Gearing Changes in Eternal Throne

[KnightOfTython]

Honestly with the changes they made putting any crafting mat on op bosses will be the same as making it bop

 

Well if they put mats on NiM (Master) Bosses only then I would agree, but thats not the case.

With 5.0 the only teaser is amount of CXP and that is a real problem if you want to make people go raiding.

 

To get CXP you have enough alternatives and casuals are fine with that.

You guys think that everyone will go raiding for fun and CXP only, but I make a bet that this will not happen.

Edited October 22, 2016 by KnightOfTython

[Kingsbount]

What truly baffles me is why anyone cares what someone that won't be in their group has, or doesn't have. Of course, I've been called out about asking this before, since it's so obvious that that's not what they're caring about, and yet, here we are again, riding the crazy train because someone else might get something someone doesn't think they deserve.

 

What truly baffles me, that people wants something that they are not suppose to have.

 

The same way i can demand Wings of Architect "becouse im running Heroics! Why Special snowflakes cannot understand that casuals are also deserve it??!!1111111".

 

Seriously. That's EXACTLY how you sound right.

 

High-end top-tier gear should NEVER get into the hands of people, who doesn't even run Operations. Period.

 

This is a LAW of ALL MMORPG'S in a world.

 

You are running high-end content - you get best gear.

 

If you will try to prove that i'm wrong - look at all those "successfull" MMO.

And you will notice that TOP-TIER gear require RAIDING.

Non of them will give you top-tier gear for doing daily quests.

 

If person A have a large house and awsome sportcar - you can't just whine that you deserve it to and demand to share it with you, despite the fact that you are simple janitor.

 

Get it through you head:

TOP-TIER GEAR DEMANDS HARD WORK.

[Zasszz]

As high level crafter you have enough credits to buy mats in GTN anyway.

So it doesn't matter, but one rare mat should be bind on pickup for a reason.

And the reason is to FORCE players into raiding to have a chance to obtain ONE item from a boss (because there are others there too) to craft something that might or might not be even useful because random stats. In the long run this results in wasting mats on useless items that dont even return the mats you spent in the first place by reverse engineering them. Even if you gain a better version of that item, it only means spending more time to obtain ONE item with a chance to craft a useful item.

 

This is one of the dumbest systems of all! Ive seen it in wow and it sucks jedibutt!

 

You seriously think that CXP is fun enough for grinding old content over and over again? That's hilarious.

Guess what raiders have been doing the past two years? Grinding OLD CONTENT! Did you play a different game the past years?

[Sareeph]

What truly baffles me is why anyone cares what someone that won't be in their group has, or doesn't have. Of course, I've been called out about asking this before, since it's so obvious that that's not what they're caring about, and yet, here we are again, riding the crazy train because someone else might get something someone doesn't think they deserve.

 

Stop being baffled. There are some who try really difficult things for the challenge. The gear that comes with it is a badge to prove you did it. If you climbed Mt Everest and I met you on the street, I would have no idea that you accomplished something amazing. Now if they had a T-shirt that could only be attained if you really did it, I could recognize your accomplishment and congratulate you. Just a thought for where you are going to try and take this, why is it that every military has special badges/uniforms for accomplishments?

 

PS. I don't look up the Achievements of everyone I pass in the game, do you?

Edited October 22, 2016 by Sareeph

[Tsetso]

Well if they put mats on NiM (Master) Bosses only then I would agree, but thats not the case.

The problem with 5.0 is that the only teaser is CXP with optional sources and that is a real problem if you want to make people go raiding.

 

I probably wasn't really clear. I think that with the rng bs and no wait till january to hear something about group content(when asked about ops specifically), there simply won't be enough people left to run even hm ops(EV & KP excluded). The small number of groups doing it will keep the mats in the guild bank to be able to partially gear a new member when someone leaves so the supply will be really small.

Edited October 22, 2016 by Tsetso

[KnightOfTython]

 

Guess what raiders have been doing the past two years? Grinding OLD CONTENT!

 

So you appreciate that and would like to move on that way? You gotta be kidding or must be paid by EA to say that.

Edited October 22, 2016 by KnightOfTython

[Tsillah]

Finding the easiest way is exactly why we have all these threads railing against this system. According to posters in these threads, they can be fully geared, or gear someone else, in three hours. We've been told that the fastest way to get end game gear is going to be through end game content, and since most of the hardcore raiders I know want it now, I don't think being able to eventually get everything you'd need for an end game raid through Story, FPs etc is going to be as game breaking as some would have us believe.

 

I sort of touched on the general idea of this part above: If the fastest way to get this gear is going to be end game content, then the people that feel like they have to have it, and soon, are going to be raiding, or maybe Pvping, to get it.

 

Well Eric might've said that NiM ops will give more points and therefore is faster, but that doesn't mean it's the fastest way to level up. Why not? Because you can't just do NiM ops. You first need the gear to do that so for the first while doing the hardest content is not the best way to level up in GC simply because you don't have the gear to do that.

 

Now I am assuming that the operations will be scaled to level 70. If they don't then, well it will be a lot easier to do but then why have new tiers of gear, so I think it's more reasonable to assume that at least anything HM or NiM will be level 70 content.

 

So the question is then, what is faster initially? That is what I am talking about. What are raiders going to do before hitting HM and NiM, in order to get the gear required to do that?

 

I wonder if it will be SM ops, at least outside of the guild context. Pugs might suffer from this a lot depending on the situation.

 

I mean if I do a series of Heroics in an hour and this nets me 80 points (just an example) and I can do an SM operation which lasts about an hour which gets me 100 points, then you might say doing the operation is the best option.

 

However, when you look at the time it takes to a get a group together, traveling to the ops, people going afk, disconnecting, leaving, being kicked and replacements needing to be found, you may find that in actual time it takes an hour and a half from start to finish.

 

Then doing heroics is more effective.

 

Now I don't know what the numbers will be exactly, but the actual numbers will determine what people will do and not do in the end.

[Tsetso]

What truly baffles me, that people wants something that they are not suppose to have.

 

The same way i can demand Wings of Architect "becouse im running Heroics! Why Special snowflakes cannot understand that casuals are also deserve it??!!1111111".

 

Let me point you to this thread

[Zasszz]

What truly baffles me, that people wants something that they are not suppose to have.

 

The same way i can demand Wings of Architect "becouse im running Heroics! Why Special snowflakes cannot understand that casuals are also deserve it??!!1111111".

 

Seriously. That's EXACTLY how you sound right.

 

High-end top-tier gear should NEVER get into the hands of people, who doesn't even run Operations. Period.

 

This is a LAW of ALL MMORPG'S in a world.

 

You are running high-end content - you get best gear.

 

If you will try to prove that i'm wrong - look at all those "successfull" MMO.

And you will notice that TOP-TIER gear require RAIDING.

Non of them will give you top-tier gear for doing daily quests.

 

If person A have a large house and awsome sportcar - you can't just whine that you deserve it to and demand to share it with you, despite the fact that you are simple janitor.

 

Get it through you head:

TOP-TIER GEAR DEMANDS HARD WORK.

First of all, you sound like an elitist snob who has a certain picture about how others must play a game.

Second, other MMOs are already doing things different.

Third, Im ok with raiding gear being available before players start raiding. It makes the first raids much smoother.

 

What I do criticize is that HIGHER raiding gear is available for not raiding. I agree that players dont really need it from our point of view but for what they are doing, it increases THEIR enjoyment of the game. The problem is that is makes raiding less rewarding FOR GEARING. Certain rewards are still only available for raiders only like the wings, achievements, the experience and the success of NiM raiding itself.

 

So when NiM players complain about what non-NiM raiders can have, its just whining and begrudging what other people can have with less effort.

 

So you appreciate that and would like to move on that way? You gotta be kidding or must be paid by EA to say that.

When did I say I appreciate grinding old content for two years? I didnt. I see the lack of raiding content like everyone else. Even tho Im not raiding much. New raiding content is a must have for swtor and bioware refuses to deliver. Yet raiders grinded the available OPs for two years. Their choice.

Edited October 22, 2016 by Zasszz

[robertthebard]

What truly baffles me, that people wants something that they are not suppose to have.

.

 

Stopped reading right there. Not supposed to have according to whom? An elitist player base that won't let them in groups to get gear unless they already have it? That's the reason raiding is dead, more than anything else, the lack of participation in raids was caused by raiders. You can gnash your teeth and flail about wildly all you like, but I've seen this behavior at work.

 

I had a fresh 50 Mara blocked from a SM op because he didn't have a NiM gear rating. I had a fully geared Sage crying about my healer spec'd Sage, and then stand in the laser in TBC and die. I guess they, like a lot of others, believed that the gear would carry them through the mechanics, and they wouldn't have to worry about it? Guess who caused that TBC wipe. That's right, that hardcore raider that was more worried about other people's gear, than what they were doing in the content. So sorry, just because someone carries someone else through a raid, it doesn't mean that the carried deserves that gear any more than anyone else.

[PizzaDaHut]

So let me get this straight:

 

The ONLY way to earn CXP is through Operations/ "Uprisings" (whatever THAT is), and ranked war zones.

 

No more Galactic Conflict weeklies, no CXP for flashpoints at 70, nothing like that?

 

Last time I tried waiting for an SM OPS group through group finder with a tank - 5 hours.

 

So, no CXP for flashpoints at 70. Got it. Great going SWTOR. This actually makes it more difficult to gear since only 500 people (or less) are playing.

[Tsetso]

So let me get this straight:

 

The ONLY way to earn CXP is through Operations/ "Uprisings" (whatever THAT is), and ranked war zones.

 

No more Galactic Conflict weeklies, no CXP for flashpoints at 70, nothing like that?

 

Last time I tried waiting for an SM OPS group through group finder with a tank - 5 hours.

 

So, no CXP for flashpoints at 70. Got it. Great going SWTOR. This actually makes it more difficult to gear since only 500 people (or less) are playing.

 

No, it's exactly the opposite. You earn CXP pretty much from anything you do in the game (not sure about RP-ing)

[robertthebard]

Well Eric might've said that NiM ops will give more points and therefore is faster, but that doesn't mean it's the fastest way to level up. Why not? Because you can't just do NiM ops. You first need the gear to do that so for the first while doing the hardest content is not the best way to level up in GC simply because you don't have the gear to do that.

 

Nobody is going to be lvl 70 immediately upon logging in either, so they won't be affected by the changes until they ding.

 

Now I am assuming that the operations will be scaled to level 70. If they don't then, well it will be a lot easier to do but then why have new tiers of gear, so I think it's more reasonable to assume that at least anything HM or NiM will be level 70 content.

 

So the question is then, what is faster initially? That is what I am talking about. What are raiders going to do before hitting HM and NiM, in order to get the gear required to do that?

 

I wonder if it will be SM ops, at least outside of the guild context. Pugs might suffer from this a lot depending on the situation.

 

I mean if I do a series of Heroics in an hour and this nets me 80 points (just an example) and I can do an SM operation which lasts about an hour which gets me 100 points, then you might say doing the operation is the best option.

 

However, when you look at the time it takes to a get a group together, traveling to the ops, people going afk, disconnecting, leaving, being kicked and replacements needing to be found, you may find that in actual time it takes an hour and a half from start to finish.

 

Then doing heroics is more effective.

 

Now I don't know what the numbers will be exactly, but the actual numbers will determine what people will do and not do in the end.

 

Right, so railing on and on about how "casuals" are going to have it easier is nonsensical, at best, at this point. We don't know, but we assume we do, or, at least, some of us do. I truly despise RNG, but I've been the "victim" of systems 1,000 times worse than this one, and that may well be an understatement, since all I know about this one is technically "on paper". None of us have seen it in action, and so, none of us know. Those railing the loudest are simply taking the worst case scenario, and running with it like it will be the norm.

[Tsetso]

Nobody is going to be lvl 70 immediately upon logging in either, so they won't be affected by the changes until they ding.

 

 

 

Right, so railing on and on about how "casuals" are going to have it easier is nonsensical, at best, at this point. We don't know, but we assume we do, or, at least, some of us do. I truly despise RNG, but I've been the "victim" of systems 1,000 times worse than this one, and that may well be an understatement, since all I know about this one is technically "on paper". None of us have seen it in action, and so, none of us know. Those railing the loudest are simply taking the worst case scenario, and running with it like it will be the norm.

 

It won't be the norm, but noone is guaranteed that he won't be the victim. I rage-quit Aion after crafting maybe 70 weapons and not critting the final craft to make for whatever craft tier was necessary for the first set, and promised to myself that i'm never going to bother with rng bs.

[robertthebard]

It won't be the norm, but noone is guaranteed that he won't be the victim. I rage-quit Aion after crafting maybe 70 weapons and not critting the final craft to make for whatever craft tier was necessary for the first set, and promised to myself that i'm never going to bother with rng bs.

 

As it happens, I was referring to Aion in that post, along with Rappelz. I did, eventually beat the RNG gods, that's not what drove me away from Aion. What drove me away was allowing capped toons to rift into lowbie lands, since I felt the "fast track" server was for noobs.

[micmitja]

Guess what raiders have been doing the past two years? Grinding OLD CONTENT! Did you play a different game the past years?

 

Exactly right we have already been grinding that old content for past 2/5 years, and now they are forcing us to do same sh it all over again without any actual new content.

 

And those of us that are here for this amount of time we have already grind on everything that game got to offer, out of pure boredom since we didn't have much else to do, if nothing else. + on top of that we have to pray to RNG Jesus as they say to get what we want.

 

Y awesome new content, most of us are waiting it with anticipation, seriously.

Edited October 22, 2016 by micmitja

[Tsetso]

As it happens, I was referring to Aion in that post, along with Rappelz. I did, eventually beat the RNG gods, that's not what drove me away from Aion. What drove me away was allowing capped toons to rift into lowbie lands, since I felt the "fast track" server was for noobs.

 

I think it wasn't allowed. I had a ~25 twink which i kept at that level for months exactly so that i had access to the rifts.

Anyway it was the no guarantee that i'll ever do it that drove me away. If that bs is coming to swtor gearing i'm out.

Edited October 22, 2016 by Tsetso

[robertthebard]

I think it wasn't allowed. I had a ~25 twink which i kept at that level for months exactly so that i had access to the rifts.

 

I had one at 30, but I didn't rift, I chased rifters, it was grand fun, and made PvP mean something. I was hoping for something like that here, but major disappointment instead.

[Zasszz]

Exactly right we have already been grinding that old content for past 2/5 years, and now they are forcing us to do same sh it all over again without any actual new content.

 

And those of us that are here for this amount of time we have already grind on everything that game got to offer, out of pure boredom since we didn't have much else to do, if nothing else. + on top of that we have to pray to RNG Jesus as they say to get what we want.

 

Y awesome new content, most of us are waiting it with anticipation, seriously.

As I wrote, I fully understand that situation and I agree that it sucks.

[Tsillah]

Nobody is going to be lvl 70 immediately upon logging in either, so they won't be affected by the changes until they ding.

 

And what does that have to do with it? You don't get any points for GC until you are 70 so what you do before that is completely irrelevant to GC. You can't use those 5 levels to get some sort of head start and if HM/NiM ops are indeed scaled to level 70 you can't do them until you level to 70 and then do all sorts of other things to get the gear required to do HM/NiM.

 

Right, so railing on and on about how "casuals" are going to have it easier is nonsensical, at best, at this point. We don't know, but we assume we do, or, at least, some of us do. I truly despise RNG, but I've been the "victim" of systems 1,000 times worse than this one, and that may well be an understatement, since all I know about this one is technically "on paper". None of us have seen it in action, and so, none of us know. Those railing the loudest are simply taking the worst case scenario, and running with it like it will be the norm.

 

As I stated, I am fine with anybody getting top gear. Are you still saying I'm one of these people railing about worst case scenarios, because then I'm going to have to seriously doubt your reading skills.

[micmitja]

As I wrote, I fully understand that situation and I agree that it sucks.

 

Well i am just pissed because veterans of this game aren't worth sh it. Who cares if they wasted years of their time in to game if u got tons of new players and noobs (what we all were at some point in time) that haven't done the 10% of content so far.

 

On this Announcement of Announcement and empty promises i don't give 5 cents on, if they would actually had any plans for they would told us just to **** and relax. How does the say goes give dog a bone to stop barking. But instead they will do what ever they want to do regardless of what players want as usual. Even when they look at the forum they always just see few posts that they want to see.

 

The Announcement of Announcement in Jan that we will have will more likely be decided if this game is still worth running or not, based on amount of ppl that have left already after 2y waiting on new group content and those that still will after they will finish new chapters and test the uprising because after that what back to 3rd year of grinding same content for purpose of gear. That wont stick

Edited October 22, 2016 by micmitja

[Zasszz]

Well i am just pissed because veterans of this game aren't worth sh it. Who cares if they wasted years of their time in to game if u got tons of new players and noobs (what we all were at some point in time) that haven't done the 10% of content so far.

Even if players choose to do only trading and mats farming, its THEIR choice of gameplay in this game. They didnt get new content either. Thats why the galactic command crap is coming.

 

On this Announcement of Announcement and empty promises i don't give 5 cents on, if they would actually had any plans for they would told us just to **** and relax. How does the say goes give dog a bone to stop barking. But instead they will do what ever they want to do regardless of what players want as usual. Even when they look at the forum they always just see few posts that they want to see.

You know the secret to ruling? Give people what they need, not what they want.

Giving people what they want can go even worse. But devs HAVE to listen to their playerbase and not just ignore it like bioware is doing right now. A good indication is that there isnt much positive feedback for any of the coming changes so far.

 

The Announcement of Announcement in Jan that we will have will more likely be decided if this game is still worth running or not, based on amount of ppl that have left already after 2y waiting on new group content and those that still will after they will finish new chapters and test the uprising because after that what back to 3rd year of grinding same content for purpose of gear. That wont stick

If they decide against new raiding content at least you know they really dont give a damn about raiders and veterans. Then you can quit with a clear conscience.

[micmitja]

They never in the history of this manage to piss so many Raiders, PvPers that usually couldn't stand each other and even Rpers have joined this club because of lack of content. So far have seen only few casuals happy about it. But even when we are talking about casual players those can be casual raider/pvper and rper.

[Wolfiry]

I'm just gonna make a guess here but they maybe want to make the top gear available for everyone beacuse of this Dark versus Light war that will be in kotet especially when I saw the last feed about bosses that will appear when one of the sides reached rank 5. And probably all the other stuff also as uprising and etc. But thats me only guessing. What I suspect will happen is that many will try first month or so and then some will stay and some will leave and those that leave will maybe consider comming back when next expansion info will be released. What I would want to know is really why they change this so much beacuse the reason to make it easier and etc is things thats just makes a game boring. I want a challenge and it to be hard so one have to really think and test and try diffirent tactics and approaches in fights and etc. I dont care about the repair cost, the joy of accomplish something that was hard to overcome even if one dont manage it that day one cant wait for next time to give it a shot again and succed.

[monster_cody]

only reason i did ops was for gear even as a prefered player, since ops passes used to cost below 350k

ever since 4.0 i stopped doing ops all together why well reason 1 was that all ops passes now cost in between 1.4-2.1million credits and reason 2 is because its the same ops over and over got tired of that

with 5.0 yeah wont do any ops whatsoever tired of old ops need new ones

as for this gearing change

let bioware do this and let them panic as they will kill their beloved endgame they LOVE so much