ban ranked players from casual warzones

[TmoneyTime]

 

Farmed, ganked, ownd, globaled, whatever the modern term is. Yes, I don't like to be killed over and over again by ranked players for their personal amusement and kill-counter.

I do not have a problem with getting killed in a warzone match. I don't mind losing matches. I want to have fun in pvp warzones.

 

Ranked players are professionals, I am not.

 

They have their buddies in pre-mades or in communication apps, I play alone.

 

They know all the tricks, I don't.

 

personal impression: Their talents, relics, and stats work as designed, mine somehow don't.

 

really bad thoughts: They know how to cheat unpunished, I don't.

 

 

 

Ranked players are professionals that should not be allowed in non-professional warzone games.

They should have their own league (of legends), play against equals, fight against their peers, compete with players that are as skilled as they are.

 

Complicated: There should be an honest matching algorithm, that pulls pre-mades apart and puts the players against each other, should put guild-mates on opposite sides, match equipment correctly, match classes correctly, and match groups differently every game.

 

 

 

Even more simple: A working ignore-list that functions in PvP.

 

Ok lets take everything step by step:

 

Farmed, ganked, ownd, globaled, whatever the modern term is. Yes, I don't like to be killed over and over again by ranked players for their personal amusement and kill-counter.

I do not have a problem with getting killed in a warzone match. I don't mind losing matches. I want to have fun in pvp warzones.

 

If you are playing PVP for fun and not the competitive aspect, you have to accept that other players are going to play competitively. I myself mess around with weird stats and taticals/set bonuses all the time (Healing Relic on Watchman sepc, Life Warden, etc.) If your not going to play serious than you have to accept that players are going to play the meta and most likely kill you. This ones on you.

 

Ranked players are professionals, I am not.

 

There are lots of different skill levels that players play in ranked. Saying that all ranked players are some how the best players in the game is incorrect. Many players can not get out of bronze or silver tier.

 

They have their buddies in pre-mades or in communication apps, I play alone.

 

This one is a choice your actively making. You can just as easy make your own group. Your choosing to play alone.

 

They know all the tricks, I don't.

 

I'm not sure what tricks your talking about. There are multiple guides and videos about specs. I would recommend to look at Biggs on youtube. He has a guide for every spec that will get you to around 85% of the specs capability. Some classes have weird things they can do, but that is mostly for parsing on a dummy. (Delaying Rail shot, Perma Deadly Saber, Etc). They are not used in actual PVP.

 

really bad thoughts: They know how to cheat unpunished, I don't.

 

There really aren't many cheats right now. Yeah some people are using Macros, but that super hard to enforce.

 

Ranked players are professionals that should not be allowed in non-professional warzone games.

They should have their own league (of legends), play against equals, fight against their peers, compete with players that are as skilled as they are

 

The problem is matchmaking always has been, but due to population this will not change. Your 100% correct matchmaking is bad right now, but I assume thats due to the low population.

 

Even more simple: A working ignore-list that functions in PvP

 

Players would then just ignore anyone better than them. They would get 0 pvp pops not possible.

[afwhoefuwov]

I understand your frustration, OP. However, I think banning rankers is a bit much. They are allowed to click the "Join queue" in Reg Warzones just like we casual, when we are good enough, can click the "Join queue" in Ranked Warzones. The main issue here IMO is that there are not a lot of rewards when playing objectives. I mean, you can get points for defending a turret, win the match in under 5 mins, defeating the ball carriers...etc. After the match, you get something like 10,000 points for objectives => sure, but does this relate to how big your rewards are? I guess it does but not much.

 

OTOH, seeing things like 4 million damage, 68k biggest hit seems much more interesting. So people forgo objectives for this because there are no penalties, they can do whatever they want, in this case: strive for highest DPS. I guess you got the extreme version of this: rankers using reg as practice match by team deathmatching everybody, and stroke their virtual ego.

 

So IMO, there are 2 possible solutions:

- Somehow makes playing objective more rewarding, rather than just "Win the game". Eg, if I get the highest objectives or I intercept the ball carrier 10 times, then there better be things like higher tech frags, higher credits...etc

 

- This is a very extreme solution, but there should be penalties for getting 0 objectives. Maybe not that harsh, but make it so that people who play objectives get a lot higher rewards. Eg. those who get 0 objectives while getting high DPS can get 50 tech frags, while those who get > 0 objectives get double, and whoever the highest objective player gets triple...etc.

 

Obviously my solutions only apply to objective based warzones. For 4v4 team deathmatch, then the reverse should happen: highest DPS gets higher rewards...etc. But that is different from your OP, because here, they can DPS their hearts out.

Edited June 21, 2022 by afwhoefuwov

[Xerekfell]

Decent has nothing to do with it when you're coming across a four stack as someone stated earlier. Let's not act like ranked players are the cream of the crop when they run the most op and overused classes. Plus, with all the wintrading that people say happens in rank, how do we know if anyone of them with those flairs got them legit or is as good as they claim to be?

 

Most of the ranked community on SF/SS are wintraders. Good ranked players have a way better understanding of a class than your average NiM raider would. Where as nim raiding involves mindlessly parsing into a boss and doing mechanics every 2-3 minutes or less. PVP is really the only true end game content because it requires you to actually know your class. Wait wait did i just say know your class? *gasps* Yes i said that. Like i said earlier, pve is scripted content where as pvp isn't. PVP isn't difficult either. Unfortunately the developers lack interest or intelligence to help pvp in this game which it still has potential to sell.

[Crazykidddd]

This is nothing new. What most of the casual or new regs players dont understand is that most of the experienced players in the game don't care about objectives because it brings nothing to the table. It's been done to death, offers no real challenge or excitement, and unless you're not yet fully geared, offers nothing valuable to the player except some useless galactic seasons points and stuff (which is cool if thats what you want but lets be real, thats ***** just an excuse so ppl have something to do/chase).

Yes all of us can understand that for casual gamers getting ganked by a premade of ranked players over and over is no fun bcs you spend most of your match out of spawn, we get it.

HOWEVER, those types of games don't happen often enough for it to be a real issue. You might get 1-2/10 matches like that in a regular q so changing the entire game for 10% of your matches being less/no fun is ridiculous. I'm sure there are complete noobs who find some of you players who might be a little better than them also annoying. This is how pvp works, its survival of the fittest (as it should be).

My advice to you would be one of a few things.

First off you can always get yourself a group going and queue in a premade as well, that way you can all move as a group and even things out a little (believe me, Ive seen casual players who group up use enough cc and focus to push back ranked premades).

Second, this is a great learning experience. Instead of thinking well here we go about to die 100 times again and seeing the rest of the warzone as unenjoyable from the get go, try and figure out ways to play better and increase your own skills. If you know you're not going to enjoy a win then forget about winning for that match (which is something I highly recommend all newer players to try out, its much more fun to just do your own thing and test yourself out to practice and have fun, which is what regs should be about, at least once in a while) and instead try and improve your own gameplay.

Maybe use those matches to work on your positioning and using line of sight to attack those players while staying hidden. Or maybe you can test out some AoE builds as those premades are great fun to launch AoE attacks at as they usually stack pretty close.

Personally, while I can understand the frustration those matches bring to newer players, I love using a nice AoE setup and lighting their team up.

Yes you will probably end up with a lot more deaths than usual, especially if you play melee, however seeing yourself with top damage at the end even with your 10+ deaths is amusing to me.

Point is, challenge yourself, force yourself to get better and deal with those situations. It might suck at first but eventually you will get better, and it will vastly improve your own gameplay in other more balanced matches.

In time you'll realize those ranked players really aren't that good, there's a reason they queue in premades in a game mode they call "not serious"

Edited June 21, 2022 by Crazykidddd

[Xerekfell]

Decent has nothing to do with it when you're coming across a four stack as someone stated earlier. Let's not act like ranked players are the cream of the crop when they run the most op and overused classes. Plus, with all the wintrading that people say happens in rank, how do we know if anyone of them with those flairs got them legit or is as good as they claim to be?

 

To addon to my previous post; everyone runs meta classes because they're meta lol. Sniper atm is really bad because it lacks defensive cds to compete against PT and Fury mara meta. The only thing sniper has close to doing anything against these is evasion and div. Shield Probe does virtually nothing, imo it's only worth using with the utility for more absorption but even then you can't take that over movement purge utility. This is just how pvp works in many games my dude, not just swtor, Destiny is a prime example of this as well.

[Xerekfell]

This is nothing new. What most of the casual or new regs players dont understand is that most of the experienced players in the game don't care about objectives because it brings nothing to the table. It's been done to death, offers no real challenge or excitement, and unless you're not yet fully geared, offers nothing valuable to the player except some useless galactic seasons points and stuff (which is cool if thats what you want but lets be real, thats ***** just an excuse so ppl have something to do/chase).

Yes all of us can understand that for casual gamers getting ganked by a premade of ranked players over and over is no fun bcs you spend most of your match out of spawn, we get it.

HOWEVER, those types of games don't happen often enough for it to be a real issue. You might get 1-2/10 matches like that in a regular q so changing the entire game for 10% of your matches being less/no fun is ridiculous. I'm sure there are complete noobs who find some of you players who might be a little better than them also annoying. This is how pvp works, its survival of the fittest (as it should be).

My advice to you would be one of a few things.

First off you can always get yourself a group going and queue in a premade as well, that way you can all move as a group and even things out a little (believe me, Ive seen casual players who group up use enough cc and focus to push back ranked premades).

Second, this is a great learning experience. Instead of thinking well here we go about to die 100 times again and seeing the rest of the warzone as unenjoyable from the get go, try and figure out ways to play better and increase your own skills. If you know you're not going to enjoy a win then forget about winning for that match (which is something I highly recommend all newer players to try out, its much more fun to just do your own thing and test yourself out to practice and have fun, which is what regs should be about, at least once in a while) and instead try and improve your own gameplay.

Maybe use those matches to work on your positioning and using line of sight to attack those players while staying hidden. Or maybe you can test out some AoE builds as those premades are great fun to launch AoE attacks at as they usually stack pretty close.

Personally, while I can understand the frustration those matches bring to newer players, I love using a nice AoE setup and lighting their team up.

Yes you will probably end up with a lot more deaths than usual, especially if you play melee, however seeing yourself with top damage at the end even with your 10+ deaths is amusing to me.

Point is, challenge yourself, force yourself to get better and deal with those situations. It might suck at first but eventually you will get better, and it will vastly improve your own gameplay in other more balanced matches.

In time you'll realize those ranked players really aren't that good, there's a reason they queue in premades in a game mode they call "not serious"

 

Most ranked players are relatively trash at the game. I can give you examples of people who were "good" but turned out to be really bad. They also wintraded; shocker right?

[septru]

Most ranked players are relatively trash at the game. I can give you examples of people who were "good" but turned out to be really bad. They also wintraded; shocker right?

 

I agree. The Ranked Overloards are all wintrading hackers. Ban them all.

Edited June 22, 2022 by septru

[Crazykidddd]

Oh yeah I've known that for a long time, and that's besides all the bought accounts lol

[ZUHFB]

Most of the ranked community on SF/SS are wintraders. Good ranked players have a way better understanding of a class than your average NiM raider would. Where as nim raiding involves mindlessly parsing into a boss and doing mechanics every 2-3 minutes or less. PVP is really the only true end game content because it requires you to actually know your class. Wait wait did i just say know your class? *gasps* Yes i said that. Like i said earlier, pve is scripted content where as pvp isn't. PVP isn't difficult either. Unfortunately the developers lack interest or intelligence to help pvp in this game which it still has potential to sell.

 

I don't play on NA, but I do on DM but I can 100% assure you that a lot of people straight up can't be asked wintrading, it's just not worth. This is written like you think people like snave are good PvPers, which is objectively speaking false.

 

Anyway, I agree that PvP WAS harder in 6.X than PvE, but now PvE is so hard that no team cleared Gods yet - only one team has cleared sisters. Meanwhile it's preseason and the queue is so starved of players that I am 21/2. It's just straight up facts that PvE is currently harder than PvP. Usually this is when the 'this can't be compared' argument comes in, but yes I can absolutely compare those two since I have... everything? That there is to have from PvE and PvP and dis both for a long time now.

Once the new gear comes, R-4 is cleared and the season starts THEN PvP might be harder again.

[ZUHFB]

I agree. The Ranked Overloards are all wintrading hackers. Ban them all.

 

We still need to decide who gets which Top3 next season, you know? On the wintrading discord where the ranked overloards conspire to all throw on snave.

[Lord_Malganus]

They should have, a very long time ago, made a true solo "q" for regs.

 

No grouping or pre-mades.

 

Everyone "q's" solo.

 

Also, they should have improved the options for choosing what type of maps to play.

 

Instead, they chose to employ rookie coders with no knowledge, skills or abilities of the game engine. So the absolute joke known as SWTOR PVP evolved into the state it is in.

[ZUHFB]

Imagine, playing with your friends in an MMO is now a bad thing somehow.

[TmoneyTime]

Who cares about arenas, Its been a dumpster fire for years now.

 

Drop the Ego's and look at the Gorilla standing in the middle of the room dancing with a party hat on.

 

The new player experience in PVP is outright bad, thus leading to the population issues, in turn leading to bad matchmaking.. When a new player ques into pvp they should not get the current experience they have now.

 

Let's say 100 new players que in pvp. Currently they are all going to face players of all skill level and get rolled over and over. Out of those 100 players 50 of them will quit with in two games due to the current experience. 40 will quit within 5 games. The other 10 are masochists.

 

This is why the population sucks. No one is going to play PVP when they are getting farmed and dont even know what is going on.(Just look at all these objective players posts. They don't understand the game at all, Not their fault) We need some type of protective que system that makes games gradually get harder not just all at once.

 

Something like first 50 games you play against low mmr only, Then the next 100 games mid mmr. Then it unlocks to the full pvp experience. By having new player have some success against low to mid mmr players. Will help the retention rate of pvp players. Frankly that's what we all want. More players better matchmaking etc.

 

Lets take Overwatch for example.(I think the game's ranked system is good, better then most games)

 

Once you get to a certain skill rating you will not get matched with players above or below a certain range. Say your at 2700 you cant even que with anyone below 2100. That means all games that your play in will have a 2700 to 2100 skill rating.

 

In Terms of swtor lets say we have 3 tiers of players, bronze, silver, and gold. Bronze can never fight Gold's. Golds will never fight bronzes, and silvers will fight each tier. That would be the best solution right now while keeping que times down.

Edited June 22, 2022 by TmoneyTime

[AndriusAjax]

This is where someone needs to post the Billy Madison vid or quote about how we are all stupider for having read this.

 

[i skipped to end after reading the OP - but I'm certain you're all stupider]

 

Yes, premades who ignore wins and losses make the 8v8 queue a worse place. I don't mind them bc they generally make games easier to win, but I can see why others do - especially the people learning how to pvp. But premades who are trying to win are great.

 

And you just can't remove grouping in 8v8s. That would be the death of the pvp player base, no doubt.

Edited June 22, 2022 by AndriusAjax

[Dyne-]

Ranked players are terrorizing casual pvp players in warzones all the time.

There is no game in which ranked players are not only killing you but the whole fun of the experience as well.

They don't even care about winning, they just want to annoy casual gamers that want to play pvp and have fun.

I played the yavin ruins today and the enemy team (all players with a ranked flair active) just ran over the map killing everyone regardless of the pylons.

We had all 3 pylons until it was impossible that the enemy team could win as long as we only kept one pylon in possession. And even then they just took one pylon. One. Not 3 as they surely were able to.

So we won. Yay... Fun? None!

 

Ban ranked players from casual warzones already and give them their own warzones instead.

 

This is a pretty silly post OP. Ranked players are not going to be barred from playing unranked PvP just because they play ranked or queue with their friends.

 

My recommendation would be to join / create a guild with people who like to PvP and duel a LOT. There are a lot of abilities in this game that you need to learn how to counter, and you're not going to be able to do that and internalize it as quickly in the chaos of an 8v8 warzone. After you get good at that practice fighting multiple opponents. Learn to stall for as long as you possibly can (and win in some cases).

 

Also, understand that if you're in PvP and you aren't walking into 99% of your 1v1s confident that you can win (against a ranked player or not), you've still got a lot to work on.

 

A good place to start would be Ragequitting gaming or Biggsgaming on youtube. They both have a lot of useful information for beginners looking to get into PvP.

[Crazykidddd]

Who cares about arenas, Its been a dumpster fire for years now.

 

Drop the Ego's and look at the Gorilla standing in the middle of the room dancing with a party hat on.

 

The new player experience in PVP is outright bad, thus leading to the population issues, in turn leading to bad matchmaking.. When a new player ques into pvp they should not get the current experience they have now.

 

Let's say 100 new players que in pvp. Currently they are all going to face players of all skill level and get rolled over and over. Out of those 100 players 50 of them will quit with in two games due to the current experience. 40 will quit within 5 games. The other 10 are masochists.

 

This is why the population sucks. No one is going to play PVP when they are getting farmed and dont even know what is going on.(Just look at all these objective players posts. They don't understand the game at all, Not their fault) We need some type of protective que system that makes games gradually get harder not just all at once.

 

Something like first 50 games you play against low mmr only, Then the next 100 games mid mmr. Then it unlocks to the full pvp experience. By having new player have some success against low to mid mmr players. Will help the retention rate of pvp players. Frankly that's what we all want. More players better matchmaking etc.

 

Lets take Overwatch for example.(I think the game's ranked system is good, better then most games)

 

Once you get to a certain skill rating you will not get matched with players above or below a certain range. Say your at 2700 you cant even que with anyone below 2100. That means all games that your play in will have a 2700 to 2100 skill rating.

 

In Terms of swtor lets say we have 3 tiers of players, bronze, silver, and gold. Bronze can never fight Gold's. Golds will never fight bronzes, and silvers will fight each tier. That would be the best solution right now while keeping que times down.

 

LOL my guy, that's what lowbies are for. If you're a complete noob queuing into 80s ungeared and unskilled all bcs you used the master datacron then don't expect to not get pummeled.

Just make a new toon, and start pvping in lowbies, that way gear matters less and you can start practicing early on against people who also don't know what theyre doing.

Any of the skilled PvP'ers in the game started somewhere as well, we didn't all just go from 0 > 100 in one warzone, so crying about getting beaten by skilled players is useless, it would be like showing up at the gym for the first time ever and crying that you cant deadlift 350 lbs.

As with everything in life there's a learning curve, and PvP is about survival of the fittest. The problem is PvE players dont understand that and queue into a game mode they are completely unprepared for and then start crying on the forums about "its not fair that guy jumped me and beat me to a pulp in 3.5 seconds, NERF THEM" and the devs who have not a single clue in hell how to pvp respond with "okay lets do it".

Like I tell people, and I don't mean this in a rude or insulting way, L2P or stay out of PvP.

It's no different than a trigger happy PvP'er playing a dps class queuing into PvE and jumping on the boss bfr the tank has had time to make sure everyone is prepared and pull aggro. Just learn how to play the game mode you're queuing into, and as one of the previous posts mentioned, for PvP one good way to do that is to duel, a LOT. Go and learn how to play different classes, even if you dont actually make a toon but at least read some guides and have an understanding of other class' dcds and rotations, that way you can learn to anticipate their next moves and counter their dcds.

✌️ & ❤️

Edited June 22, 2022 by Crazykidddd

[Xerekfell]

I agree. The Ranked Overloards are all wintrading hackers. Ban them all.

 

Septru is a hacker, he onced stealthed and i never saw him again on operative. ;(

Edited June 22, 2022 by Xerekfell

[Xerekfell]

This is a pretty silly post OP. Ranked players are not going to be barred from playing unranked PvP just because they play ranked or queue with their friends.

 

My recommendation would be to join / create a guild with people who like to PvP and duel a LOT. There are a lot of abilities in this game that you need to learn how to counter, and you're not going to be able to do that and internalize it as quickly in the chaos of an 8v8 warzone. After you get good at that practice fighting multiple opponents. Learn to stall for as long as you possibly can (and win in some cases).

 

Also, understand that if you're in PvP and you aren't walking into 99% of your 1v1s confident that you can win (against a ranked player or not), you've still got a lot to work on.

 

A good place to start would be Ragequitting gaming or Biggsgaming on youtube. They both have a lot of useful information for beginners looking to get into PvP.

 

Wanna be together forever with Ranked players?

[Zarthorn]

So reading through this thread, It would seem, several years on, PvP balance is pretty much as bad as it ever was. From Matchmaking, to some classes being outright better than others.

 

People always use the "Skill gap" as an excuse but I'm going to wager, that "skill gap" applies to a very select few that are at the very top of the rankings

 

For most it's abuse of pre-made on voice versus disorganised pick up group, long been a problem in MMO's will likely always be a problem in MMO's, but this does not mean they can't look at the major issues with class balance which still exist to this very day.

 

The biggest offender is a class that has been well, the "OP" since forever, yes, a lot of those using the word "skill gap" will hate to hear it, but the Mara/Sent mirror classes have long been problematic in PvP balance, they're designed to be a high dps type, but they also possess a stupid amount of burst and defensive tools

 

They're very much a copy paste of the WAR Choppa/Slayer and anyone that is in denial of that has never, ever played WAR and seen just how utterly obnoxious that mirror was, Choppas literally replaced Black Orcs overnight as tanks because they had so much self sustain, they could blindly rush in and just face smash their keyboard and get rewarded for it. So, they had to buff the Black Orc so they would not go entirely extinct....except it just made the game even more imbalanced.

 

Sound familiar? It should.

 

Two of the best class mirrors in PVP are Mara/Sent and Guard/Jugg, because the Mythic style of balancing has been very much applied in this situation and now every match has at least 2 of those and I'd imagine more during peak hours.

 

Bioware, needs to adopt a philosophy of balancing PvP SEPERATE FROM PvE it's clear they haven't and it's why they're scared to act when it comes to those particular mirrors as weakening them in PvE is bad for the games health due to the popularity of them.

 

But it's quite simple

 

What many call a skill gap, is a class gap

Mara/Sent doesn't take much to play, as long as you have a basic knowledge of what your buttons do, you can succeed with them far easier than any other class, Guard/Jugg take a little more knowledge but inevitably, they are still much easier to get a level of competence with than say....a healer BH/Comm mirror that take a lot of micro managing, timing, positioning and good play to get to a basic level of competence with.

 

Now, as for the ranked pre-mades in PvP:

 

You have an influx of new and returning people, they want to learn, they want to enjoy the game, but you're going to scare them off.

 

It might be fun for you to style on them, but think of it from their perspective, they got dogpiled and murdered over and over by people that are clearly more knowledgeable and skilled than them, they will just come to the conclusion that the PvP mode straight sucks and it could lead to them deciding to go "Not worth it" and not bothering.

 

There's an opportunity to re-grow the playerbase, sheathe your e-peen and suck in your pride for a couple of months and let them try to experience it before you start unga-bungaing their skulls in

 

I literally saw a ranked pre-made spawn camping against a team that was filled with lowbie new players

 

Come on guys n gals, that's Not cool and you're not proving anything by seal clubbing a bunch of players that are probably just experiencing it for the first time.

 

Walk it back, calm it down

 

P.S: If you're about to say "That's the nature of PvP", WAR died because of that attitude. Let the new/returners at least have a chance to grow before you start murking them.

[Csjbo]

 

Now, as for the ranked pre-mades in PvP:

 

You have an influx of new and returning people, they want to learn, they want to enjoy the game, but you're going to scare them off.

 

It might be fun for you to style on them, but think of it from their perspective, they got dogpiled and murdered over and over by people that are clearly more knowledgeable and skilled than them, they will just come to the conclusion that the PvP mode straight sucks and it could lead to them deciding to go "Not worth it" and not bothering.

 

There's an opportunity to re-grow the playerbase, sheathe your e-peen and suck in your pride for a couple of months and let them try to experience it before you start unga-bungaing their skulls in

 

I literally saw a ranked pre-made spawn camping against a team that was filled with lowbie new players

 

Come on guys n gals, that's Not cool and you're not proving anything by seal clubbing a bunch of players that are probably just experiencing it for the first time.

 

Walk it back, calm it down

 

P.S: If you're about to say "That's the nature of PvP", WAR died because of that attitude. Let the new/returners at least have a chance to grow before you start murking them.

 

When new players try out PVP, in any game, there is usually an expectation that they're going to die a lot. If players who are new to PVP do not want to stick around, it is rarely because of 'ranked premades' killing them over and over again. The two prevailing reasons for players not committing to progressing in PVP are that they do not find the gameplay loop enjoyable and the other would be if they felt success in PVP was unattainable unless they committed hundreds of hours to grinding gear.

 

I cannot stress how important it is for new players that queue up for PVP to understand that they will die and die a lot when they first play warzones. I remember my PVP experience in 4.0 and earlier patches revolving around unlocking 4X or Pierce and just getting steamrolled. However, I understood that PVP can be brutal, and expecting the queue to adjust to my inexperience would be foolish. If I truly wanted to become good at PVP, I had to commit and more importantly ask for help.

 

One other important thing to note is that most 'ranked premades' that farm kills over and over again....do not play ranked. The forums need to stop scapegoating ranked players for the failures of SWTOR PVP.

[Bigfallenstar]

LOL my guy, that's what lowbies are for. If you're a complete noob queuing into 80s ungeared and unskilled all bcs you used the master datacron then don't expect to not get pummeled.

Just make a new toon, and start pvping in lowbies, that way gear matters less and you can start practicing early on against people who also don't know what theyre doing.

Any of the skilled PvP'ers in the game started somewhere as well, we didn't all just go from 0 > 100 in one warzone, so crying about getting beaten by skilled players is useless, it would be like showing up at the gym for the first time ever and crying that you cant deadlift 350 lbs.

As with everything in life there's a learning curve, and PvP is about survival of the fittest. The problem is PvE players dont understand that and queue into a game mode they are completely unprepared for and then start crying on the forums about "its not fair that guy jumped me and beat me to a pulp in 3.5 seconds, NERF THEM" and the devs who have not a single clue in hell how to pvp respond with "okay lets do it".

Like I tell people, and I don't mean this in a rude or insulting way, L2P or stay out of PvP.

It's no different than a trigger happy PvP'er playing a dps class queuing into PvE and jumping on the boss bfr the tank has had time to make sure everyone is prepared and pull aggro. Just learn how to play the game mode you're queuing into, and as one of the previous posts mentioned, for PvP one good way to do that is to duel, a LOT. Go and learn how to play different classes, even if you dont actually make a toon but at least read some guides and have an understanding of other class' dcds and rotations, that way you can learn to anticipate their next moves and counter their dcds.

✌️ & ❤️

 

Username checks out. Because you have to be crazy to believe what you just said. There is no learning curve or L2P issue. It's been proven that some classes are just straight up better than others. No amount of learning a different class, guides, or videos will do you any good when there's fotm classes like Vengeance jugg or Concel OP. And people can go from 0 to 100 in one warzone. It doesn't take Einstein levels of thinking to be good in a warzone.

 

And lowbies isn't going to do you any good at all. That's just going to have people stagnate and stay there because it's less pressure and stress on them and it's not taken seriously.

[CretinUseelad]

Username checks out. Because you have to be crazy to believe what you just said. There is no learning curve or L2P issue. It's been proven that some classes are just straight up better than others. No amount of learning a different class, guides, or videos will do you any good when there's fotm classes like Vengeance jugg or Concel OP. And people can go from 0 to 100 in one warzone. It doesn't take Einstein levels of thinking to be good in a warzone.

 

And lowbies isn't going to do you any good at all. That's just going to have people stagnate and stay there because it's less pressure and stress on them and it's not taken seriously.

 

DPS jugg fotm? DPS jugg has been less then dogmeat for a long time now. Worthless dcds, pointless fluff damage unless you are in a group solo jugg is really nothing to worry about. People in regs just don't know how to kill things or focus targets or make priority targets. Chances are that pesky jugg wont die is because a healer nearby is freecasting being completely ignored by the other 5 dudes who are just trying to spam cap a door.

[GeneralTiphis]

The population isn't exactly in a good spot, you can't ban them simply because any pop reduction in any aspect of the game would be crippling.

[Zarthorn]

When new players try out PVP, in any game, there is usually an expectation that they're going to die a lot. If players who are new to PVP do not want to stick around, it is rarely because of 'ranked premades' killing them over and over again. The two prevailing reasons for players not committing to progressing in PVP are that they do not find the gameplay loop enjoyable and the other would be if they felt success in PVP was unattainable unless they committed hundreds of hours to grinding gear.

 

I cannot stress how important it is for new players that queue up for PVP to understand that they will die and die a lot when they first play warzones. I remember my PVP experience in 4.0 and earlier patches revolving around unlocking 4X or Pierce and just getting steamrolled. However, I understood that PVP can be brutal, and expecting the queue to adjust to my inexperience would be foolish. If I truly wanted to become good at PVP, I had to commit and more importantly ask for help.

 

One other important thing to note is that most 'ranked premades' that farm kills over and over again....do not play ranked. The forums need to stop scapegoating ranked players for the failures of SWTOR PVP.

 

Ranked titles kinda gave them away. So it's not really a scapegoat if they're walking around brandishing their ranked titles and armours. Oh and I would not place the failures of PvP directly at anyones' door but the developers.

 

I get that Bioware took this project on initially with no experience of PvP nor what is required to strike a good balance, why a lot of the classes when they initially rolled out were effectively templates from WAR and DaoC with new, crisper animations, yet the fundamental balancing problems that Mythic had with those games (due to them being tuned for 50 v 50, a mistake given most of WAR revolved around 20 v 20 or 8 v 8) were even more intolerable here.

 

For instance, back in vanilla, Scoundrel/Ops were able to stunlock kill 100% of the targets they picked, I know, I was one and it was even easier to do than it was with WoW combat Rogues, because the immunity bar made it even easier to plan your stunlock. Now they take a lot more thought and timing than they once did and pay for it by being extremely easy to kill when they can't use dodge or vanish.

 

Sorcerers were another one that were outright disgusting at launch, being able to output an insane amount of damage and healing while possessing a full arsenal of defensives making them incredibly hard to pin down and kill (this is how I know it was a copy paste from WAR btw) the Consular mirror wasn't remotely as good because of animation differences led to clunkiness and being far easier to interrupt (obviously this has changed a LOT since then but that initial base shows that the PvP was directly taken from another).

 

And who can forget the Commando/Merc Grav round/Tracer Missile spam? a Result of using stacking values over flat values, which again, was a problem in WAR and the infamous Bright Wizard stacking tactics.

 

The thing is, it's 10 years on since then, Bioware can no longer:

 

1. Claim they don't know what they're doing

2. Blame it on past iterance's

 

It's just straight up sloppy and lazy that they haven't got a grasp on PvP balance and that to me is extremely disappointing.

[septru]

Ranked titles kinda gave them away.

 

Serious question. What makes a player a ranked player.

 

The flair? The flags? The title?

 

Some people have only played 10 ranked games. Some people only play ranked. How do you tell the difference?

 

Caus I can tell you right now. Almost all of those titles can be achieved with 10 ranked games played.

Edited July 10, 2022 by septru