The REAL Most Powerful Lightsaber Duelists

[LadyKulvax]

Wasn't Caedus also severely injured in that fight?

 

Good point, I edited that in.

[Lugosi]

When did she rival Windu?

 

As much as I hate quoting Wookieepedia, here goes:

 

"The only student Mace Windu ever taught Vaapad to was his own Padawan, Depa Billaba. Under Windu's instruction, Billaba became a master of Vaapad, with Windu considering her virtually unbeatable in personal combat. While on a mission with her master to Nar Shaddaa, Billaba and Windu were forced into a deadly confrontation with mutated giant akks. They barely survived the encounter, and Windu would later comment that on that day, Billaba had shown blade work that surpassed his own."

 

 

And a section of Shatterpoint: (spoiler alert)

 

Flashes of battle:

- shadows fleeing the bunker as swarms of screaming electric blue blaster bolts rebounding off walls shoot them to rags-- a flood of troopers spreading into a wave through the doorway, weapons gouting lightning-colored energy, Geptun in the middle of them, head down and running, datapad cradled like a baby in his arms-- a buzzing shield of silver flame that sliced through a blaster rifle so that it exploded and took with it the trooper's hands-These images burned in Mace's brain as he fought for his life against the woman who should have been his daughter.

 

He brought his blade back up from the pit and turned his wrist on the forehand so that his recovery stroke took her in the temple with his lightsaber's butt. Her fingers slipped off the blade's activation plate and it shrank back down through his body. She howled and punched his eyesocket with her free hand, but Mace got his foot wedged between them and he shoved her away with a powerful thrust. At the same instant both of them backflipped into the air, landing on their feet poised in perfect mirror images, their blades whipping in identically curving slashes almost too fast to see. Blaster bolts howled around them. The air crackled with streaks and splatters of energy. Their blades flickered and whipped and no bolt touched their flesh. Their eyes never left each other's.

 

Something had torn in his guts when he did the backflip. Smoke trickled upward from the hole in his belly. He could smell it, but he felt no pain. Not yet. His blade whirred through the air. Hers whirred faster. She advanced. The slashes never stopped. They would never stop. They flowed one into the next with liquid precision. This constant near-invisible weave of lethal energy is the ready-stance of Vaapad. "Depa," Mace said desperately. "I don't want to fight you. Depa, please-" She sprang at him, screaming without words; he couldn't know if she'd heard him. He couldn't know if language still had meaning for her. Then she was on him. His whole world turned to green fire.

 

Mace backpedaled, parrying frantically, absorbing the shock of her attacks with bent arms and a two-handed grip. He was taller than she, with more reach and weight, and vastly more muscle in his upper body, but she drove him backward as though he were a child. Green flame struck through his guard, and only a frantic jerk of his head turned what would have been a brain-burning thrust into a line of char along his cheekbone. Still he did not strike back. "I will not kill you," he said. "Death is not the answer to your pain." Her reply was a scream louder and more savage and an onslaught to match. She broke through his guard again and scorched his wrist. Another stroke burned a slice through his pants leg just above the knee. Power roared around her, a rising storm of darkness. Mace got it now: as each Akk Guard died, his share of pelekotan backflowed through the bonds Vaster had forged among them. She was getting stronger. And with each stroke of her blade, he could feel himself slipping into the shadows. He had to. She was too strong, too fast, too everything. The only way he could survive was to give more of himself to Vaapad. To give all of himself. To sink into pelekotaris dream. He felt it: he had reached his own shatterpoint. And he was breaking.

 

Through the trace of Force connection he had with Nick, Mace felt the young Korun collapse. Something broke inside his head, and all his own wounds crashed upon him. Every cut and bruise, every cracked bone and sprained joint, the man-bite on his shoulder and the hole through his guts: all of them blossomed into silent screams. His lightsaber went heavy, and his arms went slow. She burned a stripe across his chest, and he staggered. His fighting spirit wasn't destroyed. It wasn't even far away. He could feel where it had gone. He could reach out and touch it. It was waiting for him in the dark. He took one last look at the darkness that called to him-Darkness within mirroring darkness without-And turned away. He let his blade vanish. His arms dropped to his sides. Depa moved in for the kill. Mace backed away. She leaped for him, slashing, and he slipped aside. She pressed her attack and he retreated, over bodies and through blaster-riddled wreckage of console banks, until he came hard up against a console that still had power: indicator lights flashed like droid eyes in the gloom. The blade of green fire whirled up, poised, and struck. He let himself collapse. He fell to the floor at her feet, and instead of cleaving his skull, her blade slashed the console behind him in half. Cables spat blue sparks across the burned gap.

 

Mace lay on the floor. He didn't think he could get up. Depa stared down at him, her face lit jungle-green by the glow of her blade, and a single needle of light seemed to pierce the dark madness in her eyes. "Oh, Mace..." Her voice was a moan of astonished pain. Her blade vanished, and her arms fell limp and helpless to her sides. "Mace, I'm sorry-I'm so sorry..."

 

 

Now I know one could say that he refused to fight back, but it still doesn't change the fact that her advance was to much for his defense. And if he wanted to end it peacefully couldn't he have just cut her blade in half like he did with Palpatine? Or was she just to fast for that?

[Aurbere]

He wasn't exactly in peak condition, nor was he fighting her like he was fighting Palpatine.

 

Regardless, it is a fair point for her.

[Aurbere]

Good point, I edited that in.

 

I don't know how much the Caedus fight would be in her favor. I mean, beating an injured guy who has little interest in the fight doesn't carry much weight to me.

 

Also, didn't Caedus nearly kill her in that final battle?

[AlexDougherty]

You guys would probably hate me for this, but what about Jaina Solo for no.7?

 

Not ahead of Vader, she had some skill, but never would have survived Vader, she only survived her brother because he was destracted.

[LadyKulvax]

We should remember this isn't a versus thread.

 

Jaina Solo also had the ability whilst severely injured to cut down around 20 Sith Sabers by herself.

 

We also shouldn't dismiss her final engagement with her brother, he with little attempt defeated Kyle Katarn and his Jedi allies by himself and was barely trying, yet Jaina managed to continue her assault on him.

 

Later on Luke recognises Jaina as his successor and she goes on to be described as the best lightsaber duellist behind her own uncle.

[TalonVII]

I would also say Jaina Solo. She was a shoe-in for Jedi master, and she was just as well versed in lightsaber combat as her uncle Luke. In a drop down drag out fight against any of the masters in lightsaber combat, money goes on Jaina, against luke, literally a flip of a coin on that one.

 

For her age Luke is SLIGHTLY better than her when she takes on Caedus. And that slightly, is getting lower every time. Won't be long till Jaina surpasses Luke with the saber. Rest of the force, that's not even close, but skill with a blade, if she hasn't already, she will surpass Luke.

[Beniboybling]

I feel if Jaina is superior to Vader, then she is superior to Exar Kun, as the gap between them is so small.

[TalonVII]

I feel if Jaina is superior to Vader, then she is superior to Exar Kun, as the gap between them is so small.

 

You couldn't be more right if you tried. Honestly I think Jaina is that good. Hell I think she could master Vaapad if she could find a holocron and actually learn it, same with Juyo. Imagine jaina with vaapad or Juyo mastery, not the hybrid form Luke has taught all jedi now.

 

She'd be a Jedi wrecking machine if she mastered all of form VII.

[tunewalker]

You couldn't be more right if you tried. Honestly I think Jaina is that good. Hell I think she could master Vaapad if she could find a holocron and actually learn it, same with Juyo. Imagine jaina with vaapad or Juyo mastery, not the hybrid form Luke has taught all jedi now.

 

She'd be a Jedi wrecking machine if she mastered all of form VII.

 

They had access to Juyo/Vaapad in a holocron its in several of the holocrons they found, including Path of the Jedi, Book of Sith, and of course the great holocron, but ya my thought is if she is above Vader she is above Kun.

[TalonVII]

They had access to Juyo/Vaapad in a holocron its in several of the holocrons they found, including Path of the Jedi, Book of Sith, and of course the great holocron, but ya my thought is if she is above Vader she is above Kun.

 

Agreed. Jaina sword of the jedi IMO could take on vader and beat him. That's just my opinion ofcourse.

[StarSquirrel]

Agreed. Jaina sword of the jedi IMO could take on vader and beat him. That's just my opinion ofcourse.

 

My opinion as well, Jaina was per Luke's own admission the second best post-RotJ duelists and repeatedly kills multiple sith alone, while injured. Heck she killed (I understand there where extenuating circumstances) the number #4 and idolized the #1 and the #3 learning everything she could about both. Sword of the Jedi easily gets top 5 in my book any day, but 6 would suffice.

[Beniboybling]

Well if we are all agreed on Jaina Solo for #6 I'll make that change.

 

And I assume we have a majority agreement on the following:

 

#7 Exar Kun

#8 Darth Vader

#9 Count Dooku

 

If so then we can move on to the final place, I nominate Obi-Wan Kenobi.

[StarSquirrel]

Well if we are all agreed on Jaina Solo for #6 I'll make that change.

 

And I assume we have a majority agreement on the following:

 

#7 Exar Kun

#8 Darth Vader

#9 Count Dooku

 

If so then we can move on to the final place, I nominate Obi-Wan Kenobi.

 

Supported. I feel Soresu is probably the best form after Juyo and Obi-wan was insane with it, so I definitely agree.

[Aurbere]

If so then we can move on to the final place, I nominate Obi-Wan Kenobi.

 

Obi-Wan's a good nominee. I'm sure there are others out there as well.

[Master-LC]

what about plagueis ? i mean he was very strong takking down those assasins with bare hands.

he must have been stronger then sidous in lightsaber combat .

[TalonVII]

I'd actually nominate Blademaster Kas'im. Mastered all 7 forms, taught the brotherhood's acolites lightsaber combat. Even killed his master in a duel. Would of killed bane in a straight up fight if Bane had not resorted to the force.

 

Even mastered double bladed saber and Jer''kai style of fighting.

 

No offense to Obi-wan, great duelist, but Kas'im I think is a much better duelist. And if not Kas'im Cin Dralling.

Edited August 17, 2013 by TalonVII

[Aurbere]

I'd actually nominate Blademaster Kas'im. Mastered all 7 forms, taught the brotherhood's acolites lightsaber combat. Even killed his master in a duel. Would of killed bane in a straight up fight if Bane had not resorted to the force.

 

Even mastered double bladed saber and Jer''kai style of fighting.

 

No offense to Obi-wan, great duelist, but Kas'im I think is a much better duelist. And if not Kas'im Cin Dralling.

 

*shakes head*

[sell-dog]

I'd actually nominate Blademaster Kas'im. Mastered all 7 forms, taught the brotherhood's acolites lightsaber combat. Even killed his master in a duel. Would of killed bane in a straight up fight if Bane had not resorted to the force.

 

Even mastered double bladed saber and Jer''kai style of fighting.

 

No offense to Obi-wan, great duelist, but Kas'im I think is a much better duelist. And if not Kas'im Cin Dralling.

 

Kas'im is a great duelist but he was beating Bane during his prime and 20 years before Bane's prime. In my opinion, Bane is above Kas'im if this list extended past 10 as I don't know if either will make #10.

 

Aurbree mentioned a few of people from the PT era so I'll mention some from TOR era just ensure thoroughness.

 

Darth Malgus

Revan

Aryn Leneer (A darkhorse? Slightly underrated?)

Edited August 18, 2013 by sell-dog

[Aurbere]

Darth Malgus

Revan

Aryn Leneer (A darkhorse? Slightly underrated?)

 

None of them are on Kenobi's level. Let's be honest here, Kenobi is a master swordsman with the highest level of mastery in Soresu, coupled with a high-level mastery of Ataru (similar to Qui-Gon Jinn), and high-level skill in Niman, Shii-Cho and Jar'Kai dual blade combat.

 

Skill-wise, Kenobi beats all of those you named.

[Selenial]

None of them are on Kenobi's level. Let's be honest here, Kenobi is a master swordsman with the highest level of mastery in Soresu, coupled with a high-level mastery of Ataru (similar to Qui-Gon Jinn), and high-level skill in Niman, Shii-Cho and Jar'Kai dual blade combat.

 

Skill-wise, Kenobi beats all of those you named.

 

*Cough* Says the guy who declared Malgus stronger than Kenobi in saber combat *cough*

[Aurbere]

*Cough* Says the guy who declared Malgus stronger than Kenobi in saber combat *cough*

 

No I didn't.

[Selenial]

No I didn't.

 

Nvm, re read the scenario, You declared them dead equals... That's different, i guess

[Aurbere]

Nvm, re read the scenario, You declared them dead equals... That's different, i guess

 

Not 'dead equals.' I said that Kenobi's defense was too great for Malgus to break, but the relentless assault would prevent Kenobi from responding properly.

 

The skill gap is much different.

[sell-dog]

None of them are on Kenobi's level. Let's be honest here, Kenobi is a master swordsman with the highest level of mastery in Soresu, coupled with a high-level mastery of Ataru (similar to Qui-Gon Jinn), and high-level skill in Niman, Shii-Cho and Jar'Kai dual blade combat.

 

Skill-wise, Kenobi beats all of those you named.

 

Never said or was making the argument in that post that they were ahead of Kenobi. Just mentioning, or re-mentioning, skilled lightsaber duelists from a different era than the era highlighted by yourself to ensure that the nomination process is as thorough as can be.