Itemization in 7.0

[juliushorst]

Last point I'll bother to make, I hate all of this. It hurts to leave a game I have stuck with since before day one, but I can't do it any longer. The changes coming in 7.0 are overwhelmingly negative and I am forever baffled as to how the team can be proud of any of this.

 

I actually found two positive changes: new tagging (no more open world kill stealing) and separating set bonuses into separate items that allows more flexibility. The rest is simply awful: atrocious gearing, conquest turned into more grind for less rewards and "leveling up" that takes useful skills away.

[TrixxieTriss]

If you read the statement pvp has ilvl lock ( different from bolster, according the Chris it's coded from 0) even if you don't pve, you still be BiS for pvp doing only pvp. Pve players won't have any advantage over PvP players in PvP

 

That’s only in War zones or arena. What if you regularly play in the open world pvp instance to play the rest of the game.? I exclusively use the pvp instance.

 

That means anyone who plays operations as well as pvp will have a distinct advantage over you in an OWPVP situation.

 

That’s one of the reasons why we used to have expertise stats for pvp gear. It put us on a more lvl playing field while we were in open world situations for when people in operations gear would (nearly always) jump you in your lower stat pvp gear if you were flagged for pvp.

 

And while I recognise that open world pvp isn’t a big thing in this game, there is still a pvp instance for us if we want to do open world pvp.

 

So my question to Bioware is will they by putting the same ilvl lock for gear on the pvp instances in the game to make it a fair fight? Or are we (players who like OWPvP) expected to do operations now so we can have the best gear to play the game on a lvl playing field in the pvp instance?

Edited November 3, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[ebado]

Players will still be able to use moddable gear, but this type of gear is not required for players to be effective in any content in the game. Access to a moddable gear vendor will be granted at item rating 334, which is the highest possible gear rating attainable in the major game update following 7.0.

 

So here is the deal:

 

Moddable gear is one of the few things about SWTOR gear that is interesting and I think legitimately fun. This was true at launch and throughout the time I played it. This is part of what makes your game unique. It's an interesting and practical way to minmax. I remember buying off-pieces at launch because they had the best enhancement or mod on them that I could swap to my gear.

 

It's extremely silly to effectively lock this behind VM of the newest OP. That's the only reaction I can muster. Silly. I'm sure your metrics show the participation level among your playerbase for that content. Basically the only consistent and unique thing about your gearing system is going to be limited to those players. That's silly.

Edited November 3, 2021 by ebado

[TrixxieTriss]

So here is the deal:

 

Moddable gear is one of the few things about SWTOR gear that is interesting and I think legitimately fun. This was true at launch and throughout the time I played it. This is part of what makes your game unique. It's an interesting and practical way to minmax. I remember buying off-pieces at launch because they had the best enhancement or mod on them that I could swap to my gear.

 

It's extremely silly to effectively lock this behind VM of the newest OP. That's the only reaction I can muster. Silly. I'm sure your metrics show the participation level among your playerbase for that content. Basically the only consistent and unique thing about your gearing system is going to be limited to those players. That's silly.

 

Agreed. I love modding my gear. The fact that I don’t do operations will mean I can never mod my gear again. I’m sorely disappointed at this change.

Edited November 3, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[Nichos_Ketra]

I really hope they're not pulling an NGE here. Especially with the contract for the game coming up.

[TrixxieTriss]

I really hope they're not pulling an NGE here. Especially with the contract for the game coming up.

 

It’s certainly a possibility and one they won’t disclose till a month or two out from shutting down servers.

[arunav]

So did BW just forget about GSF for this post?

 

Do we get free snacks?

 

Right now I'm assuming that maybe PVP gear drops? But that doesn't necessarily match who plays GSF.

[Drenovade]

• Starting today, Renown and Social Legacy Perks will have their Cartel Coin price reduced to 1
  

 

This hasn't happened. Renown legacy perks are 90% off, but they don't cost 1 CC, so it's still cheaper to just buy them with credits. As for social legacy perks, I assume that's referring to the emotes that get unlocked when reaching certain social ranks? Those are currently not discounted at all.

[TziganeNZ]

I must admit I'm a bit anxious about this change.

 

I only play solo. I only do story mode. I only do flashpoints if they are part of the story - I hate them. I absolutely NEVER group or do Ops or GSF or PvP or any of that other stuff. Because I solo, I'm not fussed about losing social points as I didn't get them any way. But I am concerned that, while I don't min/max my gear, I do like to improve it to the best I can get it to within my limitations. My main has an iR of 282 (no augments, no amplifiers, nothing like that), and that seems to be plenty good enough for her.

 

I also don't do weeklies or dailies. I play for the story, and for fun, not for a grind or a second job. The highest I got to for the galactic seasons thing was level 24.

 

Does this new system mean that I will never be able to upgrade my gear through the story line? How will this work for a 'hardcore casual' like me?

[SirrSlaughterr]

Does this new system mean that I will never be able to upgrade my gear through the story line? How will this work for a 'hardcore casual' like me?

 

You will be required to complete solo conquest objectives (whatever they may be) to get new gear. If a conquest objective specifically requires you to complete a story mission, you would be in luck. If not, you will have to acquire 100k conquest points in a week to meet the weekly target, and that mission completion will reward you with gear.

[TziganeNZ]

You will be required to complete solo conquest objectives (whatever they may be) to get new gear. If a conquest objective specifically requires you to complete a story mission, you would be in luck. If not, you will have to acquire 100k conquest points in a week to meet the weekly target, and that mission completion will reward you with gear.

 

Thank you for your reply - greatly appreciated.

[Lakemine]

Thank you for your reply - greatly appreciated.

 

Just be careful, they reset every 24 hours and every 7 days against your will. So once you start a mission, make sure to finish it, otherwise all that time is completely wasted. You do not get ANYTHING for it, unless you complete it.

[Lakemine]

What is going to happen with the Renown Caches? are they going away?

Are we going to be refunded the money we spent on those legacy Unlocks?

 

Thanks

 

My guess? Yes. (Also kinda stupid they can't communicate a simple yes or no lol) And I doubt they will refund it.

[Lakemine]

Can we finally be able to get Social Achievements for doing PVP. It's content where you play with 15 other players but gives nothing for Social Points now where as you get tons for playing with 3 other players in a Flashpoint.

 

Seems like it. But again, they can't communicate clearly at all.

 

Also.....this is a sad cost for this feature with the amount of other wrong bad things they are adding. Like why not just add this social points feature to pvp and leave everything else as is? THAT would be better.

[Lakemine]

so operations is the only way to get the highest level of gear. so in PVP players that don't want to do operations will be at a disadvantage?

 

that seems to contradict the philosophy statement

 

 

 

since we are returning to a "vertical" gearing system; does that mean we get expertise back on PVP gear to balance out those in operations gear?

 

I don't really have the time or interest to raid regularly any more; but now I get put at a disadvantage in the game content I want to play (pvp) for not having the time to dedicate to raiding.

 

The reason why it seems contradictory, is because its a lie. Its VERY easy to lie with words, but harder to lie with actions. Actions speak louder then words. All narcissists and manipulators say one thing to get your brain to think its a positivity or a good thing, while at the same time stabbing you in the back or betraying your trust. This is very sad and poor form pm the devs part.

Edited November 3, 2021 by Lakemine

[Lakemine]

Renown stashes won't be forcibly emptied, will they?

 

They will. But not just emptied, they will be removed straight up. You won't get any rewards from them. So make sure to take them out now or within the next 45-60 days before it drops, otherwise it will all be wasted.

[TrixxieTriss]

Just be careful, they reset every 24 hours and every 7 days against your will. So once you start a mission, make sure to finish it, otherwise all that time is completely wasted. You do not get ANYTHING for it, unless you complete it.

 

That is my biggest gripe with this system and why we are seriously considering unsubbing and going else where.

[Lakemine]

"Philosophy" means "love of wisdom" so I would be careful using the term to describe this system

 

Thank you

[TiffanyID]

I very rarely ever post on the forums. But this needs to be said.

 

There are a sum total of three changes I like with 7.0:

 

1) Being able to play a different class in an existing story.

2) Weapons being added to costume designer.

3) The tagging changes.

 

As someone with the Collector's Edition that's played since release, a long time subscriber, I absolutely HATE EVERYTHING else about 7.0. Literally everything! The more I read about it the more I dread it!

 

It is, in fact, SO BAD that what I'm going to do is the new bit of story on maybe 2-3 characters. Then I'm canceling my sub and logging off and I probably won't launch the game again until the next story update or some massive changes reverting the vast majority of this outrage.

 

You're literally adding some of the most universally hated changes WoW ever received, as if someone saw all of that hate and somehow decided "yeah that seems like a good idea, let's kill our game." I legitimately cannot fathom what in the heck the developers were thinking with any of this. It's just so sooooo bad.

 

Destroying pretty much every class is pretty much game killing, then on top of it you have devastating gear progression, removal of virtually any freedom - whether it be what we play or how we gear (both in acquisition and composition), and I don't know how anyone thought it was a good idea to go back to the original LS/DS system where we had to grind Diplomacy for hours and hours and do speed runs of Black Talon and even then it was a royal pain.

 

Pretty much everything about the new item system is horrible. How you acquire them, how they're not even moddable, how set bonuses are being changed to accessories (accessories that have locked stats and more likely than not isn't what we want/need but would be forced to use for a set bonus), not to mention how only the best gear can be acquired from Operations which probably comprise less than 1% of the playerbase - and are the only moddable new gear.

 

Forcing people to all do the same dailies, weeklies, and queues are just going ruin people's enjoyment of the game. Heck even if by some fluke it happens to be something someone doesn't mind even then it's dreadful when there are dozens of other players all trying to do the same thing.

 

Between ruining of classes, corralling of players and removing freedom of choice in how we play, or the utter destruction of the gearing system.... They're all so bad that I'm honestly not even sure which will be the most offensive and greatest cause of people getting fed up and quitting.

Edited November 3, 2021 by TiffanyID

[Lakemine]

That is my biggest gripe with this system and why we are seriously considering unsubbing and going else where.

 

Agreed. And it sucks. Been playing SWTOR for 9+ years, got my mom and sis to play, but they already quit because of the incoming changes. They arnt as good as me, and the game devs preventing me from playing with them in story mode FPs made them take 2-3 hours to finish one, till I hopped on their account to finish it for them. This is an MMO, that is NOT how the game is supposed to be played. Its supposed to be played WITH other people, having fun completing content, no matter the skill level.

 

Also these changes of dailys/weeklys forcibly being removed from us? It seems similar to Destiny 2s bounties system. Which gear is tied to those as well......BUT they have a timer on them, and you can buy more if you want to finish them all in one day or just spread them out over days. So maybe if they devs explained it that way? Like "Hey, were adding timers to all dailys and weeklys." Maybe it would have been received a bit differently. Maybe. BUT it is still a horrible system to just artificially funnel and FORCE people into VERY limited amount of content each week, and removes player choice. Which is ALWAYS a bad thing.

 

I find it funny (and sad actually) that so so so SO many game devs cant figure out or understand that very simple concept. Give players choices, and they are happy. Remove or limit them, and they get mad. I'm not a game dev, and coding confuses me too much, but even just being a poor dumb kid, I STILL understand that very simple concept. I do not understand why most devs either do not, or refuse to learn it. Its sad indeed.

[Lakemine]

I very rarely ever post on the forums. But this needs to be said.

 

There are a sum total of three changes I like with 7.0:

 

1) Being able to play a different class in an existing story.

2) Weapons being added to costume designer.

3) The tagging changes.

 

As someone with the Collector's Edition that's played since release, a long time subscriber, I absolutely HATE EVERYTHING else about 7.0. Literally everything! The more I read about it the more I dread it!

 

It is, in fact, SO BAD that what I'm going to do is the new bit of story on maybe 2-3 characters. Then I'm canceling my sub and logging off and I probably won't launch the game again until the next story update or some massive changes reverting the vast majority of this outrage.

 

You're literally adding some of the most universally hated changes WoW ever received, as if someone saw all of that hate and somehow decided "yeah that seems like a good idea, let's kill our game." I legitimately cannot fathom what in the heck the developers were thinking with any of this. It's just so sooooo bad.

 

Destroying pretty much every class is pretty much game killing, then on top of it you have devastating gear progression, removal of virtually any freedom - whether it be what we play or how we gear (both in acquisition and composition), and I don't know how anyone thought it was a good idea to go back to the original LS/DS system where we had to grind Diplomacy for hours and hours and do speed runs of Black Talon and even then it was a royal pain.

 

Pretty much everything about the new item system is horrible. How you acquire them, how they're not even moddable, how set bonuses are being changed to accessories (accessories that have locked stats and more likely than not isn't what we want/need but would be forced to use for a set bonus), not to mention how only the best gear can be acquired from Operations which probably comprise less than 1% of the playerbase - and are the only moddable new gear.

 

Forcing people to all do the same dailies, weeklies, and queues are just going ruin people's enjoyment of the game. Heck even if by some fluke it happens to be something someone doesn't mind even then it's dreadful when there are dozens of other players all trying to do the same thing.

 

Between ruining of classes, corralling of players and removing freedom of choice in how we play, or the utter destruction of the gearing system.... They're all so bad that I'm honestly not even sure which will be the most offensive and greatest cause of people getting fed up and quitting.

 

The ONLY other 2 things I will add I was positive about, is them adding the Alliance Crate armors to collections (so I can make copies of the Underworld Trooper and Underworld Smuggler chest pieces, but two favorite chest pieces in the entire game) and them selling the Digital Collectors Edition. Thats it. Just 5 things I was positive about.

 

I agree 100%, EVERYTHING else sucks and it a horrible design. And add on top they are launching it in December (remember the last Dec launch was 3.0 and look how many bugs and broken things were with that? Cora 16m HM bug? All GSF components removed (because of them removing the skill tree) and it took 6 months for them to fix it? THE MEAT TREE!?!?!) and the last 2 FPs have been broken and buggy beyond, and they are launching 3x that content!?!? Bugs on top of bugs AND changes many people dislike.

 

I'm with you, I don't know what will be the bigger thing that breaks people into leaving, because there are SO MANY of them.

[kezzin]

I very rarely ever post on the forums. But this needs to be said.

 

There are a sum total of three changes I like with 7.0:

 

1) Being able to play a different class in an existing story.

2) Weapons being added to costume designer.

3) The tagging changes.

 

As someone with the Collector's Edition that's played since release, a long time subscriber, I absolutely HATE EVERYTHING else about 7.0. Literally everything! The more I read about it the more I dread it!

 

It is, in fact, SO BAD that what I'm going to do is the new bit of story on maybe 2-3 characters. Then I'm canceling my sub and logging off and I probably won't launch the game again until the next story update or some massive changes reverting the vast majority of this outrage.

 

You're literally adding some of the most universally hated changes WoW ever received, as if someone saw all of that hate and somehow decided "yeah that seems like a good idea, let's kill our game." I legitimately cannot fathom what in the heck the developers were thinking with any of this. It's just so sooooo bad.

 

Destroying pretty much every class is pretty much game killing, then on top of it you have devastating gear progression, removal of virtually any freedom - whether it be what we play or how we gear (both in acquisition and composition), and I don't know how anyone thought it was a good idea to go back to the original LS/DS system where we had to grind Diplomacy for hours and hours and do speed runs of Black Talon and even then it was a royal pain.

 

Pretty much everything about the new item system is horrible. How you acquire them, how they're not even moddable, how set bonuses are being changed to accessories (accessories that have locked stats and more likely than not isn't what we want/need but would be forced to use for a set bonus), not to mention how only the best gear can be acquired from Operations which probably comprise less than 1% of the playerbase - and are the only moddable new gear.

 

Forcing people to all do the same dailies, weeklies, and queues are just going ruin people's enjoyment of the game. Heck even if by some fluke it happens to be something someone doesn't mind even then it's dreadful when there are dozens of other players all trying to do the same thing.

 

Between ruining of classes, corralling of players and removing freedom of choice in how we play, or the utter destruction of the gearing system.... They're all so bad that I'm honestly not even sure which will be the most offensive and greatest cause of people getting fed up and quitting.

 

^^^ I agree with every word of this.

[Lakemine]

What I need to know really are two big things in general...

 

Why is the dev team taking active steps BACKWARDS and passing them off as improvements?

 

Next, and I mean this with all sincerity, why is the dev team EXCITED to show any of these changes off?

 

I know that the forums are not read by the dev team and so you are seeing none of this feedback. If it were the case devs actually read the feedback here, this would be a very different expansion. As such, the only way I know how to get anyone's attention that may care is to unsubscribe, which I have already done. I don't understand how decisions can be made and implemented that take away player choice at the same time it is advertised we are somehow getting more of it.

 

Restricting the best gear to the content that a minority of the community takes part in after an entire update of being rewarded the best gear from all sources will never make sense to me. It only shows that you were never confident in the changes made in 6.0 and after letting everyone get used to them, you strip them all away. I have never run a master mode operation in my entire time with this game, outside of master mode EV and KP before they were removed, and I've been playing since the beta. It's not that it's content I don't like, but I am not going to join an operations guild when my group of friends I play the game with has no interest in running them. Now we will lose the chance to get the highest gear by sticking with master flashpoints and that is somehow offering more player choice?

 

I didn't want this to become a rant as I stated I know it won't even be seen by a single member of the dev team, but this expansion feels like it has gotten absolutely everything all wrong. You have hundreds of players here begging you not to do this and yet we now have no choice but to put up with changes we hate or stop playing altogether.

 

How are the players that run operations harmed by other players having another route to get the best gear? Give them some other exclusive rewards the way you do with Ranked PvP seasons. Give them achievements for slogging through the hardest content the game offers. Don't punish players that don't or can't run operations because you refuse to implement a reliable system into the game for including them in group finder. I am not leaving my guild just to get some high end gear and it will be impossible to form groups for this sort of content as people stick to guild members only for master ops.

 

Last point I'll bother to make, I hate all of this. It hurts to leave a game I have stuck with since before day one, but I can't do it any longer. The changes coming in 7.0 are overwhelmingly negative and I am forever baffled as to how the team can be proud of any of this.

 

I know I may get hassled for this, but I know of at least one dev who was in a elitist discord who communicated a lot. Would joke and interact with them......and the toxicity that came along with it. That is actually why I left the discord, because an ACTUAL DEV who works at BioWare was listening to the elitist jerks and agreeing with their collective mindset.

 

So actually.....some of these gatekeeping changes, make complete sense with the devs mindset is being influenced by gatekeeping toxic selfish elitists.

 

(And no, I will not name names. That is against the ToS.)

[Lakemine]

It's putting lipstick on a pig. It's their job to seem excited no matter how terrible things are.

 

You mean be deceptive, lie and manipulate.

 

Fixed it for you.

[Banthabreeder]

I have NEVER EVER been able to complete the "Complete 3 Master Mode Flashpoints" in a week's time because so few people que for MM's. I think honestly the only character that I have gotten to do MM flashpoints with is my healer. My DPS never, if rarely get in a MM flashpoint. My Tank maybe once or twice. My point is it takes a hell of a lot longer to complete that quest than one week. If I complete just 2/3 and the week goes by, your new system says FU and puts me back at 0/3 for the next week. I call BS.

 

Same for WZ's. If your at 9/10 wins and the week is up, your system says FU and resets me back to 0/10. Again, this is BS.

 

Gearing will be so unfair to everyone who doesn't or can't run Op's for gear. Simply put, two players equally talented at their role, one wears Op's gear and the other wears Fp's gear, the Op's player will always have an advantage over everyone else in a WZ (PvP) match. Of course this is BS.

 

Are you people deliberately trying to get everyone to leave the game? Is that the goal of this 10th year anniversary? Are you guys so over the game that you feel you need to completely ruin any fun playable aspect to it in hopes of getting the game to shut down due to lack of players? I've only complained about 2 things here but so many people have other issues that it feels like your completely ignoring ALL OF US and doing whatever your uninformed bosses are telling you to do. (I had another word for your bosses but decided I didn't want to be banned for life for saying it)