ZeusThunder Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 What you have with the Arsenal tree right now is a spec that is OP for PvE, but horrible for PvP (when you get attacked). In PvE, it's THE spec to have if you're a Merc. If you're using Pyro for DPS than you're doing it wrong. In PvP, arsenal does crazy sustained and burst damage if the person isn't attacked. If someone does attack them though, they will lose that 1v1 fight every time. Being the only class without an interrupt, the mercenary is at a serious disadvantage when attacked, especially if specced Arsenal. So it will be interesting to see what changes Bioware comes up with. "Fixing" the class w/o breaking it or making it OP isn't easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yazule Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 What you have with the Arsenal tree right now is a spec that is OP for PvE, but horrible for PvP (when you get attacked). In PvE, it's THE spec to have if you're a Merc. If you're using Pyro for DPS than you're doing it wrong. In PvP, arsenal does crazy sustained and burst damage if the person isn't attacked. If someone does attack them though, they will lose that 1v1 fight every time. Being the only class without an interrupt, the mercenary is at a serious disadvantage when attacked, especially if specced Arsenal. So it will be interesting to see what changes Bioware comes up with. "Fixing" the class w/o breaking it or making it OP isn't easy. I agree 100% about everything EXCEPT the OP for PVE, Snipers do the similar dps, their crit buff is sick, and they are just as immoble. Arsenal just stacks well in groups because Heat sigs stack, but that is the mechanic of it after all. it is a slippery slope and with synergy so interconnected to TM I highly doubt it will be "similar" to what we have now, it will be way better or way worse, flip a coin. Based on 14 years of MMO's it will most likely be way worse... then we will have to whine for a few months, and then they will start working on the fix and then 6 months after we are nerfed we will probably be better than ever... it is the nerf pendulum, the nerf bat givith and the nerf bat taketh away... it is a cycle that is common in all games that do constant updating and changing. lucky me i got my sorc to 50 before this happened, so now i will get my agent starting leveling so that when the sorc nerf bat hits i will have another 50 to fall back on, by the time that toon gets nerfed i will have my marauder leveled up and by the time they nerf them BH will be back in fashion. I have just laid out the next 1.5 years of my gaming experience in swtor lol... well unless my friends get sick of this game and move on ... gaming has evolved for me from "I love this game" to "I love playing with this group". I would play hello kitty if that is where they decided to go next. friends > content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huntarkansas Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I do not agree with you on the fact that Merc's can't win 1v1 battles. I think it greatly depends on the skill of the Merc. My current spec is 3-31-7 I personally don't have much trouble dealing with any specific type class in a 1v1 situation other than and Operative in the War zones. They kidney punch the heck out of me and there is not much i can do about it. Although I am figuring out different patterns that I can at least last a little longer in that fight. I have also had multiple fights being out numbered 2v1 and was able to win those fights also. Now I fully understand that I was more than likely up against players that had less gear and skill, but a win is a win. When equally equipped I feel like it comes down to the play style and the different tactics used to determine the winner. I am in no way saying that I win all my 1v1 battles, but I do win my fair share. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yazule Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I do not agree with you on the fact that Merc's can't win 1v1 battles. I think it greatly depends on the skill of the Merc. My current spec is 3-31-7 I personally don't have much trouble dealing with any specific type class in a 1v1 situation other than and Operative in the War zones. They kidney punch the heck out of me and there is not much i can do about it. Although I am figuring out different patterns that I can at least last a little longer in that fight. I have also had multiple fights being out numbered 2v1 and was able to win those fights also. Now I fully understand that I was more than likely up against players that had less gear and skill, but a win is a win. When equally equipped I feel like it comes down to the play style and the different tactics used to determine the winner. I am in no way saying that I win all my 1v1 battles, but I do win my fair share. yeah 1v1 isnt that bad for us fo sho... people seem to think kiting is the answer, which is silly because we lose our only asset (dps)... you just gotta stand toe to toe and hope they dont know how to play all that well. equal geard equal skill a lot of classes got our number though... i often surprise them with an insta cast 8 second stun (and then 2 heals and a tracer before they come out of it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artichokey Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I don't think BW will make all that big of a change to our current dps rotation. If anything, it will probably be a 3-6 second CD on tracer to limit spamming, it may even apply 3 stacks to allow for faster application. From there, it will then be 1-3 powershots mixed in (which hits harder than tracer anyway) followed by the HM, Unload and Railshot. They will essentially place some of the load on power shot ,since that is our only other go to ability currently. 1 extra button in the rotation will not be a big deal. Now if they decide to go crazy and completely gut out tracer missile without allowing for power shot, then we will be in trouble. I am worried however, how they are going to account for all the buffs/debuffs tracer accounts for. They could bake in our 10% damage reduction shield though tracer and still be fine and they could just make it so we get quick tracer locks and heat signatures, so the ramp up time wouldn't be so bad, if said tracer missile were to be put on cooldown. These changes wont hurt PVE and makes no difference in PVP since we already get use of these debuffs and abilities already. This is all early on in speculation at any rate. None of the speculated changes could even take place. Im just trying to show the already silver lining to what many think will be the end of BH life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huntarkansas Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I guess one thing i never use is Power Shot. I find it as a worthless ability along with Fusion missile. I am like the rest of us stuck using the tracer missile, but Unload,Heat Seaker, and Rail are the ones i like the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artichokey Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) I neglected to comment on the 1vs1 pvp stuff. Currently, we are nearly a free kill to an operative and any tank worth his weight can keep us locked down from tracer spam long enough to kill us. Sorcs are just plain mean with their, stun, knock back and interrupt before melting our face off and marauders give me nightmares. It may be that i play on a high skilled pvp server, or that i am just not all that well versed at arsenal in pvp, but i do see it as Mercs are horribly outgunned in melee range with little in the way of defenses to show for it. I don't need to read after this "oh you got 2 knocks backs 1 stun and a CC, L2P". We all know 90% of all the classes have a gap closer to counter our knock back and our stun is laughably short to the point that its likely better to just go for another tracer shot in favor of the burst. Unload gives us a snare that last for 2 seconds that gives the enemy the ability to walk up on you as you try in vane to kill him. Rocket punch is a 4 meter knock back that does not snare and also fills up the resolve bar. Our 1 minute cc is easily broken and has no added bonuses. Our 25% damage shield is nice when paired with kolto overload (15% health gained over something like 15-20 seconds). But other than that grants us no other perks when arsenal. Sure we have 30-40% damage reduction through armor at any given time, but that doesn't mean jack against force users. Our armor only negates elemental and kinetic damage. Meaning, we might as well be wearing nothing. When you see it all layed out you see what tools we do and don't have. And you realize the ONLY thing we can do in pvp situations is nuke for all we are worth before we get focused down. Edited March 14, 2012 by Artichokey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylriana Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) OP for PvE? I disagree. Outside a few bugs skewing their DPS they're ( according to simcraft ) fairly similar to sniper damage. I think the easiest solution here would be to slightly nerf TM's damage (no more than 10%, and even that's probably stretching it), and then add onto "Light 'em up" something along the lines of "For each stack of Heat Signature on a target, increases the damage of Power Shot by X%"(1-2% per stack) and to slap Charged Bolts/Power shot onto Tracer Lock / Charged Barrel too as an activator too. Combine that with fixing the inflationary bugs and you'd be golden. Other than something like that, I can't really think of what you could do to change the spec anyways. Unless they tried something really weird like altering the talents radically enough to make explosive round/missile blast part of the arsenal rotation. Edited March 14, 2012 by Sylriana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hxxr Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 You actually are aware that Power Shot deals more damage then Tracer Missile? Or rather ... it scales better, so it's median is lower when you hit 50 and higher when you're clad in BiS gear/enhancements and most importantly Rakata weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrjenkies Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I agree 100% about everything EXCEPT the OP for PVE, Snipers do the similar dps, their crit buff is sick, and they are just as immoble. Arsenal just stacks well in groups because Heat sigs stack, but that is the mechanic of it after all. it is a slippery slope and with synergy so interconnected to TM I highly doubt it will be "similar" to what we have now, it will be way better or way worse, flip a coin. Based on 14 years of MMO's it will most likely be way worse... then we will have to whine for a few months, and then they will start working on the fix and then 6 months after we are nerfed we will probably be better than ever... it is the nerf pendulum, the nerf bat givith and the nerf bat taketh away... it is a cycle that is common in all games that do constant updating and changing. lucky me i got my sorc to 50 before this happened, so now i will get my agent starting leveling so that when the sorc nerf bat hits i will have another 50 to fall back on, by the time that toon gets nerfed i will have my marauder leveled up and by the time they nerf them BH will be back in fashion. I have just laid out the next 1.5 years of my gaming experience in swtor lol... well unless my friends get sick of this game and move on ... gaming has evolved for me from "I love this game" to "I love playing with this group". I would play hello kitty if that is where they decided to go next. friends > content Do you have ADD? You went off on a complete tangent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cegenaus Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 im definitely looking forward to this so called nerf. as long as one thing gets buffed if something gets nerfed i will be partially happy. i would rather not see dps nerfed but if it brings more mobility then that might be a trade im willing to live with. if not theres always pyro and i am almost done with my sorc healer and have a jugg tank to start working on. oh and my sub runs out at the end of april lol id love to see arsenal become a ranged mara, awesome damage with better mobility and a skill level requirement to play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts