ReverendAnderson Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I lose 15$ per month starting NOW, that`s what. Because, IF this happens, it`ll be at best around 3 to 6 months from now, assuming EA is actually not the EA I think it is and it`ll go "Full Troll" from day one. That is between 45 and 90$, ONLY to see their "hand". If the game isn't worth $15 a month now, then it wasn't worth $15 yesterday morning either, and you should stop paying for it. Assuming you'll still be alive and able to access the internet when the F2P thing hits, you aren't out anything you don't want to be by waiting to see how things go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammersteinSW Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Had they given a studio like Obsidian (KOTOR 2) 50-60 million $ and enough time to develop KOTOR 3 then they would have had a blockbuster game which would have netted them way more money with less development time. KOTOR 2 was awesome in many ways - and keep in mind that this was a title that got rushed out of the door since Lucasarts suddenly decided to push up the release date by 6 months or so. Check out the fan restoration project for the full experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProsaicProse Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) Erm, considering what their word has been worth so far on this game (especially considering recent developments), I don't believe anything they tell us anymore. Sadly, it was mere days ago I had faith in EA/BW. What's said now can and will always change in the end. Edited August 1, 2012 by ProsaicProse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ganzor Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Give me ONE object from that store that directly gives you an advantage please. Stat tomes Uber potions Store exclusive relics Relic removal scrolls I'm positive there's more then those now, but you only asked for one and I gave you four. I abandoned the game after they started REMOVING features from subscribers in order to then add those features into the store. And before you say stat tomes are available in game, it's the classic example of putting them in with an astronomically low drop rate just to technically meet the "available through gameplay" BS so the apologists can claim it's all above board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Actually, being a player of LotRO also, I can tell you that there are elements of Pay2Win on the fringes of the store. There are relics (and more importantly, really GOOD relics) that you can only get in the store. Better than what you can get in game. There are store-only potions (morale, power, debuff removal) which are on a separate cooldown to normal potions (and their cooldown is massively shorter too). Stat tomes, while "technically" available in-game are such an infrequent drop (and require you to have picked up a chain of such infrequent drops all the way up while leveling to actually be able to use something you drop from high level content) that I don't know anyone who's actually got to Rank 7 of one without buying them in the store (or having amassed and then spent more than a small fortune on them of in-game money). When f2p came out for LotRO, it wasn't just the payment model that changed, but the general design ethos too. It felt like there was a lot of "lets make the grind big so we can stick things in the store to make it easier" going on. I don't expect this to be any different. I played DDO - you can't count stat tomes, because they do drop in the game, and while nice, they aren't the difference between beating a raid and not beating it. They aren't the difference between winning and losing a quest. They are for convenience. I had a much better experience with DDO than you had with LOTRO, and thats probably because of the core game - even when I was with DDO, we had LOTRO players coming into DDO because LOTRO was too grindy - just was always that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Conclusion: They screwed us. And lol@listening and reacting, more like ignoring and locking threads. how did they screw you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leathfuil Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Stat tomes Uber potions Store exclusive relics Relic removal scrolls I'm positive there's more then those now, but you only asked for one and I gave you four. I abandoned the game after they started REMOVING features from subscribers in order to then add those features into the store. And before you say stat tomes are available in game, it's the classic example of putting them in with an astronomically low drop rate just to technically meet the "available through gameplay" BS so the apologists can claim it's all above board. Starlit Crystals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProsaicProse Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Lol and this is why f2p generates revenue for ailing games - they are good at pulling the wool over peoples eyes to squeeze out more cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 i played ddo - you can't count stat tomes, because they do drop in the game, and while nice, they aren't the difference between beating a raid and not beating it. They aren't the difference between winning and losing a quest. They are for convenience. I had a much better experience with ddo than you had with lotro, and thats probably because of the core game - even when i was with ddo, we had lotro players coming into ddo because lotro was too grindy - just was always that way. ^^^ this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apocalypsezero Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I just hope F2P players who buy coins can post in the forums. Doesn't look like it at the moment http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=4946889#post4946889 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styxx Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) If the game isn't worth $15 a month now, then it wasn't worth $15 yesterday morning either, and you should stop paying for it. Assuming you'll still be alive and able to access the internet when the F2P thing hits, you aren't out anything you don't want to be by waiting to see how things go. You missed my point completely. I`ll spell it for you... 1. I was happily paying 15$, because, well, everybody gets access to EVERYTHING with that - win / win for everybody 2. F2P is announced and TECHNICALLY, I, still paying a sub, am "VIP / Premium" 3. IF I am to believe their sales pitch, I will get all content as a Premium, minus the supposed "fluff" from the Cash Shop. And here is the thing. From now on, I am paying my sub, fully expecting to receive what they claim I would. What IF all this was a lie and, further down the road, 3 to 6 months later, they add "Super Sword of Earth Shattering SuperYoda", that is +50% better than everything you can get ingame? One day before all mobs in the game get a +50% boost? Because I didn`t pay for that crap. Nor will I pay one day longer past my then-current sub if that happens. But the question is : Who`s giving me back the money I`ve spent, believing EA`s PR machine? Will YOU, ReverendAnderson, pay my sub then.. OR guarantee with your next 10 years paychecks that it won`t happen? "Talk is cheap, Whiskey`s for money". Edited August 1, 2012 by Styxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 You missed my point completely. I`ll spell it for you... 1. I was happily paying 15$, because, well, everybody gets access to EVERYTHING with that - win / win for everybody 2. F2P is announced and TECHNICALLY, I, still paying a sub, am "VIP / Premium" 3. IF I am to believe their sales pitch, I will get all content as a Premium, minus the supposed "fluff" from the Cash Shop. And here is the thing. From now on, I am paying my sub, fully expecting to receive what they claim I would. What IF all this was a lie and, further down the road, 3 to 6 months later, they add "Super Sword of Earth Shattering SuperYoda", that is +50% better than everything you can get ingame? One day before all mobs in the game get a +50% boost? Because I didn`t pay for that crap. Nor will I pay one day longer past my then-current sub if that happens. But the question is : Who`s giving me back the money I`ve spent, believing EA`s PR machine? Will YOU, ReverendAnderson, pay my sub then.. OR guarantee with your next 10 years paychecks that it won`t happen? "Talk is cheap, Whiskey`s for money". well no you get the fluff content too since they give you money to use in the cash shop anyway if you are subscribed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Stat tomes Uber potions Store exclusive relics Relic removal scrolls I'm positive there's more then those now, but you only asked for one and I gave you four. I abandoned the game after they started REMOVING features from subscribers in order to then add those features into the store. And before you say stat tomes are available in game, it's the classic example of putting them in with an astronomically low drop rate just to technically meet the "available through gameplay" BS so the apologists can claim it's all above board. Sounds more like sour grapes. When I was in DDO, I got all my stat tomes from raids. And while I can't comment on relics because I played DDO, we did have potions that boosted XP, or were for convenience, that made raids easier etc. But thats sort of the point - those things made content easier, but it was more than possible to complete any content in the game WITHOUT it. It seems to me you Pay2Win whiners dont really understand what Pay2Win means. It means there is content in the game that is IMPOSSIBLE to complete WITHOUT purchasing something with real money from the online store. THAT is the DEFINITION of PAY2WIN. Things that give you an advantage, a leg up, in PvE content are NOT Pay2Win AS LONG AS you can complete the content without it. If they start gating content, or do something stupid like give PvP people a potion that makes them more powerful in PvP matches, THEN I will agree its sliding to Pay2Win. But really, the examples given so far are not Pay2Win - they are Pay for an advantage in PvE, but thats how they make money - as long as all content is ciompletable without the store items, its not Pay2Win, except in the deluded minds of jealous have-nots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styxx Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Had they given a studio like Obsidian (KOTOR 2) 50-60 million $ and enough time to develop KOTOR 3 then they would have had a blockbuster game which would have netted them way more money with less development time. KOTOR 2 was awesome in many ways - and keep in mind that this was a title that got rushed out of the door since Lucasarts suddenly decided to push up the release date by 6 months or so. Check out the fan restoration project for the full experience. Obsidian is developing SouthPark MMO. Laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggomy Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Stat tomes Uber potions Store exclusive relics Relic removal scrolls The only thing you have a point on is the relic removal scrolls. The potions are not "uber". They were when they first came out now its a waste of money. The store relics are not as good as the ones you make via the melding process and the crafted relics are only available from other players. Stat tomes at first when cap was 600 I would agree with you. Now with the stat caps being removed 50 in any stat is not worth the money to buy it. You are talking people with upwards of 2000 in a stat. 50 means nothing now. Relic removal scrolls are the one thing I have actually purchased. That being said I used the free points they gave me for being VIP (lifetime sub here). So I havent really spent money outside of buying moria, mirkwood etc since launch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styxx Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) well no you get the fluff content too since they give you money to use in the cash shop anyway if you are subscribed That`s not what I asked. And no I don`t. I will get content that is in the game PATCHES. I don`t believe I will get ANYTHING from the Cash Shop for free. Edited August 1, 2012 by Styxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Doesn't look like it at the moment http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=4946889#post4946889 I know, I am hoping that changes, as well as a couple other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZionHalcyon Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 he meant an official statement - not some behind the scenes interview. It came from an official in charge of the F2P. You're splitting hairs in order to continue to e-rage rather than accept someone in charge said it isn't Pay2Win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 That`s not what I asked. And no I don`t. I will get content that is in the game PATCHES. I don`t believe I will get ANYTHING from the Cash Shop for free. if you are a paid subscriber then yes you can buy anything in the cash shop with out spending any extra money. Each month they will give you a certain amount of "cartel coins" so you can purchase the fluff items you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProsaicProse Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) if you are a paid subscriber then yes you can buy anything in the cash shop with out spending any extra money. Each month they will give you a certain amount of "cartel coins" so you can purchase the fluff items you want. If we get 100 coins a month and things cost 10000 coins, or even 1000 coins per item, I think not. Previously it was all included in game via the monthly price tag, now it's not? Edited August 1, 2012 by ProsaicProse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codek Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 But the question is : Who`s giving me back the money I`ve spent, believing EA`s PR machine? Will YOU, ReverendAnderson, pay my sub then.. OR guarantee with your next 10 years paychecks that it won`t happen? Did you enjoy playing the game up untill then? if yes, why should you get a refund? you can quit once they confirm your fears. if no, why are you still playing? stop worrying about what they plan to do months from now and pay for what is in the game now.... You can make your decision to re-subscribe when the time comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 If we get 100 coins a month and things cost 10000 coins, or even 1000 coins per item, I think not. ..... umm yeah you still would you just have to wait. If it's anything like Turbines F2P then you will never have to spend a dime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codek Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 If we get 100 coins a month and things cost 10000 coins, or even 1000 coins per item, I think not. Previously it was all included in game via the monthly price tag, now it's not? Now this is just becoming speculation.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typeslice Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Well they are saying no p2w items....I want to believe them, I really do, but on the other side I played lots of game that started with vanity/conviniece cash shop items and sooner or later turned into p2w games. List of games I played that started with vanity items and derailed to p2w games: - Aion (after going f2p) - R.O.H.A.N - RF Online - Atlantica Online - Perfect World - Fiesta Online - Flyff - Granado Espada - Twelve Sky I'm sure there are plenty more....question is do we trust EA not to turn this into a p2w game? how long before a greedy EA executive enters a meeting with two big $ in his/her eyes?....guess time will tell. To be fair and too put things into perspective, I think most would agree that swtor has a better core game and more potential than any of those games ever did. It also, most likely, has more subs now than any of those games did when they went free to play. I don't believe that swtor is in as big a hole as any of those games were, therefore I think they have more flexibility to not have to resort to p2w; but only time will tell. The people that speak in absolutes on these boards (both haters and supporters alike) are kidding themselves - you have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProsaicProse Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Now this is just becoming speculation.... Is it really? Before I paid flat rate and enjoyed everything the game has to offer. With f2p, apparently I can't anymore - there are going to be limits and restrictions on content, even for subscribers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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