Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) TORSTATUS Okay the above is simply to prove a point... YES before people say "they increased server capacity... I know. Also before people say "how" does he know? Well he knows because all he does is automatically copy the feed from the SWTOR official site. It's the trends that are important. launch... low drops. when everyone finishes the story it grows. It drops again the weekend the new movie launched. BUT then grows again after the new year. Now with this small update we see yes on the day it launches low drop...the it basically climbs right back up to the November 2015 high point. It will be almost 2 months between this and the next chapter. Can anyone logically say that subscriptions can be sustained with fluff rewards under the current circumstances? So conclusions. I am under NO delusions that BW can suddenly develope new playable PvE content. The team that did that was either laid off or moved over the ME:A and the budget is largely locked in at least until Part I is over. So, imo, BW either needs to change the current financial model and not have KOTFE be sub only. Yeah sure have the "subs get it for free, for those willing to do it, but a B2P option is likely in order. If not I see a rather rough spring and summer for the accountants trying to justify things. Edited February 23, 2016 by Ghisallo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JouerTue Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 i don't know how they could think this was a great idea from start. i still don't believe people just sub for the chapters. i am subbed because i like the rest of the game, chapters are an extra. if they'd been the only thing i do, i'd NEVER stay subbed for those alone. i lost hope for new ops, but i want to see if the new wz and champion thing change something. i doubt, but let's see. TFA hype is over! and next episode is way ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_plankskull Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 We went through this already... both sides going back and forth... for roughly 30 pages... and no one really changed there mind... Only thing we can do is wait for the next quarter results, and hope they actually post all the necessary vital information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackosaur Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) Success to EA is measured in $$ not server populations. Unless you can prove they're not making a profit with the new approach this conversation is moot. Edited February 23, 2016 by Jackosaur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 This really cemented for me how much of the forums are children talking about things they don't understand at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falensawino Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) That website can't be accurate. according to that site, it says all the pvp servers have the same population. ø 0.96 Jung Ma (RP PvP) ø 0.96 East Prophecy of the Five (PvP) ø 0.96 West The Bastion (PvP) if you actually visit any of these servers, you'll find that jung ma is a ghost town compared to the other two. there are population differences between the pvp servers and this website doesn't reflect that Edited February 23, 2016 by Falensawino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_plankskull Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 That website can't be accurate. according to that site, it says all the pvp servers have the same population. if you actually visit any of these servers, you'll find that jung ma is a ghost town compared to the other two. there are population differences between the pvp servers and this website doesn't reflect that ø 0.96 Jung Ma (RP PvP) ø 0.96 East Prophecy of the Five (PvP) ø 0.96 West The Bastion (PvP) All three servers flat lined... that enough should tell you something needs to be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 All three servers flat lined... that enough should tell you something needs to be done. You don't really understand numbers, do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrelballz Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) Success to EA is measured in $$ not server populations. Unless you can prove they're not making a profit with the new approach this conversation is moot. Gotta agree with this until the next earning figures come out KOTFE currently is a success. I also do suspect with the eternal championship and the new warzones that an OPS is eventually around the corner so with all that content they should be able to bring in a good amount of vets and new players into the game. Edited February 23, 2016 by squirrelballz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_plankskull Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 You don't really understand numbers, do you? I myself wish there was a more accurate way to tell the exact population... but servers shouldn't be referred to as a "ghost town." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 We went through this already... both sides going back and forth... for roughly 30 pages... and no one really changed there mind... Only thing we can do is wait for the next quarter results, and hope they actually post all the necessary vital information. My point is to only note that the game can possibly succeed just not with the current financial model. no more no less. please don't read into things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 My point is to only note that the game can possibly succeed just not with the current financial model. no more no less. please don't read into things Okay, show me the reports of how much money they're making. You have NO METRIC to judge how much population translates to how much money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_plankskull Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 My point is to only note that the game can possibly succeed just not with the current financial model. no more no less. please don't read into things I don't agree either that the game will continue to exist in the next few years if it keeps this trend up, but alas... there were some others who thought that developing only story content will keep the game alive. As mentioned... before... only the quarter results will really tell the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingUsPoo Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 With threads like "I Spent $450 on cartel packs" followed by 200 posts of "me too and i didn't get my glow stick", how could Bioware/EA possibly think things are going bad? They made a metric crap-ton of cash this last month. They'll roll out another pack and people will buy it by en-mass just to put on the GTN (like always). Until that stops, there could be 4 people per server and the game will still be a success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 Success to EA is measured in $$ not server populations. Unless you can prove they're not making a profit with the new approach this conversation is moot. The thing is though how many people will keep a sub ticking for 2 months when they don't play. You have only to look at the one MMO that used to give regular subscriber updates... WoW. If you actually read all of their releases (not just those around expac launches) you saw basically a Sine Wave in terms of subscriber numbers. Is there any reason to think a different dynamic would exist here. Okay, show me the reports of how much money they're making. You have NO METRIC to judge how much population translates to how much money. Well I can tell you something. Until this expac the quarterly reports were less than thrilling in terms of this game and its success, after the 6-8 week dev cycle of 2013 calendar year. The only time after that when they had good things to say was the quarter that SoR launched. Even then it was just "brought many new players to the game" but in terms of profits it was not mentioned as contributing to growth in the segment. That is very telling and after that it was downhill again. Then for this expac they did indeed speak of good things. Not surprising since to play this expac at launch it required a subscription. But stop for a moment and consider something. I LOVE SWTOR, honestly I do, but i also have this nasty tendency to think logically. What is logical thought? 1. remembering all the players that complained the sub model was too draconian and that f2p should have more. --- this make me say "why would these players remain subbed... or not be complaining even more because this expac provides less for an existing sub (play wise) than any before it. 2. thinking... "how many players will pay 14.99 a month for ~1 hour of new content on a 2-1.5 month cycle with only a single fluff reward in the same period to keep them playing? 3. We have become a society, even admitted in the December live stream of "binge watchers". Will this dynamic somehow have a disconnect here? If so please provide a logical explanation as to why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 That website can't be accurate. according to that site, it says all the pvp servers have the same population. ø 0.96 Jung Ma (RP PvP) ø 0.96 East Prophecy of the Five (PvP) ø 0.96 West The Bastion (PvP) if you actually visit any of these servers, you'll find that jung ma is a ghost town compared to the other two. there are population differences between the pvp servers and this website doesn't reflect that If you go to the monthly bits you see some small difference. The problem is this, and it sucks. PvP, especially Open World PvP, has been dead here for some time thanks to the fact the engine does not allow for large scale and/or open world PvP. The main purpose to roll on a PvP server is to engage in Open World PvP. Ergo they all have similar low ratings because...well people just don't roll on them here. Search "Illum" and "PvP" to see the prime example of open world PvP failure in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 With threads like "I Spent $450 on cartel packs" followed by 200 posts of "me too and i didn't get my glow stick", how could Bioware/EA possibly think things are going bad? They made a metric crap-ton of cash this last month. They'll roll out another pack and people will buy it by en-mass just to put on the GTN (like always). Until that stops, there could be 4 people per server and the game will still be a success. The problem is those are, as the industry calls, "whales". "Whales" are fickle players who can leave as quickly as the arrived. To keep them you MUST keep them engaged in playing. When people do not play they do not pay. When there is nothing new to do what keeps them engaged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 2. thinking... "how many players will pay 14.99 a month for ~1 hour of new content on a 2-1.5 month cycle with only a single fluff reward in the same period to keep them playing? At this point I'm convinced all the people who hate the current direction of the game still pay sub to come on here and whine about it, so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) I don't agree either that the game will continue to exist in the next few years if it keeps this trend up, but alas... there were some others who thought that developing only story content will keep the game alive. As mentioned... before... only the quarter results will really tell the truth. I agree on you last point. The thing is this. I am in my mid 40's, have played MMORPGs since UO and EQ days. They are all I play. I also, besides my pension and separate 401k, personbally invest and some of those investments are in companies like EA, Activision/Blizzard etc. (not those, I invest in ones a bit more consistent atm). Because of this I have for about 20 years now followed the financial performance of games rather closely. Here is what we have. EVERY MMORPG, and I mean every one, has suffered financially when there is nothing new to "play". EQ2 had major issue with TSO because it took 18 months. This game had major issues because it was 14 months before SoR came out. I could note others as well but those are two that I think most, if they did not play, are familiar with. SWTOR here is looking to keep people subbed not with new playable content but rather with fluff rewards provided at the same time we get a 60-90 minute updates on a 30+-60 day cycle. Imo it beggars logic to believe that this is sustainable over the long haul. Now maybe back in the day where the games in the market were EQ, WoW, EQ2, DAoC, Asheron's Call, SWG and CoH, FFXI, Lineage you could get away with it. but now what do we have? EQ, EQ2, WoW, SWTOR, FFXIV, SWTOR, GW2, Aion, Blade and Soul, TERA, Secret World, Wild Star, Archeage, Rift, Neverwinter, then add in the games that filled specific niches that previously only MMORPGS filled, such as Destiny, League of legends, DOTA etc. (I purposefully omitted EVE online because it is rather unique in many ways and appeals to a VERY specific type of MMORPG player.) When the market is this saturated, you can't take anything for granted and I fear that EA/BW is doing just that, because of the IP involved here. Edited February 23, 2016 by Ghisallo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrelballz Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 At this point I'm convinced all the people who hate the current direction of the game still pay sub to come on here and whine about it, so... Not the best way to spend 15 dollars in my opinion and I personally wouldn't. However, if it gets their voice heard people should do whatever they feel is necessary after all this is the official forums and that said 15 dollars for voicing concerns isn't the worst way to spend money for some people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 Not the best way to spend 15 dollars in my opinion and I personally wouldn't. However, if it gets their voice heard people should do whatever they feel is necessary after all this is the official forums and that said 15 dollars for voicing concerns isn't the worst way to spend money for some people. Oh and I don't pay a subscription anymore. I had a recurring multi-month subscription that won't run out for sometime. I intend to get my monies worth so when I have nothing to do in game, I will be here letting my opinions be known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neglience Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) If EAs goal was to get more players to play the game with KOTFE, it is clearly a failure. Most servers are still ghosttowns as before KOTFE and the "full" servers are not that full either. If this game makes more money with KOTFE, well time will tell. I would say the big income from SWTOR is the CM-market not sub fees. So as long as players spend $$$ on the CM, the game will be fine. Edited February 23, 2016 by Neglience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andisim Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 still subbed, didn't play for three weeks now, just no urge to do so. due to no new content i started to chase the planetary achievments, but now i'm bored by doing so. think i'll remain subbed anyway, doesn't hurt me that much. but who knows... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappywhite Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Success to EA is measured in $$ not server populations. Unless you can prove they're not making a profit with the new approach this conversation is moot. There ya go. Sub numbers don't matter one bit when people are paying hundreds of dollars for hypercrates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappywhite Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 If you enjoy the game, play it. If not, play something else. Why does its success or profitability affect your opinion of the game itself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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