ZRated Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Love a lot about the game.... from the playing solo aspect... I think grouping on the Heroic2 quests is good but, as far as the HEROIC4 quests go.... I hate the match-ups and think the loss of companions etc. is crap. Most same-level Heroic4 quests require a near perfect team from what I have been on so far. I just don't have the patience for a wipe every other mob.... or when playing a healer...taking all the aggro after a few casts even with a tank spamming taunts... What is the setup for these quests?? I have been on about 20 of them so far and not a one was anywhere close to worth the time and expense of repairs, etc. Most of the drops suck...and if one is completed... I come out with less money than I went in with due to the constant repairs and junk salvages... I am quickly losing interest with the whole game playing solo most the time... but really don't like the quests offered for a group over 2 people. In the same amount of time I could make more money, XP, and buy better equipment farming for commos. So..again I ask ... Is there just one setup worth having for these +4 quests?? It looks to me like you need 3 healers and a tank so far... Or do what I see the most... Get to lvl 50...solo the lower level HEROICS and mail the drops to your alt... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurkz Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) For heroic 4's you should run the same as a FP group, 1 tank, 1 healer, 2 DPS. It's possible to get away with just a tank and some DPS though if you're decently geared and/or have a good healing companion. Also, interrupts and coordination are huge. Particularly on the Champions. Edited February 23, 2012 by Lurkz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aethyriel Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 the most important thing when doing a H4 (and to a lesser extent a H2 of course) is crowd control and interrupts. You can do any H4 quest without healer and/or tank with just 4 dps or even 3 dps and a healing comp if you CC right, interrupt spells, move out of stuff and play smart. You can and will get your *** kicked by trash and whatnot if people in your grp just don't cc ooc or in combat with stuns etc or break cc early or don't focus dmg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRated Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 seems like a crap shoot if you are wanting to join up with local people in the zone for some quests... I guess I am used to the other game I played for 7yrs (not WoW).. where you can adjust the difficulty for the team you have...and you get to use everything you get in the game "i.e. companions". I do like strategy and all... but when you are new to the game and jump into one of these groups... there is absolutely no handicap or learning curve other than a lot of frustration and the sense of wasting your time like I have done so far. It takes a lot of fun out of a good game for me...and this is why I seem to be playing solo most of the time and not joining the invites to the large H4 quests. I think a difficulty level adjustment (like any other MMO game I have played) would be a good thing... Not taking your chances with 3 other players you don't know and spending 2 hours with minimal results. I hate to complain about it...but it has me pretty frustrated and getting bored with the game. As far as flashpoints go.... I have yet to have been able to get on one. Although I just dinged 50 on my main... Apparently I am told I need better this and that etc. to get on with a group. So I am left again with playing solo to try and build my "gear" up to play with other players... Again.. a difficulty setting would allow for us "newb 50s" to be able to get in on some action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vexxation Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 my other half and myself 2 man all the heroic 4s that we cant get grps for. Hes a tank, Im a dps and we use my heal comp and his dps comp. We use as much CC as we can which helps a LOT, and make sure everyone is dpsing/attacking the same mob (the tank target) at the same time and not all off doing their own thing. I've done a few heroics with no healer but the other dps all had good cc - which meant we could take out all the other mobs and just focus fire ONE at a time. I have also healed a heroic 4 as gunnery spec commando (which is not the proper heal spec btw lol) plus we had no tank. We used CC again, and the damamge was spread fairly evenly meaning healing, even on my dps spec, wasn't too hard to manage. There are ways to do it, even without optimal groupings, I promise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shama Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 As far as flashpoints go.... I have yet to have been able to get on one. Although I just dinged 50 on my main... Apparently I am told I need better this and that etc. to get on with a group. It sounds like you've had bad luck with your server being full of arseholes. Hopefully there are still people on your server who aren't so dictatorial about gear ... normal mode flashpoints of your level shouldn't require special gear and *are* playable by a new 50. As for the your request for difficulty settings, that is what the 'hard mode' is for on flashpoints ... that is the mode that will require better gear/tactics/coordination/balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shama Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 So..again I ask ... Is there just one setup worth having for these +4 quests?? It looks to me like you need 3 healers and a tank so far No, from what I've seen you really don't need the 'perfect' setup of healer, tank and 2 dps for any of the Heroic 4+ quests. I have been on many of these with far from perfect setups (one in particular all of us were smugglers) and you just need to be smart with what you are doing. So assuming that is the case, and you're having such a hard time because everyone is just bundling into the fight without thinking things through, then some general advice would be: - Take time to survey the area you are about to fight in ... are there patrols? How many gold star enemies in the group? Do any of the enemies have buffs that mean they can't be taunted or CC'd? - Mark your targets and make sure everyone knows what the marks mean - 60 sec CC as many targets as possible, so that you can all concentrate on one or two enemies, make sure no one breaks the CC - Everyone should attack the same enemy - If you have a healer then protect them - If you have a tank then focus on the target they are attacking - Use interrupts if you see your enemy charging up an attack - Be aware of what is going on around you, so don't back off into another group of enemies, or push your enemy into another group. You really really don't want to be dealing with 2 groups at once. - Heal/rest between fights rather than rushing off to the next group So good luck, and hopefully you'll see that these H4+ quests are very doable and can be fun! They just need some coordination and tactics, and can't be rushed into like normal quests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deusBAAL Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Love a lot about the game.... from the playing solo aspect... I think grouping on the Heroic2 quests is good but, as far as the HEROIC4 quests go.... I hate the match-ups and think the loss of companions etc. is crap. Most same-level Heroic4 quests require a near perfect team from what I have been on so far. I just don't have the patience for a wipe every other mob.... or when playing a healer...taking all the aggro after a few casts even with a tank spamming taunts... What is the setup for these quests?? I have been on about 20 of them so far and not a one was anywhere close to worth the time and expense of repairs, etc. Most of the drops suck...and if one is completed... I come out with less money than I went in with due to the constant repairs and junk salvages... I am quickly losing interest with the whole game playing solo most the time... but really don't like the quests offered for a group over 2 people. In the same amount of time I could make more money, XP, and buy better equipment farming for commos. So..again I ask ... Is there just one setup worth having for these +4 quests?? It looks to me like you need 3 healers and a tank so far... Or do what I see the most... Get to lvl 50...solo the lower level HEROICS and mail the drops to your alt... Are we playing the same game? Seriously? Most H2 can be soloed (with companion) Group setup was never an issue for me for any H4, finding enough people (of any role) however usually is. Though on planets thats not really an issue either... I just keep questing until someone else is interested in a Heroics too. And yes, sometimes you wipe... thats part of the game and keeps it challenging (besides that death is totally neglectable in SWTOR) And dont ya cry about the few credits for repairs, wear greens and its totally cheap while custom gear is a lot more expensive. And if your tank got guard on you, you shouldnt draw aggro as a healer at all...... besides that you got a crap load of skills that safe you (stuns, detaunts, whatever) SWTOR is totally easy and shaped for casual players, unlike many other MMORPG. If you need a full group to just kill any trash mob in a zone and if you loose 1/4 lvl on each death THEN you can come here again and complain that the game is too hard on you. In Everquest you could even delevel by dying... (which was actually rather funny with all the "reding" running gags) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRated Posted February 24, 2012 Author Share Posted February 24, 2012 Well...everything above was good insight except for "that guy" on the thread. First off... I wouldn't be complaining or ASKING ADVICE about it if it wasn't such a problem. If you actually paid attention to the post instead of trying to nitpick it.. you would have noticed about 3 times I mentioned how I am tired of playing solo... Yes... I know you can solo most H2 quests... and I have done many that way.. The point is...I want to play with groups more often.. So far the many groups I have joined up with are still noobs like myself to this game... and so far just about 85% of anything with 4 or more in a group turns out to be a disaster... When I try to join groups for Flashpoints... I get swatted down by the "gurus" who don't want a new player with them... They cop the same attitude you seem to show... So... bottom line is this... The game has become boring playing it solo. I can roll the dice and hope to get with a decent group that doesn't just jump into mobs clicking every attack they can...or I can wait for a server transfer option to come up so I don't have to start all over again to get with some decent/friendly players. One great example is I am still on the end quest (Ilum) for my main... asked the 36 people in chat if someone could help me with an end boss I just could not take down.. Instead of no help... I got the whole "that guy is easy" or "you shouldn't need help with him"... Thumbs down so far with that... end rant.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shama Posted February 24, 2012 Share Posted February 24, 2012 One great example is I am still on the end quest (Ilum) for my main... asked the 36 people in chat if someone could help me with an end boss I just could not take down.. Instead of no help... I got the whole "that guy is easy" or "you shouldn't need help with him"... Thumbs down so far with that... end rant.... Yeah sorry to hear about that: it does sound like your server is a magnet for a-holes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorgonKara Posted February 24, 2012 Share Posted February 24, 2012 (edited) I consider myself an average SWTOR player and I will say you are not crazy, the 4 person group content is a lot more difficult than the "solo" stuff. You really have to have good group coordination, know how this game works and have decent gear on your character to beat it. -Especially once you start to get into Hardmodes, where one mistake can mean a group wipe on certain bosses. Once I learned how group content works in TOR, I explain it to any pickup group I might get into as best I can and that usually helps, but the main thing that has been most helpful for me is getting into a good guild with other players that are willing to learn the fights and help each other get geared up. Hardmodes and Heroics seemed almost impossible until I took the time to learn the fights with a group of friends, learned the group dynamics and got my character better gear, all while dying a bunch of times. Now that I know how most of them go, I can run many of the group missions & Hardmodes without dying once, provided I'm with a group of guildies that knows what they are doing. You have been playing a month so you are a newb, but I only say that because this game does in fact provide a decent challenge (and I've also been playing SWTOR since day one and have been in testing 3 times). I'd say for the average person it requires some practice and patience. It's fun once you get the hang of it, mostly (There are a couple hardmode fights that can be frustrating even with a "seasoned" group). Part of the fun is learning how to overcome the challenges. Edited February 24, 2012 by MorgonKara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafaman Posted February 24, 2012 Share Posted February 24, 2012 Hmm... I had not thought about it, but the server could make the difference. I have had a pretty good experience with groups and asking for help on my server. On one occasion I was really stuck, went back to the fleet, and had a 50 jump in and help me stomp a mission. Lol! Didn't feel guilty about it at all. So mileage will vary, but one thing I have found is that at higher-levels pick up teams are much more effective. Everyone knows their role for the most part. But... I do think that the best results come from working +4s with a complete group. Healer, Tank, and 2 DPS. Pretty good training for the harder Flashpoints too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRated Posted February 26, 2012 Author Share Posted February 26, 2012 I consider myself an average SWTOR player and I will say you are not crazy, the 4 person group content is a lot more difficult than the "solo" stuff. You really have to have good group coordination, know how this game works and have decent gear on your character to beat it. -Especially once you start to get into Hardmodes, where one mistake can mean a group wipe on certain bosses. Once I learned how group content works in TOR, I explain it to any pickup group I might get into as best I can and that usually helps, but the main thing that has been most helpful for me is getting into a good guild with other players that are willing to learn the fights and help each other get geared up. Hardmodes and Heroics seemed almost impossible until I took the time to learn the fights with a group of friends, learned the group dynamics and got my character better gear, all while dying a bunch of times. Now that I know how most of them go, I can run many of the group missions & Hardmodes without dying once, provided I'm with a group of guildies that knows what they are doing. You have been playing a month so you are a newb, but I only say that because this game does in fact provide a decent challenge (and I've also been playing SWTOR since day one and have been in testing 3 times). I'd say for the average person it requires some practice and patience. It's fun once you get the hang of it, mostly (There are a couple hardmode fights that can be frustrating even with a "seasoned" group). Part of the fun is learning how to overcome the challenges. Yes still new to the game in many aspects...but I have played healers..tanks for 7yrs on another game. Although the game is completely different... The role of your class is still the same. I know how to play in groups... and when in new "territory" I just follow the lead of the team. I got booted from a FP in the middle of a fight after a wipe because I was a Sith Assassin without heals they said... I asked why they let me on then...they said "No one plays a Sith Inquisitor class that doesn't heal"... Ok.... well.... guess you found one... I have decided to try and find a new server to start all over on. I joined a guild when I first started the game but they decided to go to full time PvP and no one gets on the guild anymore (in 3 weeks). Sigh... right now I am simply logging onto all my alts just to craft and gather.... I got burned out on solo mode already... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewayshemoves Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Yes still new to the game in many aspects...but I have played healers..tanks for 7yrs on another game. Although the game is completely different... The role of your class is still the same. I know how to play in groups... and when in new "territory" I just follow the lead of the team. I got booted from a FP in the middle of a fight after a wipe because I was a Sith Assassin without heals they said... I asked why they let me on then...they said "No one plays a Sith Inquisitor class that doesn't heal"... Ok.... well.... guess you found one... I have decided to try and find a new server to start all over on. I joined a guild when I first started the game but they decided to go to full time PvP and no one gets on the guild anymore (in 3 weeks). Sigh... right now I am simply logging onto all my alts just to craft and gather.... I got burned out on solo mode already... Wow. You might even want to change servers, haha. I've never ever ran into any problems like that at all. As far as the heroics being difficulty. Some are. It seems like the difficulty varies a lot even in one area. Sometimes an elite will be more difficult than a champ later on, etc. And dealing with random people who are there is sometimes tough. Just learn to know where to CC and how to do it and try to lead the group. CC will make or break a group. I did all the heroic4 with my scoundrel and my friend on his shadow, and it was easy as hell to just stealth through, cc, take down on at a time and move on. We're doing it now with me a tank and him a healer, and it's working just as well. You really just have to coordinate. That's all it comes down to. A group, no matter how well geared and skilled will break if they can't communicate and coordinate cc and focus fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shama Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I got booted from a FP in the middle of a fight after a wipe because I was a Sith Assassin without heals they said... I asked why they let me on then...they said "No one plays a Sith Inquisitor class that doesn't heal"... Ok.... well.... guess you found one... Yep, as I said before, it sounds like you've got a bad server. When other players are forcing you to play a certain AC because the other 'doesn't make sense' then you've got a problem. You should be free to play however you like, so long as you are doing damage and not causing wipes then how is getting a wipe in a FP your fault? Because they ran it without a healer? Run, don't walk, to a new server and start enjoying your game with players that don't demand a playstyle/AC on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datamonger Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 The ultimate flaw with PUG's (pick-up groups) is that they're random. You don't know who you're getting. Sure, you know the class and level, but you have no idea of the quality of that player. If that player is using a "healer", will they actually keep an eye on other player's health bars, or will they just "pew pew" with the same 2 or 3 attacks over and over? Will the tank actually TANK, or just stand there and wait for someone else to rush in? Will all the players even be paying attention, or are they stoned or drunk out of their minds? Will they see the mission to the end, or will they all quit the group after the first faceplant? The only way to avoid PUG's is to make friends who have a similar schedule as you and seem to know what they're doing in a fight. You'll find that Heroic 4's are actually not that difficult when you have the right team. Otherwise you can just keep rolling with PUG's and sometimes you'll find a winning team and sometimes you won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRated Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 Helped a bunch of people yesterday with different alts on their quests when they asked for it in General. Even jumped on my 50 and went to help a lvl20s group finish... Not one "thanks" haha. Even on my alt at same level... When the quest was done they left the group and that was it. Found out that they didn't share the Heroic..so when spending an hour with them from start to finish...I notice they were talking to the contact...left group..and took off. I didn't get the end bonus or any end XP. Name me some servers that are good.... because I just got my first bill in game and may go ahead and cancel. This is the opposite of how I play... I always help random people, etc. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GellonSW Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 You should prob try hitting up the RP-PVP or RP-PVE servers. Idiot and douchebags are always around on any server but those servers tend to have a smaller percentage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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