripoff and then in the next scream at any mechanic differences they find. It's ridiculous.
This guy is no authority on tanking believe me.
Taunt doesnt build threat it causes mobs to attack you for the time its effect is up. JK have one ability that generates threat Hilt Strike, and it has a minute cool down, all other threat comes from our form. At a rate of 50%, our form reduces damage and generates threat at that rate. A troopers ion cell, their tanking form, generates threat, reduces damage and INCREASES DAMAGE. Now that seems a bit one sided especially since two of the three picks in the first tier of the defense skill tree also increase DAMAGE. I have advised all those that I know to not run a JK at least till its fixed, take that for what it is worth. If you enjoy tanking this isnt the class for you, if you want others to do your job for you and have all kinds of reasons why you dont fail as a tank, when you arent even doing the job, then play a JK.
Oh I forgot this tid bit, two other JK guardians in my guild also 50's but they are dps, have change their mains to something else, one a trooper tank, the other consular shadow. We went to 50 in hopes of something good at the end, and we got it....other classes. However, my son has a 50 sent jedi and it rocks.
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And I'll post THIS again, with the added subheading of Learn 2 Play before you get aggressive on a discussion forum. Just because you suck and don't want to put the effort into improving doesn't mean you need to act like a ******* to everyone else.
That being said, try reading and following some advice as opposed to sticking your fingers in your ear and "LALALA"ing your way through the discussion.
It is absolutely a threat mechanic. You're not using your threat modified abilities properly. Yes, taunt and and shout are part of your rotation as opposed to being 'oh crap' buttons, but that doesn't mean its 'broken', its just different. The same goes for your mitigation CD's, they should be in your general rotation.
Tanking in SWTOR is very difficult in comparison to a certain other MMO's "current" system, with their 500% threat buffs that allow you to lolaoe your way through everything.
Gather initial aggro with a shout and stomp, then use the time it buys to tab through some sunders. Apply Blade Storm to ranged to keep them interested in you, and Pommel Strike anyone who seems to be getting out of control.
Tab a -lot-. Taunt a -lot- to buy yourself time. Every time you finish a threat rotation on your mob pack, shout again and do it over again. Threat races are a constant source of challenge, and with the way threat ramps it takes 4 GCD's to regain threat if your DPS snags lead. Make sure your DPS is focus-firing the correct mobs so once you gain initial aggro you can hold it with Force Sweep and your conal AOE strike.
lol if you knew who and what kinda tank you were talking too, you would go hide, I dont need advice I can tank or should i say out tank you or anyone else you wanna put me up against, that isnt the issue. the issue is it isnt fun for hardcore tanks it is desinged for fail fluff tanks. the end result of this is, you cant hold aggro so hit taunt...fail mechanic, fail mechanic, fail mechanic and if you like it, well we know where that puts you in the rank of tanks, fail.
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everyone just proves my point over and over, JK tanking is broken. Does that mean you cant tank as a JK, no. I am a level 50 JK tank and have tanked everything short of raids. What it means is, it is not fun, and for those who dont seem to understand a few things. It isnt hard to stop dpsing...just dont hit a button. What is hard is trying to max your dps so the stuff dies in a timely manner. Not doing something isnt hard, that is why JK's are broke, because Bioware did "not" fix them and feels its easier to "not" do anything about it.
Tanking 101- you as a tank are suppose to pull, hold, control the action and take the damage, that is your job. If you can not do this because of mechanics then the mechanics are broken.
So again, does that mean it cant be done. No it doesnt. I have done it, but I cant wait to log off that toon after tanking for guild and get on an alt. Why? Because JK are broke, boring and lame. Which doesnt set well with me, being the fan I am of Star Wars.
guess i have to post this again and add, if you like being a useless taunt instead of a effective tank, then by all means continue to post your silly squables here. However, if you see the same problems I do then help me let the DEVS know what you see. That is why I bother to post because they need to know our views on the problems. A jedi knight should not be the lowest class or spec for anything in STAR WARS. Trust me I do not find tanking likes this dificult, I have never played a more fluff tank. Its boring and useless.
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everyone just proves my point over and over, JK tanking is broken. Does that mean you cant tank as a JK, no. I am a level 50 JK tank and have tanked everything short of raids. What it means is, it is not fun, and for those who dont seem to understand a few things. It isnt hard to stop dpsing...just dont hit a button. What is hard is trying to max your dps so the stuff dies in a timely manner. Not doing something isnt hard, that is why JK's are broke, because Bioware did "not" fix them and feels its easier to "not" do anything about it.
Tanking 101- you as a tank are suppose to pull, hold, control the action and take the damage, that is your job. If you can not do this because of mechanics then the mechanics are broken.
So again, does that mean it cant be done. No it doesnt. I have done it, but I cant wait to log off that toon after tanking for guild and get on an alt. Why? Because JK are broke, boring and lame. Which doesnt set well with me, being the fan I am of Star Wars.
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Mobs dropping aggro is something the developers LOVE LOVE LOVE, so don't get too alarmed when it happens. Just be quick on the taunt button, and as long as you're hitting the highest DPS buttons as often as possible you'll be fine.
I did the Vig/Def build for a while, with the overhead strike. I found that it lacked some important living tools like Blade Barrier and Stasis Mastery. Stasis Mastery, I've found, is wonderful for soloing. It stuns a mob just long enough for a cooldown to come up, and its 10m range is great for aggro on that one last mob in a pull.
I found myself focus starved with that Vig/Def build, too.
I like my guardian and I have a lot of fun playing it. I had some times when I didn't enjoy myself, but that was before I got the healing companion.
are you a tank or dps because that is two very different things, as a "tank" doing anything is boring. takes forever to do a few dailies, can hold aggro so fast mass pullling is out of the question, just a very lame boring class, as a tank. I have gone dps and jedi knight as dps is ok, still the weekest of the classes unless you go sent. which I find very heart-breaking, I am sure most of Bio-ware staff probably wasnt even alive when Star Wars came out but let me assure you the whole story in the movies is based on Jedi, so to make the knights so weak, well I am surprised.
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I am a level 50 guardian tank, tanking on a jedi is silly imo and i am leveling alts to play instead. At this time I am guilds only upper level tank so I stay one for them, however I have suffered through 50 boring levels, just to have a toon that I cant stomach to go questing on or enjoy tanking on.
The mechanic in TOR is not a true tanking mechanic, its a taunt mechanic. Its designed to let pittiful players take on a roll where everyone else can do his job. I have tanked everything up to raids at this point. We have gotten through everything fine, but I have had no fun doing them.
I have to say I cant wait to get another toon up, doesnt matter which. I have played trooper, consular and had a blast with both of them. They have ruined the JK guardian and unless boredom is your thing dont go that way.
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Well I have been getting reports of very poor customer service from some members of my guild. Answer's like, if it isnt working re-roll you toon (a level 50). There have been other situations that members have stated the response was less then satisfactory. I dont know if EA is aware of the customer service we are recieving or not. I am sure that as large of a company as they are, they realize that customers are what pay the bills. Short answers, put offs, generic responses, and laying the blame back on the paying customers will not get any company very far. The bad reviews will likely start flying soon if the players arent kept in the loop. I know I can over look a lot of things if I know why, when and maybe how.
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The system isn't broken. Your belief that you should be able to AoE tank like a paladin in WoW is the issue. I have 0 problem tanking and holding threat. I don't find myself waiting around on a cooldown to be effective. If you have fail dps that are nOt CCing and focus firing your target news flash let it end poorly for them. It isn't your job or the healers to carry stupid.
Maybe the issue is that I run with a fairly constant group who understands CC and assist targeting and you seem to be runnin with fail pugs.
And you are a jedi tank at level 46? and if your idea of tanking is holding on mob that to me means you couldnt handle real tanking so yeah the system is broken. You guys seem to think because you fail at the job that its everyone elses fault which prooves the point I made to start with. That tells me you cant learn a dps class well enough to be effective, which would make healing out of the question so you choose tank. The spec were its everyone else's fault. Lame. I tank because I like and can do the job. I tank, run a raid, keep my folks safe, and have a ball doing it. At least till now. Sure dps will learn when to pull and when not too, but you obvisouly never really tanked anything difficult. If all you can do is guess at what you think in a theory, then dont bother me with it. I am there doing it and it is broke. Funny thing is no one has said "what do you think would fix it?" This will be my last post on the matter, I can make up my own mind what to do from here I posted because the devs. need to know the problems experienced and long paying customers see. If that isnt an issue for you, good day, I dont need your input.
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All of this is what I keep seeing with everyone single QQ thread about tanking. DPS needs to not be fail, use your CC (it is there for a reason) and have a kill order. If you can't hold threat single target that's a you issue not the class.
interesting, so what you are saying is tanking in tor=no fun, dps in tor=no fun, how about healing with this free for all, I cant do my job mentality I suppose it would be the most fun. You are correct, wow is the game I have the most experience in, though not the only one. Wow has been the top MMO for 7 years for a reason. Partly because specs were defined, if wow made a mistake at bc then I doubt the subscriptions would have almost doubled in a short period of time. You may enjoy standing there waiting on a cooldown to come back so you can tank again but I do not. You may fail at tanking so bad that its a relief to have others do it for you, I do not. You may think even though you have not played the class to the point I have you know better then.
All that being said means nothing, either tanks are tanks or you dont need them. But no worries I went dps, as many have. Look in general chat on your server, search for a tank to run Red reaper. Good luck.
Ill either dps and wait till they fix this or Ill choose another class. Yes if wow was Star Wars based and wasnt going the way of the panda, I would rather play those tanking mechanics with a bit of this thrown in.
Try as you might you cant defend a broken system, if it wasnt broke then wow would have stayed that way.
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By the way if you are not a Jedi Knight tank and atleast level 46 and have cleared everything up to your level...then you have nothing to say, simply because you have no bases to say it. Furthermore, its not about just pvp or leveling or flashpoints. I am a raider I tank things that one shot other members of the grp. Again, my job.
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So you're saying that I, on my Gunslinger, should be able to stand there and spam Thermal Grenade and Sweeping Gunfire nonstop in an AoE situation with absolutely no mindfulness of how much threat I am generating on that entire pack of mobs?
Because I promise you, with *any* tank I've met so far, if I do that, I'm going to be taking fire real fast.
What I am saying is I am a skilled tank and that the mechanic here is for those who are not and need everyone to do their job for them, and if it fails then they can blame others. Why is a tank having the highest threat a new idea to you guys? That is our job...otherwise why have a tanking class, spec or gear. I dont mind some cc and dont mind dps picking off trash but to constantly having to taunt just to hold is silly, that makes me less able to pay attention to all aspects of the event and keep grp safe. Once again, news flash....a tanks job is to take the damage and protect the grp, period.
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I'm sure you do take care of your healers considering the amount of damage you must take by tanking like it's WOW. Funny though, I have no issues and yet I don't have healers, I have heals/dps. But Yeah I guess you need full time heals.
So i see your point, no need to have defined classes lets all just go free for all, and do a tank spec if you just want to take forever to kill something. But the benefit is, you get to call yourself a tank...lol. There are defined names to trees for a reason if that reason doesnt exist, it isnt the players fault. So, I guess they should be called taunt instead of tank. What a wonderful idea, make a tree unrewarding and not needed. I guess its good for forums so people can fuss about I like earning my way or I like everyone doing my job for me. But hey, free for all sounds fun.
Knights of the Cross ( Christian guild) checking in
in Check-ins
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Hey J,
I am sorry to say that we went from 170+ members to only a handful with most of them leaving as soon as time gives out. So at this time we dont have any plans on much. We are all trying out different games and looking for something we can call home. http://www.guildportal.com/Guild.aspx?GuildID=413910&TabID=3513617 you can go here and apply so you can keep up with what guild does in future.
Sorry again, I wish I had better news.