azhrione
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Posts posted by azhrione
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As pyro, power shot shouldn't be part of your rotation at all, unless you really need that PPA proc to reset railshot and that no one is on you at the time (don't waste power surge on that) and even then it takes 3 power shot casts to proc PPA tops and by the time you do, unload is ready to use for that.
Umm this is exactly why Power Shot is part of the priority rotation, because you WANT to be using Rail Shot every six seconds.
Think of it like this, what is the cooldown of Rail Shot if you did not use Power Shot. If you get a proc on the first Unload, then you get one free Rail Shot, after that it is no faster than one Rail shot every fifteen seconds. Kind of a waste of three talent points, eh?
Use Power Shot, even in PVP, if you can't/won't then you need to rethink your spec.
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Well I don't buy that... it seems very overstated. For sorc jolt has a 4 second lock out and 12 second cool down so they can lock out one TM every 12 seconds I'm assuming the sage ability is the same. Plus doesn't pyro have the same problem with unload and power shot, it's two main attacks? Plus If you are standing LOS of a so called interrupt spam that would be stupid. interrupts are a big problem for both specs but it hardly renders you useless
Because everything that Arsenal does is tied to spamming TM. A four second lockout is enough to invalidate you for whatever time it takes for them to take you out or to prevent you from doing your job in whatever map you are in. Since every class but Merc/Commando has an interrupt they can just take turns which I have seen done with my own team before. We call out the Merc Interrupt Order just for fun against bads in RWZ who insist on bringing an Arsenal, then take turns interrupting them. Sure you can make it work in a stellar team if you are at the absolute top of your game, with the best gear, and have a team willing to carry you, but the best you can hope for is that you will not hurt the team.
As for Pyro things work a little differently since about 30-40% of our damage in WZ is burns. Not to mention if Unload is going to proc Rail Shot it does it at activation, not completion, meaning if Unload gets interrupted we still get our free Rail Shot. Losing Power Shot to an interrupt is annoying, but it is at the bottom end of our priority rotation.
An Arsenal Rotation would look like this:
Is Unload on cooldown? No, Unload.
Yes? Does target have five stacks of Heat Signature? No, TM.
Yes? Is HSM on cooldown? No, HSM.
Yes? Do you have five stacks of Target Lock? No, TM.
Yes? Is Rail Shot on cooldown? No, Rail Shot.
Yes? Are you at 50 heat or less? No, Rapid Shots.
Yes? TM
This is how Pyro looks:
Is the target burning? No, Incendiary Missile.
Yes? Is Rail Shot on cooldown? No, Rail Shot.
Yes? Is TD on cooldown? No, TD.
Yes? Is Unload on Cooldown? No, Unload and cancel if Rail Shot procs.
Yes? Are you at 50 heat or less? No, Rapid Shots.
Yes? Can you stand still for a GCD? No, Rapid Shots.
Yes? Power Shot.
You can see the problem that Arsenal has here, if TM ever goes on cooldown, their priority rotation is screwed. If Power Shot goes on cooldown, it is annoying but it is only used at the bottom of the priority list.
I need to make up some flow charts for this to explain it better.
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Thanks to you I now understand better the following quote:
But I would have formulated it in anotherway: "Always use aim augments, and if your crit is >35%, switch a endu/crit/surge soph for an endu/power/surge one"
BTW I thought that the DR on crit was just about the crit index and that the "due to aim" crit bonus was unaffected ?
Currently no matter what Power Augments are already about .002% better than Aim Augments even taking Crit into account. This is due to various talents and abilities increasing damage or doing other things on Crits.
Aim adds to the "Critical Rating" we have, it does not directly add to Crit %. This means once diminishing returns are hit we gain little or nothing from Aim in terms of improved Critical %. At this point Power Augments become a lot better than Aim Augments.
You are right in that if you are hitting diminishing returns with Aim Augments, then you should be moving stuff around. From my experience this is really hard to do overall since the best gear is a little short on Crit.
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Well I'm going to disagree. I know I'm in the minority but I really like arsenal pvp post 1.3. I've tried both and pyro is still more mobile and does slightly better sustained dps (because you have to keep moving in pvp). But I find arsenal much better now and has better burst dps. If you can stay on your feet and play like a hit and fade sniper... You can really take out targets much quicker because of the burst. Pyro is also better at 1v1 ( although I think they both are hard) because you can do much more damage as you kite.. where as arsenal you have to run and reestablish your position. I think 1.3 has made arsenal viable and it plays much better to my play style... But I would try both before you dismiss it
Until something can protect you from lockout interrupts Arsenal is not viable in any serious pvp capacity. In Ranked WZs, a Sage or GS will be assigned to keep your TM on perma cooldown and you'll spend a whole lot of time being ignored.
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No hogwash just warzone observations.
I am an Assault commando and When I duel against a dps PT I win.
But a competitive guild does not care about that. They want a damage class doing huge damage.
Jedi Sage, Gunslinger then Vanguard are the real damage class they can easily do 600K damage to 750k damage. Commando is limited to a 300K-450K damage for the same played warzone.
Show me several scorecards with huge commando damage with more than 600K damage, and I will agree with you, but for the moment it's just a broken class useless in RANKED warzone
Any game where my team is so bad that 600k+ damage gets done by anyone then I will be up there with them.
As I am on vacation this week, this will have to wait until I get back.
However I will say that I do not think I have topped 525k in a RWZ yet, 600k is entirely possible if everyone else is bad but the healers in a normal pugged WZ. Damage numbers are usually lower for everyone in RWZ for several different reasons, better protection, better movement, better communication, and far more objective oriented play. I have WZ where I get 150k and others where I am at or close to 500k, but I am always in the top one or two for the WZ unless I get stuck babysitting an ignored node. That rarely happens as we will shuffle people to put the DPS where they can do the most good.
Huge numbers on a scorecard means your team is in a bad match up, not that there is a problem with the class.
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Is this a PvP or PvE conversation? If it's PvE then my post can be disregarded.
If not, then I guess it comes down to play style. More endurance is never a bad thing. Infrared Sensors is great when running around or guarding objectives and catching an Assassin or Operative before they open on you or anyone else, and the 2% damage reduction isn't bad. I am always mobile and hardly ever use Power Shot, and only cast Unload if no one is around me and I want to proc my rail shot. It's all preference.
Speaking only about PVP.
Why would you move when it is not in your or your team's best interest for you to move? Why ignore one of our hardest hitting abilities when you can actually use it effectively. I understand that we need to be mobile, but not to the point of ignoring important abilities.
Priority should look something like this:
Is the target burning? No, Incendiary Missile.
Yes? Is Rail Shot on cooldown? No, Rail Shot.
Yes? Is Thermal Detonator on cooldown? No, TD.
Yes? Is Unload on cooldown? No, Unload and cancel if Rail Shot procs.
Yes? Is heat under 50? No, Rapid Shots.
Yes? Can you stand still for a GCD? No, Rapid Shots.
Yes? Power Shot.
This should have you using Power Shot at least two or three times every fifteen second rotation period. Which you need to be doing in order to get Rail Shot procs. Pyro a lot more mobile than Arsenal, but it does not have the ability to be supremely mobile and retain all of its dps capability.
As for Infrared Sensors, the benefit of Stealth Scan is usually fairly predictable and it is rarely on cooldown when we need to use it. Plus we have other ways of clearing stealth if need be, Sweeping Blasters, Jet Boost, DFA, etc. I would rather be able to cast through an AE or melee tickle when I need to, than get 1% endurance and shortened cooldown on a situational ability.
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That's my only complaint really that I still have =/
That and our utter lack of utility in PVP
Getting Deadly Cannon fixed is going to require a campaign. We need actual logs showing it doesn't work in 1.3.
Easiest say to test this is to get an empty Orange Cannon, strip naked, and only have talents up to Grav Round. Do nothing but Full Auto for 10 minutes. Every 15 seconds, Full Auto on a dummy.
Then put two points into Deadly Cannon and do it again for 10 minutes.
Screenshot and video both tests and results.
Then spam every single relevant board here until they acknowledge the problem.
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If you are standing there trying to cast while getting beat on, you're doing it wrong. That's what the Arsenal tree is for. Pyro is all about staying mobile and kiting (or trying to kite at least). Personally I run this:
If I am ranged, I need to be able to cast Power Shot without every random AE or melee tickle causing me to lose time on the induction.
I will gladly trade 1% endurance and worthless Infrared Sensors for the ability to cast/channel without pushback. I tested it without going with another 3% Crit, was worth it in PVE not in PVP.
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You will respec Assault and your guldies will tell you to reroll Assault Vanguard because Vanguard Assault is twice more powerful in ranked warzone....
Hogwash, no Assault Vanguard or PT has ever doubled me up in any WZ rated or non. If anything their advantage lies entirely in the matter of utility. They obtain, protect, and manage objectives better than we do, and they have a better game against heavy armor classes. We have range while they have to be in melee to do the most damage.
Twice as good? BS, the advantage is maybe 5% for Assault Vanguards against Commandos head to head.
My team will not ask me to reroll, that would be insane since it would take over a month to level and gear up with no guarantee that I would be able to play Vanguard as well as I play Commando.
It is over reactions and embellishments like this that mask the real problems Commandos have.
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Finally got to 50 and put on my spiffy new recurit armor. I figure, I can at least hold my own right?
NOPE!!
Seems like everybody on the other team has at least 18k HP, that was like the lowest I saw in about 15-20 warzones I ran. In some cases, it was just 3 or 4 GCD's and my poor little guardian was taking a trip to the spawn point. Whats worse, some of them simply ignored me, laughing at my small and puny lightsaber
I don't want any battlemaster nerfs or anything, can I just have a hug plx?
Yeah there is a huge difference between Recruit gear and fully Augmented WH gear. Good news is that BM gear is cheap, only takes a few days to get geared up, and is pretty good.
Take your lumps, pay your dues. =)
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i would prefer a separate root ability.
Personally I do not want another button to press, would greatly prefer that they change an existing ability or talent.
Pinning Fire seems like a perfect place to put it. High enough up the tree to prevent hybrid builds and strong enough to have a real impact in PVP and add some PVE usability.
I would like Sticky Grenade to get a root component from a Deep Gunnery talent, but that would require re-balancing the tree.
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So I still need three pieces to fill out my commando Rakata and have not yet gotten anything but a campaign relic. Everything is augmented.
What should my overall damage numbers read at this point? I am worried about my bonus damage which is at 522. My current crit % is 36 something.....
My toon is strictly PVE and is looking to bust the best sustained DPS possible.
This link should give you a good framework.
Specific numbers are mentioned in the threat at various points.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1117292-Arsenal-Bounty-Hunter-Are-YOU-Doing-It-Right
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It could be a second or two, and have a proc chance upon using jetboost. It can be tied to the sweltering heat talent. kind of like the sorc's overload root, except it would be shorter, cleansable, and/or not guarranteed to proc all the time.
That would make it exactly the same as the sage/sorcerer talent, and they seem to frown upon exact duplicates.
I think a better idea would be to change Pinning Fire from a snare to a root, which by itself would solve a lot of problems. Minimal Change, no need to change gear or rebalance abilities, just a simple change.
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I have not PVP'd with my gunny since 1.2.. I don't see how things could have changed that much for us in WZ.
I thought my gunny would be useless in OPS as well, but have been proven wrong.
At this point I am building a PVP toon, not quite sure what class that will be yet, and I am parking my 74 valor gunny and using him only for PVE OPS and dailies. It is sad because I love the toon.
Let me know when the situation changes.
Just respec Assault for PVP, I know it's a PITA but I do not see them fixing Gunnery anytime soon. Even then the changes would have to be fairly minor in order to keep it in line with their damage potential.
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I've heard that 8 sentinel/mara teams arent doing well but i dont see how they wouldnt. 8 different heal procs going off in roation, 8 vanishes. 8 group -wide speed boosts to rotate thruogh, berry mean damage, great utility, snares, healinbg debuffs. i dunno - im gonna give it a shot. I know thats off topic but w/e
We have run into them before, they do not close range well and cannot stop pushbacks. We peel off and keep them 1v1 and kiting as much as possible. Sure, they get their damage and kills in, but cannot deal with objectives. Assassins are much nastier as Force Speed, Guard, and Taunt are probably the most unbalancing effects in WZs and they have them all to go along with great CC and DPS.
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Agreed. I wasn't trying to imply that any tool could roll a Vanguard and win 1v1, but if you have 2 similarly skilled/geared players, I have no doubt that the Vanguard will beat the Commando every time - the interrupt alone gives them an advantage.
1v1, I typically beat the Assault VG, because they cannot close range more than once every 30 seconds, can cleanse the burns, and easily get them into Ammo problems. Only classes I have issues with 1v1 are Operative DPS (IRONY) and really good Marauders. Well Operative healers too, but that isn't so much a problem of them killing me, they can't, but me killing them.
However this isn't a 1v1 game, it is an objective based game. This is where the utility comes into play, VG has it and we do not.
Did a test last night on the PVP Dummy, noted that just spamming Hammer Shot was 700dps all by itself. Found that interesting.
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I'm sorry, but im very loyal to the idea that when talking damage vs damage, it doesn't really matter if you can do 30-50k more than the other guy by the end of the wz, but who can brin more utility/group friendly things to the wz,. im not suggesting you don't already know this but if you are in ranked rz just because you "out damage all but the best GS or VGs" then well.. I dont see a bright future for that particular team based soley on logic
Shrug 28-9 since Tuesday, I say we do OK.
We get beat by heavily stacked teams, but do OK against well rounded teams.
Our team is:
Watchman Sentinal
Watchman Sentinal
Tank Hybrid Shadow
Tank Hybrid Shadow
Assault VG
Assault Commando
Sage Hybrid
Scoundrel Healer
We consistently lose in Voidstar and Huttball to the 4x Operative Healer/4x Juggernaut team. Too much control and not enough healing debuffs on our side. GS would likely make this more winnable due to the healing debuff, but I do not think it would be more than a 20% win.
Lose to the 8x Assassin team in Novare since they can split 4/4 and dominate us with the speed that they move between nodes. Swapping me out for a GS or VG wouldn't help here, we'd still lose.
Stacked teams are really screwing around with Rated WZ, they're really bad against other stacked teams but wreck well balanced teams.
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The sad thing is, what you'd want from a gunnery commando is something gunslingers/snipers do better and it really leaves no reason to take one if you want to put together the best team you can.
Player should always be considered before class but if both players are good most teams will take the class that suits their needs better.
I have my spot in RWZ, because I out damage all but the best GS or VGs. I will state that while player > class, that I would be a ton more effective at the exact same role as a VG than as a Commando. I just do not have the patience, and neither does my team, for me to reroll VG and gear up again.
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Not even close mate. Vanguard owns Commando with the assault line. Assault is best, imo, for Commando as well, but a Vanguard has so much utility that Commando simply doesn't have.
azhrione did a great job above explaining why.
I won't say "owned", a lot of this is l2p stuff. I do not lose the damage/kill rate to Faceroll FOTM Vanguards/PT. A good one will still equal or beat me in numbers, so damage is not really the issue.
The real problem is objective based on utility. Their ability to have a much greater impact on the outcome of the game while STILL pumping out silly damage numbers is what makes them better.
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If your Crit is >35% then Power Augment is better since diminishing returns have kicked in for Crit.
If your Crit is <35% but >30% and your Bonus Damage is under 400/700 then Power Augment is better since bonus damage means more than Crit rate when you are that low. You should fix your gear before slotting anything though.
Any other time Aim > Power in terms of augments.
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I have been thinking about this. Everywhere i see people say that VG assault spec are better than commando. But isnt commando slightly better since they can reset HiB from 30m? I know VG's HiB reset skills are instant, but i find it better to do it from a distance. I have a lvl 25 VG assault spec, and i always have to go close combat to spam those 2 skills. 1 thing commando also got are self heals, and a pretty good knockback. Only thing i would miss from my VG are the ability to tank and my belowed harpoon... So what are your opinions of this matter?
Assault Vanguard has a lot going for it that we miss.
1> Harpoon - The ability to drag someone to them, even if on a long cooldown.
2> Taunts - Not as effective as in Shield Spec, but the effect upon survivablity is huge.
3> 100% Plasma Cell Proc on Ion Pulse.
4> Better Armor Pen rating on HiB.
6> Greater increases to elemental damage via talents.
7> More base attacks that are Elemental Based and thus ignore armor.
8> More stuns, one of which is an AE.
Those are huge advantages, and it turns Vanguard Assault into something of a faceroll. Commando Assault is not worse, just different and we do have some disadvantages. The primary differences are that our skill set is designed to keep enemies at range, and Vanguards is designed to keep them in melee range.
1> AE Knockback - Vanguard has Harpoon, we have Concussion Charge. It is a wash for all intensive purposes.
2> Spot Healing - This is a big deal even if we have huge induction times and high ammo costs. The ability to self heal is a big balancing factor, and is one of the reasons Commando does not have more utility.
3> Range - While Vanguards have a 100% proc rate on Plasma Cell and thus their snare, it is primarily designed to keep someone from running away from them. Ours is not 100% but is designed to keep them away from us or to allow kiting. Vanguard has to get close to do the most damage, if you can keep them at greater than 10m, then it really gimps their damage.
4> Tech Override - Yes it is a long cooldown, but it is something that really gives us an advantage for either an instant heal, instant plasma grenade, or instant Concussive Round.
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Hey guys, Im leveling a mercenary and I'd like to have some input as far as expertise goes. I've read several post that say to go with the fire tree but not real indication especially after the changes in 1.3. Please give me some critique or some pointers on this build. Thanks.
This is the build you want to have in PVP.
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#300MIkZZcGrrzhGMs.2
Stabilizers is required for PVP otherwise you cannot cast while getting beat on.
Upgrade Arsenal replaces Hired Muscle for only a single point.
Muzzle Fluting is an absolute must, otherwise Power Shot takes too long to cast.
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Since Ranked Warzones are coming in 1.3 and Commandos received a minor buff, what's their use in a Rated Warzone?
Player > Class
That being said Commandos and Mercs come into Rated WZs at a significant disadvantage in terms of DPS. Gunnery is a joke in PVP, with long inductions and an utter lack of mobility. Is it possible to PVP as Gunnery and be successful? Sure but it is going to be a heck of a lot harder to do it as opposed to a Gunslinger.
Assault is a little better off and the DPS output is borderline OP, the downside is that in Rated WZ you will be going up against stacked classes who hold all the trump cards. Vanguard is just flat out better in this spec with Harpoon, Taunts, 100% no cooldown Plasma Cell proc, and more elemental based attacks. Which means that any sane group takes an Assault Vanguard over an Assault Commando.
Right now the preferred Rated WZ group is going to look something like this:
Sentinel
Sentinel
Shadow Tank Hybrid
Shadow Tank Hybrid
Assault Vanguard
Lethality Gunslinger
Sawbones Smuggler
Hybrid Sage
You could potentially replace the Vanguard or Gunslinger with a DPS Commando, but the group suffers as a whole with the lost utility. Hybrid Sage could also be a CM Commando, but without the bubble or force speed, some maps are going to be really tough.
Just remember Player > Class but a great player playing a good class is going to trump one playing a bad class.
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On my BH-Merc I did a very heavy healing/dps build that made me nearly immune to death unless 3+ people got on me though dmg wasn't really sustainable. Last night after a bit more time I moved the build around a bit playing off the full auto synergy resetting high impact bolt. I dropped the crit which was my intention after gearing up because its so easy to get over the soft cap. I did a few test runs last night in pvp and was alot more mobile as incendiary round allows you to go right into a high impact bolt. Followed by a full auto to reset if I have time to plant and not chase someone you can easily go into grav round spam, high impact, and reset it with full auto and keep your dot up. I was pulling over 400k mostly single target, which normaly I haven't seen those numbers unless I was aoeing large packs of players before the nerf to mortar volley/death from above. Also in this build giving up the dmg boost on dots below 30% I think is somewhat made up for by charged barell and rotary cannon which tie into the whole synergy I was talking about earlier in this specific rotation. Anyways this is what I changed over to let me know what you think.
This build is silly, you are far better off going full Gunnery if you are investing all the way up to Rotary Cannon. Ammo management is a nightmare on this build because of the lack of Cell Charger. Sure you are going to get off a lot of HiB but the reality is that it is still roughly one every 15 seconds once you factor in the need to keep using Grav Round.
If you insist on sticking with it, then move the two points in Deadly Cannon to Tenacious Defense as Deadly Cannon is currently bugged and does not apply bonus damage to Full Auto. Also move Nightvision Scope to Parallatic Combat Stims, since one is an active, situational talent and the other is a passive and improves the worst aspect of the build, Ammo Management.
1.3 Ideal stats for arsenal?
in Commando / Mercenary
Posted
Your Surge and Crit are a bit high and your accuracy is low.
You really want your accuracy at 100% and preferably at 104% so you do not miss offhand ticks.
Your opener should be TM, the faster it stacks the better. Unload should only be used on proc.
Consider some of the newer 6/31/4 or 7/31/3 builds that work Alacrity into the mix. I believe in testing it takes you from 26 activations per minute (APM) to 32 APM, which is a significant increase in DPS.
7/31/3 Alacrity Build.
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/mercenary#2032-1f76d26e7le-d
6/31/4 Alacrity Build (experimental)
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/mercenary#1032-1f76d26e7le-9