Silenceo
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sure, though I'd like to know the relevant variables because from what Sil has said about the situation I think he's right that he'll arrive unmolested. I'd like to see you lay out the relevant info for us to debate so I have more than just Sil to go off of.
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Due to the fact that Sil can't shut up about his master plans and such I know far more than I would ever want to know... and what is concerning me at the moment is that I don't think patrols or active search measures would be something the EoL would have to spend much time dealing with.
Considering how the EoL forces arrived (and since I know how I'm going to assume it was entirely successful based on all variables I'm aware of) the EoL forces should have very little opposition in getting onto and hacking into the station to acquire schematics and such. And since the method of infiltration means J's forces won't have any warning, they won't even be doing thorough patrols or actively using pre-cog or sense anything to counter Sil's troops.
I mean let's face it, they're on a HEAVILY secured station, in a completely dominated system, with a massive fleet out the front door, and no indication of incoming attacks at ALL. Those guarding the station have no reason to take any special security measures or be especially prepared for any attack, so we're talking about the EoL forces infiltrating a base that has no reason to expect them...
I mean, adding this to the amount of space and lack of guards... Can... Can I just walk right into the control room? I am sure my Quaesitors will be good and keep their stuff going to not be detected, I promise they will be good! /sarcasm
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Alright, time to go over the EL's method to its madness before there are further misunderstandings.
To clear a few things up:
- The EL is NOT dispersing throughout the station to eliminate enemies as some points discussed might indicate.
- At any point in time, they would be in contact with each other using droid speak. (Quaesitors excluded)
- They are only removing those who are in their way.
- They start without a schematic and such things, but would at least have an idea of the general direction to go, and using the previously mentioned data gathering skills could refine their trajectory as they go.
- The station is VERY big, and with the numbers posed, it is going to be rather sparse with defenders.
On the stations
:Its size: 1,753,000
Reminder... That is area, not meter length. An ISD, has an area of 384,000. (1,600x.3)=Width. 1,600=length. WxLx.5= Area due to triangle. 480x1,6000x.5=384,000. Basically, the station is larger than 4 ISD's but MUCH better armed, though, the armament doesn't matter much atm...
Counting the heroes, there are 10104 RF units. Now, I am not super great with 3-D math, so someone correct me if my numbers are off... But that effectively means 173m squared or so per individual, if all is spaced evenly. That is of course, a great deal of them being average joe Marines. For the Knights, assuming J wants them in groups, at the bare min going to try using 2, a duo patrol which is not all that rare.
1,753,000 /50 = 35,060 squared. Suffice to say, if they are evenly patrolling the ENTIRE station, then the Knights will be spread quite thin and unable to mount a suitable defense.
Anyways, leaving this point to be expanded upon later.
The EL formation:
The 60 droids are, as previously stated, in 5 hunting parties. However, what I didn't get a chance to state however, is how it is all arranged. Think of it like a 5 pointed star, with a party on each point, trying to maintain said formation as they proceed and converging on threats before engaging if necessary. In the center of said star, would be the 3 heroes and the 40 Quaesitor, basically walking unopposed if the hunting parties are doing their jobs. Ultimately, while the Quaesitors could do more, they are not really here for the clearing the station point or fighting in general. They are for what comes after. For those of you keeping track, that means that melding of power would not be weakened by separation, meaning that the chances of Marr or Thane detecting them rapidly dwindle. As they go, the 4 syncers in each hunting party will be searching databanks for schematics, directions, and etc etc to direct the trajectory. In turn, marines who are encountered by the hunting parties would be knocked unconscious for the Quaesitors behind them. Once finished with them, said units would execute the marines. Again, using the information obtained to improve their trajectory.
Ofc, if there is a large group of marines, then they might kill a few of them. As for you trying to use the traits to protect the marines, even with all the traits, the Tech Order units would still be able to one shot them due to their capabilities, already being in short range, and their skill level, being akin to a force unit essentially.
The two parties in the back would be sealing all of the blast doors that they could, which might tip off the RF, true, more so if they encounter it more than once, which would bring Marr/Thane into play without force trickery. It would however cause them to have issues persueing them, since they would have to cut through the doors, unless they are already ahead of them, at which point it would likely turn into a Thane v Hunting parties.
Thane Encounters them Alone Scenario:
Say Thane does indeed sprint off to face them alone, and assuming that she goes the frontal due to the rear being full of sealed blast doors, there are a few things that could happen. The EL wouldn't sense her coming, this is true, however, they might pick something up on the frequency monitor or on one of the terminals as they are going. She would likely go past one of the external hunting parties first, at this point sensing the Quaesitors, so likely sprinting for them. Worst case, she spots the hunting party of 12 and engages. Worst case for me I mean. They would attempt to fall back to the core group, with the other hunting parties converging.
At which point it would be all of my forces v Thane. At least 48 Tech Order units (assuming all 12 of the first group were destroyed), 3 skilled combatants, all highly agile, and 40 dark side assassins. Now... Do I have to go into the specifics? I mean... Just to re-iterate:
Tech Order units = Jedi Knight tier (average Knight)
Quaesitor units = Jedi Knight Tier (highly skilled Knight)
Heroes = Each capable of killing force users themselves
In such a fight, all of the variables I brought up earlier... Every. Single. One. Would come into play. Suffice to say, Thane would be in over her head. She is good, but as I stated before, Heroes are still Mortals. Even the high tier force using ones.
How each unit would likely react to this situation:
Quaesitors = mental assault boosted by war chants and melding of power, followed by coordinated feints, distractions, and flanking attempts.
Tech Knight = Surround and pressure, using Droid Meld, Advanced Droid Race, their repulsor generators, and their armor to keep Thane contained.
Tech Deceiver = Boosted by Droid Meld and Advanced Droid Race to create multiple illusions (x16-20 units), using sonic amplifiers for sonic assaults, while seeking opportunities to strike.
Tech Syncer = Boosted by Droid Meld and Advanced Droid Race to link ALL of the droids together (16-20 syncers, 48-60 units), and all that combined hardware for their advanced Analysis protocols to find Thane's weaknesses.
Albaf, Zibu'to, and Xil'Drom (if he isn't off infiltrating) = In the center, providing Thane something to focus on.Assuming just Albaf and Zibu'to, they would operate in a kiting style of combat. Albaf acting defensive and mobile, while Zibu'to keeps up the pressure. If they manage to flank Thane, they pour on the pressure from multiple sides. If Xil'Drom is there, they make to surround her on 3 sides and pressure her, using their agility (and her divided attention) to stay alive, with XD adding in variables for Thane to counter by way of his many gadgets. Most likely, XD would fight Thane with the appearance of her diplomat friend.
Suffice to say, Thane would be overwhelmed. If she decides to wait until all of the Knights are gathered, the control station might already be taken by the time they mobilize, as well as other stations vulnerable. If they all plan to meet at the control station, she would face the EL invaders at full strength, but her own forces would not yet be fully assembled.
Now, if Marr enters the picture, best case scenario, both she and Marr face them just outside of the control center. In that scenario, the droids all engage the force users while the Quaesitors go for the control room. Which, after being cleared, would be sealed off and oxygen from the rest of the station would be vented into space. If the droids are still fighting the force users, it is here that the balance would tip drastically in the droids favor. Should they try to open the blast doors, they would leave themselves exposed.
Anyways, I am sure we will get into this part later, so for now, just going to post the character stats below...
Albaf
Profession: Leader of Free Droids
Species: Magnaguard (droid)
Gender: Masculine
Clothing: Blue cloak across shoulders, and hood over the head.
Items:
1. Vibrostaff (2 blades)
2. Shield gauntlets
3. Personal Shield Generator
Physical traits:
Age: 50 years
Skin: Durasteel
Complexion: Grey
Hair: None
Eyes: Bright Blue
Build: Standard Magnaguard
Height: 1.95 m
Weight: 123 kilograms
Survival of the Learned: He has amassed a great wealth of knowledge from the Clone Wars, and not just on the personal battle field level. While no commander himself, he knows much concerning both sides. Despite the order for all droids to be deactivated or destroyed, he managed to survive. He is adept at self preservation and learning. (Also to use most CIS units)
Mimicry: After many years of practice, he has managed to harness the programs that allow Magnaguards to learn from observation, into a being able to mirror an opponent's moves. Should he be capable of replicating them, he will be able to store them in his database and mimic those he sees.
Droid Liberator: Unlike most Magnaguards, he has an internal transmitter which can be used to communicate with others in the vicinity via droid speak. When nearby droids commanded by organics, he will send signals to them, attempting to break them free of their masters control. Only can be used on a small number at a time.
T1
Reading Others - R9 L5 (405)
Physicality - R7 L1 (217)
Agility - R10 L10 (550)
T2
Melee Weaponry - R6 L1 (312)
Zibu'to
Zibu’to, The Sheriff
Profession: Law Keeper
Species: 501-Z Police Droid
Gender: Masculine
Clothing: Outfit
Items: RK-4 Starforged Blaster
Wrist Rail Shooter (BH)
Heurostatic processor
Physical traits:
Age: 50
Skin: Worn Grey
Complexion: Silver
Hair: None
Eyes: Black
Build: Average
Height: 1.9 meters
Weight: 100 kg
Innates:
Gunslinger: Quick on the draw and accurate can be a lethal combination, even more so when the fighter is well versed in using the environment to their advantage. Increased accuracy, range, and cover effectiveness of this character when using a pistol as well as scaling combat effectiveness with the environment skill.
Autonomous Detective: Calculated and thorough, is oft how a droid police officer was often described. However, this particular character has been at it for decades and has upgraded his systems extensively to improve retention, fine details, and a general boost to his perception at all times. If not for being forced out of the business, he surely would have out-done all the others.
Trick-Shots: Some say that some shots are merely impossible. Trick shooters however, say they are merely the fun ones. This individual, through much practice, has managed to accomplish nearly all of the trick shots and has learned to use them in combat, which has also drastically increased his accuracy.
Skills:
T1
Agility R5 L2 (110)
Reading Others R6 L1 (158)
Schematics R2 L1 (12)
Environment R10 L1 (421)
T2
Ranged Weaponry R8 L1 (576)
Xil'Drom
Xil’Drom, The Cloak
Profession: Assassin
Species: IR-9X Replicator Droid
Gender: Masculine
Clothing: Upper torso with extra armoring (to protect canisters)
Items: (will cost 100 credits upon prep start)
Vibro-Hands - Middle, ring, and pinky fingers have bladed tips that form together to form a point, with the side of the pinky also having a bladed edge. Ultrasonic generator in the insulated palm.
Fusion Cutter - Extends from right index finger.
Finger Spike - Extends from left index finger.
Frequency Monitor - Top of right palm.
Comlink - Top of left palm.
Climbing Claws - Underside of finger tips, and front of feet.
Grappling Hook - Under the left wrist.
Wrist Cord Launcher - Under the right wrist.
Wrist Lasers - Both wrists, top side.
Gas Projector - Mouth, 2 tubes. One for smoke, one for poison.
Flame Projector - Chin mounted, right side, with the cannister in the upper sternum.
Carbonite Projector - Chin mounted, left side, with the cannister in the Lower sternum.
Macrobinocular - Installed into eyes.
Poison Canister - Left Pectoral.
Smoke Canister - Right Pectoral.
Sensor Scrambler - Built along the back, causing a bulge, much like SkyTrooper’s armor back.
Dart Launcher - Both thumbs, only firable when thumb aligns with rest of forearm. Darts are stored within the forearms, and when one is fired, another is loaded into the thumb. None lethal, tranq darts.
Scattergun - One installed within each shin, aimed upwards to fire out of the knee.
Personal Shielding - Installed on the buttox.
Holo-Disguise - Built into chassis.
Physical traits:
Age: 20
Skin: Black and Grey
Complexion: Reflective Silver
Hair: None
Eyes: Red
Build: Average
Height: 2 meters
Weight: 130 kg
Innates:
Chosen from the Best: His status as one of the best Replicator series of droids was earned by his ability to mimic not just appearance, but mannerisms and voice patterns better than others of his model, leading to his selection as an assassin. Increased Infiltration skill.
Overzealous: Being intensely devoted to the cause mean he tends to act quickly, decisively, and without much forethought. As a result when he’s forced to improvise he tends to kill, destroy, and act impulsively. However, this does mean his loyalty and motivation are very high.
Resourceful Assassin: He is skilled at incorporating his equipment and gadgetry into his martial art centralized fighting style, while staying in constant motion. Due to this skill, he has become adept at managing his energy reserves.
Assassin of Assassins: Due to his incredible skills in infiltration and Assassination, he has learned how to counter other assassins or infiltrators. Scales with Infiltration and Assassination skills.
Skills:
T1
Infiltration - R10 L1 (460)
Assassination - R7 L1 (217)
Agility - R6 L5 (180)
Ingenuity - R5 L1 (105)
T2
Martial Arts - R4 L1 (128)
Gadgets - R4 L1 (128)
- The EL is NOT dispersing throughout the station to eliminate enemies as some points discussed might indicate.
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If were being realistic the precog and the droid brain wouldn't cancel each other out in this instance precog will still give my knights the heads up they need to block your attack.Where droid brain will help here is when they are in a actual fight.Not to mention they have force sight which would help them scan for the tech knights in stealth.You also have to remember my knights don't fight alone they fight as a unit not as compound as your force user but still never alone.To help boost there force bond perk.To the poison while effective this perk .Living Shield's: The Imperial Knights are able to embed their bodies with the force which allow them to take more damage than a normal force users could.Allow them to take more damage and slow down the effect of the poison.
Except it is still low level precog, and the precog lacks any boosters. The reason I brought up the droid brain upgrade, is because it would make that warning kinda pointless, as even though they were warned, it would be operating fast enough to compensate. I mean, lets not kid ourselves, droids are notorious for being harder to sense in-universe which has made them an issue in the past for Jedi. In this situation, your Knights are going against droids designed to face off against Jedi and eliminate them quickly. They also, as I have said before, never work alone. As I mentioned earlier, if they are constantly using force sight they are going to exhaust themselves and not be as effective when it comes time to fight.
As for the perk: "Force bond:When Imperial Knights are fighting together they have a small boost to their combat efficiency while working together."
A boost to their efficiency when working together, that is good, but doesn't make dodging an opening strike that they don't see easier or looking around with super powered eyes easier. Better as a team when fighting, definitely. Working together to check more area? Definitely. Covering each others flanks? Definitely. I mean, at the core of it, the precog is level one and in the scenario, they are not pushing their power into said ability to boost it, which means that it would be more akin to a weak spider sense. Giving a half second or so of warning, but not showing WHAT the warning is about.
Do they have any anti-poison force abilities, training, or etc? (In the past, I have always graded poison and physical damage separately due to how they operate, not sure how K does it. At the very least, would basically be pure willpower to delay it, though, due to the strength of the poison + the cut, would still be lethal.)
A assassination is a ambush Which sounds just like what you described so yea your forces are attempting a ambush on my forces.Like you said my perk will work.The droid ability like I mentioned only work in combat it wouldn't cancel each other out in this ambush attempt plus like you said my perk would work here so it give me the edge with my basic precog ability.Perk +Precog I have the edge here.
Except it doesn't work in a super-natural way is what I was trying to explain, and apparently failed at. A guy can be the best martial artist in the world, but even they can be defeated by an amateur when they aren't expecting a fight. Spot good locations to be ambushed from, sure, better at getting defensive positions against them, sure, holding out longer than others during it, sure, but evading a strike that they do not see coming (or if the non force users) can't sense coming... No, just no. As I previously explained, you are really stretching the precog that is at a super low level beyond what it could compensate for. It is the main flaw of your force users, having low precog but pretty good on most other things.
Alright, lets go with a quick scenario of where they are able to not be eliminated. 3 Knights v 3 Knights, 1 graze, 1 eliminate, and 1 unharmed for the knights (the represent all 3 outcomes). The eliminated one is out, and would make it 3 v 2 (scenarios like this could happen due to probabilities, chances, and RNG). The 2nd one with the wound would be severely hampered by said poison, but still able to fight with his comrade. They go and fight the droids. Say the droids opt to 'trade blows' which is not something that the Knights would have experience with since, well, who the hell trades blows with a lightsaber?! In that act, the Knights would lose hard. The droid are made of a durasteel/cortosis alloy, meaning, that they cannot be destroyed by a single saber blow, in fact, it would mean they are EXTREMELY resistant to lightsabers in general, as we have seen weapons of such hold up to dozens upon dozens of saber strikes. Say the knights do this exchange, relying on their armor, speed, and lightsaber to come out on top. I would bet money that they would be surprised that the droid would still be standing, and at least one of them would then be struck with a blade. From there, it is compounding. If none of the Knights get out of the fight alive, then they can't warn the other Knights, and the droids can refine their Knight assassination protocols.
Ofc, this was a 'fair' scenario numbers wise. In this match... it is NOT going to be fair. Nor are your Knights likely, before the red alert, to be traveling in large groups as they likely will be patrolling the large station. 2-3 max I would say. As for my droids, they would likely be moving in groups of 12, 4 sub-groups of 3. There would be 5 of these hunting parties.
Just to cover bases, regarding the Knights other options from the saber:
Speed
Precog - covered
Melee - covered
Tk - Low grade, and would make Knight concentrate on one droid, allowing others to strike.
Force Persuasion - useless against droids.
Melee ++ - saber involved
Force Speed+++ -saber involved
Lightsaber throw - saber involved
Alter damage - Useful, though not known if strong enough to turn the tide at its current level
Force wave - buy them a little time, but could easily lead to exhaustion (do remember, they are not characters, but just regular guys, they have the power of a master npc, but still are rather finite compared to characters)
Force Jump - Could try to escape, I suppose
Force throw - similar issue as TK
Tutaminis - Nothing here to absorb
Force Body - Double edged sword, but would allow them to continue fighting through poison for a time.
Telepathy - useless vs droids
Force confusion - useless vs droids
Force Repulse - tiring but very useful in 1vx scenarios
Mind Trick - useless vs droids
Force sight - tiring, but could potentially spot a droid before it strikes
This is impossible now sil because of the scenario you just posted if your at this position where you failed to assassinate my Knights the first time the station is on high alert and my knights are ready which makes another attempts even harder. which also put Marr and Thane on high alert and attempting to head to the command center and or thane hunting them down as a huntress kinda of her job like you said she rather do it alone and with her points in intel be able to track the rest of your units pretty easy.She will find your Quaesitor easy with again high force sight and sense finding you isn't that hard my basic knights will be able to find you with there sight if your in the area.
Unless your Knights are, without high/red alert, patrolling in groups of 10, so only 10 groups to cover this entire station, then it is unlikely that the initial knights to encounter one of the 5 droid hunting parties are to survive. That said, they could cause issues for the droids, which is when the Quaesitors would switch objectives and go and assassinate them. On High Alert they would likely funnel more into Precog, but that ultimately would NOT help them, as the Quaesitors would, since they then know the enemy are on high alert, funnel more energy into concealment. Which directly counters abilities like precog as they cannot be sensed or perceived by the force (unless the senser is stronger, specific skills, or etc) so the assassination attempts would still have a good chance of success as they work in groups of at least 5.
Except Thane trying to confront them solo, is a death wish in this scenario. (Will detail why in another post)
As for the basic Knights, their sight range is rather limited since it is only level one.
As for spotting Quaesitor with it, did a little more reading on Force Concealment:
"You blend in with the universe. Think of it as Force camouflage. The trick is to become so comfortable with it that you can slip into this state of being… dissolved, yet still carry on functioning, fully aware."
―Jacen Solo
If Jacen Solo is taken at face value, that would counter Force Sight, though would need a ruling on that by K...
All that said, if the station goes to red alert before they can even get close to the command center, they would change their objective to get around such. Combination of Quaesitor drain knowledge, and Xil'Drom frequency monitor would help the learn RF positioning and move to counter it.
Yes they did and the GE confirmed it.Which I mentioned with the video only having about 2 weeks of editing by you was easily proven to be faked.Your right we don't know the full capabilities of Xil drom. When you start attempting to assassinate my knights which will go poorly they will be on alert.Even than like you said Thane would search for dark side energy on the station even if its faint dark side energy IMO wouldn't be faint since it be the only thing on the station like that.As it is right now your forces can sneak up on her and a face up fight she has a strong advantage against blasters user with her High force deflection and tutaminis she can use to defend herself against someone like the sheriff. Not to mention She still smart with her intel ability she will put two and two together and send her men to the command center after she find your men she will send marr for help.Ok, and where is this evidence? As far as I recall, in that trial, they only decided to look into XD more, and were not willing to give a statement yet. That said, there shouldn't have been anything on XD's memory or etc that implicated the EL or DU directly in any way thanks to his infiltration skills. (glances at K) We specifically talked about this point...
You misunderstood. It is not Thane that I am saying would be having issues. Only, you know, EVERYONE ELSE. Pardon my French, but apart from Thane, all of your units (unless in a sizable number) are fodder for my 3 heroes.
To use the big yet more common threat of the Knights as an example:
Which leaves literally just Thane, Marr, and MAYBE the Hunters. Ofc, this plays into other variables, just as detection time, distance, and etc etc.
Counter him is pretty simple actually you can't read a droid mind... Thane walks into the room scan everyone umm hey phil can you come here real quick I want to ask you something put two and two together and good bye Xil. Really having trouble reading someone mind because they have a strong will and not getting anything at all is completely different.You have to remember thane is still the fastest person on the station Max agility and force speed she can get anywhere on the station faster than any of your units. I think your over estimating your queastors ability to hide their presence it be easy to stop them and find them. Plus even with only M5 and M6 someone trying to hide there presence in the force is easier to find when you know they are trying to hide themselves its a giant red flag someone is trying to hide from me so I'm on high alert.As I mentioned above, it wouldn't be Thane that XD is trying to fool, and his infiltration skills would tell him that the gig is up in that scenario due to the cues and such.
As for the speed, never disputed that, merely pointed that there is a LOT of ground to cover, and it is mostly twisting corridors, elevators, and such to navigate, not a straight line. Not to mention trying to find something in a 3D space, that is moving, and might be hiding its presence, at the very least making it only a general area instead of pinpoint until she gets closer.
Lets do a little math real quick. Lets say distance, only passively at first, and distracted = 1 each. Let X be melding of power (excluding other perks for now). Concealment is rank 1, so lets go with = 1. 1+1+1+1*x+y=total concealment. Y, being other variables that are not specifically stated, so basically treated as a "if I forgot anything, else, 0" clause. Assuming at the start that x = 1, just to nullify it, then that is a rating of 4, which even then, would mean a very faint reading. Now, suppose that each quaesitor adds .1 to the standard 1 due to melding of power. That would be 1+1+1+5+y=8. Which would mean that when they are together (next post I will explain their formations) that they would have a rating of 8 and wouldn't be sensed by Thane until they split up. Now, as mentioned before, they work in groups of at least 5. Which would equate to 1+1+1+1.5+y=4.5. In this scenario it is still possible to go unnoticed, but she would likely detect them at this specific point. Marr ofc is 1 mastery level lower than Thane. Now, if they are separating, then they are not following the plan...
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Just wanted to mention your Knight thing Is incorrect my Knights in training the tier lower than than Knights.When I create units they start off as Knights in training then move to Imperial knights my Knights in training have Precog which means my Imperial Knights have Precog.So your One shot isn't possible.Here a link talking about there armor
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial_Knight_armor
Also I'm pretty sure that my Always prepared perk would help with the sneak attack thing can't be ambushed.
I agree xil drom frequency monitor will inform your forces when the Red alert is started but you have to remember my People Know you have used replicator droids in the past and it won't take long for them to put two and two together.Also really with R10 agility and M10 force speed how long do you really think it will take me to catch your Quaesitors?I will say with thrya and her hunters they can find the low number of Quaesitors easy.
*Pushes up glasses like a nerd*
*Nerdy voice* Well actually, that would only mean that they have a level 1 of precog, which would then go up against the droids stats. The Knights would still be at a huge disadvantage in the beginning of said interaction, due to the stealth, as well as precog being canceled out by: "State of the art droid brain capable of processing fast enough to keep up with pre-cog (force weapon 100)", essentially, closer to IG-88 than regular droids if you have read that book, but ofc not as extreme as IG-88's. So add in the lack of sense, and that precog is only level 1 without any boosters, and the likelihood of the backstab working are still pretty great. As for the armor itself, it still has a lot of weak points, though it does have a solid chest. The arm pits, neck, legs, waste, and etc etc could still be struck. Not as quick and dirty as a direct backstab, sure, but wit hteh poison and the advantage they would have after landing said hit, it would be enough.
As for the perk: "Always Prepared: Through years of fighting a shadow war units in the remnant soldiers are always expecting to be walking into a trap, So they're always watching over their shoulders waiting for a ambush. Hard to set a ambush for units of the remnant." It sounds nice in this scenario, and would work in most scenarios, but this would literally mean that they are, without sense, dodging an attack they literally cannot see coming. This is also technically not what would fall under an 'ambush' in the sense that it isn't a battle initiation or a fight with multiple units. It is a assassination attempt. Technicalities, sure. That said, I do stand by the not seeing the attack coming and that the precog is neutralized/evened out by the droids own abilities.
Ofc, an alternative, if the first few attempts to assassinate a Knight goes south, would be to have the Quaesitor assassinate the Knights. Straight up a fight, I admit that the Knights would slaughter a Quaesitor as that is not what they are intended for. However... They are still rogue-esque. They may not LITERALLY turn invisible (that is for the next teir) but their skill set does allow them to move around very sneakily, and with the force concealment, that would make them unsensable in the force by the Knight's, though at close range Marr or Thane could sense them if they are alone and not melding power. Basically, think Assassin Creed style assassination, out of sight, leap from the shadows, impale them, disappear.
As for Xil'Drom...Did they ever actually find a connection between the EL and XD when they found him before? Do remember, IC, there are more than just you or I, and Replicators are not even EL specific tech. Originally, they were Sith Empire. Though, the only character who saw it happen in person was the Diplomat, was it not? Nor did the diplomat witness the full capabilities, which could lead to assumptions, and you know what happens when people do that...
As for Thane finding the Quaesitors, well, for one, it is VERY BIG station... For two, that timer only starts once she or Marr senses one of them. With melding of power + distance + not focusing on sense passively + surprise + concealment = it would either be EXTREMEMLY faint, or not sensed at all since the sense levels are M5 and M6. Good to be sure, but variables!!! Now, if they only sensed something super faint... are they so insecure about their skills that they would instantly jump to putting the station on such high alert? I mean, in that situation, due to what you said to me about Marrs situation, I would think Thane would set out solo and try to find what it is. From there, if she is confident in her abilities (which looking at the stat page, she probably is) she might arrive solo as well, give or take a few that might already be nearly. At that point, well, characters are powerful, but they are still mortal. As for Xil'Drom himself, pray tell, what would they do to counter it, even if they knew he could change forms in fact, it could play AGAINST you due to not having a way to stop the shape changing, and no ways that I know of that you can de-activate his abilities. Which could lead to everyone on the station thinking that they are the imposter, which could lead to chaos. I mean, what if Thane goes into a room, and all of the personnel point their guns at her each and every time she enters a room, demanding proof that she is who she appears to be? Sure, there might be a protocol to bypass this, but then... There are again the Quaesitor's drain knowledge, which could rip that out of a crew members mind and XD himself could use it.
As a last note, you say 'low number' of Quaesitors, but you only have 3, maybe 4 if you count Marr, that would be capable of sensing them out. In such a large station, with all the variables, I would say quite a while to find them all.
Side Note: The other perk would only come into affect though when the defenders are not being stealth attacked, otherwise it would be a supernatural phenomenon.
"Imperial Boarding actions:The Imperial Marines are the best of the best when it comes to boarding and repealing enemy borders.Bonus to unit cohesion when boarding an enemy ship or stopping enemy boarding operations." -
In the interest of keeping it bite sized...
Information gathering:
- Quaesitors can drain knowledge from any crew members that they encounter.
- Tech Syncers have the ability to hack systems.
- Xil'Drom could infiltrate an area and retrieve data.
Something to note regarding the Imperial Knights:
They do not seem to have precog OR sense... Meaning that unless the Knights are exhausting themselves by always using sight, the droids can one shot them from stealth. Back stab them Dark Souls style. Even if they survive said stab (from what I remember, their armor isn't full plate, but multiple components, many gaps that in combat they learned to protect and etc) the TO Blades are coated in a fast acting poison.
About RF communications and coordination:
Xil'Drom has the frequency monitor which will allow him to listen in on said things and relay it using droid binary to the other droids, allowing them to use it against them.
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Alright, now to bring up the perks for the EL:
Rivals of the Rakata: In times long past, their people had done fierce, seemingly unending, battle with the Rakata. Despite losing the war and being forced into hiding, they retain their warrior origins proudly, with their will to survive having only strengthened.
Hive Origins: Despite each individual having a mind of their own, their history indicates that they have been hive-like in ages past. While archaic, it does help the members of this faction coordinate with one another.
Droid Meld: Due to how the faction is run, and how they operate with each other, increased effectiveness and efficiency between droids. They are able to coordinate among each other more so than the average organic.
Advanced Droid Race: Due to the focus on the military, lack of memory wipes, and the extensive use of droids, they have developed improved AI. Increase Overall Droid Effectiveness.
Thick-Hide: Beneath their armor, their skin has toughened over the millennia of fighting, allowing them to endure more battle damage.
Warrior Race: Members of this faction are born to battle, and are taught from a young age to be able to defend themselves, and how to fight when called to serve.
Fanatics: The members of this faction are religious zealots which will follow their codes unto death, and are totally devoted to the cause. Pain threshold is drastically increased.
War-Chants: The more friendly force users that are nearby, the greater allied forces are able to coordinate with one another. Force users are affected more so.
Melding of Power: When a group of force users are together in battle, they can combine their power for brief moments for powerful combined assaults.
Ancient Bond: It is very difficult to ‘disrupt’ their connection to the force (such as with neural inhibitors or electric shocks) and have intense concentration/focus.
Martyr's: When a Hero dies, the faction gains 20 skill points to spend immediately. The points on cooldown are unaffected. Does not work with suicides or ritual deaths.
Religious Fervor: When a Hero is defeated, other Heroes in the area gain a temporary boost in fighting proficiency.
To the Victor, the Spoils: When a Hero from another faction is killed by one of this factions Heroes, it steals 20 of the defeated character's skill points.
Ion Shielding: All Droids/Mechs are shielded against ion/energy attacks and are harder to short out.
Advanced Laser Weaponry: This faction has managed to progress their weapon technology to a level above galactic standard, for all types.
Anti-Stealth Tech: Managed to reverse engineer RF anti-stealth technology.
Repair Masters: Whether it be starships, droids/mechs, or ground structures, they are skilled in repairing battle damage in an orderly fashion.
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Going to try and keep it in straightforward, bite sized pieces this time, instead of text walls, as is my go to...
Overall plan:
Get to the control center before the surrounding fleet can be notified and take control of the station. From there, hyperspace the station to Rattatak, where the EL has recently positioned a small fleet due to the recent RF's retreat.
Things to remember about EL forces:
- All three types of droids used are akin to a Jedi Knight in skill/lethality (unit, not char) but not in versatility, hence why they cost as much as a force weapon, from the tech that makes it possible to do such.
- The droids mentioned above also each have a stealth belt to move undetected.
- Said droids also will work in groups of 3 at the minimum, one of each type, as they also link together as such. Larger groups however are possible due to the Syncers, and allow a snow-balling effect.
- Quaesitors are best thought of as my force orders rogue's. Pilots/Assassins/Sneaky.
- Quaesitors also have the ability to mask their presence from force users.
- Quaesitors can steal knowledge from sentient beings using 'drain knowledge'.
- Xil'Drom can essentially infiltrate anywhere on the station by himself if needed due to his skills and equipment.
- Albaf can turn any droids they encounter to the EL's side.
- Zibu'to should have no issues securing points by himself, save if RF characters come into play.
For now I will leave it there, and give J a chance to post his over-arching post...
Just for a reminder concerning the Tech Knights, Tech Syncers, and Tech Deceivers, the write up about their style.
Style of Combat of the Tech Knight, Deceiver, and Syncer: They would attempt to use their slender blades (slimmer than galactic standard) in combination with their enhanced limbs and range of movement, to perform maneuvers that organics simply cannot or choose not to. For example, what Grievous does with the spinning of his wrists. However, since they know jedi need to be taken by surprise, they would have programs (aka their version of the forms) for different attack styles. Such as special maneuvers that work with one, two, or double blade, however, the changing of style is the point they would be vulnerable at due to tinkering with the weapon. That said, such types of alterations during combat have been an issue for Jedi of the average variety in the past. The downside is, if the quarters are too enclosed, they may get stuck with whatever type they currently had drawn. For example though, if using the 2 blades they could have one doing the twirling trick like grievous, acting like a shield kinda, while the other seeks a thrust. Or with the double form, basically a quicker variant of what Magnaguards did with elctrostaffs. If going single, might try to fence a bit, or to throw the blade at the Jedi, drawing the 2nd blade then, if they got breathing room, could use their tk to retrieve the blade.
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Usually K tells me I can make my agenda for week a but he won't check it or do anything with it until Sil done with the previous week.
It is indeed T39, I asked that question multiple times. That said, you are right, I didn't ever list what was on my station, because I didn't have anything but the standard stuff that is auto on it, aka, fodder.
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Station 404
Turn: 39
Location: Bakura
Arena: Space Station
Units used:
- 20 Knights
- 20 Syncers
- 20 Deceivers
- 40 Quaesitors
Heroes used:
- Albaf
- Zibu'to
- Xil'Drom
Assumed RF forces:
- Marines (unknown)
- Crew (unknown)
- Technicians (unknown)
- Droids (unknown)
No forces are listed to be on the station currently, so unless there is a criminal lack of documentation... This should be about what is on the station, unless a character is stationed there. Though, that would have had to have been placed BEFORE the operation, for obvious reasons that will be made clear during the debate.
- 20 Knights
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The switching the blades on/off is actually a practice called Trakata. While often interwoven with niman, it also has prominence with the other forms as well. It does tend to be most effective with Makashi, Shii-Cho, Juyo, and Niman though, due to the way that such a technique bolsters these forms.
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It is true, that there are essentially only two kinds of Niman practioners. The ones who do not want to dedicate to lightsaber combat, and the prodigies.
What made Niman so powerful, is that it in a way allows the force user to approach the battle from a perspective that none of the other forms truly allow. Yes, some shift from strength to speed, or acrobatics... But other than Vaapad, which very few learned due to its dangers, only Niman remained as the form that brought force power to a saber duel in more than a passing sense.
All force users could of course throw out a push, throw, pull, or etc in the heat of battle every now and then, but that is not what Niman helped with. Niman provided a form without a true weakness, while also not really excelling in any single thing. The good of that, is that unlike forms like Makashi, it doesn't have a natural counter other than superior skill. The catch 22 being that most Niman practioners did not practice much and thus lacked skill, due to it being thought of as the diplomat form.
Those who took it to its Nth degree though... Each and every one of them is remembered as being one of the greatest saber duelists of their respective era's. Exar Kun for example is infamous for his Niman, as well as his tendancy to incorporate force strikes into his saber sequences. Yes, most jedi/sith could use the force during combat, but Niman essentially allowed them to do it flawlessly, without wavering in their saber movements. Kun for example, used this proficiency to unleash powerful blasts of force energy which could K.O. an opponent with one shot, if they were not prepared.
Other examples being when Niman is mixed with Sokan, where the environment and force combat proficiency combine to make something truly terrifying.
That is not to say that Niman is inherently superior to the other saber forms, far from it, but for one of an acute mind and with the talent, it allows the user to not just fight with the blade but their mind as well. The other forms each have their own pros/cons, whereas Niman balances out, ultimately making it the most adaptable form. If there is one thing to NEVER be underestimated in combat... it is sheer adaptability.
That does not mean that it will out-do the other forms though, since adaptability is no good if they are not given the chance to adapt, such as when Djem So users batter through an opponents defense with sheer strength before they can muster a proper defense. Mmm... I suppose another way to say it, is that all of the saber forms are somewhere along the edges of a circle, judging where their natural speed, strength, and mobility and such are. Whereas unlike the others, Niman is in the center of the circle instead of along the edges. It does not have innate speed advantage, nor disadvantage. Nor strength advantage, or disadvantage. It merely is completely balanced.
One of the difficult things about taking something so balanced, to such a high level like some of the Jedi and Sith did during the time of the movies, is that each if something is completely balanced... how does one make it better, without creating a weakness? Therein lies the issue, since Niman practicioners who did indeed seek to improve, ended up relegating Niman to a secondary form and taking another form as their new primary, to improve.
It is only in the very rare cases of true masters of saber combat, that they are able to boost all of the elements of Niman and stay true to the form, without having to lean on another form to boost them up.
I suppose what my sleep depraved mind is trying to say... Is that there are so few masters of Niman, precisely BECAUSE it is so balanced, that to improve it would cause imbalance which would then lead them to another form that they would likely then prefer, which leads them to no longer seeking to perfect Niman, but rather to focus on their own strengths. Individuals who are truly balanced and thus capable of fully utilizing Niman to its Nth degree, are much harder to come by, in my opinion at least, than most of the other traits that the other forms thrive off of.
*looks over text wall* Gosh dang it, meant to just do a sentence or two... Ah well... Last paragraph has the summery if you want to skip the bloat...
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(Esh-kha speech has been translated to basic for viewing ease)
The Echo's of Legends had gathered to mourn the passing of Starwalker and Organizer, murdered by the RF in the most recent act of war. The old married couple lay upon pedestals at the end of a long isle, with Esh-kha standing on either side. One by one, the other named Esh-kha of the faction came and gave Eulogies, remarking how great the two of them had been. After a time, it was silent, no one wanting to take the next step. It was at this time, that a slow, methodical, pace could be heard walking down the isle.
"Of fire and blood, they shall not go unavenged." The figure was at the far end of the isle, approaching the pedestals.
Those in attendance gasped as they turned to view the newcomer, who was none of than Starwalker and Organizer's son, Tarkus. He had been secluded for a long time now, seemingly uninterested in the war and the Esh-kha's reemergence into the galaxy... The death of his parents must have changed such.
He was now half way down the isle. "They sought to bring great fortune to our race, to lead us to a new dawn. Instead, they have been lead to their dusk, and now their killers plot to kill us all, not for what we have done, but for what they fear we will do..."
By now he had reached the steps to the pedestal, and he turned to face the audience. "Each and every one of us has a duty to uphold." His midnight black armor began to gleam in the light as he gestured towards the crowd before turning to ascend the steps.
At the top, he slowly caressed his mothers face, and then his fathers before whispering, "We were equals once, father, mother... But I will fulfill your dreams, if not for the Legends, then for you..."
He turned to face the group once more. "Before, we were hesitant, seeking all avenues of engagement! NO MORE!" He produced a holoprojector from his person which instantly ignited the air around him with streaks of blue. "I have a plan, my brothers and sisters... And with it... We shall have vengeance..."
Tarkus's eyes smoldered with fire, even as the group stood in awe of the hologram that showcased his plan, the eyes continued to burn for vengeance.
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One of my personal favorites is, 'Speaker for the Dead".
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Yeah Sil is a necromancer, always keeping things alive long after they've kicked the bucket.
Not that I'm complaining, the faction I've put together for this will wipe the floor with them all!!!!!
That said, the new system means things can take forever. I think Sil and J have been locked in this battle since...
January?
I tell ya, K and J take FOREVER on the agenda stuff!
Side note: I shall wipe that faction of yours from the face of the galaxy!
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Sil I think its time for your complete surrender.If your leaders turn themselves over I'll let the rest of your forces survive:D:D
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So we've forgone pretense and accepted that this is just a super-involved/customized pvp DnD campaign with dice rolls?
*Rolls dice* Dice say that I have to say no.
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My sub lapsed for like 2-3 months... cause, you know, this is slow : P
A one legged turtle glued to a glacier in a time dilation field is still a millions times faster than this game...
I blame J's disorganization and K's willingness to make each turn a week long.
Most of my agenda's are finished within an hour. Except when I need input from K... Jokes aside, good to see you are back, Star.Though, you missed the chance to roast my forces in the recent battle. -
Correct
I would appreciate an explanation/details for what happened with the Veritas on the Lucrehulks, if possible. So many things are not clicking and I was hoping you could fill in the holes.
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Just to clarify, the RF forces fell back, correct? So that EL still controls Belsavis space?
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The Great Battle of Belsavis (T22)
RF
Destroyed
27 Adepts
69,500 tie defenders
59,750 Tie Vanquishers
9300 TIE Hunter
6000 A-wing
48,500 Skipray
4 Executer
1 SSD Ravagers
1 SSD Ravager The Fel Flagship
48 Pellaeon
26 Providence
100 Majestic
75 Nebula
200 Bothana Assaults
500 Ardents
500 Vindicator
100 Enforcer
200 DP20
11,000 Crusaders
100 Tartan
554 Aegis
4,065 Hammer
Damaged
1 Executer (40%)
38 Pellaeon (40%)
5 Lucrehulk (70%)
20 Providence (5%)
KIA
Commander Praven
Wounded
Praven (2 turn recovery)
Void (4 turn recovery)
MIA
140 Adepts
Flynn
EL
Destroyed
10,000 Long Arm
1,000 Caliber
143 Phalanx
1,135 Adept (Warden)
7055 Adept (Sentry)
300 Adept (Quaesitor)
10 Adept *(Pallium)
1,300,300 Locusts
2 Inevitable
Legend
Station
15592 Arrow
Damaged
Captured
14 Pellaeon
45 Providence
KIA
132 SD-Hulks
4360 Esh-kha Warriors
250 Veritas
46 Incinerator Droids
46 Carbonite Droids
Organizer
Starwalker
Wounded
Seer (1 turn to recover)
Albaf (3 turns to recover)
Vao (4 turns to recover)
Pel Soab (1 turn to recover)
Can we also get a "what/who is alive still" list for comparison?
Damage estimations in credits:
RF
Starfighters: $1,150,700
SSD (not including upgrades): $408,000
Destroyers: $145,100
Cruisers: $514,300
Frigate: $104,268
Corvette: $221,700
Total value of destroyed ships: $2,544,068
Total value of captured ships: $37,600
Total value lost: $2,581,668
(Were there any troopers on the lost vessels?)
EL
Starfighters: $447,398
Pilots: $45,900
Frigates: $15,000
Cruisers: $170,000
destroyers: $71,500
SSD: $300,000
Orbital: $1,191,000
Total value of destroyed ships: $2,240,798
Total value of lost soldiers: $48,923 (currently excluding Inevitable compliments)
Total value of lost assets: $2,289,721
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I'm sorry I had 3 papers do and a group project out of no where:(:(
:D:D
:(
Assassin/Shadow Tank Stats logic/help
in Shadow / Assassin
Posted · Edited by Silenceo
There are basically four main different schools of thought on sin tanking stat allocation.
Shield focus, minor absorb (consistent but can be taxing on healers and no major reducs from shield absorbs)
Absorb focus, minor shield (when you shield, you shield BIG, but it doesn't happen often. Spiky but can work with skill.
Balanced Shield and Absorb (Middle ground, decent shield rate and decent absorb. healers tend to like this one)
Skank tank (toss in crit, more power focused mods, and generate ALL the threat! Leave rest to healers. Less def)
Personally, I prefer the balanced method because when we do that, we can have insane amounts of shield still due to the use of Dark Ward, and still have decent absorb.
There are a few key things you need to take note of when deciding on which style of sin tank you want to use. They are all from within out spec, but must be accounted for when considering the stats:
- Dark Ward (+18% shield chance, 15 stacks)
- Bulwark (+10% absorb, gain 1/10 per defended/shielded/avoided attack, reset on Dark Ward use)
- Recklessness (+30% absorb for 20s, 1m 30s cd)
Tacticals:
- Ward of Continuum (+3% defense chance, +5 stacks of Dark Ward, refresh on Dark Ward use)
- Tome of Wrath (+2% absorb per target hit by Wither for 5s (wither has a cd of 10s)
- Double Cloak (can be used to be very tactical in operation boss fights)
Important things to keep track of:
- Each of these can compound with each other, turning a squishy tank into an Iron Warden.
- Continuum is great for single target encounters
- Tome is VERY good for 2+ target encounters (on Ravagers, I have gotten up to 130% absorb on pulls, its amazing)
- Absorb from Bulwark and Recklessness stack, and if you have high enough absorb, can nullify enemy attacks
- Always, always, always consider dark ward's dual purpose. 18% shield chance on demand, but can leave it after the stacks are gone, to stay with 10% absorb. What you might need changes constantly so keep on your toes.
- Know what your shield % chance is when dark ward is off, so you know how much you can gain or lose
Personally, I heavily advise the 50/50 or so split, because it is very versatile and adaptable. When using Dark Ward for example, you can easily still maintain a 65% shield chance while retaining around 50% absorb. One thing to keep in mind in regards to absorb though, is that it has a faster gain early in the points than shield, but around 2.5k or so shield and absorb start to have the same gain rates. Going beyond that too heavily in either I believe can lead to reduced survivability but that can all be adjusted for in your own style.