**SPOILERS** Chapter IX Eternal Throne

[IasonEvan]

I have really enjoyed everything about all these chapters, storywise. It's all well done.

 

My dialog choices up until now have ALL WITHOUT FAIL been that I don't want the throne. I've literally said it 6-810-12 times. I don't know how many but it's been a bunch, so to NOT get the option to NOT sit on it ran so absolutely against anything I wanted to do as to completely go against your own story. It kinda ruins the whole thing.

 

My character, from the choices THE WRITING TEAM gave her was ALWAYS UNEQUIVOCALLY, "I don't want the throne" so for her to sit on it without the option to reject it like Galadriel rejecting the ring is like if Mrs. Failed Sheev Clone Jr. and Mr. Failed Sheev CLone Jr. decided to leave their most precious girl with a junk trader named Unkar Plutt in what amounts to basically indentured servitude to keep her safe.

 

The discerning viewer quickly realizes that the writers didn't end with the story they started with and had a bunch of continuity errors.

 

Also, the loot and XP game in this was DEPLORABLE. I'm hard pressed to think of an MMO that has worse loot. A cash shop is supposed to pay the bills not supplant the actual fun of getting drops in an MMO. On top of it you have what is in essence a mandatory sub and a cash shop.

 

You give me the option to REITERATE OVER AND OVER AND OVER THAT I DON'T WANT THE THRONE AND THEN YOU FORCE MY CHARACTER TO SIT ON IT?

 

It's doubly awful because I HONESTLY ENJOYED MYSELF UP TO THAT POINT. The character development was amazing. I ADORED that you guys swung for the fences with changing the companions etc. It was bold. So disappointed you didn't follow through on the decision to NOT SIT ON THE THRONE though. You should at the very least REMOVE that option from the game. It flies in the face of prior choices and autonomy of the player and the story that you created.

Edited August 22, 2020 by IasonEvan

[SteveTheCynic]

The discerning viewer quickly realizes that the writers didn't end with the story they started with and had a bunch of continuity errors.

Yes. That has been discussed at length, and I believe it has been confirmed by the staff, that the original plan was for three expansions of KotFE scope (16 chapters each).

Also, the loot and XP game in this was DEPLORABLE. I'm hard pressed to think of an MMO that has worse loot. A cash shop is supposed to pay the bills not supplant the actual fun of getting drops in an MMO. On top of it you have what is in essence a mandatory sub and a cash shop.

I'm not going to debate this, although I'd note that this complaint is essentially unrelated to KotET Chapter IX. I'd also note that SWTOR's subscription is less mandatory than, say, WoW's or FF14's, and both of those have cash shops as well (in both cases, items cost actual cash rather than "tokens" (Cartel Coins) that can be acquired by other means...).

You give me the option to REITERATE OVER AND OVER AND OVER THAT I DON'T WANT THE THRONE AND THEN YOU FORCE MY CHARACTER TO SIT ON IT?

The choices there *are* significantly railroaded, I agree, although you can at least refuse to be Emperor (which is the usual meaning of "I don't want the throne" anyway). Physically sitting on the throne is merely a mechanism for regaining control over the Fleet. Think of it as pushing the "regain control of the Fleet" button, except that button is wired into the seat of the throne so you have to use your butt to press it.

It's doubly awful because I HONESTLY ENJOYED MYSELF UP TO THAT POINT. The character development was amazing. I ADORED that you guys swung for the fences with changing the companions etc. It was bold. So disappointed you didn't follow through on the decision to NOT SIT ON THE THRONE though. You should at the very least REMOVE that option from the game. It flies in the face of prior choices and autonomy of the player and the story that you created.

You've seen my view on the "sit" thing, and the semantic distinction between "I don't want to take the throne" == "I don't want to be Emperor" (an option you have) and "I don't want to even *sit* on the damned thing" == "I don't want to push the 'control the Fleet' button".

 

On the other hand, what I don't like is that there are only two options: "be a tyrannical Emperor" and "be a peacemaking non-Emperor", better expressed as "iron fist in a spiky durasteel gauntlet" versus "bare hand offering an olive branch". Where's "y'all will make peace or I will use the Fleet to *make* you make peace", aka "iron fist in a velvet glove"?

[FlameYOL]

On the other hand, what I don't like is that there are only two options: "be a tyrannical Emperor" and "be a peacemaking non-Emperor", better expressed as "iron fist in a spiky durasteel gauntlet" versus "bare hand offering an olive branch". Where's "y'all will make peace or I will use the Fleet to *make* you make peace", aka "iron fist in a velvet glove"?

 

This would've been a good option to have though I suppose you could headcanon that into the Dark Side ending.

[IasonEvan]

Yes. That has been discussed at length, and I believe it has been confirmed by the staff, that the original plan was for three expansions of KotFE scope (16 chapters each).

 

I'm not going to debate this, although I'd note that this complaint is essentially unrelated to KotET Chapter IX. I'd also note that SWTOR's subscription is less mandatory than, say, WoW's or FF14's, and both of those have cash shops as well (in both cases, items cost actual cash rather than "tokens" (Cartel Coins) that can be acquired by other means...).

 

The choices there *are* significantly railroaded, I agree, although you can at least refuse to be Emperor (which is the usual meaning of "I don't want the throne" anyway). Physically sitting on the throne is merely a mechanism for regaining control over the Fleet. Think of it as pushing the "regain control of the Fleet" button, except that button is wired into the seat of the throne so you have to use your butt to press it.

 

You've seen my view on the "sit" thing, and the semantic distinction between "I don't want to take the throne" == "I don't want to be Emperor" (an option you have) and "I don't want to even *sit* on the damned thing" == "I don't want to push the 'control the Fleet' button".

 

On the other hand, what I don't like is that there are only two options: "be a tyrannical Emperor" and "be a peacemaking non-Emperor", better expressed as "iron fist in a spiky durasteel gauntlet" versus "bare hand offering an olive branch". Where's "y'all will make peace or I will use the Fleet to *make* you make peace", aka "iron fist in a velvet glove"?

 

The sit part I was talking about was when you first arrive at the throne before the electricity part you just sit down with no choice. I actually wrote this post prior to defeating The Emperor. My character simply would not have sat down at all. This is my first time playing this content. I quit in 2012, came back for like a week in 2013 and just started playing again. I liked it enough to sub. I really enjoyed myself. This particular thing was haphazardly done though. They gave me MULTIPLE dialog options to Val where I said I did NOT want the throne. For my character to just sit down without a choice kinda ruined the end for me.

[SteveTheCynic]

The sit part I was talking about was when you first arrive at the throne before the electricity part you just sit down with no choice. I actually wrote this post prior to defeating The Emperor. My character simply would not have sat down at all. This is my first time playing this content. I quit in 2012, came back for like a week in 2013 and just started playing again. I liked it enough to sub. I really enjoyed myself. This particular thing was haphazardly done though. They gave me MULTIPLE dialog options to Val where I said I did NOT want the throne. For my character to just sit down without a choice kinda ruined the end for me.

OK, but you're told that you have to sit or the Fleet will kill *everything*.(1) Given that, are you still going to walk away? It makes sense to at least take a seat, even if you're not going to be Emperor.

 

However, a dialogue option to sit "under protest", of the type, "OK, I'll sit, but only to stop the Fleet," would have been useful, too.

 

(1) There's a separate debate about whether you should trust the person who said that, of course, but given the badness of what happens if you don't trust him, ...

[Bxvx]

I would of liked to see another option also its either become the tyrant you're overthrowing or pacify the fleet, we could of had something like be an emperor that would actually do good things and maybe a 4th option for you to just walk away and let it go wherever lol. Or maybe let Senya take it I'm sure she didn't want it but she was actually a pretty good character if you didn't kill her off lol

[IasonEvan]

OK, but you're told that you have to sit or the Fleet will kill *everything*.(1) Given that, are you still going to walk away? It makes sense to at least take a seat, even if you're not going to be Emperor.

 

However, a dialogue option to sit "under protest", of the type, "OK, I'll sit, but only to stop the Fleet," would have been useful, too.

 

(1) There's a separate debate about whether you should trust the person who said that, of course, but given the badness of what happens if you don't trust him, ...

 

For the culmination of what I found to be a really engaging story it was a disappointing ending that flew in the face of the dialog choices they were giving me.

 

Here's how I'd fix it in order of the best option:

1.) Allow my character to abstain from the throne. Give the option where I don't have to be ruler which goes along with the dialog options the game gave me to say like 5-10 times it felt like.

OR

2.) Remove the multiple dialog options for your character to say they don't want to rule so that actually taking the throne doesn't fly in the face of your dialog options.

OR

3.) Write an actual compelling ending that isn't a McGuffin. It's so lazy.

[ChaosIsGolden]

Sorry for how longwinded this is, but it's a good thread to put what I feel killed player choice in KOTET and somewhat beyond. (Note, I haven't started Jedi Under Siege, I'm curious to see if your preferences make a big difference in the overall narrative. While giving the player base more dialogue options that feel natural to your chosen class).

 

Honestly, for the most part, I enjoyed certain aspects of KOTFE and KOTET, romances with Lana and Theron, in particular, was well done. Certain companion returns were handled nicely (I'm looking at you Kaliyo and Jorgan for Agent and Trooper returns); overall, the story was entertaining, especially on my Juggernaut.

 

However, while I did appreciate how the first eight chapters of KOTFE made even my Smuggler feel natural as the chosen hero, I didn't particularly enjoy how chapter nine hits and your character is given the dialogue option of a good guy or evil jack***, no in-between. This continues until the end of KOTET, while also making my non-force user characters feel irrelevant, which annoys the hell out of me since my main is a gunslinger.

 

If they’d been allowed to finish what they were planning with the next two expansions, I wonder if the story might have been more satisfying, and your character could have gotten those nuanced reactions that felt ideal for your class. Hell, it may have even given a good reason why non-force user classes felt like a natural choice other than the fact that you’re a good leader.

 

I wish the Bioware team would have been smart when they dropped 4.0 and taken a similar path as they did in 3.0, giving the fans an overall enjoyable story. While also releasing content for other players interested in more than just the story. New fps, ops, wzs, and arenas would have kept the entire player base satisfied and subscribed.

 

Instead, Bioware did the same thing they did upon the initial release of SWTOR, which was expecting the story would be enough to keep the player base happy. That's not the case; while I assume there were many people pleased with the overall narrative, there were many other players who wanted more than just reruns of old PVE content and no new PVP instances to enjoy. This, to me, was the most significant detriment for why KOTET felt so condensed and dropped down to the options of a saint or evil dictator. They had to end the Zakuul arc quickly to please the fleeing player base, which translated into giving the player no opportunity to say kiss my *** to remaining the commander and warming the throne at the end of KOTET.

[Bxvx]

Sorry for how longwinded this is, but it's a good thread to put what I feel killed player choice in KOTET and somewhat beyond. (Note, I haven't started Jedi Under Siege, I'm curious to see if your preferences make a big difference in the overall narrative. While giving the player base more dialogue options that feel natural to your chosen class).

 

Honestly, for the most part, I enjoyed certain aspects of KOTFE and KOTET, romances with Lana and Theron, in particular, was well done. Certain companion returns were handled nicely (I'm looking at you Kaliyo and Jorgan for Agent and Trooper returns); overall, the story was entertaining, especially on my Juggernaut.

 

However, while I did appreciate how the first eight chapters of KOTFE made even my Smuggler feel natural as the chosen hero, I didn't particularly enjoy how chapter nine hits and your character is given the dialogue option of a good guy or evil jack***, no in-between. This continues until the end of KOTET, while also making my non-force user characters feel irrelevant, which annoys the hell out of me since my main is a gunslinger.

 

If they’d been allowed to finish what they were planning with the next two expansions, I wonder if the story might have been more satisfying, and your character could have gotten those nuanced reactions that felt ideal for your class. Hell, it may have even given a good reason why non-force user classes felt like a natural choice other than the fact that you’re a good leader.

 

I wish the Bioware team would have been smart when they dropped 4.0 and taken a similar path as they did in 3.0, giving the fans an overall enjoyable story. While also releasing content for other players interested in more than just the story. New fps, ops, wzs, and arenas would have kept the entire player base satisfied and subscribed.

 

Instead, Bioware did the same thing they did upon the initial release of SWTOR, which was expecting the story would be enough to keep the player base happy. That's not the case; while I assume there were many people pleased with the overall narrative, there were many other players who wanted more than just reruns of old PVE content and no new PVP instances to enjoy. This, to me, was the most significant detriment for why KOTET felt so condensed and dropped down to the options of a saint or evil dictator. They had to end the Zakuul arc quickly to please the fleeing player base, which translated into giving the player no opportunity to say kiss my *** to remaining the commander and warming the throne at the end of KOTET.

 

Kind of off topic but related to what you said, I'm more of an imperial player a few months ago when I came back I actually made all the different Rep classes. But the Jedi Under Siege was probably my favorite as a Republic toon. It's been so long since I was considered the hero of the galaxy was nice. Not spoiling anything but I hope you enjoy it also!