GTN sorting system. What determines the order?

[TrixxieTriss]

This has been bugging me for awhile now and as a GTN trader, I probably should have asked this a long, long, time ago.

 

When you look at the GTN prices and sort them by price. You will often see items at the same price and listed at different times, but it doesn’t affect the order. You will also see that the names aren’t sort alphabetically.

 

Ie, if I list xyz item for 50k and another person comes along 3 hours later and also lists at 50k, sometimes they will be above mine on the sorting and other times they will be below.

 

So what determines the sort order? It’s not time, it’s not alphabetical and it’s not how many you list.

 

There are some players who have worked it and are always at the top, regardless of which character I’m on with. This nearly guarantees they will always sell theirs first.

 

Has anyone got any theories or actual knowledge on how the GTN sorting works when things are the same price?

 

It’s a shame Bioware just don’t make it random (like every other thing in this game) Ie someone lists 5 at 50k and another lists 3 at 50k, then the system could mix them and not have a block of 5 and then a block of 3.

[Caalem]

It's likely undefined. If I had to guess, they're just sorting based on whatever you picked(in this case, price) with no secondary sort for equal values. The order of equal items once sorted is therefore not specified. Edited December 31, 2019 by Caalem

[OlBuzzard]

This has been bugging me for awhile now and as a GTN trader, I probably should have asked this a long, long, time ago.

 

When you look at the GTN prices and sort them by price. You will often see items at the same price and listed at different times, but it doesn’t affect the order. You will also see that the names aren’t sort alphabetically.

 

Ie, if I list xyz item for 50k and another person comes along 3 hours later and also lists at 50k, sometimes they will be above mine on the sorting and other times they will be below.

 

So what determines the sort order? It’s not time, it’s not alphabetical and it’s not how many you list.

 

There are some players who have worked it and are always at the top, regardless of which character I’m on with. This nearly guarantees they will always sell theirs first.

 

Has anyone got any theories or actual knowledge on how the GTN sorting works when things are the same price?

 

It’s a shame Bioware just don’t make it random (like every other thing in this game) Ie someone lists 5 at 50k and another lists 3 at 50k, then the system could mix them and not have a block of 5 and then a block of 3.

 

Sort by :

 

Frequently if the item has a unique title such as "Sensuous"

Type in:

Sensuous Set will bring up all of the sets

Sensuous (just that word) will bring up ALL of those items... gloves, dress , top .. boots.

 

Look at the top right hand "price". This is usually for the unit price. I click on it twice (usually right after bringing up the item(s) or sets I'm looking at. This does two things... 1st click usually arranges from highest price to lowest … second from lowest price to highest. I'm always looking for the best price.

 

For whatever reason it does NOT keep that setting. So each time you hit the "search" button … it resets the process. To get that cheapest price … click on that top far right hand price column twice … You'll get there.

 

BTW... it should be noted that this has been that way for years.

 

Addendum to note: also please note that the market has been absolutely NUTS the last few days. I've seen entire PAGES (eight line items per page) disappear in a matter of seconds !!

:eek:

[Void_Singer]

[...]

So what determines the sort order? It’s not time, it’s not alphabetical and it’s not how many you list.

[...]

by all appearances it's a merged timestamp sort, not of the time remaining, but a partial of the time submitted.

[JediQuaker]

It may be a matter of overlapping sort options.

I'd have check later, but if I recall..... Say, for example you click on the "name" column to sort them alphabetically. If you then sort them by price, units with the same price will be alphabetical.

I really don't know what the default sort order is though. It seems that any column I click on results in a different sort order. (The default sort order seems to be to sort them as groups, in no particular order.)

[OlBuzzard]

This has been bugging me for awhile now and as a GTN trader, I probably should have asked this a long, long, time ago.

 

When you look at the GTN prices and sort them by price. You will often see items at the same price and listed at different times, but it doesn’t affect the order. You will also see that the names aren’t sort alphabetically.

 

Ie, if I list xyz item for 50k and another person comes along 3 hours later and also lists at 50k, sometimes they will be above mine on the sorting and other times they will be below.

 

So what determines the sort order? It’s not time, it’s not alphabetical and it’s not how many you list.

 

There are some players who have worked it and are always at the top, regardless of which character I’m on with. This nearly guarantees they will always sell theirs first.

 

Has anyone got any theories or actual knowledge on how the GTN sorting works when things are the same price?

 

It’s a shame Bioware just don’t make it random (like every other thing in this game) Ie someone lists 5 at 50k and another lists 3 at 50k, then the system could mix them and not have a block of 5 and then a block of 3.

 

Trix…

 

Sorry I rushed through mu initial response..

 

Yes.. If ALL of the items you are looking at are exactly the same item (even in specific detailed descriptions) … and they are EXACTLY the same price... then those items will be grouped together without specific order.

 

Following some of your other posts regarding the market … pricing etc... I'm guessing that what you are suggesting is that the first person to post a particular price should have their merchandise kept at the TOP of that list (within that specific price) … and anyone else who would post the exact same item at the exact same price should have ALL of those items posted together AFTER the posted pricing of the first "customer".

Usually this is only a problem where crafting items are listed. AND this is only a problem where some players will itemize ONE item at a time … ALL priced exactly the same … there by taking up several pages. The next player who would also post several line items of the same product IF THE EXACT same price were used could come 20 minutes later (assuming that the first players stuff was still there that long) and could BURRY the first players items that were listed. (I've seen this happen).

 

That said … usually what happens is that the SECOND player will reduce their cost by one single credit … that would automatically place their product ahead of the first player … assuming that anyone who is searching the market is using any sort of system which DOES list the items IN order by UNIT cost.

 

At any rate... I'm certain this sounds confusing. It is not. The market is more than buy cheap and sell high.

 

There is a lot more to it than just that.

[TrixxieTriss]

Thanks for the replies.

 

I think I may not have supplied enough details in my OP.

 

What I’m trying to ask is this :

 

If I list a crafted colour dye and 3 other people list the same colour at exactly the same price, but at different times, at different listing intervals and the names are spread out across the alphabet, why then are the same people always higher on the list?

 

It doesn’t seem to matter if I’m first to list, have different listing intervals (ie 6 hours, 1 day or even 3 days), or if my name is higher or lower in alphabetical order. It doesn’t matter if I list 1 or 10 dyes.

 

I’ve tested this on many Alts to see if it had something to do with character naming conventions. I even went so far as too make an Alt to make sure I that no one was above me (for testing reasons).

 

The same people always seem to be able to list before, after or during the time Im listing and will always be above everyone else when everyone is at the same price.

 

Let me give you an example. Player G lists 2 gray dyes for 70k, Then Player M comes along an hour later and lists the same dye at 70k. But when you do a search by price, Player M’s listing will be at the top. Player G sees this and relists their dye at exactly the same price, but Player M’s listing is still at the top.

 

Why doesn’t this mater? Because 1 person can dominate the price and listing with just one item (dye). They do this by relisting 1 dye at a time each time theirs sells. And they are guaranteed to always be number one when you list by price.

The problem really arises when that person doesn’t just list one, but lists 3+ at a time, so even if one sells, they have enough time to jump back and list more before anyone even realises.

 

That leaves everyone else with one option. Under cut them or you will never get to sell anything. This creates price wars and stupid competition to be the cheapest. Often it drives the price into the floor.

 

I’ve tried a few strategies to avoid this. One is to buy all their stock and list it higher. But if they are watching and replacing like I said above, then they will do the same as soon as you buy theirs.

I don’t like undercutting people who I can see are only wanting to list a few dyes at a time to make a steady income. And so I often list it at the same price as theirs. But what happens every day is 3-4 players jump on and list 5-10 of the same colour at the same price as we’ve already listed. Now that wouldn’t be an issue if the positions on the sort list were random, but they aren’t and these guys know it. So they list at our price and we can’t sell anything without undercutting them.

Even if you undercut. They will be there to list at your price again and once again they hog the sales.

 

Its obvious these people have discovered how the sort system works when every thing is at the same price. What I’m trying to figure out is “how does the system really work?”.

 

FYI, I’m no longer crafting and selling for profit. But I’m bored as hell with the game and playing around on the GTN and trying to work things out is fun for me.

I’m also thinking of making a GTN trading guide for crafters (not CM items) with all the tips I’ve picked up. One of the last bit of info I need is how does the sorting system work to put some people ahead of others when they are all the same price.

[Caalem]

I'd suggest just undercutting by only 1 credit. Seems easier.

[Shinian]

As a developer myself, of more boring stuff than games, I see sort order being a pain to predict. I sort by a column of values, but every time I search, I get the resulting list in a different order within the parameters requested.This is a fault/quirk, in my case at least, with the database software, not with my application.

[Mubrak]

It's likely sorted by the internal database id. Imagine a spreadsheet with all listed items: You are sorting/filtering the list locally by item name, price, category, etc. but in the end you are telling the server that you bought the item from row #42, and that row is then marked as available for the next listing.

 

When a new item is listed, it gets the now free #42 and shows up between the identical entry in row #100 that was added an hour ago, and the one in row #30 that was added yesterday. From our point of view there is no system to the order, but there also isn't a way to manipulate it to move our items to the top.

Edited January 1, 2020 by Mubrak