Caceyn
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Youtube:
Watchmen
The Corsair
Jedi Shadow PvP
Ninth entry to the Shinarika PvP series that takes a whole new route. There are no standard 31/x/x specs in this video, only hybrids. Combining the aspects of Tutorial videos with Entertainment, the very video itself is a hybrid. Hope you enjoy and find the material useful. Stay tuned!
00:19-00:36 : 23/1/17 Introduction and Info
00:38-00:55 : 0/13/28 Introduction and Info
01:19-01:21 : Example 23/1/17 Spec
01:22-01:25 : Example 0/13/28 Spec
01:25-01:35 : 23/1/17 and 0/13/28 Rotations
Produced by PSI.
Edited by Shinarika.
Filmed by Shinarika.
0/13/28 "Arika": http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601ZhGbRZfbcRrrodc.1
23/1/17 "KC-Balance Hybrid": http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601rfMozrskZoZf0cRrM.1
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23/1/17
This is an awesome spec and probably the one I am going to use for rateds. This or my own personal 13/28 Balance-Infil hybrid. Now this spec is awesome. Think of it as a more mobile Kinetic. You have the defensives of KC, but you have more mobility and burst damage. You also get insta-force lift.
The trade off is TK and Slow time. Both, of which, are excellent abilities on their own, but it is a fair trade. This spec is very supportive to the team and can pump some good burst damage. I highly recommend it to anyone who's serious about rated play.
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0/13/28
Messing around trying to find new ways to entertain myself with my Shadow... I suddenly came up with this spec out of nowhere. I remember seeing it on "paper" and thinking "Oh gosh, that spec would perform awesome if I think it works the way I want it to!". Well, what a surprise... this spec more than fulfilled my expectations, it surpassed it.
This is a very high-damage dealing spec that features a multiple arsenal of attacks to keep you going and keep you going strong. FiB and Breach, both high internal damage (Yes, this spec utilizes Shadow Technique!) along with the SS proc... this spec is just a pure armour-penetrating build.
On top of the high and consistent damage, the force management is great! That's the other part that surprised me. You have so many buttons to press yet you're not force starved entirely. Granted, you must monitor your force like you would as any spec. I'm still working around getting used to this spec but I absolutely love it. The burst literally requires little to no setup and you have the ability to just keep going.
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I'm liking the Akira build, I think i'll try that out for a week or so and see how things go.
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WOW that's a lot of power. Not unlimited though
As of now, after a few hours of doing dailies and scrunching up enough for augmented gear, I have a total of 340 power and my accuracy is 101.93% LOL
I still can't hit 4k as of yet, but I've managed to hit 3.9k without the use of any buffs. My expertise has gone up to about 947 (up from 897) because I accidentally bought the gloves that I was going to use on the chestpiece. Oh well, just more farming
I'm going to have to take a look at the cannons you are talking about, though the hilt but be a problem unless I decide that I can lose 50 exp for more power. My surge is quite bad, around 67% or so and my crit chance is really low also (around 35%)
I think I spent around 500k credits today just increasing my power level and all. It's all worth it in the end though, but for PvP I'm going to have to bring my exp up to at least 1100 to be able to do anything at all.
You don't need anymore than about 1100 Exp. as Inf. Trust me, it won't make of a difference between being hit for 1200 vs. 1250/1300. You're still squishy, you're better off to hit them harder with more power.
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I just swapped factions to play with some friends on canderous ordo and my goodness the republic is horrible. All day long loosing streaks and teams of complete fail ruin the warzone experience. The republic players lack the knowledge of PvP basics, so let me educate the general public here.
TIPS:
1. Focus fire : When you come upon a battle, don't just pick a random target or purposefully choose a full health target. The most effective way to victory is to target an enemy who your teammates are already attacking. This makes a huge difference.
2. Healers : Healers cannot go unchecked. They need to be focus fired down or they need to be crowd controlled & interrupted. Unchecked healers on large fights will easily sway the outcome in the healers favor.
3. Organization : Don't just charge at a random objective after you die. Open your map to see where your team is and join them. You should generally move to a point you control and leave with your team to secure another point (leaving some to defend or at least one person to call incoming attacks)
4. Teamwork : Use buffs more than at the start of a WZ. Use your abilities to aid others. For example, throw out guards and taunts, use CC to try to save your teammates from dying. Do what is best for the team, not what will inflate your personal stats or get you medals....those things should come naturally.
5. Persistence : Do not give up hope. If you give up you sentence the rest of your team to carry your dead weight and it usually results in others giving up. Ultimately resulting in a WZ that is no fun. If you are going to loose, go down swinging. Talk to your team and organize attacks or defenses. DO NOT just all stack on the one point you control to rack up some defense medals before defeat.
6. CC & CC some more : Use your stuns, use your mez, use your root. Do not just let your cool downs sit un-used.
If your opponent is not under some form of CC and they do not have a full resolve bar. Hit them with something. If one team is constantly flinging out 4 second stuns, 10 second mezs, and rooting melee classes and the other team isn't, who do you think will win? Try to time them well, but given any 10 seconds in a battle, there are several prime opportunities to put CC to use.
(be careful not to waste your CC on some one who is already CC'd or has a full resolve bar)
7. Relics : Get some and use them! Use them all the time! Are you about to unload AoE's into a group of enemies? Relic. Are you about to Unload into a healthy target? Relic. Are you about to spam heal your buns off? Relic. They have short cool downs and you can start most of your fights out by clicking on one to gain an advantage over that poor SOB who doesn't use his.
Thank you. Please feel free to chime in with more warzone tips for the PvP impaired.
This is the problem with PvP in general...
1. Nice Zerg, way to show/have skill. After all you don't need it you've got 8 people beating on 1 person. If your team is really good you can zerg down 2 people at once!
2. See point 1.
3. See point 1. Yes, join your team because heaven forbid they can't do anything with out you or you without them...
4. Agreed
5. There is a point of no return, once you hit that...you might as well stack up.
6. This should be, use CC correctly.
7. Per captain obvious tips...lol, this is obvious.
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You'd be surprised. One of these specs I've tested has opened my eyes to new ideas.
31/31/31 is beastmode tho.
Inquiring minds want to know
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People seem to say power. At this point after a lot of testing, I'd agree. Now some are willing to sacrifice every single bit of crit for power - this I would not do. I will, however, let crit get to 25% or so in order to add more power. Certainly makes a huge difference.
Agreed, I like to have mine just because i'm anal about it to around 25% buffed. The rest into power.
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Afternoon all,
After spending much time with my current Shadow, I decided to hit the big reset button simply because I was not happy with the character or the look. Luckily, I had not developed an attachment, even if after leveling up to 35. Anyway, I have started another one this time with a purpose in mind, becoming a Jedi Shadow Ninja. My original Shadow, I had not made my mind up to which direction I wanted to go. Moreover, I was still learning how the skill tree works in conjunction with the character and its corresponding level. I now have a better understanding; however, I am still learning. This is far different that what I am use to in CoH/CoV. Below is the link to the build I intend to use. I would like it if you all would look at what I propose to do with my character and offer advice. Your input and critique are most welcome. Thank you in advance.
This build I wam going with Infiltration: (7/32/2 )
http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/jedi_consular/shadow/#::cfe11fe2fe2f5ef2ef6ef7ef15
Truthfully, the spec is junk.
2 points in Force Focus are a waste as you'll always be in Shadow Technique.
1 point in Misdirection needs to be 3.
2 points in Shadowy Veil need to be removed (it's junk for Inf.) and put into misdirection.
2 points in double bladed defense are a waste as you're dps not a tank, so you won't be clocking or parrying anything. You'd be better off putting those 2 points into expertise or elusiveness
2 points in situational awareness are useless as well.
http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/jedi_consular/shadow/#::e4fe4fe3fe2fe2f5ef2ef7ef7ef14
This is what I use and it hits like a truck when using Clairvoyant Strike (main attack), when using Force Breach, Shadow Strike, Spinning Strike, and Project...
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I would tend to disagree with most people in this thread.
I'm almost valor 79 atm, and just about to get my 4th war hero piece. Not bragging, just saying I've played a decent amount of hours pvping in all specs, including hybrids. Playing full balance right now (7/2/33).
Here are some of my thoughts:
* KC in DPS gear is the king of generalists. One of the best builds IF you're solo queueing. If, however, you're planning on rolling with proper 8-mans in rated warzones, you do not have a place there. Anything you can do, someone else can do better.
* If you're going kinetic, I would suggest doing it as a real tank, not a generalist with mediocre DPS and barely any tanking abilities. Get full tanking gear.
* Someone said Balance is just as squishy as infiltration. Not true. And not because of self heals, which are marginal at best, even with 2-piece force master set. The reason it's not is because you're a kiter. Constantly moving in and out of melee range. Maximizing your own DPS uptime while minimizing your opponent's. This isn't possible as infiltration.
* Balance is heavily oriented around objectives. 2 sec root which doesn't build resolve is excellent for killing people in fires, stopping sorcs/assassins trying to force speed away. Force in balance at 30m range is great for interrupting multiple people capping a node, especially as you can place it behind a node if someone is LOSing.
* Placing dots on everybody is a crappy strategy for killing people. It doesn't really put that much pressure on a team since you'll be hurting people for a few hundred dmg at a time. You'll also run out of force really fast. Put dots on the 3 people you hit with FIB, for the force regen if you like... but your time is better spent focusing down a single target.
* Infiltration sucks. No reason to ever take one over any other DPS class. Burst isn't that amazing. If you can't kill someone on your first rotation you're basically screwed. I will kill you in seconds as Balance with something like 70% of my HP remaining. You're also utterly predictable, and have basically no utility.
* Kinetic is the best 1v1 class out of the three, and I would place balance at second place. I can kill most anybody in a good 1v1 situation, exceptions being really good tanking assassins, marauders and some pyrotech PTs.
Ultimately, play what you like. I suggest you try everything and sort of figure things out on your own. These are just my opinions and they're just as worthless as anyone else's.
I VERY rarely if ever get beat by a balance shadow as inf. Balance burst is nothing compared to Inf and I gib them all the time in 3 globals max if my cool downs are available. If they're all down, yes Balance will win. Even if I have half my cool downs i'm looking at better than a 80% win against them.
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Okay some I'm curious again with the 7/31/3. This is how I set it up
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601Mc0MZhGMRkG0rtzZc.1
Is that looking about right? My dps was pretty horrible though. I'm in pvp gear bm shield, stalker head, chest, legs. recruit gear on left and belt and tank orange gear on hands and feet.. So I got alot of gear building and my first attempt was only like 650.... It was my first time out of 31/0/10 though and didn't get much chance to play with it.
I don't think I read anywhere in this topic that we can't claim dmg in this from spinning strike since the op dummy doesnt drop below 30. Has anyone took a reading during a real boss? Also I am curious on the parses what is lightning strike?
Your spec is ok, though it depends on if you are PVP or PVE for the spec to work correctly:
PVP: Remove the 2 points in Expertise and put it in Elusiveness. The increase in survivability with a 20sec Force Speed and 45 sec. CD for Resilience is huge in PVP, worth much more than 25% chance to do 6% more damage
* Play style: The 2 points in situational awareness move to Celerity. The 2 points in Kinetic Field move to fade.
With my gear currently : 1520 WP, 71% surge, 30% crit, and 480 power. Against non-tanks i'll hit with CS for 1200-1400. Project between 4-4.5k, and FB over 4.5-5k, SS: 4k, spin strike: 4700
Jugs and Tank Shadows: about 30% less than that.
play style in pvp is essentially using cs as much as possible because you're effectively a chainsaw chewing through people. People don't last long with this spec when using CS. You aren't forced to burst someone down to kill them. CS against non-tanks is unhealable. The only issue is force management if you decide not to burst them down.
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If they pop Guarded and they have no resolve at all...you CC them, they pop cc break, you cc/kb/mez them again. That will fill their resolve but they've been stopped. Also, as noted if they pop guarded at 10% health, you only need to 5% (roughly 1-2k damage) and they're dead. If they pop guarded at anything above 10% you just effectively had them nuke themselves and you're even more ahead. Hence why I said originally, keep the resolve as low as possible.
To add more to my post, you're going to have to sit there and bang with them until they pop it. If you're going toe to toe with them it sounds counter intuitive to do that but as I mentioned before it's the only thing you can do. If they go into a ravage/MS, don't turn and run from them...run strait through them. So many times I see people try and soak that damage or back peddle. If you see that channel, run strait.
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Let me ask you Maras/Sent something, do you pop Guarded/Undying at 80% hp? right, you wait until you're very low on hp to achieve maximum damage reduction for its duration.
Now, in the time it took us to force you into that low hp range that you had to pop Guarded/Undying, did you stand there admiring the view? right you were beating the hell out of me with your various high damage hitting attacks as well you should.
You guys keep saying to CC you when you pop Guarded/Undying but the only problem with that argument is that I'll be dead or near death by the time you actually were considering using it. Somehow I'm supposed to have survived that long in the fight without filling your resolve bar? yeah right, unless you're a terrible Mara/Sent that will never happen. If I don't use stuns, knockbacks, push, or other abilities to keep you off me I don't stand a chance. There's no other defensive ability that will allow me to live through your burst damage without adding to your resolve, aside from roots which most classes aside from slinger/snipers don't have.
Let's assume for the sake of argument that somehow I'm still alive and your resolve bar isn't full yet, and I have managed to bring your hp down and force you to pop Undying, I CC you when you use it, what's to keep you from popping your CC break, AFTER you pop undying? right you keep leaving that small detail out, that you have a CC break ability. Then you proceed to finish me off doing full damage while attacks hit you for 1-2 damage.
Undying/Guarded is the problem, no class should be able to reduce incoming damage by that much without penalty. Losing 50% of your already low hp isn't a penalty, it just guarantees you will stay alive for another 6 seconds to finish off the other player. It's the Paladin bubble all over again only Blizzard had the sense to reduce your damage by 50% when it's up. You have no such limitations.
If they pop Guarded and they have no resolve at all...you CC them, they pop cc break, you cc/kb/mez them again. That will fill their resolve but they've been stopped. Also, as noted if they pop guarded at 10% health, you only need to 5% (roughly 1-2k damage) and they're dead. If they pop guarded at anything above 10% you just effectively had them nuke themselves and you're even more ahead. Hence why I said originally, keep the resolve as low as possible.
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I've read the all the threads (all 30 pages) in this topic and there are parts where i think some people are giving the marauder/sent a 31/31/31 spec like they do with KC/Darkness shadows.
Point in fact as I do play a Inf/Dec shadow (the real dps tree of shadow/assassin) is this from MY point of view:
Cliff Notes: Seriously, learn how to beat them 1v1 and quit calling for nerfs...nerfs only hurt a game. As another melee DPS (INF/DEC) , CD for CD the marauder/sent is a better AC currently do to its survivability and increased utility it brings to an Op or rated team when compared directly to the Inf/Dec shadow/assassin.
The 5 second 99% damage that sents/marauders have is fine. All AC's have a method of controlling this: Stun, KB, Mez, slow, or other combination of the sort in their AC. The key to beating all sents/marauders 1 v.1 is forcing them to pop their cool downs EARLY and to keep their resolve low so when they do start using them you can counter. Sounds easier than it is in reality or in the ebb and flow of a PvP battle.
My biggest problem with this AC (again from the dps tree of shadow/assassin NOT the OP tank version) is the bubble they get that refreshes itself and stays up for 15 seconds if being continually hit by a melee attack that causes damage to the person hitting them not sure what its called) When that is used while i'm on them, i'm done for. The only option I have for that is to stealth and stay away until its down for the next "X" number of seconds. The only issue to doing that though for it to work, I must have 2 cool downs available. 1 - force cloak so I can go invisible, and 2 - reslience so I can cleanse the dots (depending on spec). If i don't have those available, i'll be popped out of stealth and they're back on me at which point i'm then left with stuns and/or KB which I try to save for other CD's of theirs.
As another melee who must get into the thick of things to do my damage, I do not have the survivability that Sents do...plain and simple.
Those calling for Nerf's, understand this:
1. The up time/ToT that a sent/marauder has on ANY target is very high.
2. They do as much sustained damage as any other dps AC in the game...contrary to popular belief its not as high as some would suggest it is....training dummies aren't a good indicator of DPS for any class.
3. The sheer number of cool downs they have to get out of trouble or to stay in the fight longer is amazing, and played by the right person is in truth awesome to watch.
As a bonus, those saying this is the new FOTM, please understand that you're perpetuating a self-fulfilling prophecy by continually stating this.
Again, just my opinion...
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There was a guide laying around the internet listing all the locations for the Willpower/Endurance Datacrons but for the life of me i cannot seem to find it again.
Does anyone have a link or remember where it was?
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This is new.
Been getting some requests about testing certain specs. (Mainly Hybrids)
What I'll do is take your spec for a test run and let you know how it performs.
Post your build here, the rotation you use and the preferable gearing.
Thanks.
Current Builds:
26/0/15
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200MsrszMskRZZf0cRr.1
-Shurijo
*Currently Testing
22/3/16
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#60...ckZRZfMoRr0z.1
-proteuzz
*Currently Testing
0/21/20
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601ZGGr0kMM0zZfMcRrMz.1
-Yallow-X
*Currently Testing
If you could try this one:
7/31/3
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601McMZhGrRkhMbtzZc.1
Same gearing/rotation as you would with any Inf.
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Youtube:
Watchmen
The Corsair
Jedi Shadow/Sith Assassin Guide
The ultimate Jedi Shadow/ Sith Assassin guide to PvP. Updated for 1.2, this segment is jam-packed with information to cover almost every aspect of this class. From learning to spec to understanding how to use your abilities, this montage sees to it that you perform at the top notch of your ability. Hope you enjoy the education and find the material useful. Stay tuned!
00:19-00:39 : Ability Codex
00:40-01:33 : Kinetic Combat Introduction, Rotation, Tips, Focus and Gear
01:34-02:09 : Infiltration Introduction, Rotation, Tips, Focus and Gear
02:10-02:45 : Balance Introduction, Rotation, Tips, Focus and Gear
02:47-03:15 : Gear Setup for All Specs
03:16-04:57 : Example Fights for All Specs
04:58-05:16 : Example Specs for All Specs
Produced by PSI.
Edited by Shinarika.
Filmed by Shinarika.
Balance: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601McZRZfMfRrMkrfz.1
Infiltration: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#6010MZhGbRkGMbtzZf0c.1
Kinetic: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601rcrozrskrsZZf0cM.1
Additional
Ability Descriptions: http://jedi.well-of-souls.com/abilities_consular.html
Gear/Character Check: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/
Nice video as always, and I must say that i've learned a lot from you regarding "rotation/priority" etc. The only thing I disagree with on this though is the spec that you use for Inf. Like you I stared using the 2/31/8 spec from the beginning, and I absolutely loved the burst potential that it has.
My problem with it though is when setting up for burst. I essentially have a 45% chance to do an extra 2-2.5k damage every 10 seconds due to upheaval. Instead of putting my points into upheaval I did this spec:
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#601McMZhGrRkhMbtzZc.1
What i've found out by using that spec instead is that I lose the burst potential (yes I know burst is king in PVP) with the extra rock, I gain though about 4-500 extra white damage per CS. In that same cool down time of 10 seconds I'm not doing about 2.6k-3.3k of guaranteed damage. I also gained additional survivability by the decrease in cool downs for resilience and force speed. Against tank armor that i'm trying to chew threw like vanguards/KC shadows i'm hitting much harder and its almost a winable scenerio for me.
Now, my gear is no where near what yours is, i'm just BM with a the Force Healer earpiece. I would imagine with your gear levels you would do even more and it would make the numbers even better. Here is my gearing below for your comparison.
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/749a9239-675e-4f1f-805a-91419afaebe7
If you could give it a try and let me know your thoughts on it i'd appreciate it.
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Infiltration spec in 50 pvp? A rare bird you is. I bet snipers love you.
As a partial War Hero, I actually enjoy snipers. They fall fairly quickly to me.
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Here is my first parse - would appreciate feedback on why my dps is so low, lol
Spec: 2/31/8 http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/Shadow#20-1vc2k18e2k-30f
Gear: Full rakata http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/f141fd6e-3e98-4222-8f30-30c8f82b29b2
Stims: None
Buffs: Consular only
Dps: 1030 dps over a 6 minute fight (12:44:31 - 12:51:18)
Parse: http://www.torparse.com/a/5881
going to try the other inf build and skip project and see what happens
edit:
ok new spec
spec: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/Shadow#2032-1vc2k18e2k-3
parse: http://www.torparse.com/a/5923 (13:22:56-13:27:15) 1041 dps
No stims, though i'm not sure it would have a 100dps increase without using stims. it could though. Thanks for the test though, it confirms what i'd thought for a while.
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Intro:
This is a proposed change to the Sage/Sorc AC DPS/Kiting, as I feel 1.2 fails to make our class viable @ PvP (once ranked is deployed) and PvE (in some ways). The focus is PvP and is a constructive thread made for proposals, not conjecture or opinion on how un-/powerful we are or L2P issues. I have played standard (3/7/31), hybrid (0/23/18), modified standard (2/11/28; 0/13/28) and have been playing since launch on this character only. I have a mix of BM/Rakata gear and I feel I have a good grasp of my flaws and strengths when compared to other characters, but with 1.2 the balance seems lop-sided.
I tried to give 1.2 a chance. I still have my AoE/CC damage, which looks good on a leaderboard, but realistically it feels like I am Brock Lesner’s backhoe tire, and “other” classes have his sledgehammer and pounding me with it. This was not the case pre 1.2 and was not due to the change in PoM proc. The buffs other classes got, along with the already inflated cc, have severely crippled Sages/Sorcs. It has gotten players to the point that most are quitting/rerolling or stubborn as hell and enduring the beatings (I am the latter). It is pretty obvious that 1.2 has made our survivability suspect, at best. With the mass re-rolls and somewhat “unwarranted” nerfs some classes were subject to makes me highly doubtful I can use my Sage will be viable in Ranked. This is just background to understand my proposed changes.
Problems (the good; the bad; the ugly):
-Sages/Sorcs were overpowered from the PvP damage output perspective: We needed a nerf, and I think another is required. I will explain more on this later.
- Our skill trees are incorrectly balanced from a role perspective: The “shared tree” is not really shared and the other two have misguided skills for the role. I thought game mechanics would have made us kiting DoTers (Balance Tree), burst DPS/Off-DPS (TK Tree) or healers (Seer Tree), but we can’t get enough in a single tree to excel at any of these. Since this was not addressed before 1.2, our flaws are now even more evident, given the nerfs and buffs that took place.
-We have no defensive CD/threat generator, but too much CC: Seems like most classes have at least one DFCD, and some with more depending on skill tree or class. There are none for our class. Our CC is the main contributor to the OP’d threads. It just so happens some of the CC is directly attached to our AoE, which is a problem.
-Most of our attacks are Force based but are kinetic damage: We have very few ways to initiate internal damage. Since we are heavy force-users, lore and role dictates that most of our attacks should be internal types and also takes armor rating out of the equation.
Proposed Changes (Can we get some of the dogmatic view of the Jedi Counslars?)
Tree Changes:
1. Swap “Two Disciplines” from the Shadow/Sin balance tree with “Assertion” from the Sage/Sorc balance tree (both are on the same tier anyway): This will give us some melee bonus on each “Project” (more on this later). This should be an easy change since it is a “shared tree”.
2. Swap “Kinetic Collapse” from the TK tree, for “Psychic Suffusion” and move that high in the TK tree: This gives more decisive need to spec high in TK for max DPS and gives Seers a better tool for survival while healing.
3. Change “Mind Ward” to ALL ATTACKs, but nerf it to max reduction @10% instead of 14%: This will help the balance tree in kiting/tanking aspirations.
4. Get rid of “Rescue” and make “Force Pull” a lower threat friendly on the seer tree and “Force Push” on the balance tree that generates high threat and “small perks” if the attackers hit someone else (an effective taunt): If we want to kite, then we need a threat generator.
5. Add a “Double Strike/Sabre Strike” talent on the TK tree: How much and what tier? Eh!! Maybe 20% and tier 3 or 4. It gives incentive to spec in the TK tree.
6. Revisit all Sage/Sorc skill trees because they are not really role defining (except maybe the Seer tree): I could go on for days about the trees, but for length considerations, I will leave it at that.
Talent Changes:
1. Nerf our AoE DAMAGE OUTPUT by 30%, and change Force in Balance to a Kinetic attack: The PoM proc was causing the issue, but if you reduce the damage on ANY PoM proc’d attack, then the number would have fell in line better. Say “instant activate, but decrease damage by 30% over a straight activated one”. As a whole, AoE is much more valuable to prevent caps/plants, but the damage made our numbers outlandish on PvP leaderboards and still does to a degree.
2. Change Mind Crush to an internal attack and Disturbance to an elemental attack and buff them 20%, and take out the “root” requirement: Mind Crush should have NOTHING to do with armor rating (unless by “mind crush” you mean sticking your head in a force-vise). It should be an attack on the person’s mind; not their head, and would fall more in-line with the lore of consulars. Only mental resistance talents that are spec’d out or talents should mitigate a withering of the mind. The Disturbance animation is a “lightning ball” so make it an attack that can only be shielded with generators or redirected/mitigated with talents.
3. Give us a talent like “Deflection” on a 2min CD: Deflection is in the Shadow/Sin pool, and should be an easy add.
4. Lock “Tumult” to Sage/Sorc only, unlock “Tumult” so we can use it against other players and buff “Tumult” 50%, increase the CD on “Tumult” to 90 sec, and keep the incapacitated requirement as is on “Tumult”: Whew!!! It’s a lot, but did I mention changes to “Tumult” are long overdue. I mean seriously. We already have limited attacks (as some call us “one-button wonders”). Why not open us up to more melee, if the range is eliminated. This could be our “Neo, matrix style, nuke” but it still would require a stunned opponent and good timing to connect (saying a breaker is available to the opponent and they are willing to use it).
5. Increase the CD of ALL CC (Force Wave, Force Stun, Force Lift)abilities by 20 Sec: This will need to be the tradeoff since it would appease the “Sage/Sorc CC is too much” crowd (resolve makes our CC ineffective at a certain point, but whatev…)
Conclusion
These are just observations and suggestions I have come up with. Overall I feel these changes will not cause an “overperformance” as BW calls it, and all classes can live with these. Even if BW implemented a few of these, our Quality of Life would greatly improve and also make us more viable for rated warzones. Even if it is just for a trial, I encourage BW to do it.
If you want to add or change ideas, feel free, but like I said comment on why the idea is bad; not anything else. I want to keep this 100. I can accept my ideas being critiqued, but fanboy; class bashing is not what this thread is about. Come correct, or don’t come at all…
TL: DR
1. Increase our kiting abilities.
2. Give us a defensive CD and a threat generator on long CD’s (aka better defense on the balance tree).
3. Nerf our AoE DMG output further.
4. Give us more attack types: Internal v Kinetic (better single target DPS).
5. Increase our CC CD’s (which are a bit much).
Let me preface my reply by stating I play an Inf Shadow and have from day 1. Currently valor 65, ALL received via WZ's.
Your thread has some merit, but some of the abilities you're speaking about would also affect the shadow/sin tree as they're baseline abilities for Consular/Inq
1. Tumult I can think of no reason for a mage/force wielding ranged class to have a melee ability Your proposed change here would give Sage/Sorc access to talents already in the Shadow//Sin tree effectively giving Inf/Deception 2 kicks with different cool downs one in stealth the other not, and Kenetic/? (forgot Sith tree name) 2 kicks all of which are available out of stealth. - Tumult would make Shadow OP and Kenetic even more OP than it already is.
2. CC: Increasing the CD on the stun timer, nerfs Inf/Dec. As it is we're the squishiest melee class in the game. When we go to cloak, if we don't want to get popped from it we need to use our resiliance along with it. Killing our stun timer would decrease the already pathetic survivability of the Inf/Dec tree.
3. Doublestrike/Saber Strike. Refer to what I said about tumult. There is no reason to have a force wielding ranged caster with a melee ability. That is crossing pretty close to the inf/dec tree.
4. Deflection: Again, this is a talent that comes from Shadow/Sin. I'll trade you your bubble for my deflection. It's a 50% increase to defense, not an blanket barrier to receiving damage. In other words, adding deflection would make the defenses of sage more OP than they already are.
At the end of the day, there is nothing really wrong with the CC and/or damage that Sages do from my perspective though you disagree. The only thing that I would do if I were going to change something about sage/sorc is I would make it so an AOE will not keep someone from capping a node but that affects multiple classes, not just sages.
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Play any Melee class.
You do that in a split second regardless of player gear.
Mercs get one big hit on you and then you kill them within 15 seconds before another HS can be fired.
Oohh sorry you took some damage for a second.
Delete the Paladin bubbles from Marauders and Sentinels then we'll talk.
If you're crying about Mercs, the least survivable of any class in the game atm, then you're absolutely horrendous at PvP.
If you wanna talk least survivable, try playing an Inf/Deception Shadow/Assassin
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Smoking dope if you think people actually PUG anymore. It's all premades now, meaning if no premades are on, no PvP at all.
Actually, I pug all the time...even since patch 1.2 went live.
Of the 50ish battles i've been in. I've won 11. That was the first day or so, not one this weekend, not one healer this weekend in any wz i've been in, and sents and knights, and their counter parts are tearing stuff up.
This from most likely the only inf shadow left on the server that PVP's.
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I just wasted 30 minutes of my life playing my level 42 Sage after the 1.2 update. Was trying to get past my class quest opponents of 1 Strong level 38, 1 Strong level 37 and 2 level 38's... Couldn't keep my companion alive long enough for him to do any damage and couldn't do any myself. Never had any problem at all until tonight. Go ahead and flame on me that I'm not any good at the game; whatever; I never claimed to be, but I would like to be able to make it through the class quests and play the story when I'm 4 levels above the enemies....
But I guess noone will listen to me since I'm one of the invaluable subscribers that haven't reached level 50 even though I've been a constant subscriber since day 1.
Really BW? My server's dead (3 guild members on out of 438 tonight), my class is dead, and everyone on the forums say I should have stuck it our and made it to 50 for the free month... Really....?
What was the class quest? I remember a class quest like that on Belsavis I believe. Granted I was playing as a Shadow(inf) my problem was my healer couldn't keep me up. The way I solved it was by using my CC and playing like my class is supposed to be played instead of the mind numbing hack and slash it was until then. I believe the class quest was Attis Station or something along those lines.
I wound up soloing it, but I did die a few times before I finally wised up.
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It's not bugged, just overrated. PvE gear will still find a place. Silly BW, you fail yet again.
Care to elaborate?
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This.
I use far more keys on my tank spec than infiltration or balance. Mainly because of taunt/guard. I still have to use all the attacks too...
They are all key bound, there is no "rotation" since a good tank will use a priority system.
um...I'm an Inf...what makes you think i don't taunt? It's a baseline skill. If you're referring to FB, I still use it as well.
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I have seen this repeated a lot of times on PvP threads, well...
...Using Potency -> Project -> Force Breach...
...If you have Upheaval is a waste because you spend one charge of Potency on the lesser 2nd Chunk most of the time, instead you should always use FB 1st:
Potency -> Force Breach -> Project
That way you get the max of your Potency's high crit chance.
With gear you get 3 charges of FP so all 3 will crit.
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Anyone who still plays infiltration has got guts. Nice job!
I prefer Inf over Kenetic...the way I figure it my "defense" comes in my ability to burst someone down so quickly my short(lack of) cool down's won't matter.
Shinarika - Shadow Breaker [Ultimate Jedi Shadow/Sith Assassin Guide]
in Shadow / Assassin
Posted
FWIW, you're about 3 weeks behind me. I loved Shadow and the concept behind this game, but BW has successfully screwed it to the point i'm not going to pay to play anymore. Like you, Rateds, cross server queuing (PvP and PVE), poor economy, and lack of anything original (aside from Space AIDS) is what did it.