Why Was Oricon Never Made Solo-Friendly?

[Ylliarus]

You are free to believe that.

 

However, the Oricon quests existed before this game ever knew purple quests.

 

At the end of the day, for me it's still an MMO and this is a part of it. I don't mind if they "fix" it, but for me they don't need to. My solution is to make the story end with the H2 and keep the ops quests optional.

 

When I play through the vanilla story and finish the class story, I can happily skip straight into SoR skipping Makeb and Oricon. Doesn't feel like there's something missing between the two as far as I'm concerned. That's how I feel about it.

 

All in all though, I don't think there's much of a reason for BW to do anything with this, but maybe my solution is just simple enough for them to sneak it in at some point. Who knows?

 

No I really think that would be the nost optimal approach as to thus subject and it would be very much in line with what we have seen regarding operations and story content thus far. Makeb operation is optional, Temple of Sacrifice is optional, Iokath's god machines are optional. So if the Heroic 2+ was the true end if the Oricon arc and the operations an optional continuation/finalization, I think that would be sufficient a solution as to making the Oricon arc more solo friendly.

 

The only question remaining would be when to implement this; which is not an easy one to reply to. Because some want it asap but I myself for example understand there are currently bigger fish to fry.

Edited September 12, 2017 by Ylliarus

[psandak]

I had a thought on my way home from work today...

 

If they did ever provide an alternative ending, would solo players want to still get the ops missions reward tauntaun?

 

And if the option was given: solo path OR group path, once you did one you cannot go back and do the other; if you do the solo path you lose the ability to ever get the group path and its rewards, would you still be OK with that...so long as you can complete the story?

 

I also do not think the "end after H2" would fly. To me "OK you've (the player) done the grunt work, now we (the faction) will handle the Dread Masters," feels anti-climactic. As has been pointed out, with SOR and Revan, regardless of the path chosen - solo or group - one must still finally defeat Revan (mechanics of the encounter aside).

[IoNonSoEVero]

I had a thought on my way home from work today...

 

If they did ever provide an alternative ending, would solo players want to still get the ops missions reward tauntaun?

 

And if the option was given: solo path OR group path, once you did one you cannot go back and do the other; if you do the solo path you lose the ability to ever get the group path and its rewards, would you still be OK with that...so long as you can complete the story?

 

I also do not think the "end after H2" would fly. To me "OK you've (the player) done the grunt work, now we (the faction) will handle the Dread Masters," feels anti-climactic. As has been pointed out, with SOR and Revan, regardless of the path chosen - solo or group - one must still finally defeat Revan (mechanics of the encounter aside).

 

It's not about the loot for me, and I fully do think that if someone completes an Op they're entitled to something special, like the Tauntaun. I don't think any solo players here are asking for that, and neither would I.

 

And since I have no intention of ever completing an Op, no, I don't care if taking the solo choice waives my ability to do the group quest.

 

I do think the optimal thing for solo players would to give them a way to defeat the Dread Masters solo, but at this point it's just about compromise to get to the end of the story arc.

Edited September 13, 2017 by IoNonSoEVero

[aerockyul]

I had a thought on my way home from work today...

 

If they did ever provide an alternative ending, would solo players want to still get the ops missions reward tauntaun?

 

And if the option was given: solo path OR group path, once you did one you cannot go back and do the other; if you do the solo path you lose the ability to ever get the group path and its rewards, would you still be OK with that...so long as you can complete the story?

 

I also do not think the "end after H2" would fly. To me "OK you've (the player) done the grunt work, now we (the faction) will handle the Dread Masters," feels anti-climactic. As has been pointed out, with SOR and Revan, regardless of the path chosen - solo or group - one must still finally defeat Revan (mechanics of the encounter aside).

 

Mounts are a dime a dozen (maybe less, even). Other than that one guy, no one who wants some (any) solo way to finish the Oricon arc is asking for it because of the rewards.

 

It's weird. Solo-centric posters say "I want to finish the story" or "I want to experience just the ending cutscene" or something like that, and it translates to the group players as "You just want the rewards" or "You want to take away our ability to group up".

 

Wanting to experience the things most raiders break their spacebars over is not the same as wanting anything else from the Ops or finding ways to take away content from group players.

[Ylliarus]

I had a thought on my way home from work today...

 

If they did ever provide an alternative ending, would solo players want to still get the ops missions reward tauntaun?

 

And if the option was given: solo path OR group path, once you did one you cannot go back and do the other; if you do the solo path you lose the ability to ever get the group path and its rewards, would you still be OK with that...so long as you can complete the story?

 

I also do not think the "end after H2" would fly. To me "OK you've (the player) done the grunt work, now we (the faction) will handle the Dread Masters," feels anti-climactic. As has been pointed out, with SOR and Revan, regardless of the path chosen - solo or group - one must still finally defeat Revan (mechanics of the encounter aside).

 

I really truly don't care about the Tauntaun mount xD if I want a Tauntaun mount I'll go to Hoth and do that little grind there or buy a reskinned Tauntaun mount from the GTN. Truly, I don't care about getting rewards or loot, if the price of having a solo alternative for Oricon was that I wouldn't be able to get any rewards not even CXP or EXP, then fine. No problem, I'll pay that price. If the subsequent price is that I am forever in eternity excluded from the Oricon operations (man, you sure like to put permanent and hard consequences to doing something solo) then so be it. If I get to play Oricon from start to end and get the full story experience of the that narrative, then I don't see why I should fret over never being able to do those 2 operations again.

 

Mounts are a dime a dozen (maybe less, even). Other than that one guy, no one who wants some (any) solo way to finish the Oricon arc is asking for it because of the rewards.

 

It's weird. Solo-centric posters say "I want to finish the story" or "I want to experience just the ending cutscene" or something like that, and it translates to the group players as "You just want the rewards" or "You want to take away our ability to group up".

 

Wanting to experience the things most raiders break their spacebars over is not the same as wanting anything else from the Ops or finding ways to take away content from group players.

 

And it's exactly what you say. When I made this thread I didn't even remotely consider the subject of rewards for a solo alternative. All I wanted was that players who have a solo focus would be able to finish the Oricon arc from start to end properly, without any operation walls being thrown up in front of them, or at least, have a backdoor available when operations are required to further the story. Really, I couldn't care less about a Tauntaun mount you get from the Operations, as if we didn't have enough of those as reskins around in the game

 

Apart from that one poster, those in favour of a solo alternative don't want any rewards in that solo alternative. We don't want a shortcut to let's say Wings of the Architect, we don't want to be more rewarded than raiders who put time and effort into completing the Oricon operations, we also don't want to take away people from raiding or have operations dissapear from the game. Those in favour of this suggestion only want

to be able to finish the Oricon arc in their personal playstyle. That is all, no more, no less.

Edited September 13, 2017 by Ylliarus

[orangenee]

I still do the weekly Revan solo just because I can.

 

I mean I just got through the SoR story with my trooper and the rewards from that now are completely obsolete. before the server took a dump that is....

 

If the Oricon Op had a solo equivalent it shouldn't have better rewards than a heroic. It just feels like a loose end really what with all the build up and the chat at the end of the sequence. It just feels like "OK, so we'll leave the very dangerous Sith Lords to sit and think about what they've done while I just go somewhere else".

 

There's no way this comp can run an op anyway so it'll just get left undone for now.

[VegasTheLost]

Not trying to be offensive here, but I keep seeing that 'All I want is the story' and 'Story, story, story' etc.

 

Thing is, no matter how much one tries to be a hardcore raider, one cannot ignore that the bossfights themselves tell the stories in these OPS. Not the 2 cinematic before the last bossfigts. You see, without the bossfights one can't imagine why Bestia is the beastmaster, why Tyrans is the tactician, why Calphy is the prophet for past and future and why Raptus is the leader. Or why Brontes is the scientist and Styrak is the warlord. And to be honest a solo fight would be underwhelming, trust me. Once you see these fights, especially in NiM, you know that moping up the floor with them just not gonna work as a story, even if it's titled as Story Mode or Solo Mode. You'll see that you needed a team to be truly cathartic.

 

So my advice is, just go for it, really do, and you'll see that it worth it. Not because of the rewards or cxp or whatever, but for the experience(not XP ). And as I said, if someone is on The Red Eclipse server I might can arrange a ride.

[Mubrak]

I still do the weekly Revan solo just because I can.

 

But the Revan Fight isn't the alternative to ToS, everyone does that. The solo players do the weekly instead of ToS.

 

As for cutting the story after the H2 being anti-climactic: Nowadays, the first time a solo player ever hears about the Dread Masters being a threat is when they get the Oricon quest. Section X was gutted (if you even figure out it exists) and the rest of the plot is told in the ops.

 

For an ops player Oricon may be a little solo interlude in a series of ops, but for the solo-player Oricon is a solo-questline that suddenly requires you to do an operation.

Edited September 13, 2017 by Mubrak

[orangenee]

But the Revan Fight isn't the alternative to ToS, everyone does that. The solo players do the weekly instead of ToS.

 

It's my only choice. If I go into ToS with my present rig I'd be about half an hour behind everybody else at 15 FPS if I'm lucky. So some of us can't do Ops as there's no point trying as we'd be useless due to hardware. I can't justify a "treat" like a new rig right now though I could afford it.

 

Raiders are just bricking it because they're running out of players to raid with. More solo options would further impinge their raidyness.

 

I doubt there'd be nearly as much railing against this topic if raiding was a flourishing pastime.

[masterceil]

It's my only choice. If I go into ToS with my present rig I'd be about half an hour behind everybody else at 15 FPS if I'm lucky. So some of us can't do Ops as there's no point trying as we'd be useless due to hardware. I can't justify a "treat" like a new rig right now though I could afford it.

 

Raiders are just bricking it because they're running out of players to raid with. More solo options would further impinge their raidyness.

 

I doubt there'd be nearly as much railing against this topic if raiding was a flourishing pastime.

 

It's not the lack of a raiding community that sets my opinion on the matter, but the lack of raids to do, period. Every hour that Bioware spends looking at Oricon (and there would be multiple hours involved, even just inserting a new cutscene after the Heroic or whatever) is one less hour that goes into the development of new content.

 

I couldn't care less about the idea of solo players getting their story. Those that want to run Operations can, will, and do already run them. Those that don't, won't, and having a solo-friendly option to end the Oricon storyline has no effect on that whatsoever. What it does have an effect on is where the devs are spending their time, and we're still three bosses short in Gods from the Machine.

[Jedi_riches]

It's not the lack of a raiding community that sets my opinion on the matter, but the lack of raids to do, period. Every hour that Bioware spends looking at Oricon (and there would be multiple hours involved, even just inserting a new cutscene after the Heroic or whatever) is one less hour that goes into the development of new content.

 

I couldn't care less about the idea of solo players getting their story. Those that want to run Operations can, will, and do already run them. Those that don't, won't, and having a solo-friendly option to end the Oricon storyline has no effect on that whatsoever. What it does have an effect on is where the devs are spending their time, and we're still three bosses short in Gods from the Machine.

 

And I couldn't care less howong it takes to finish God's from the machine, I see it as fixing a mistake they should never have done in the first place and yes it was a mistake bioware admitted as much when they did SOR the way they did. Fix existing content before doing new stuff.

[Ylliarus]

It's not the lack of a raiding community that sets my opinion on the matter, but the lack of raids to do, period. Every hour that Bioware spends looking at Oricon (and there would be multiple hours involved, even just inserting a new cutscene after the Heroic or whatever) is one less hour that goes into the development of new content.

 

I couldn't care less about the idea of solo players getting their story. Those that want to run Operations can, will, and do already run them. Those that don't, won't, and having a solo-friendly option to end the Oricon storyline has no effect on that whatsoever. What it does have an effect on is where the devs are spending their time, and we're still three bosses short in Gods from the Machine.

 

And I couldn't care less howong it takes to finish God's from the machine, I see it as fixing a mistake they should never have done in the first place and yes it was a mistake bioware admitted as much when they did SOR the way they did. Fix existing content before doing new stuff.

 

Look, I get that there is hostility between the two groups, group-content focus players and solo-focus players, albeit I have no clue as to why one is hostile to the other but when one does express snark/hate/spite towards one the other swiftly expresses the same sentiment. So let's try to remain civil.

 

I get the raiders and their frustration about the fact that operations are coming at a very, very slow pace. I also get the solo players who don't want the developers' entire focus to be solely on group content. But when we start arguing "I don't care about you" "I care about you neither" it won't get us anywhere. In all honesty, blunt honesty, I truly believe that the raiding community has been wronged with the fact that they didn't get a single operation since SoR. I am of the sincere opinion that the developers' time and resources definitely should be devoted in large parts to bringing out not only Gods of the Machine but also other new operations that don't come out on a monthly basis because truly it's somewhat preposterous to not get an operation in one release.

However, with that said I don't want group content to become the sole focus of the developers. I know, many raiders will say that they deserve that since story content got the sole focus with KotFE and KotET. Yet look at how happy that made you, do you think it would make the other half of the playerbase happy if the same mistake was made again? I am not saying this in an accusing manner, I say it in the way to express that was a bad idea, to give one aspect of the game all the focus. So if the developers would do the same now for group content and have that be the sole focus, then as I said the other half of the playerbase will be unhappy and complain.

 

Please understand that my request/suggestion to implement a solo-alternative to Oricon is not one to divert the attention of the developers from group content. I don't want Bioware to disregard the raiding community of this game nor do I want them to stop producing content for your guys. I am merely urging for an equal distribution of atttention, time and resources to all aspects of the game like Keith in his May 2017 Roadmap promised and stated was the teams intention. If it was the developers' goal to attend to all aspects of the game, why would it be so wrong to ask for some attention to go to making a solo alternative for Oricon? After all, the developer team did say they want to devote more resources and time to group content, but don't want to disregard other aspects of the game. By saying "I don't care whether you solo-players can play the game the way you want or not" you are asking the developers to devote their focus to one aspect of the game, which was a mistake in KotFE and KotET that should not be repeated again. The same also goes for the solo-focus players saying "I don't care if you can raid or not", let's not assume such stances towards one another as that only adds to the hostility.

Edited September 13, 2017 by Ylliarus

[Tsillah]

No I really think that would be the nost optimal approach as to thus subject and it would be very much in line with what we have seen regarding operations and story content thus far. Makeb operation is optional, Temple of Sacrifice is optional, Iokath's god machines are optional. So if the Heroic 2+ was the true end if the Oricon arc and the operations an optional continuation/finalization, I think that would be sufficient a solution as to making the Oricon arc more solo friendly.

 

The only question remaining would be when to implement this; which is not an easy one to reply to. Because some want it asap but I myself for example understand there are currently bigger fish to fry.

 

Well that's where it's at. From my point of view not everything has to be the same but I do get the frustration of having an unwanted quest stuck in your quest log (KotFE/KotET quests in my case).

 

What I do not know is how much work and/or possible issues are involved in such a change. I'll have to go through the story line again to see how that H2 ends when doing it as part of the story. The thing is that I just don't dare make any assumptions on what's easy or hard to change in this game with the engine it has.

[NeoBlakkrstal]

So on my Sith Inquisitor, Sith Sorcerer better said that I have been playing for years now the mission on Oricon is still there.. stuck at the same exact point... left untouched... It's where you have to finish the 2 OPS in order to finish the story arc on the planet. Which is something I don't understand why it hasn't been remedied to be solo-friendly.

 

I don't do OPS, I don't want to do them as it's not my playstyle and I don't need the pressure of it on my shoulders. Flashpoints sure I love 'em, PvP I do daily and love it with all my heart, but I'll stay away from OPS. Which is where my issue lies with because now I will never be able to finish Oricon. Why wasn't there an alternative added to the Dread Master Arc like we had in Shadow of Revan? People could choose to play the OPS or they could do dailies instead to progress the story. So, it's not like an alternative is unthinkable and lately Iokath also has a story arc that can be supplemented with an OPS but it's not vital to continue the story. I ask therefore again, why after all this time there wasn't crafted a solution for the Oricon story arc?

 

Perhaps the alternative could be really easy and doing the dailies will be what is needed. A more fun solution could be making an alternative flashpoint for the Oricon OPS that allow the player to experience the raids but it's not on actual Operations level and is also soloable for those who like that playstyle. You'd be given the choice whether you'd want to complete the Oricon story through OPS or Flashpoint. The latter would also be a good preparation for those who'd eventually want to dive into the operations.

 

My question is this, I understand you don't do Ops, but why not just go ahead and join a guild run for DF and DP when they happen? These two come up during conquest weeks as the Daily GF Op all the time. Just go on the runs with your guild, even if it isn't your play style, I am sure that your guild could guide you through the Ops, and then you would be done with them. No reason for EAware to nerf Oricon. They have taken the Nerf bat to enough content, thank you very much.

[NeoBlakkrstal]

I'll have to go through the story line again to see how that H2 ends when doing it as part of the story.

 

The Heroic on Oricon, when done as part of the planetary story arc, and NOT the daily, ends with you going back to speak with the Sith, and being given the Dread Masters Op mission to take the speeder to the Fortress entrance.

[Ylliarus]

My question is this, I understand you don't do Ops, but why not just go ahead and join a guild run for DF and DP when they happen? These two come up during conquest weeks as the Daily GF Op all the time. Just go on the runs with your guild, even if it isn't your play style, I am sure that your guild could guide you through the Ops, and then you would be done with them. No reason for EAware to nerf Oricon. They have taken the Nerf bat to enough content, thank you very much.

 

I get your sentiment, I get that it would be easier to say "just run the ops" and it would sweep the argument off the table that I and others have had negative experiences with raiders in the past and steer clear from it nowadays. However, I also have stated in this discussion that I am not the kind of person that can pull out 2 hours or more for an operation to sit non-stop behind my computer, because I have various obligations in real life that may pop up throughout the day or evening and I have to go, whether I am in an operation or not, whether the team is relying on me or not. It's not just a matter of not wanting to do it, but it's also the matter of difficulty with combining it with real life. For those kinds of people it would also be wonderful to have a solo-alternative because we'd have the opportunity to schedule in when doing what in the game at our own leasure, not having to rely on queue pops or announcements in general chat a group is being formed.

 

Also, I am already in a guild but we simply aren't a raiding one. We stick to Uprisings, Flaspoints and Heroics but leave operations be as that really isn't our interest at the moment. The community is very open and kind so I wouldn't want to leave my guild simply to run two operations.

Edited September 13, 2017 by Ylliarus

[Tsillah]

The Heroic on Oricon, when done as part of the planetary story arc, and NOT the daily, ends with you going back to speak with the Sith, and being given the Dread Masters Op mission to take the speeder to the Fortress entrance.

 

Ahh thanks. Yeah so then the key moment is when you speak to the Sith.

 

Depending on how that goes it could be either sufficient to make it possible to abandon the ops quest. It gets trickier if they have to change something in the convo cinematics.

[kodrac]

Nonetheless, this doesn't take away my belief that a solo alternative should be added some point in the future. Not now, but sometime.

 

I just don't see where they could squeeze in a soloable quest or Flashpoint. The OPs are literally kill the Dreadmasters. Would there be an alternative quest or Flashpoint to kill their slightly less-evil twins and call it a day?

[Tsillah]

I just don't see where they could squeeze in a soloable quest or Flashpoint. The OPs are literally kill the Dreadmasters. Would there be an alternative quest or Flashpoint to kill their slightly less-evil twins and call it a day?

 

That's why I suggested to let the storyline stop with the H2 where the end of the story comes down to "yay, we stopped the dreadmasters from executing their evil plot to take over the universe".

 

Then you can go for killing them in the operations if you want and pick up the one time quests optionally instead of having them pushed to your quest log automatically.

 

The only thing that needs doing is to sever the acquisition of the ops quest from completing the story version of the H2 and making sure that the convo at the end of that H2 feels like a story end. It's that last bit that can make it more tricky.

 

At the same time I'm not sure if this is something that BW even are interested in doing something about because I'm not sure how many people really are concerned with this. I have no way of substantiating that.

[Mubrak]

That's why I suggested to let the storyline stop with the H2 where the end of the story comes down to "yay, we stopped the dreadmasters from executing their evil plot to take over the universe".

 

Well, now that the quest can be abandoned, those that don't want to do the ops can abandon it and headcanon that the dread strongholds were nuked from orbit after their defenses were scattered. Those that don't want to abandon the quest, because they want to see the cutscenes and get the TaunTaun one day, should consider making today that day.

 

 

On the other hand, the actual question in the thread title is fair: Why didn't BW make Oricon into just another daily area without connection to any greater (pre-KotFE) plot?

 

They sure did so on Section X (cutting most ties to the Dread Masters plot) on Black Hole (no more mention of the Republic's pyrrhic victory on Corellia between local agitators and the Empire's scorched earth retreat) and on Makeb (no cat-and-mouse games that leave the Empire little room to mine the isotope 5 they worked so hard for.)

Edited September 13, 2017 by Mubrak

[supertimtaf]

I am not the kind of person that can pull out 2 hours or more for an operation to sit non-stop behind my computer, because I have various obligations in real life that may pop up throughout the day or evening and I have to go

 

Just so you know, no operation takes more than one hour (if you've got a really bad team with you). A good team will clear it in 45min or less, but I understand what you're saying.

 

Still, the main reason as for why the raiding community is quite... Opposed to this alternative (I don't count myself in this, because I have other reasons) is most likely because of the whole state of group content these past years.

Swtor is a game with very few raids, before 4.0 everything was cleared by most raiding guilds, because everybody knew what to expect. With 4.0, and with the lack of developpement towards group content, the dev team decided to bolster up operations, making them difficult again without changing anything or bringing anything new. Heck, they even nerfed the story mode by a lot (removing entire phases from boss battles, or even removing the entire mechanic). This put the raiding community in... I don't wanna say despair, but more like an angry state. Not only they didn't get anything to play around for a long time, but the only content they could do was old content, made insanely more difficult (for HM and NiM) in order to keep them busy for the year, without any new reward or incentive to clear it. Talk about cheap work.

 

This made the raiding community... leave. For somewhere else, where they could find new and interesting challenge. This is what caused a bit of an exodus on some servers that are now dead.

 

Now we're on Game Update 5. X

Great, a new operation, this made the few peoples that were still into intensive raiding interested into new content. Finally, they'd get to have new challenges and... Oh, crap. A single boss ? And the next one is in 4 months ? Well...

I think you see what made them cry a lot for this operation. The whole operation was planned to be released entirely in a single year. We're almost at the end of this year and we only have two boss released.

 

For the old content, it was still bolstered up, in order to keep raiders "entertained". Sadly it was done in a really bad way. Most of the previous dps check became really hard, because BW didn't took the time to rebalance the whole fight and prefered using an automatic bolster solution. As a result, some HM boss fights requires dps checks that are as tough as the one you encounter in NiM, making "normal" raid progression really hard.

Add to this the whole "class nerf" thing, which made raiding worse by a lot, because most of the class, except when put in hand of legendary-skilled players, cannot handle anymore tight dps check.

You know, another way to keep peoples is to usually makes an ops harder. BW decided to nerf every class instead of working on this, because it's super difficult to work on a new operation AND to adjust numbers on an old one.

 

As for the new operation, we had hopes that it would be interesting. Sadly it was so badly balanced that the first boss was way too easy in SM and almost impossible on Hard... Funny thing is that the second boss has no real change of difficulty between story and hard mode.

 

 

Yeah, the whole raiding community is leaving, and most of them are quite depressed by the whole aspect of the game now. Don't be so harsh on them because they want to experiment new content.

For them, the whole Kotfe/Kotet thing is almost two year spend into solo-content only. And now they are seeing post like this, that ask to make the few things that are still group exclusive soloable ? I can at least understand their frustration.

 

 

Again, why not ending the quest chain with the end of the Heroic ? "Congrats, you saved the galaxy, now either you go home and report to Marr that the job is done or you sign up for the strike team that will kick the Dreadmaster's *ss."

 

Seems fine by me, still leaves some choices for the player, without forcing him/her into an unwanted operation... While still allowing peoples to be interested into raiding. This community lack of new peoples. Don't remove them one of the few opportunity they have to find new players interested in this. We both know that the "hey, solo ending or operation ending ?" won't make peoples try the operation. It's the whole theme of the dark side : "The easy way is the best way". And from what we've all seen here, I doubt we can call anyone on this topic a "Jedi".

Edited September 13, 2017 by supertimtaf

[psandak]

Not trying to be offensive here, but I keep seeing that 'All I want is the story' and 'Story, story, story' etc.

 

Thing is, no matter how much one tries to be a hardcore raider, one cannot ignore that the bossfights themselves tell the stories in these OPS. Not the 2 cinematic before the last bossfigts. You see, without the bossfights one can't imagine why Bestia is the beastmaster, why Tyrans is the tactician, why Calphy is the prophet for past and future and why Raptus is the leader. Or why Brontes is the scientist and Styrak is the warlord. And to be honest a solo fight would be underwhelming, trust me. Once you see these fights, especially in NiM, you know that moping up the floor with them just not gonna work as a story, even if it's titled as Story Mode or Solo Mode. You'll see that you needed a team to be truly cathartic.

 

So my advice is, just go for it, really do, and you'll see that it worth it. Not because of the rewards or cxp or whatever, but for the experience(not XP ). And as I said, if someone is on The Red Eclipse server I might can arrange a ride.

 

Thank you for bringing this up, because I struggled to get the same thought into words.

 

To those who answered my question, thank you for confirming what I thought would be the case but that I was afraid was not: you confirmed that you do not care about the rewards. In this case, I have a solution that should be not terribly difficult to implement: after the character is sent on the mission to enter the Dread Fortress, you are given the option:

 

option A: play through the operations and get the rewards and see the entire story

option B: you the player are choosing to skip the operation missions and will have your character flagged as if it completed the operations and you can therefore experience the final cutscene. Add an "are you sure? You can't go back once this flag is flipped" warning.

 

That said I think some misunderstood. I did not mean to say, "if you do the solo path you can NEVER do the operation." What I meant to say was, "if you chose the solo path you give up the operation path mission rewards."

 

What I do not know is how much work and/or possible issues are involved in such a change. I'll have to go through the story line again to see how that H2 ends when doing it as part of the story. The thing is that I just don't dare make any assumptions on what's easy or hard to change in this game with the engine it has.

 

I recently (last weekend) went through the Oricon story and the short version is that after the H2 you are told, "OK now everything is ready or as ready as it will ever be...invade the Dread Fortress."

 

If the story were to end there for the character, it would seem disjointed IMO. basically being, "OK you've done all the grunt work now leave the real challenge to others." That is not a very "heroic" ending.

 

Think about the movie Die Hard. If John McLane took out three-quarters of the bad guys and then he said, "OK LA cops come on in."

Or Arnold in Commando...he does all the leg work to figure out where they are holding his daughter and then he calls the Army and says, "here they are go get 'em!"

Or closer to home...The Jedi Knight class story. the JK works so hard to fight to get to the Emperor and then the Jedi Order says, "OK you've done enough. We'll take it from here."

[Mubrak]

That said I think some misunderstood. I did not mean to say, "if you do the solo path you can NEVER do the operation." What I meant to say was, "if you chose the solo path you give up the operation path mission rewards."

[...]

If the story were to end there for the character, it would seem disjointed IMO. basically being, "OK you've done all the grunt work now leave the real challenge to others." That is not a very "heroic" ending. "

 

Sure, but it could be as simple as not starting "[Ops] Descend into the Dark Fortress" automatically but putting it on the mission board instead (or doing so when you abandon the quest) so that you can do the quest when you feel ready for operations (or have the oportunity to do so)

 

As it is, the quest will block one of your 25 mission slots until you abandon it or do the operations, which, even if you don't refuse to do operations, may take weeks if you aren't in a guild that regularly does ops runs (especially as a rather new undergeared dps). By the time you get to do it on that char, you most likely already are on Iokath, and the Dread War should be not much more than a distant memory from your character's point of view.

Edited September 14, 2017 by Mubrak

[Ylliarus]

Sure, but it could be as simple as not starting "[Ops] Descend into the Dark Fortress" automatically but putting it on the mission board instead (or doing so when you abandon the quest) so that you can do the quest when you feel ready for operations (or have the oportunity to do so)

 

As it is, the quest will block one of your 25 mission slots until you abandon it or do the operations, which, even if you don't refuse to do operations, may take weeks if you aren't in a guild that regularly does ops runs (especially as a rather new undergeared dps). By the time you get to do it on that char, you most likely already are on Iokath, and the Dread War should be not much more than a distant memory from your character's point of view.

 

The operation quest not starting and simply being something you have to manually acquire after you are done with the heroic really is the easiest option. It may come over somewhat silly as to the fact that the PC indeed does the grunt work and the Empire would handle the dread masters afterwards, but nonetheless for those who simply want to finish Oricon and not have it be stuck in the mission log is a fine solution. Very low maintenance and easy to implement.

[JattaGin]

Just so you know, no operation takes more than one hour (if you've got a really bad team with you). A good team will clear it in 45min or less, but I understand what you're saying.

 

That's what they always tell you to lurk you in, but do not believe the lies! No operation is ever done in under 1 hour.

 

The walkthrough itself might only take 45 minutes. But at least 4 of the following things ALWAYS happen:

 

1. After you have 8 (16) players, it takes nonetheless 20 minutes until the team finally enters the OP.

 

2. The main tank disconnects and then has to reassamble his/her computer which takes at least 15 minutes.

 

3. The healer's cat scratches the door of his room and his mum yells at him to do something about it. This takes 3 times 5 minutes.

 

4. Various short breaks for smoking and/or toilet break, never at the same time though but in a row.

 

5. Dinner time.

 

6. The mum of one of the DPS needs the computer for herself, so the DPS has to quit the group.

 

7. The replacement for the DPS takes 15 minutes to join the OPs, because he has to list his crafts on the GTN first.

 

8. Your group wipes 4 times at trash, because no one pays attention or cares.

 

9. Bugs prevent you from progressing in the OPs.

 

You might think I'm joking, but all of the above always happened and happen when I play OPs. It's one of the reasons I dislike this content.

Edited September 14, 2017 by JattaGin