Psygenic Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 (edited) Unionize. Use Anthem as leverage. Edited August 1, 2018 by Psygenic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xordevoreaux Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Your post demonstrates a complete void in the understanding of not only how shareholder profit-driven companies operate but the nature of vendor-consumer relationships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthWoad Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Your post demonstrates a complete void in the understanding of not only how shareholder profit-driven companies operate but the nature of vendor-consumer relationships. Can you explain them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psygenic Posted August 1, 2018 Author Share Posted August 1, 2018 Your post demonstrates a complete void in the understanding of not only how shareholder profit-driven companies operate but the nature of vendor-consumer relationships. You demonstrate that you care more about EA's profit margin than Bioware staff or this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlameYOL Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Is this a troll thread or serious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthWoad Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Is this a troll thread or serious? I'd assume it's serious. It's only a "troll thread" if you don't agree with what's being said, according to my observation on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodrac Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Clearly a L2P issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 You demonstrate that you care more about EA's profit margin than Bioware staff or this game. EA is a FOR PROFIT corporation. EA is concerned with profit. Period. They don't keep the Austin studio open as a charity or a tax write off and they don't keep SWTOR open to please it's few loyal fans. When the bottom line says it's no longer making money, they'll terminate the game and not give a second thought about it. Or, if their accountants determine that Austin is a money pit, they'll close the Austin office and transfer SWTOR to a team they already have in a profitable location. This has nothing to do with caring about EAs profits - it's common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psygenic Posted August 1, 2018 Author Share Posted August 1, 2018 EA is a FOR PROFIT corporation. EA is concerned with profit. Period. They don't keep the Austin studio open as a charity or a tax write off and they don't keep SWTOR open to please it's few loyal fans. When the bottom line says it's no longer making money, they'll terminate the game and not give a second thought about it. Or, if their accountants determine that Austin is a money pit, they'll close the Austin office and transfer SWTOR to a team they already have in a profitable location. This has nothing to do with caring about EAs profits - it's common sense. So you're saying that Bioware staff shouldn't use collective bargaining to secure their jobs and more resources to develop games because EA (of all companies) might lose a few dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightSaberAddiCt Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Do you even know what a union is? It sure as hell wouldnt mean more games being put out, it would mean less. Not to mention, cant really see myself feeling sorry for those poor game developers, especially at BW:A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xordevoreaux Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 (edited) So you're saying that Bioware staff shouldn't use collective bargaining to secure their jobs and more resources to develop games because EA (of all companies) might lose a few dollars. Linemen working for the phone company and machinists in auto plants form unions. Software developers don't scrape by on $11/hour. There are therefore damn few white-collar high-tech unions in existence, and the reason for that is salaried compensation in the market pushes compensation higher, not lower. High skill begets high wages, so you see few unions in high-skill/high-professional industries. The downward pressure on wages rests in the predominantly menial and repetitive jobs. It's there that motivation exists for people participating in those employment circles to unionize. Not high tech. High tech has only one downward pressure on jobs, and that's the hiring of H1-Bs, which we all know has been somewhat curtailed with this administration, and we're currently under the least amount of unemployment, including in high tech, in decades. That gives highly skilled workers one thing that the machinists and linemen don't have -- industry mobility. Highly skilled workers have high job mobility -- they can move to similarly lucrative positions at other jobs should compensation at their current company fall below current market standards for that compensation. Low-skilled and semi-skilled people lack that job mobility, so their wage protection manifests in the form of unions. But not in high tech. Edited August 1, 2018 by xordevoreaux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 So you're saying that Bioware staff shouldn't use collective bargaining to secure their jobs and more resources to develop games because EA (of all companies) might lose a few dollars. So you think they need to unionize and just demand more money to develop this game? You honestly think that's how this works?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psygenic Posted August 1, 2018 Author Share Posted August 1, 2018 Hopefully, Bioware staff would be able to gain more job security in case Anthem flops, and yes, more resources to develop this game. But just go ahead and argue the point since that's all you forum people care about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xordevoreaux Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Hopefully, Bioware staff would be able to gain more job security in case Anthem flops, and yes, more resources to develop this game. But just go ahead and argue the point since that's all you forum people care about. We are countering a nonsensical issue raised in a thread, and hopefully demonstrating the groundless premise to the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psygenic Posted August 1, 2018 Author Share Posted August 1, 2018 Ok you got me. It was a dumb idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlameYOL Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 I'd assume it's serious. It's only a "troll thread" if you don't agree with what's being said, according to my observation on these forums. I've seen threads I disagree with, but aren't troll threads. The 2 aren't the same but it's hard to tell in this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 (edited) So you're saying that Bioware staff shouldn't use collective bargaining to secure their jobs and more resources to develop games because EA (of all companies) might lose a few dollars. Collective bargaining will do nothing to provide more resources to any companies product or service development. Collective bargaining can serve a purpose in the context of labor rights for employees, but it would only do so if there are actually persistent labor rights violations taking place at Bioware. Given the number of federal and state labor laws in place to protect against unfair labor practices now days... it is highly unlikely that unionizing the studio staff would do anything positive for the staff at all. In fact.. it is likely to negatively impact them as it gives them some form of "collective" bargaining power.. but also requires they submit to the will of the union, pay dues to the union, be forced to be converted to hourly labor and the restrictions that come with that, be at the whim of the union in terms of seniority vs job cuts by a company, having yet another supervisor (the "union steward") in the mix, etc. etc. In the modern era of labor.....unions do not protect jobs per se.. they simply protect better against unfair labor practices (like substandard wages, bias in treatment of an employee, no overtime pay, being forced to work long hours, etc). They cannot stop layoffs or redirection of resources by a company, only set some of the terms of such actions). Besides.... historically unions have shown little benefit to professional "white collar" employees in most industries. I would suggest the OP become more familiar with the current state of labor laws and their inherent protections, as well as the history of collective bargaining in the non-blue collar segments of the national work force. Edited August 1, 2018 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthWoad Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 I've seen threads I disagree with, but aren't troll threads. The 2 aren't the same but it's hard to tell in this one. Well unionizing is a very good method of protecting peoples jobs and livelihoods, I don't see how that's a troll? And with the state of SWTOR now and the upcoming Anthem (we don't know how well it's going to do) it would be a good idea to secure your future as a developer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlameYOL Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Well unionizing is a very good method of protecting peoples jobs and livelihoods, I don't see how that's a troll? And with the state of SWTOR now and the upcoming Anthem (we don't know how well it's going to do) it would be a good idea to secure your future as a developer. Because unless EA is breaking some kind of law in regards to how they treat their employees I don't see the justification. Hence me asking whether or not it's a troll thread, how they treat the game is bad but are they treating the employees bad? Anyway OP admitted to being a stupid idea so I'll stop here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightSaberAddiCt Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Well unionizing is a very good method of protecting peoples jobs and livelihoods, I don't see how that's a troll? And with the state of SWTOR now and the upcoming Anthem (we don't know how well it's going to do) it would be a good idea to secure your future as a developer. Good developers have a good future, all unionization would do is make it harder to get rid of sub standard developers. Sorry but it is a bad idea. Job security is not owed, it is earned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rion_Starkiller Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 (edited) Ok you got me. It was a dumb idea. Git gud OP <insert more derogatory internet slang here> Edited August 1, 2018 by Rion_Starkiller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decxswx Posted August 1, 2018 Share Posted August 1, 2018 Unions discusses conditions and pay for the worker, not on what they do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmorrisson Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 (edited) Save SWTOR by moving Satele Shan to the West Coast. APAC ensured the server formerly known as Harbinger was active 24/7 even when the rest of the world is asleep. Edited August 2, 2018 by jimmorrisson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hebruixe Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 Is this a troll thread or serious? It's obviously a joke thread, despite the fact that it didn't really succeed at being funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanNV Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 If Anthem flops, they all get laid off anyway. Collective Bargaining won't save them. And if the development of SWTOR is an example of the expertise at BW:A, they'll deserve it when it happens. What would have save SWTOR is real development of the content players were asking for 5 years ago. Living up to the promises made at the Guild Summit would have gone a long way to help, if they'd done it in 6 months or so. Now it's too late. New people aren't flocking to this game and staying long term. Players who have left are now invested in other games and aren't flocking back no matter what they put out. At this point all they can do is hope to create something that will keep the current players from leaving. And from what I can see, they aren't even doing a great job of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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