Why Solo Ranked Sucks and Will Continue to Suck

[johnadamswife]

4 dps games exist, 3 dps healer games exist, 3 dps tank games exist.

 

I get that some players don't enjoy tank/healer but that's what the game should be played as. 4 dps games are a complete joke. The game should be played with both tanks and healers. How do you expect a new ranked player to load into a 4 dps game, get tunneled by 4 people then die. It's just a complete joke. When you have no consistency in solo queue whether it be tank/healer to 4 dps it makes it impossible to balance correctly. Ex. Powertech, Lethality Operative. Those classes end up not being played much if at all in 4 dps games but in group ranked they are among the most broken classes. So this leaves powertech specifically needing a survivability buff in 4 dps games but not in tank healer. This renders the game completely out of balance. Also not to mention jugg tank is literally the only playable tank in any competitive game.

 

PLEASE REMOVE 4 DPS GAMES, 3 DPS HEALER GAMES AND 3 DPS TANK GAMES - IF YOU CAN'T PLAY TANK HEALER, THEN DON'T PLAY

[Warrioroffhell]

The way how current players are the best games in solo ranked are 4dps who actually reflect ur skill lvl , tank/heals while they can be good haven't been as good since season 10 and in season 13 they were utterly boring cause of forcebound and grith teeth etc. Also u have a higher chance of getting the most irritating players in ur teams cause most of them play tank/heal to throw on the queue for their own amusement (i will not mention names cause people who play ranked know who i'm talking about)

[Warrioroffhell]

 

PLEASE REMOVE 4 DPS GAMES, 3 DPS HEALER GAMES AND 3 DPS TANK GAMES - IF YOU CAN'T PLAY TANK HEALER, THEN DON'T PLAY

 

nice joke btw

[johnadamswife]

in season 13 they were utterly boring cause of forcebound and grith teeth etc.

 

I agree but that's why I mentioned 1 viable tank. Another big problem is that healing is so weak that healers rely on not having to heal their tank. I get that some of the best players like 4 dps games but quite honestly this game should be always tank healer, like any other solo queue game like league and such. By having all of the games tank healer it makes it very clear what classes are over/under performing and allows the very very small dev team make changes faster.

 

But in reality a good tank healer player is miles better than a great 4 dps player.

[septru]

You can always que group ranked. Lots of tank/healer games there Edited March 21, 2021 by septru

[JediMasterAlex]

PLEASE REMOVE 4 DPS GAMES, 3 DPS HEALER GAMES AND 3 DPS TANK GAMES - IF YOU CAN'T PLAY TANK HEALER, THEN DON'T PLAY

 

In other words, you want to remove all dps games because you can't survive without tanks and healers babysitting you. Great suggestion with a totally pure motivation.

 

But in reality a good tank healer player is miles better than a great 4 dps player.

 

In actual reality, good solo ranked players are good at both, but it must be nice to live in a fantasy land. If anything, the opposite is true. If you're only "good" with tanks and healers, that just means you're getting carried.

Edited March 21, 2021 by JediMasterAlex

[foxmob]

I agree that balancing specs and classes is nigh impossible when you take away the trinity.

 

HOWEVER, I'm not sure how much experience you have in solo ranked or group ranked arenas. I can say with absolute certainty that two new dps will never -- ever -- kill anything in a game in which both teams have 2 dps, a healer, and a tank. given that the healer and tank are only half decent, the games will go to acid every time.

 

one good thing about 3 and 4 dps matches is that (with the exception of stealth shenanigans) you will get definitive winners each round.

 

/2cents

Edited March 21, 2021 by foxmob

[foxmob]

In actual reality, good solo ranked players are good at both, but it must be nice to live in a fantasy land. If anything, the opposite is true. If you're only "good" with tanks and healers, that just means you're getting carried.

 

the guy's a bit out there, but c'mmon. PT dps in solos vs. PT dps in group, same guy. highly skilled. gonna be much more effective in group, no? there are classes/specs that play much better depending on presence of support roles.

[JediMasterAlex]

the guy's a bit out there, but c'mmon. PT dps in solos vs. PT dps in group, same guy. highly skilled. gonna be much more effective in group, no? there are classes/specs that play much better depending on presence of support roles.

 

Yes, but I deliberately ignored that part of his post, because that's clearly not his actual concern. Plus, the best ap pts still performed very well in solo ranked where they have to play plenty of all dps games even if they attempt to dodge them (see the leaderboards).

[TheOverMind-]

4 dps games exist, 3 dps healer games exist, 3 dps tank games exist.

 

I get that some players don't enjoy tank/healer but that's what the game should be played as. 4 dps games are a complete joke. The game should be played with both tanks and healers. How do you expect a new ranked player to load into a 4 dps game, get tunneled by 4 people then die. It's just a complete joke. When you have no consistency in solo queue whether it be tank/healer to 4 dps it makes it impossible to balance correctly. Ex. Powertech, Lethality Operative. Those classes end up not being played much if at all in 4 dps games but in group ranked they are among the most broken classes. So this leaves powertech specifically needing a survivability buff in 4 dps games but not in tank healer. This renders the game completely out of balance. Also not to mention jugg tank is literally the only playable tank in any competitive game.

 

PLEASE REMOVE 4 DPS GAMES, 3 DPS HEALER GAMES AND 3 DPS TANK GAMES - IF YOU CAN'T PLAY TANK HEALER, THEN DON'T PLAY

 

 

Solo ranked is better than anything else. If there was only tank and heal games it would be boring and because those games are ridiculously much longer with these mtachups. If you don't like it just don't queue but don't bother solo pvpers by making a topic like that.

[Csjbo]

4 dps games exist, 3 dps healer games exist, 3 dps tank games exist.

 

I get that some players don't enjoy tank/healer but that's what the game should be played as. 4 dps games are a complete joke. The game should be played with both tanks and healers. How do you expect a new ranked player to load into a 4 dps game, get tunneled by 4 people then die. It's just a complete joke. When you have no consistency in solo queue whether it be tank/healer to 4 dps it makes it impossible to balance correctly. Ex. Powertech, Lethality Operative. Those classes end up not being played much if at all in 4 dps games but in group ranked they are among the most broken classes. So this leaves powertech specifically needing a survivability buff in 4 dps games but not in tank healer. This renders the game completely out of balance. Also not to mention jugg tank is literally the only playable tank in any competitive game.

 

PLEASE REMOVE 4 DPS GAMES, 3 DPS HEALER GAMES AND 3 DPS TANK GAMES - IF YOU CAN'T PLAY TANK HEALER, THEN DON'T PLAY

 

There's a contradiction in this post because the OP complains about the game lacking balance as PTs and Leth operatives dominate group ranked (ie tank/heal games).........but then recommends that solo ranked only feature tank heal games....wouldn't that just turn solo ranked into a Jugg tank and PT mosh pit?

 

The fact that each type of matchups, 4 DPS, 3 DPS 1 Heal, 3 DPS 1 Tank and 2 DPS 1 Heal 1 Tank have their own "meta" to an extent where certain classes are more effective than others actually lends itself more to balance (as players on classes that are not as strong in certain matchups can pass on queueing for awhile) than just forcing one matchup down players throats.

[Ahavery]

Blah blah blah. Yes, certain classes are at a disadvantage in solos. Get over it. Learn concealment op or something. Whining about balance will get you nowhere with the devs. In fact, they’ll probably do the opposite of whatever you want

[Enticy]

4 dps games exist, 3 dps healer games exist, 3 dps tank games exist.

 

I get that some players don't enjoy tank/healer but that's what the game should be played as. 4 dps games are a complete joke. The game should be played with both tanks and healers. How do you expect a new ranked player to load into a 4 dps game, get tunneled by 4 people then die. It's just a complete joke. When you have no consistency in solo queue whether it be tank/healer to 4 dps it makes it impossible to balance correctly. Ex. Powertech, Lethality Operative. Those classes end up not being played much if at all in 4 dps games but in group ranked they are among the most broken classes. So this leaves powertech specifically needing a survivability buff in 4 dps games but not in tank healer. This renders the game completely out of balance. Also not to mention jugg tank is literally the only playable tank in any competitive game.

 

PLEASE REMOVE 4 DPS GAMES, 3 DPS HEALER GAMES AND 3 DPS TANK GAMES - IF YOU CAN'T PLAY TANK HEALER, THEN DON'T PLAY

 

Yeah, I’m going to go ahead and second the sentiment that if a dps player can’t effectively get kills in 4 dps matches, they damn sure won’t do d!ck but squat with a tank and/or healer propping them up. Heals and guard are not, have never been, and never will be a replacement for using line of sight, your CC, and your DCDs properly. If you can’t do those things, all a healer and tank will do is prolong your inevitable death.

 

By the way, the reason most people don’t play tank or healer in ranked isn’t because they can’t. It’s because they often wind up stuck with the kind of dps players that lean on them entirely, get tunneled, and waste their time.

[foxmob]

meh. in retrospect, solos are more interesting with 3 dps and 1 utility (same utility on each team though).

 

I say this b/c there are so few players in solo queue that the queue cannot effectively place players in matches of all the same skill bracket. But one weak dps on a trinity team precludes ever killing anyone on the other team.

 

but with 3 dps and only 1 utility, it's still possible to make a game out of it if one of the three dps isn't great but also follows directions.

 

basically, 3:1 is better for the queue being at least a little more receptive to less skilled players (me! lol), but it definitely screws class balance (e.g., any PT spec).

Edited March 25, 2021 by foxmob

[cflems]

Yeah, I’m going to go ahead and second the sentiment that if a dps player can’t effectively get kills in 4 dps matches, they damn sure won’t do d!ck but squat with a tank and/or healer propping them up. Heals and guard are not, have never been, and never will be a replacement for using line of sight, your CC, and your DCDs properly. If you can’t do those things, all a healer and tank will do is prolong your inevitable death.

 

By the way, the reason most people don’t play tank or healer in ranked isn’t because they can’t. It’s because they often wind up stuck with the kind of dps players that lean on them entirely, get tunneled, and waste their time.

 

Weird sentiment considering AP PT and Deception Assassin are specs that exist. A PT will do way more d!ck squat with a tank and a healer than they would in a 4dps game. A sin will do way less. The other specs all basically exist at different points along that spectrum, and that's the atrocity that we currently call game balance. "Play your way" btw.

 

Also. What you're describing is literally just solo ranked, it may just not be for you. Better rated players get heavier sandbags until the sandbags get too heavy and their ELO stops increasing, that's the name of the game. It happens to the DPS teammates of the sandbag too. But healers get plenty of top 3s and tanks get top 3s at astounding rates (all of the juggs this season except Cunamo? someone double check on that). So it's not really a problem with support mechanics, just that some people don't like carrying, or find they aren't able to.

[JediMasterAlex]

But healers get plenty of top 3s

 

I think Shalom is the only top 3 healer this season, and we all know he probably wintraded. I'm not 100% sure on all the mercs and ops though.

 

For sorcs at least, it's not that healing is terrible, but more that lightning is one of the top solo ranked specs. Prior to 6.0, more sorc healers were in the mix at the top I think because the sorc dps specs were average.

Edited March 25, 2021 by JediMasterAlex

[cflems]

I think Shalom is the only top 3 healer this season, and we all know he probably wintraded. I'm not 100% sure on all the mercs and ops though.

 

For sorcs at least, it's not that healing is terrible, but more that lightning is one of the top solo ranked specs. Prior to 6.0, more sorc healers were in the mix at the top I think because the sorc dps specs were average.

 

Too 3s in a specific season unfortunately have more to do with the personalities who decide to pursue them. This season it was you, szopen, cerasi, ayana, aqrius, shalom obviously. Not sure if any other than shalom went for it by healing, I know most of those players tend to be dps mains. I do know a bunch of people like vehirt on our server, for example, ended up gold purely by healing. In season 12 (also 6.0) there was also junkbrain and skirina. Plus lyala before his ban evasion shenanigans. I'm also not super familiar with the op and merc players but that's already a bunch of the top threes this expansion.

[JediMasterAlex]

Too 3s in a specific season unfortunately have more to do with the personalities who decide to pursue them. This season it was you, szopen, cerasi, ayana, aqrius, shalom obviously. Not sure if any other than shalom went for it by healing, I know most of those players tend to be dps mains. I do know a bunch of people like vehirt on our server, for example, ended up gold purely by healing. In season 12 (also 6.0) there was also junkbrain and skirina. Plus lyala before his ban evasion shenanigans. I'm also not super familiar with the op and merc players but that's already a bunch of the top threes this expansion.

 

Sorcs were Shalom, Ezmode, Jed (aqrius), Szopen fourth (relevant if shalom gets reset/banned). Sages were Ezmode, me, Cerasi. But yeah, I know doing well as healer is totally possible. And I agree, top 3s are maybe not the best way to measure anyway, especially because lightning is near the top right now for solos.

Edited March 26, 2021 by JediMasterAlex

[Enticy]

Weird sentiment considering AP PT and Deception Assassin are specs that exist. A PT will do way more d!ck squat with a tank and a healer than they would in a 4dps game. A sin will do way less. The other specs all basically exist at different points along that spectrum, and that's the atrocity that we currently call game balance. "Play your way" btw.

 

While I will concede that AP PT and Deception Sin are both overtuned in different ways, a bad dps player will still get turned inside out while playing these specs. My point was that a tank and healer in every queue isn’t going to magically bring balance to solo ranked, which is what the OP was getting at.

 

So it's not really a problem with support mechanics, just that some people don't like carrying, or find they aren't able to.

 

Yeah, that’s exactly the last point I made. It’s not that people can’t or don’t want to play tanks and healers in ranked. It’s that they don’t want to potentially have to carry bad dps. I’ve seen plenty of ranked games where I was on a four dps team against tank/heal/dps/dps, and we buried the other team because their dps couldn’t focus or peel us off of the healer.