Premades ruin PvP

[Skummy]

10 hours ago, TmoneyTime said:

You know what's cool. The Devs have already solved this problem by putting in the battle record. The harsh truth is that people that are complaining are not good at PVP. Its a simple fact. As you can see in the below screen shot if somehow your not winning more then loosing its all on you. You are the one common player in each pvp map you play. I only que solo and a 66% winrate with a class that is considered bottom tier is proof  enough. Also some of those games I trolled in cause that's just a thing I do for fun.

 

I'll say it again, the really top end PVP players have spent more time parsing, researching, learning than you have. I have probably more time parsing than most of the people on here have in actual PVP. Sometimes you just have to accept that your not playing correctly and change it or keep the same status quo.

 

https://imgur.com/a/yXyV6Ac

Yea you right idk what im doing at 70% winrate im just imagining p2w korean elements in an american mmo. kekw https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1020659784174813247/1082823082982527108/Screenshot_2023-03-07_16_29_52_012676.jpg Looking up a youtube videos so much research, taking 11mil dmg every game is normal ive took 20mill b4, But hey you're right a new player will do the same going against a team  stacked with geared players. Good take!👍💪 

 

 

Think the mmo you looking for is bdo.

 

 

Edited March 10, 2023 by Skummy

[AwesomeTacoCat]

13 hours ago, TmoneyTime said:

You know what's cool. The Devs have already solved this problem by putting in the battle record. The harsh truth is that people that are complaining are not good at PVP. Its a simple fact. As you can see in the below screen shot if somehow your not winning more then loosing its all on you. You are the one common player in each pvp map you play. I only que solo and a 66% winrate with a class that is considered bottom tier is proof  enough. Also some of those games I trolled in cause that's just a thing I do for fun.

 

I'll say it again, the really top end PVP players have spent more time parsing, researching, learning than you have. I have probably more time parsing than most of the people on here have in actual PVP. Sometimes you just have to accept that your not playing correctly and change it or keep the same status quo.

 

https://imgur.com/a/yXyV6Ac

This is a terrible argument. On the toons that I almost exclusively solo que on I also have 60-70% win rate because I can hard carry. But many of my losses are to premades. That’s to say, if I didn’t have to constantly face premades, I’d probably be closer to 80-85%. It’s not fair that I have to play against these premades and for my win share to go down. 
 

I also played about 30 arenas last season in groups of 3-4 and went 30-0. Never lost. And only 1 of those 30 games was remotely interesting, which is why I mostly solo que. 
 

I and the others pleading to have separate ques just want balanced matches. That’s it. And that’s really not too much to ask for…

Edited March 10, 2023 by AwesomeTacoCat

[Glower]

Look at this sh*t. Pathetic.

https://imgur.com/GwrLncq

[Skummy]

Wow shocking. They should probably remove the solo part then, And add a lfg tool like every other mmo. Instead of shouting in general like its 2011. All my friends quit after they removed 8v8 ranked. I should of left too but im dumb. There was actually pvpr's queing 8v8, There was even premade lowbies. Nobody seemed to complain then. But yea wierd a mmo promotes grouping such a wierd concept. Only theirs problems, What happens when the game is ded like it is now. What happens when bolster doesn't work and theirs gearing issues? I used to log in to harbinger and bastion in 2.0 on pub fleet and there were 1000's of ppl doing things at 2am pst now its a ghost town. 

Edited March 11, 2023 by Skummy

[DeannaVoyager]

1 hour ago, Skummy said:

Wow shocking. They should probably remove the solo part then, And add a lfg tool like every other mmo. Instead of shouting in general like its 2011. All my friends quit after they removed 8v8 ranked. I should of left too but im dumb. There was actually pvpr's queing 8v8, There was even premade lowbies. Nobody seemed to complain then. But yea wierd a mmo promotes grouping such a wierd concept. Only theirs problems, What happens when the game is ded like it is now. What happens when bolster doesn't work and theirs gearing issues? I used to log in to harbinger and bastion in 2.0 on pub fleet and there were 1000's of ppl doing things at 2am pst now its a ghost town. 

 

We have lfg tool like every other mmo, it's called group finder. Or activity finder. Not sure which one it's called these days but same thing. It's used by solo players when they want to do group content, but don't want to overcomplicate things. 

 

I remember quitting lowbie pvp because of premades.  The only reason I didn't come to complain here was because lowbies are now worthless anyhow. I used to play it a lot when we got warzone comms to buy gear when we hit max level. That's gone several patches and levels ago. I only did lowbies because I enjoy casual pvp. Once the enjoyment part was taken away with premades on the other side, it was easy to quit pvp completely.  With 7.2 and pvp revamp I was hoping to be able to pvp again, but doesn't seem so.

[krackcommando]

4 hours ago, DeannaVoyager said:

I remember quitting lowbie pvp because of premades.  The only reason I didn't come to complain here was because lowbies are now worthless anyhow. I used to play it a lot when we got warzone comms to buy gear when we hit max level. That's gone several patches and levels ago.

😄 lowbie pvp was so broken, and I miss it!

back in the day, before every profession was homogenized, cybertech was the prof that manufactured 3 of the 4 pieces that went into moddable armor, and there was a new "mod/armoring/barrel/enhancement" tier every two levels. I used to discover purple schems in the exact stats I wanted and insert them every two level. it didn't matter who was in the queue.  I was auto attacking ppl to death (hyperbole but you get the point). it was just fun. discovering all kinds of wacky stat distribution schems was fun. and creating armor and mods was useful and unique while level. I miss that. not sure what the problem ppl had with professions or if BW just decided to muck with them, but they were never as fun after 1.x.

 

[DeannaVoyager]

46 minutes ago, krackcommando said:

😄 lowbie pvp was so broken, and I miss it!

back in the day, before every profession was homogenized, cybertech was the prof that manufactured 3 of the 4 pieces that went into moddable armor, and there was a new "mod/armoring/barrel/enhancement" tier every two levels. I used to discover purple schems in the exact stats I wanted and insert them every two level. it didn't matter who was in the queue.  I was auto attacking ppl to death (hyperbole but you get the point). it was just fun. discovering all kinds of wacky stat distribution schems was fun. and creating armor and mods was useful and unique while level. I miss that. not sure what the problem ppl had with professions or if BW just decided to muck with them, but they were never as fun after 1.x.

 

Yep, and I made hundreds of millions with some old crafted mods in 6.x because those mods had absorb as tertiary stat. Most ops were scaled to 70, and stats were capped with them so you could afford weird mods with more stats. I also used to craft myself lowbie gear when I played pvp, although not every two levels. Those were the good old days.

[Visue]

Premade should only queue against premades. 

Premade v. pug is an unfair advantage and not fun to play.

[XioaMei]

yep they need to filter group ques to fight other group ques. if you que as a group you should be matched against another group que no matter how long or even if you get a match. Only let solo Ques fight against other solo ques. But lets be honest boiware don't really care!!!

[Tiffanitte]

     I apologize in advance for the lengthy post. I do not post very often at all, though I do read these posts a lot.

 

     If you remember, Open world PVP was a thing on servers, like Jung Ma, which was a RP/PvP server. This was before Bioware made PvP it's own instance that you have to CHOOSE. Before that, Open world PvP slowly over the years became a breeding ground for Bullying and Harassment. Thank Gawd Bioware put an end to that. For that, I thank Bioware immensely. But now we have a new breeding ground for Bullying and Harassment -- Premades that que for regular WZs knowing (9 out 10 times) they will get a Pug enemy team.  They know this and their intentions is to bully and humiliate the Pug team. There's this que for "Issue Challenge" which is exclusively for Premades of various sizes. However, this feature for the most part goes ignored (dust and cobwebs are on this que button). This Issue Challenge que is a FAIR fight, and players do not want a FAIR fight. Players seem to want the unfair advantage, so they que regular WZs. Sadly this Premade invasion of regular WZs becomes a Bullying and Harassment FEST. Sure, the Premade is having fun, laughing at players on the Pug side, capping all the nodes, and camping the spawn zone. Meanwhile, the Pug team is feeling bullied, harassed, humiliated, helpless, frustrated, VICTIMIZED, upset and angry. When these solo quers encounter too many Premades, it makes them feel a sense of futility to continue doing WZs. Why should one group of players get to enjoy WZs and another not? Not everyone has the time to become elite, and super skilled, and competitive. I have heard the cracker jack excuses from the hard core players, like, L2P, get better, or make friends. They justify their bullying by giving out such cracker jack excuses. Not everyone plays the game 24/7, most players have lives, families, jobs. They log in to have a little fun on their free time. To get Bullied in a WZ by a Premade isn't fun and only makes a person simply log out. Who the hell wants to bullied in a video game? It's supposed to fun. When I have played WZs where it's a Pug v Pug, the match is super fun. Sometimes it's so close that when either side wins, everyone is walking away feeling good. The Issue Challenge que is ignored because folks actually want to humiliate a Pug team with a Premade. I have to assume that's why they que regular WZs -- to Bully. It's a perfect way to Bully and/or take out anger on innocent players. Premades vs. Pugs have become the new Open World PvP Bullying breeding grounds.   

It's just more Bullying. 

Make a Solo Que only que please.

 

     The other thing I wanted to address is personal bullying and harassment of a player in a WZ. I am not talking about healers cause they expect to be focus targeted and harrased, it comes with the job. I am talking about a dps player being bullied and harrased. Whether it's random choice or because maybe you melted them down when they were being dps'd by another player and got butthurt, there's some players who spend the whole WZ on ONE player, harassing them and bullying them. Killing them over and over and over again throughout the WZ, usually on a Stealth class who has lots of CCs. Sometimes a Tag team of stealths  bully and harass one player for the whole WZ. The chat box proves they are, when all you see is that person defeating you and no one else, or the tag team's names. I have become a victim of that on occasion. These players will not leave you alone, the follow you wherever you go, wait for you at the respawn point, and even if you try to hide, the find you, all the way to the edges of the map where no objectives are even close by. Why do they they do this to a player? Why Bully like this? I have no idea other than this person is a jerk. This behavior is unacceptable. They know they can get away with Bullying cause it's PvP, you know, and you are supposed to kill players. They hide behind the guise of PvP to bully and harass players. That was the same excuse they use in Open World PvP when they'd hide in stealth waiting for players doing dailies to enter into their web. It's PvP they'd say. It made Bullying legal. I think there should be an easier way to report these toxic bullying players. Maybe a drop down on their portrait, ->report harassment and a reason box, and a copy of the chat box progress for the whole WZ copied and sent to Bioware. Thank gawd there's only a handful of these jerks. On a side note, I brought this up because I was in a Void Star WZ the other day, and I saw this Merc who was being attacked constantly by this stealth tag team and I saw this poor Merc keep saying in Say Chat, "Stop Harrassing me." I whispered her later and she said that this tag team wouldn't stop, they followed her everywhere, ignoring the doors and other players. I watched them even follow her in stealth all the way back to window (waaaaay back from the doors) where she was trying to cut a break and they killed her there too. She was being bullied for sure and I felt bad for her. She did leave the WZ, of course. Who wouldn't? She said she didn't know these bullies and that she had no idea why they were picking on her. It's not the first time. It has happened to me too on occasion. This toxic behavior probably stems from Premades who get away with bullying Pugs, so why not take the toxicity to a higher level, cause you know, it's PvP, right. Just make it easier to report these players for this toxic behavior of bullying one player only thru the entire WZ. I play a Madness /Lighting  Sorc, and I know what it's like to get picked on. There has to be penalties for this kind of bullying. It has to stop.

 

     The PvP weekly has as a reward,  2000 Tech Fragments, and 3 Legendary Embers and other stuff. The PvP Daily has 300 Tech Fragments, 1 Legendary Ember. You get to do the weekly 3 times and the daily 7 times. So, that's 6000 Tech Frags, 9 Embers for all 3 weeklies combined. 2,100 Tech Frags, 7 Embers if you do the daily for the entire week. Grand total - 8,100 Tech Frags, 16 Embers. You do these missions on multiple toons and you rack up a fortune of Tech Frags and Embers. My question is why don't Flashpoints weeklies offer these kinds of Tech Frag and Ember rewards? You do all the Flashpoint weeklies along with Tech Frags from bosses, and you don't even come close to these numbers. Plus, no embers for doing FP weeklies. One of the major reasons I started to PvP again 4 months ago, was the EASY way to get Tech Frags and Embers. I like PvE but doing FP's and OPs isn't getting me the EASY Tech Frags and embers like PvP does. So, I pick weeks to grind for Tech Frags and Embers. You need lots of tech frags and embers to make Augments, esp. Gold Augments. Gold Augments are king for PvE. If you wanna do hard mode Operations, you need gold augs. Perhaps you should offer players weeklies for Flashpoints that offer 2000 Tech Frags, and 3 Legendary embers per weekly.  That would be great! I wouldn't feel such a need to grind WZs. Yes, I do have fun in WZs, but with all these Premades, I'd rather do FPs with the same rewards. That way, I can just do WZs for the PvP season and have a little fun instead of just grinding multiple toons for tech frags and embers. Thank You. 

 

     Target markers. I hear in chat, "Mark the healers! It helps a lot. However, players abuse these markers and put them on dps for revenge cause maybe you melted them down. They do that to me because I am a madness Sorc and they get mad cause I melt them down. They put a marker on me and I get ganged up on. This abuse happens more often than you think. I have an idea. How about you pre-mark toons with either a floating icon (above class symbol) or glowing circle (under the feet) according to their choice of healer, dps or tank. Blue, orange, and green colors for the floating icon or glowing circle. This way everyone already knows who's healing, dpsing, or tanking. No need to mark anyone anymore. 

 

     Emotes. It makes me feel good and warm inside when a player blows me a /kiss, or /hug me or even /thank you when I come their aide in a WZ. Lots of positive emotes. However, in a WZ, the ones that are toxic are /laugh when you kill an opponent, or /spit at an opponent when you get mad, and other negative emotes. These negative emotes need to be taken off the list in WZs, blocked. If a Cathar cannot use her species special growl ability in a WZ, why allow negative emotes. Leave the positive ones unblocked. Take more toxicity out of PvP. Thx.

 

     Please, Bioware, MAKE A SOLO ONLY QUE. END THE BULLYING AND HARASSMENT PLEASE!

 

Okay, I said my peace. 

 

It's just more Bullying!

 

 

[krackcommando]

5 minutes ago, Tiffanitte said:

My question is why don't Flashpoints weeklies offer these kinds of Tech Frag and Ember rewards? You do all the Flashpoint weeklies along with Tech Frags from bosses, and you don't even come close to these numbers

because pvp is harder. because the grind to get the pvp weeklies is a lot longer than 3 FPs. iunno. this one seems pretty straightforward to me.

[TrixxieTriss]

1 hour ago, Tiffanitte said:

But now we have a new breeding ground for Bullying and Harassment -- Premades that que for regular WZs knowing (9 out 10 times) they will get a Pug enemy team

Is it the 2-4 man or 5-8 man premades causing you so much grief? I ask because before 7.2, there have always 2-4 man premades & this wasn’t the issue it is today. 

Also what server are you on? From anecdotally listening to different people, it seems some servers are worse than others. 

I think most reasonable pvpers recognise that premades make it unfair for people queuing solo. And that 5-8 man premades are over the top & should never have been added to the pug queue. 

Sadly Bioware have shown us they don’t care about fair. They won’t even discuss the situation. The best we can hope for is they revert it back to 4 man premades being the upper limit. But I don’t think they are even going to do that anytime soon. Because that would mean they need to admit they were wrong. Something BioWare are incapable of doing.

Which means the only solution for solo players is to not PvP until they do. It’s only when BioWare see PvP numbers declining or pop times getting too longer, that they will act. The more people who realise this & stop playing PvP, the quicker BioWare will act to address the situation.

Unfortunately, too many people are only interested in the season rewards than actual enjoyment playing PvP. So I can’t see numbers dropping off enough for BioWare to act soon. 

So is the only winning move to not play or play & not have fun 🤷🏻‍♀️

FYI, I’d like solo only queues too. Even if it’s just for Arena to start with & limiting premades to 4 man in WZ’s. 

Edited May 8, 2023 by TrixxieTriss

[Varcado]

I agree 100% with you! wz are terrible for casual players that want to have a good time when fully geared FOTM burst players and a healer want to group and focus everything till they are camping the graveyard saying EZ in chat. We should have random solo wz and group wz for groups who want to pvp against other premades. If you choose to queue solo you should only be put against other solo players to make it fair.

Edited May 8, 2023 by Varcado

[zrrkington]

you're just being a spam bot now.

[drspookz]

This is a troll post right?

[Varcado]

Why is there no penalty for people that queue 4 or more people against a pug??? aren't they supposed to have a higher queue time? weren't they supposed to be queue against other premades? premades are ruining WZs

Edited May 8, 2023 by Varcado

[septru]

because you probably had a premade on your own team.

 

[krackcommando]

it's going to happen if you're only 8 or 16 players in the queue.

before and after the patch, I would regularly get the same premade.

after the patch a couple nights ago in at least 3 straight arenas (always other team) i ran into the same premade. a match later, they were on my team. however, those two (it was only two no rizz guys) were not the only same faces I saw. I think the number of players in queue was just really small (< 9) which would make it impossible to pop any matches w/o them. it was frustrating to have them on the opposite team 3x in a row though. 😄

I was more frustrated about the fact that my team had two ppl < 228 gear. to be fair, though, they had a guy around 309 or 316 in at least one of them matches.

btw, to your whining about SF in another thread, go play SS or DM and then get back to me about how bad it is to maybe run into a large no idea, hysteria, reign in darkness grp who might drag out a match to forever just to farm you. (most of the time, even though they ignore objectives, they don't actively troll you by preventing players from scoring or capping. in all honesty, it's more of a punishment to be on their team...even though I'd rather just leave regardless).

Edited May 8, 2023 by krackcommando

[Aghasett]

Just do it. Or watch PVP participation continue to shrink down to zero.

[TrixxieTriss]

Or they could split the queue & give us a  solo only queue. 

Sadly, I can’t see BioWare doing either. They’ve already moved into their next PvP project, which is adding GSF to the PvP season. 

I think the best we can hope for is BioWare reducing pre-made sizes back to the 4 man maximum in WZ’s. 8 man premades is ridiculous & should never have happened. 

Ideally they should also make Arena a solo only queue to make matchmaking better, but we know they probably won’t do that either. 

But you are right. The longer BioWare ignore the pre-made vs pug issues & refuse to discuss it with the community, the more people will stop pvping. 

Edited May 9, 2023 by TrixxieTriss

[Aghasett]

6 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

I think the best we can hope for is BioWare reducing pre-made sizes back to the 4 man maximum in WZ’s.

 

Nah. It needs to be no pre-mades in regs. Anything less is tantamount to digital sadomasochism. The numbers bear this out very starkly.

Edited May 9, 2023 by Aghasett

[Tiffanitte]

On 5/7/2023 at 10:51 PM, TrixxieTriss said:

Is it the 2-4 man or 5-8 man premades causing you so much grief? I ask because before 7.2, there have always 2-4 man premades & this wasn’t the issue it is today. 

Also what server are you on? From anecdotally listening to different people, it seems some servers are worse than others. 

 

5-8 man premades are the problem. Starforge is the server.

[Sappharan]

On 5/7/2023 at 9:50 PM, Tiffanitte said:

     I apologize in advance for the lengthy post. I do not post very often at all, though I do read these posts a lot.

 ...

You make a lot of good points.  You also make a couple of points with which I disagree.  I have experienced most of what you have mentioned during my time pvping in the game, which is why I can appreciate your frustration.  As much as I would love a solo queue, I don't think it is ultimately a good idea.  At least, I might regret wishing for it if I ever do make friends in the game that enjoy pvp.  Hope for a reduction of 8mans to 4mans.  I think that would vastly improve our collective experience.

Second, the bullying.  I largely agree.  It is bullying...and those players that behave as you describe are pretty lousy human beings.  But, if Bioware/ea does as you wish, the game would have no end of people reporting on one another for the slightest infractions, real and imagined.  That is why the laissez-faire approach Bioware/ea takes is okay with me.  I'd rather deal with the occasional lousy human beings than deal with the threat of being banned for simply attacking a player that imagined I was bullying when I am not. 

[Sappharan]

On 5/7/2023 at 9:50 PM, Tiffanitte said:

 

It's just more Bullying!

 

 

After my nap (yes, I need those), it occurred to me that your post is just ANOTHER example of why the deserter debuff needs to be abolished. 

[Tiffanitte]

19 hours ago, Sappharan said:

After my nap (yes, I need those), it occurred to me that your post is just ANOTHER example of why the deserter debuff needs to be abolished. 

Yes! removing the deserter debuff would help. I like that idea. I remember playing back in the days when there was no deserter buff and I never understood why they made a deserter buff later on. Gameplay was fine. People still leave the WZ like they did back then, so I don't think a deserter debuff accomplished anything. At least if some jerk bullies you, you have the option to leave the WZ and que again right away.