Kaggath Battlegrounds Heats - Galactic Alliance vs Phantom Hegemony

[Aurbere]

OK, counter-strategy. As I mentioned the Hegemony is going to go for the enemy flagship as well, and I think they are going to have a much easier time of it. One squad of Storm Commandos should be enough to do the job, remember the Hegemony has the support of Imperial Intelligence, they can provide the full layout of an ISD, heck they might even have the exact schematics Chimaera itself, as well as useful information such as weak points and patrol rotas.

 

This will make infiltrating the vessel easy. Board the ship with some drop pods carrying Storm Commandos and a distraction e.g. a Carbonite war droid, or a force of B2 battle droids, then have the Storm Commandos go about their work. Overload the reactor, lay waste to the hangar bays, and force Gilad into an escape pod bound for Ord Mantell.

 

A good point about boarding squads, but I would counter that point with the fact that it is likely that the GA has SpecForce soldiers on board, which would prove problematic for the Storm Commandos.

[Beniboybling]

Like what? Your commandos are off storming a ship that's much harder to attack, that will take much much longer to attack due to the raised Alarms and locked doors. There's a bloody train on your ship, and none of your droids or cameras can even SEE Jaina.

 

Her battle with Grievous would be the only delay, but we all know how easy that would be for her.

Storm commandos have stealth fielded generators, a detailed layout of the ship and wealth of inflitration expertise that Jaina lacks. They will not be tripping alarms or getting locked behind doors.

 

On the other hand, Jaina has no foolproof means of avoiding detection. Sure she can shut off some cameras but sooner or later one of the droids she hacks apart is going to contact command before she can dismantle it.

 

Nor will all the cameras (which all she did was blow up with the Force) be on display for all to see.

 

Remembering that the Malevolence is at full capacity now, expect security to be much tighter than before. Heck bearing that in mind, Jaina might not make it to the bridge. Activate ray shields anyone?

[Beniboybling]

A good point about boarding squads, but I would counter that point with the fact that it is likely that the GA has SpecForce soldiers on board, which would prove problematic for the Storm Commandos.

Not sure what SpecForce can bring to the table if they have no idea the Storm Commandos are on board...

[Aurbere]

Not sure what SpecForce can bring to the table if they have no idea the Storm Commandos are on board...

 

Well, they'll know about boarders. Kinda hard to miss boarding ships.

 

Though I think Tune said a while back that the SpecForce troops had means of detecting stealth. I'd have to look into it.

[Beniboybling]

Well, they'll know about boarders. Kinda hard to miss boarding ships.

 

Though I think Tune said a while back that the SpecForce troops had means of detecting stealth. I'd have to look into it.

Don't forget about the distraction. Recall when Ventress' rescued Nute Gunary, drop pods are launched, seemingly deploying just a small army of droids, but once the field has been cleared out pops Ventress undetected.

 

The same strategy will be deployed here, the Alliance has no knowledge of the storm commandos, and pods are going to be striking every ship. They'll assume its a routine boarding action, and as soon as the coast is clear out pop storm commandos, stealthed mind you, and go about there work. Gilad won't realise whats happening until its far to late.

 

Regardless, Storm Commandos > SpecForce in my opinion.

[Aurbere]

Don't forget about the distraction. Recall when Ventress' rescued Nute Gunary, drop pods are launched, seemingly deploying just a small army of droids, but once the field has been cleared out pops Ventress undetected.

 

The same strategy will be deployed here, the Alliance has no knowledge of the storm commandos, and pods are going to be striking every ship. They'll assume its a routine boarding action, and as soon as the coast is clear out pop storm commandos, stealthed mind you, and go about there work. Gilad won't realise whats happening until its far to late.

 

Regardless, Storm Commandos > SpecForce in my opinion.

 

That's a sound strategy. Of course, if the attackers fail, then I assume the pods would be destroyed/searched, which blows the Storm Commandos' cover.

 

That's debatable. I would probably agree that Storm Commandos are superior, but I would have to do more research on it.

[Beniboybling]

That's a sound strategy. Of course, if the attackers fail, then I assume the pods would be destroyed/searched, which blows the Storm Commandos' cover.

 

That's debatable. I would probably agree that Storm Commandos are superior, but I would have to do more research on it.

Well, the B2s beat the Clones into next week, and this time they'll likely have an incinerator war droid to beat. Bear in mind though that they don't even have to wait until the coast is clear, with stealth they can deploy any time.

[Aurbere]

Well, the B2s beat the Clones into next week, and this time they'll likely have an incinerator war droid to beat. Bear in mind though that they don't even have to wait until the coast is clear, with stealth they can deploy any time.

 

Fair points. However, I would assume that the SpecForce soldiers are better equipped and better trained than your average Clone soldiers, so I'm sure they have the means to deal with most boarders.

[Silenceo]

I just wanted to point out that there are very few Storm Commandos as it is, and should anything go wrong... Well, even Elites can go only so far... Also, if you are sending that many B2's to each and every ship for a chance to win the space battle by boarding party, I wonder if that is wise. You only have so many B2's, and should too many be destroyed in space...

 

One thing is nagging at me though. Are they using boarding pods like in that episode, or are they using the gunships? I merely ask because defenses around the Chimera are likely the strongest portion of the fleet, likely slightly behind their lines. In order to reach that vessel with boarding parties they would need to weave through oh so much turbolaser fire. The drop pods are not exactly small either, nor can they really evade shots too well. Yet they can carry many more troops than the gunships, which there are a limited number of.

 

What I am getting at, is what if the pod with the majority of the storm commandos... Is lost in transit? That would screw up the PH boarding actions AND hurt them bad for the ground battle.

 

Even if all of the B2's manage to board, the GA not only would have some of their own ground forces to push them out, but they would have ship defenses, the crew, marines, as well as home field advantage. Most likely most of the pods won't make it due to their clunky nature and size, they are designed to crash into enemy ships for petes sake! DESIGNED TO CRASH.

 

In all likely hood I think it will actually be Garm in space due to the crews being Rebels and such. Not to mention Rebels have a lot of experience fighting imperial boarding parties. Rebel Specops might even have techniques specifically for Storm Commando tactics... *hint hint* Due to experience of course.

Edited October 9, 2014 by Silenceo

[Aurbere]

I was under the impression that, if the PH attempts boarding parties, they would use the Gunships to transport troops, primarily. Of course they could use a mix. I'm sure Beni will point out the means of transportation.

 

Of course they could be destroyed en route, but it's likely that many would make it, considering the vast numbers of fighters for escort.

[Silenceo]

I was under the impression that, if the PH attempts boarding parties, they would use the Gunships to transport troops, primarily. Of course they could use a mix. I'm sure Beni will point out the means of transportation.

 

Of course they could be destroyed en route, but it's likely that many would make it, considering the vast numbers of fighters for escort.

 

That is a terrible idea. The more they cluster up or group up to defend targets such as those transports that are so close to the GA ships... Well, let us just say that swaths of star fighters have been destroyed in just such scenarios due to the large weaponry of capital ships not needing to be nearly as accurate.

 

Though does anyone remember what the total star fighter capacity for the PH is? That should tell us just how many gunships there are.

[Beniboybling]

I just wanted to point out that there are very few Storm Commandos as it is, and should anything go wrong... Well, even Elites can go only so far... Also, if you are sending that many B2's to each and every ship for a chance to win the space battle by boarding party, I wonder if that is wise. You only have so many B2's, and should too many be destroyed in space...

 

One thing is nagging at me though. Are they using boarding pods like in that episode, or are they using the gunships? I merely ask because defenses around the Chimera are likely the strongest portion of the fleet, likely slightly behind their lines. In order to reach that vessel with boarding parties they would need to weave through oh so much turbolaser fire. The drop pods are not exactly small either, nor can they really evade shots too well. Yet they can carry many more troops than the gunships, which there are a limited number of.

 

What I am getting at, is what if the pod with the majority of the storm commandos... Is lost in transit? That would screw up the PH boarding actions AND hurt them bad for the ground battle.

 

Even if all of the B2's manage to board, the GA not only would have some of their own ground forces to push them out, but they would have ship defenses, the crew, marines, as well as home field advantage. Most likely most of the pods won't make it due to their clunky nature and size, they are designed to crash into enemy ships for petes sake! DESIGNED TO CRASH.

 

In all likely hood I think it will actually be Garm in space due to the crews being Rebels and such. Not to mention Rebels have a lot of experience fighting imperial boarding parties. Rebel Specops might even have techniques specifically for Storm Commando tactics... *hint hint* Due to experience of course.

4 saboteur specialists is all they need to get the job done. That's a mere 10%, and they could well make it back alive.

 

And in the absence of any real obstacles, I think its unlikely that anything will go wrong.

 

18 B2 battle droids was all it took to overwhelm the defenses of the Venator escorting Gunray. But I expect that Lumiya will only direct boarding parties to attack the most important vessels, and use war droids to back them up.

 

Drop pods, drop pods that will be screened by hundreds of starfighters, they won't even see the pods coming. Which, if need be, can be launched straight out of the Malevolence as it rolls over the enemy.

 

Remember, you can't counter what you can't see, they won't have any idea storm commandos are on board. Not to mention that storm commandos are some of the most elite stormtroopers in the Imperial military. They would stomp.

 

Well that's a shame, cause Garm isn't protected by plot armor, so he'll be going down with the ship.

[Aurbere]

That is a terrible idea. The more they cluster up or group up to defend targets such as those transports that are so close to the GA ships... Well, let us just say that swaths of star fighters have been destroyed in just such scenarios due to the large weaponry of capital ships not needing to be nearly as accurate.

 

Though does anyone remember what the total star fighter capacity for the PH is? That should tell us just how many gunships there are.

 

Considering that such actions have been accomplished before, I don't see how it is a terrible idea. We see gunship escorts in TCW and other sources succeed in landing at their destination.

 

Beni would have to clear that up since he detailed his fighter count.

[Beniboybling]

I was under the impression that, if the PH attempts boarding parties, they would use the Gunships to transport troops, primarily. Of course they could use a mix. I'm sure Beni will point out the means of transportation.

 

Of course they could be destroyed en route, but it's likely that many would make it, considering the vast numbers of fighters for escort.

HMP Predators could only be used to transport B2s, and are really only designed for atmospheric combat. I doubt they would be wasted here. Drop pods on the other hand, can offload all kinds of troops and cut right through the hull. Edited October 9, 2014 by Beniboybling

[Silenceo]

Considering that such actions have been accomplished before, I don't see how it is a terrible idea. We see gunship escorts in TCW and other sources succeed in landing at their destination.

 

Beni would have to clear that up since he detailed his fighter count.

 

In that scenario I was more pointing to the colossal fighter losses, not the transport being destroyed. Hard to target one or two transports amidst a swarm. I was more referring to the large ships merely firing volleys into the supposed hundreds that are all condensed in a small area to get that ship on target.

[Aurbere]

HMP Predators could only be used to transport B2s, and are really only designed for atmospheric combat. I doubt they would be wasted here. Drop pods on the other hand, can offload all kinds of troops and cut right through the hull.

 

Atmospheric combat? Battlefront 2, you lied to me!

 

JK, so I guess we're going for drop pods?

[Aurbere]

In that scenario I was more pointing to the colossal fighter losses, not the transport being destroyed. Hard to target one or two transports amidst a swarm. I was more referring to the large ships merely firing volleys into the supposed hundreds that are all condensed in a small area to get that ship on target.

 

They don't need hundreds, though. Just a squad or two to soak up laser fire and screen fighters.

[Beniboybling]

Here's how screening the drop pods works folks, first it makes them difficult to spot, so the enemy won't be able to see them coming. And secondly it makes them difficult to destroy because as soon a laser bolt heads their way a fighter can suicide and shield it from harm, bearing in mind that only point-defense cannons will have much of an effect.

[Aurbere]

Here's how screening the drop pods works folks, first it makes them difficult to spot, so the enemy won't be able to see them coming. And secondly it makes them difficult to destroy because as soon a laser bolt heads their way a fighter can suicide and shield it from harm, bearing in mind that only point-defense cannons will have much of an effect.

 

I'm not sure, but wouldn't scanners be able to pick up drop pods. I mean, I assume that's what happened in the Black Talon flashpoint seeing as how the ensign wasn't even looking out the window.

[Silenceo]

I'm not sure, but wouldn't scanners be able to pick up drop pods. I mean, I assume that's what happened in the Black Talon flashpoint seeing as how the ensign wasn't even looking out the window.

 

Wasn't that only a transport as well? Gage class if I remember...

[Aurbere]

Wasn't that only a transport as well? Gage class if I remember...

 

Yes, it was a Gage-class transport ship. Though I wonder what you are implying...

[karadron]

The fighter screen ide to protect the drop pods works...in theory. In application though and against a commander known for on the fly thinking not so much. As has also been pointed out drop pods do appear on sensors, and if Garm or Pelleaon sees a mass of fighters, then guns will turn. Turbolasers are actually quite effective against fighter swarms. Even proximity to the lasers can severely damage starfighters with shields. Unshielded ones like the PH's won't stand a chance.

 

If that isn't an expectable way to counter the pods, then the phantoms offer another way. With the ability to slip in and out of stealth quickly and the power they can punch would prove more than enough to take out the pods. This can be done quick enough that the droids sensors wont be able to get a lock, and since they're droids not accustomed to dealing with vessels like this it can be best assumed that it will consider them destroyed.

 

Which also leads to another point about droid vs organics. The case in space is that droids have never proven to be superior to organic pilots. They may have certain advantages, but those have always been limited by programming. Organic pilots though, even with their meatbag failings, have an element of surprise that can be offered due to the uniqueness of each individual. Even better is the fact the pilots in question are those of the Rebel Alliance, which was one of the Alliances strengths--another was Special Forces, which the GA also has access to.

[Beniboybling]

I'm not sure, but wouldn't scanners be able to pick up drop pods. I mean, I assume that's what happened in the Black Talon flashpoint seeing as how the ensign wasn't even looking out the window.

I don't think that's evidence that suggests that scanners can automatically identify drop pods, I think that's evidence to suggest that scanners can cross reference what they are seeing with a database of what they've encountered in the past.

 

The Empire would have encountered these drop pods before, and at some point likely cataloged their characteristics in a database accessible from every Imperial ship in the navy, as well as other vessels, for quick identification.

 

After all, what distinguishes a drop pod from a starfighter? In this case nothing a computer would be able to detect, they both have engines, move at similar speeds, are of a similar size etc. etc. I doubt they'll be able to identify them.

 

That said I'd like to bring another factor to the table, jammers. Each Munificent is equipped with state of the art jamming technology capable of disrupting enemy sensors and targeting systems, on top of that, it did not effect friendlies. So they will most certainly activate them, making it nigh impossible for drop pods to be identified and targeted.

[Beniboybling]

Which also leads to another point about droid vs organics. The case in space is that droids have never proven to be superior to organic pilots. They may have certain advantages, but those have always been limited by programming. Organic pilots though, even with their meatbag failings, have an element of surprise that can be offered due to the uniqueness of each individual. Even better is the fact the pilots in question are those of the Rebel Alliance, which was one of the Alliances strengths--another was Special Forces, which the GA also has access to.

Tri-Fighters have given Jedi pilots such as Saesee Tiin a run for their money, in terms of space superiority they dominate. Edited October 9, 2014 by Beniboybling

[LadyKulvax]

I think it would be very important to mention that Jaina Solo is herself an ace pilot with excellent command of dog-fighting tactics and would prove a superb fighter wing leader that could really make the difference in this kind of engagement.

 

She beat Master Durron's record speed.

 

She flew in the Yuuzhan Vong war and scored hundreds of kills(no exaggeration).

 

She even took on a fleet of Sith space pirates with nothing but a StealthX and proved lethal, on that note I assume Jaina gets her StealthX which had a few pretty hardcore modifications, it was faster, took much more damage and had an improved hyperdrive system.

 

She learned directly from Luke, Wedge, Chewbacca, her Father and Durron in the skills of a pilot and was eventually considered un-matched.