New ideas for pet classes

[Destilon]

This is something I've been mulling over since day one. I've heard a lot on the subject from other players and all, but I'm still feeling quite strongly that it's missing. I know, it could certainly be argued that ALL classes (having companions) are already pet classes, but the traditional pet class feel, (a man/woman and his/her dog/cat/whatever) needs to be brought in to SWToR. I am aware of several difficulties that adding them could cause, more obviously the companion system would be almost wasted on them, or they'd be unfairly advantaged if they had a pet AND a companion... which of course solves itself if you make the pet a companion. Although giving the classes freedom to choose the pets, and exchange them as well, would sort that out fairly easily. If that then causes an xp difference in the pet classes you could just write unique quests for them every ten levels, beginning with level ten, AFTER choosing a skill tree direction. The reason I say AFTER will become evident when I explain what the trees could be, as I have a VERY creative way to handle those too. So I'll give an outline here as to starter classes and advanced classes that I think would definitely bring a diversity to the different schools at this point, which I think for obvious reasons, make the most sense, to be a new Jedi and new Sith class.

 

1) Jedi Caretaker / Sith Dominator (Up for debate of course)

 

A)Beastmaster having skills that enhance oneself and their strictly beast-type pet with the force, and pet heals (maybe even a druid/healer style character).

 

B)Engineer having skills that add new weapon and armor and speed upgrades to a droid pet and themselves (building up a force armor to oneself and maybe even a hunter/tank style character)

 

C)Cybertech having skills to add cybernetic upgrades to oneself AND beast style pet. (virtually a brand new pet class I've never seen before).

 

 

Integrating these into the Star Wars the Old Republic universe seems easy, as Jedi have always connected with animals and tech around them ,so it just makes sense. The level 10 choice of an advanced class would never have been MORE important, as it would determine what type of pet you'd even be using, and to offset the experience from companion quests you'd have a quest line every ten levels to learn some new aspect of building / attuning oneself to a pet, and add a new pet to your companions. You could make special droids and animals that aren't available anywhere else through those companion pet quests, although being able to tame a pet of your choice or beating up droids to gain recipes for new droid pets should definitely be there too. As a special for the Cybertech an idea would be allowing them to tame the cyber beasts / abomination mobs(which Beastmaster could NOT) like those big uglies on Voss, while still being able to add on to them with skill armor looks and weapon enhancements. Beyond this you could still give them the Jedi / Sith ship and droid, but maybe make the engineer able to upgrade the ship droid to use weapons and an actual useful healing droid or something. The stories would be completely unique as they would be completely different classes of Jedi / Sith that would have totally different goals. There were a whole lot of Hutts / Empire / other groups out there doing brutal things to animals, or trying to create the ultimate killer droid, and maybe freeing them to promote justice and balance or trying to get a hold of that new droid or tech for a droid would be good motivators for the classes? Anyway, I think they should earn a new companion slot every ten levels through one of those quests (based on which type of pet) AND they could have four and an apprentice (or five) and still have the ships droid, hk, new ewok, and access to unique pets with unique upgrades. Well, that's my two cents worth, hope you love it and we get to see it evolve and playable in game one day.

[Isnardi]

I really like this idea. I think we should support it for future updates. This will keep the game interesting and stop a lot of us from getting burned out.

[Nempo]

1) make it a non-force using class. There are billions of beast tamers int he SW lore, few Jedi/Sith bother with animals in this manner...the quote goes (that both Jedi say multiple times int he story) "The force is my ally" ...not 'the beast is my ally'.

 

2) your 3rd build has been seen multiple times in fantasy style games...it is known as a necromancer building a flesh golem. Original EQ had you have a single golem you could graft things onto to make it stranger, and it has since been replicated several times...usually abandoned as it becomes a hassle and unbalanced. Either you force the class to get the best upgrades to be on par with everyone else (the pet is half the character after all) or you allow the class to get stronger than everyone else if you equip the pet with the best upgrades...it is nothing less than a balance nightmare unless you start the game with such a class and monitor it very closely.

 

3) if the pet took your companion away, there is no reason for the class to ever get companions. if the pet class gets companions and pets...it is incredibly stronger and faster to level in pve as down time will be insanely easy...dps pet+dps player+heal companion=wrecking crew. In PvP it creates an unfair advantage currently as PvP is balanced without pets being a consideration...for example...if the pet dies can the tamer bring it back to life? If you say yes, what is the requirements for it? Out of combat is easy to get now (look at all the macro's for swaping talent configuration in pvp right now), 15 second channel? That would be appropriate, especially if it must be done where the pet was killed, anywhere else and it fails. If resurection is impossible you just gimped the class horribly.

 

4) NEVER under any circumstances do you ever allow a pet class to be a healer. Every single game that has ever had this capability has found that such a class becomes overpowered far too fast, especially in a pvp situation as it allows the player to dps and heal at the same time. Healing is a choice, to heal you must stop actively attacking. If you balance it so the damage is less and the healing is less, you end up with a healer no one wants in a group, ever. If you only lower the pet's damage, you end up with a pet class that may as well not even have a pet.

 

This game is simply not designed for pet classes thanks to the companion system we are all pet classes anyway.

[Destilon]

"This game is simply not designed for pet classes thanks to the companion system we are all pet classes anyway."

 

I said the part about us all technically being pet classes in my opening, and adding that the game is "simply not designed for pet classes" contradicts the fact that we're already all pet classes lol. Either we're all pet classes so it doesn't change anything, OR it's not designed for pets... which is it?

 

1) If you want them to make non- Jedi / Sith classes, take the time to post something supporting your idea, with ideas that suggest how it would make any sense for a SWToR game to have. Pretty much EVERY Jedi gets their own droid and can tame a beast when needed, some more successfully than others, I'm just expanding on that, maybe even suggesting that these classes have been lost to the future but a remnant of them still comes through at times like the arena, with Anakin, Amadahla ( I'm sure I spelt that totally wrong lol) and Obi'wan in Episode 2. and the control the control of tech like Anakindid had as a child, in episode 1, which seems to be completely natural to Qui'gon. More than that he hints that it's even something that they would have noticed and would tell them a child had a connection to the force, and when they are born in the republic it would have led to testing.

 

2) Although necromancer (Golem) could be like the third build, there is a huge difference between an unthinking, or undead, creature you create or summon and a living being you add to and enhance. I can see a similarity and technically I'm sure you could even call the advanced class Necrotech or something as it IS a sort of monster-pet class, but the point was also to make yourself cyborg as well as your pet, which also adds that cyborg Jedi (slowly becoming a bit corrupt or Sith trying to make themselves live forever or something into a Jedi / Sith story of it's own as it's already a part of Star Wars culture and technically a main underlying theme in the movies. Oh, and even if it's been tried and failed in other games before this, it isn't a reason not to try it, and get it right in this one. Bioware has some extremely creative and skillful employees that, I'm confident, could do with it, what they've done with everything else in the game, making it a huge success.

 

3) As for PvP imbalance issues, there aren't any, as the pet is the companion. I stated pretty clearly that you could have a pet AS a companion OR one of the companions that all classes get. (ship droid, Hk droid, or Ewok) I did suggest that you could still offer an apprentice type companion and cut the number of pet companion slots down to four from five. I think the apprentice companion would also be outstanding, especially as a Cybertech / Neccrotech, as you could be slowly turning him or her into a cyborg, or even quickly like Darth Vader / General Grievous, so that really gives another cool story arch there too. Anyway, there would be no overpowering pet issue for PvP, as NOBODY gets a companion in PvP, and neither would you. The issue would be to make sure you balance these classes with enhanced armor / damage / skills that they can use in groups and PvP to aid everyone in there team, and keep them useful for groups by making them able to tank or heal or however they want to handle that. Anyway, I had already addressed that by having a pet AS the companion.

 

4) Okay., I'll try restating this AGAIN for you; Pets ARE companions. Now by that I mean, that rather than having a companion around, (healing, fighting, tanking) you have a pet. I said this in the first post, but you know, it might not have been clear enough . Now, I have a question for you. How does a class that heals imbalance the build if you have a pet in SWToR? Keep in mind when you reply, that I ask that, already having healing classes with (pets) companions in the game right now, and they don't get a (pet) companion when in a group, without having it in place of another (human) player in said group. Seeing as that has already been addressed by the designers, and already works in THIS game, why would we look to other failed attempts in other games to prove it can't work?

 

Thank you for your thoughts, as it did give me the idea for better story arcs, that support inclusion of apprentice companions in the builds as well. I hope I addressed your misconceptions of the original post, and I'm happy to defend my hypothesis, and look forward to seeing your non-Jedi / Sith pet post, so feel free to post a link here so we can all benefit from your creative idea. Can't wait to read it and good luck with it man.

[Nempo]

Destilon, if they take up the companion slot, and don't actually act as a "pet" of any other game, there is zero point for them in game as we all have companions already.

 

The reasonf or not havign them Jedi/Sith is simple...there isn't enough focus on non-force users...Despite the increase in number durign this era, they are still RARE. Any new stories for the game should focus on non-force users more than the force users.

 

I get it, you love pet classes, problem is you aren't making a pet class, you are making a class that leans on your companion more than we already do (play the game with your companions stashed away sometime, it should open up your eyes).

 

If your class doesn't add somethign new (which if all it does is alter how you use your companion, ergo it isn't really offering new here) it has less of a chance than people wanting an imp smugler story and a rep BH story. If you litterally summoned a pet, ontop of your current companion, and was apreciably powered. ex:your pet dies you are litterally at half strength, half the hp pool a normal person has, half the attacks, etc...all due to the pet you now have also having it's own hp and attacks independent of you...

 

A change of the companion roster is rather pointless here, it is nothign new, just a shift in game style that...in a PvP environment would also net you dead fast due to not having a companion, ergo not having your pet in your design of the class you envision, which means most of your talents would not work, meanign the class is incapable of standing up on it's own. If it was, you just created an OP class for PvE grinding and soloing while simultaneaously creating the weakest class for OPs, Hardmodes, 4man content, and PvP.

 

If a class cannot function perfectly on it's own without a companion slot, it will never be seen in this game as it must be viable in all playstyles on the same level of power scaling.

[Destilon]

AHHHH! So now it's pointless because we're all pet classes but the character would be imbalanced because without a pet they are useless. Do you actually read the posts before you say they are all wrong? Do you just see the word Jedi and flip out? The fact that it's designed for the game's already extensive companion system, being Jedi or Sith means you would still get the buffs yourself, that would be provided by your skill choices. You'd obviously have your own skills to fight with, just like all the other pet classes... as we all have companions already, and your buffs would be building up your fp or op group and and benefiting everyone... so how exactly does it make you useless to a group situation? I said all this before, so look at it again, and I'll remind you, that this is MY post, and I happen to think having another Jedi / Sith class with more Jedi / Sith story, would be good. If you want more classes that aren't Jedi / Sith go make your own post about it, and give them ideas for it... because frankly you're wasting your time in here trying to tell me you don't like my idea... that's sort of the nature of it... I have an idea, I post it, and some people like it, and others don't. It doesn't mean I'm right or wrong, just because you don't like it... I do, and if Bioware does they can use it, or not.

 

Telling me you don't want more Jedi / Sith story and the game has already got too much of it, seems odd as the entire Star Wars franchise is revolving around the Jedi / Sith story... The main guy starts out, is found by a Jedi, raised to be a Jedi, betrays them and becomes Sith, and is then redeemed by his son who becomes a Jedi and brings him back around before he dies. Yes there are other characters in it, but the main story is trying to defeat a Sith Emperor and return the galaxy to a democratic run, Jedi defended freedom, and way of life. If you don't like the Jedi / Sith part... what does that leave? You want to have a bad attitude and fly around in a ship? They gave us 4 of each type character 2 Jedi / 2 nonjedi on either side, so how is the story too Jedi / Sith already? You want a game without them? Play Star Trek.

 

Anyway, I get it, you don't get that I was suggesting some unique class ideas that fit the already worked companion system, and I really have no idea why you want to believe so badly that they can't play in groups at all, simply because they don't use their pet. That was my whole point about them being companion style, they can be dismissed and you're still a Jedi, and can fight and enhance you're allies. Maybe it's because I'm not using the term auras like paladins have, does that help? I'm not calling this class a hunter or suggesting they be attached at the hip to their pet and lose half their hp's when it isn't around or w/e... I'm saying make a class that has a pet feel, and allows us to choose them too. Whether we want a bunch of droids or animals or hybrid cyberbeasts, their is DEFINITELY a call for them (and here's the important thing) IMO... so I'm saying it. If you think the game will be ruined by it, then go write one for the non-jedi classes... it's a free galaxy guy.

 

P.S. The majority... and I mean all but you, have loved the idea, and they all have said that, even though you have companions, it would definitely add to the game if they could be animal / droid / cyber, and you had that kind of choice. That would be the people outside the forums / offline, that would return to the game and resub, and some that continue to play but have cut back to free or don't get on as much right now. Just thinking that might matter to Bioware too . They already have a great game here, and I've played every class to 55 but my imp sniper and rep trouper who are only 53 as of now, as I was taking a break after gearing them for 55, and doing Makeb just short of 6 times. Last guy (55 Jedi Sentinel) hasn't gone to the last fight yet. So it dawned on me that maybe we could use a couple more classes with new stories that still fit the rest of the stories they have already written very well. Oh, I also love the idea I've seen around that suggests shifting from imp to rep... not suggesting I have any idea how to make that work, but it would have to be a new story arc available to everyone based on light / dark side alignment I'd guess. I heard some ideas on making the fp's and op's soloable too, and I'm well aware of this being a "mmo" but it stands to reason some (and I'm noticing a huge group of these now) would love to be able to just go it alone. Some of us are very ill, and have no idea when things will take a turn for the worst and we have to log to rest or throw up or just due to our massive amounts of pain... especially when a group hits a wall and starts fighting amongst themselves... It would certainly be awesome for those of us that would enjoy it, to have the option, and I really don't get where the ones that love the multiplayer grouping get off saying it's unfair or w/e as they wouldn't be affected whatsoever. Before anyone throws the loss of people in the queu trying to get a group thing at me... I and most of them wouldn't be in the queu as we really only bother with fp's or op's in guild anyway. Other than these things and maybe some kind of guild ship or a mailed guild invite token that I've seen in other games allowing us to invite our alts to our guilds if, as I mentioned, we don't get on too often due to health or life issues and would still like to be able to be in our guilds but maybe don't see too many on at our play times, it would be nice.

Edited September 19, 2013 by Destilon

[Destilon]

Oh, and yes, I am Ironman! AND Sparticus. So there.

[erichcs]

That is a very good well thought out way for the Bioware developers to create a new character class for both the Republic and Empire factions which I believe would be a great addition to the game.

 

I totally support this and hope they take your ideas and implement this at some point in the future as a expansion to an already great game.

 

Keep up the good work.

[Chicktopus]

I don't see why not to have pet classes. You'd probably wind up losing out on companion stories, though,

[erichcs]

I would really like to see this added in a future game update or expansion. I believe that the players would not loose out on the player companion story lines because adding a combat pet class would really give a existing player more things to do in the game even if they do not add a new character class. These are just my thoughts and some may agree and others may disagree but I think this could and really would fit well in the established lore of the game. The real challenge would be to make it work for a specific character and which animal pets could be used and how would the player obtain them.

[erichcs]

I really would like to see a engineering type character class which really would fit well in this game but I doubt they will add it in a future expansion.

 

Would like to be wrong though.

[erichcs]

A non force using pet class would work for this game and fit in quite well but unfortunately I do not see them putting this in the game either.

[Destilon]

I have a strange feeling that "Disciplines" is just what we're all thinking it might be. It could be that they add the pet training abilities to us in the new skill sections as new abilities for existing classes. I'd be a very happy jedi if it did happen.