Server Merge Discussion Thread

[omaan]

source?

 

Server merge discussion thread

[CrazyCT]

Server merge discussion thread

 

{Ah, 5 people demanding it and 5 people against it - Ladies and Gentlemen, I present "The Majority".}

Edited July 30, 2017 by CrazyCT

[OwenBrooks]

Ah, 5 people demanding it and 5 people against it - Ladies and Gentlemen, I present "The Majority".

 

I chuckled when i read this

Edited July 30, 2017 by OwenBrooks

[omaan]

{Ah, 5 people demanding it and 5 people against it - Ladies and Gentlemen, I present "The Majority".}

 

 

Messages numbers from different players in server merge discussion thread which voted FOR implementation of merges:

2,4,5,11,12(Not directly, but it is for server merge),15, 16, 19,20 (Not directly, but it is for server merge), 26, 31, 33, 39, 43, 52 (Not directly, but it is for server merge), 57, 70, 72, 77, 94, 98 (Not directly, but it is for server merge), 105,107,116 ETC.

 

Learn to count. AND IT IS only first 12 PAGES.

 

Those who are against are mostly the same rp-persons (retajack, Cesarabit and a few others) repeating their messages to others, and these players are in minority.

Edited July 30, 2017 by omaan

[ZionHalcyon]

Someone has to do it.

 

I'd argue we have too many. If a player has to white knight for a developer, it means that the white knighter passively believes the development team is unable to defend themselves and needs said white knight player to come to their defense.

 

When you get into the psychological reasons for repeated white knighting, it is the pinnacle of a form of narcissism and hubris.

 

Doesn't mean people can't disagree with critics-everyone has a different opinion. But those that thrive on jumping into threads and arguing with paying customers who have a criticism of the game may need to re-evaluate their priorities.

[Eshvara]

I'd argue we have too many. If a player has to white knight for a developer, it means that the white knighter passively believes the development team is unable to defend themselves and needs said white knight player to come to their defense.

 

When you get into the psychological reasons for repeated white knighting, it is the pinnacle of a form of narcissism and hubris.

 

Doesn't mean people can't disagree with critics-everyone has a different opinion. But those that thrive on jumping into threads and arguing with paying customers who have a criticism of the game may need to re-evaluate their priorities.

 

I don't notice many If I have to be honest. I know of 1 Elite Warlord white knight on the forums. Compared to that person, the others don't even stand out.

 

And no, I'm not talking about o'l dasty. Though sillyness aside, I personally don't really like to call people white knights or use that term.

It makes me feel like the people who use the word sjw.😔 Not a fan.

 

If I ever use the word White knight in a serious manner, you can throw me in the sewage. I can't swim.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Eshvara

[Zeng]

NO! Please don't speak for me. I've been here from day one, read the forums a lot but rarely post until some righteous person believes they know what I WANT. So don't assume YOU know what I NEED. If YOU are on a low population server that is YOUR fault, get off that server and find a new one. Don't ***** and moan that you want to merge because YOU can't be bothered to pay for a server transfer. Don't have money to pay for it ? Get off your butt and find a job! Flame me all you want but I am sick of people that claim to know what the COMMUNITY wants. Too many games have been wrecked by poster thinking they know everything and claim it's what everyone wants. IT'S NOT! Not everyone that play this game read the forums so don't claim YOU speak for everyone! It's just YOU! Edited July 30, 2017 by Zeng

[ZionHalcyon]

I don't notice many If I have to be honest. I know of 1 Elite Warlord white knight on the forums. Compared to that person, the others don't even stand out.

 

And no, I'm not talking about o'l dasty. Though sillyness aside, I personally don't really like to call people white knights or use that term.

It makes me feel like the people who use the word sjw.😔 Not a fan.

 

If I ever use the word White knight in a serious manner, you can throw me in the sewage. I can't swim.

 

Trust me, I know you don't mean dasty. Those of us who have been active on the Forum longer than 6 months at a time span within the last 5 years now exactly who you are talking about.

[CrazyCT]

Messages numbers from different players in server merge discussion thread which voted FOR implementation of merges:

2,4,5,11,12(Not directly, but it is for server merge),15, 16, 19,20 (Not directly, but it is for server merge), 26, 31, 33, 39, 43, 52 (Not directly, but it is for server merge), 57, 70, 72, 77, 94, 98 (Not directly, but it is for server merge), 105,107,116 ETC.

 

Learn to count. AND IT IS only first 12 PAGES.

 

Those who are against are mostly the same rp-persons (retajack, Cesarabit and a few others) repeating their messages to others, and these players are in minority.

 

How many of them are original people, and not sock puppets supporting themselves? And Bioware came out and said there were 1,000,000 subs (I have my doubts, but it's the only figure we have to go on), so even if you had 1,000 unique players supporting your case, that's only 1 thousandth (0.1%) of the population.

 

Learn to math.

 

Hardly a majority.

[Eshvara]

How many of them are original people, and not sock puppets supporting themselves? And Bioware came out and said there were 1,000,000 subs (I have my doubts, but it's the only figure we have to go on), so even if you had 1,000 unique players supporting your case, that's only 1 thousandth (0.1%) of the population.

 

Learn to math.

 

Hardly a majority.

 

Nvm, misread.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Eshvara

[Deewe]

Heya Keith.

 

This topic is extremely overdue since 18+ months now and should have gotten top priority from day one when you took office. Now, it's half?! a year later, you have nothing to present other than vague obvious months long possible processes and the bottom line is nothing will happen for quite some time to come. You don't seem to realize or understand (or realized it too late) that this topic should have been solved YESTERDAY.

I am lucky enough to play on a populated server (Ebon Hawk) and totally agree with the above.

 

Server population should have been the top 1 priority.

 

You might get players back with new content but those who leave disgruntled by the lack of action in terms of server population won't get back.

[Thruine]

Can't everyone on a low population server just get a free transfer rather than merging servers or megaservers. I don't like some of the problems that come with server mergers and magaservers just make things like heroics even more crowded (where two can sometimes be enough to cause wait). Not sure why we need to merge servers. And if they do, I hope its low populated with low populated and not low with mid to heavy. If there are problems, keep the casualty rate down as much as possible.

[Spyderwoman]

Good luck with making demands on what you feel they have to do with their game.

 

Typical of most forum posts though, they only come here to complain

[CrazyCT]

Typical of most forum posts though, they only come here to complain

 

Are you saying that the majority are actually happy with the game the way it is, and don't feel the need to come to the forums to whine about it?

[LD_Little_Dragon]

Yet, most of the players want it, which means it must be happened. I hope, you kid are old enough to understand that all important changes are implemented when MOST of the subjects demand it. Minority has no power to choose for majority. Welcome to real world. You can have your rp server, so you could stay there with a small group of players drinking imaginary whine and chatting garbage in cantinas but it doesn't mean active players must suffer.

 

Who are you to determine who is and isn't a majority? Repeat posters don't count more than people who only rarely, or never, post at all.

 

And 'active players'? What does that mean? Here's a tip for you - not every player has to pug or PvP to be a real active player. In fact, I would argue that the RP'ers are far more social and group orientated then your so-called 'active player'.

 

I'm a solo player myself - and do you think Bioware cares? Cash is cash even if a player does nothing but sit around all day watching the clouds fly by on Hoth.

 

Let's say they merge all servers - it won't magically make me suddenly start using GF. You can spend 90cc and move to a server where GF pops more often. What do you think a server merge will do that you transferring won't?

[ekwalizer]

Thank you Eric!

 

I am all for mergers because I believe keeping dead servers active does more harm than good. Players who return to, or roll on, those dead servers, are faced with the illusion that SWTOR is a dead game...which it is not.

 

There are a few primary concerns:

• Guild assets

• RP servers

• Names

 

Guild assets should be handled in advance of any merger by Bioware, on a case by case basic. Guild ships and guild strongholds would need to be unlocked on a new server and special help in reforming guilds should happen. Any merger needs to be as smooth as possible and guilds are one of the most important assets of this game.

 

RP server either need to continue to exist, or they need to have special accommodations in a merged scenario.

 

Name purge prior to any transfers and moving high population servers to the lower pop ones is what I would expect. That doesn't negate naming issues, but it does help.

 

One additional thing I would like, with or without a merger, is an expansion of the /ignore list. The current limit is too low and I believe it needs to be higher.

 

They can, and have previously, handled guild assets (banks specifically). So this shouldn't be very difficult for them. Granted there are more "moving pieces" with a flagship than a bank. But the way it used to work was that the GL sent a ticket telling them where the guild was going and the DungeonMasters verified their assets and granted said assets on the destination server.

 

While a name purge is probably the easiest thing for them to do, wouldn't it be better to have them redesign the naming convention to something similar to what Cryptic uses? Then my main would be Ciks@Ekwalizer (on JC) and the @Ekwalizer could be hidable under options.

 

I don't have much of an opinion on RP servers, but it seems to me that one RP server should be enough. Considering the Player Vs Whatever is now an opt-in function at the player level there is definitely no reason to leave any PvP servers open (I haven't logged in longer than necessary to retain control of my guild in about a year so I don't know what has and has not transpired).

 

The NA servers are going to be a cakewalk compared to the EU servers.

Edited July 30, 2017 by ekwalizer

[ekwalizer]

 

Would just prefer that a rp server like Ebon Hawk stay just the way it is and not be merged with a server, say like, Harbinger.

 

I think most reasonable people would support retaining an RP server like EH.

[ekwalizer]

Please ensure that no one will be negatively impacted by server merges by ensuring that any and all issues surrounding server merges have been resolved prior to considering server merges.

 

As it stands now, every player has the option to play on a server with a population that matches their population/community desires. There is no reason to negatively impact multitudes of players because some players refuse to avail themselves of any of the options they already have to play on a server with a population more to their liking.

 

Rat,

 

It is impossible to please everyone, all the time. I understand your point, even if I did have to wade deep into your sarcasm. But the fact of the matter is that players do not have the right to play on the server of their choice (all the time). There are, and have been for quite some time, far too many servers when compared to the server capabilities and player density.

[Mevan]

Merge the servers already!

 

Put TOFN and Progenitor into TRE!

 

Stupid idea is stupid^

[omaan]

How many of them are original people, and not sock puppets supporting themselves? And Bioware came out and said there were 1,000,000 subs (I have my doubts, but it's the only figure we have to go on), so even if you had 1,000 unique players supporting your case, that's only 1 thousandth (0.1%) of the population.

 

Learn to math.

 

Hardly a majority.

IT's called average numbers lol, u physically cant get an answer from everyone is swtor, so devs are making such threads to see how many players support or not support their decision. By your logic bioware should not have made all those discussion threads where they received feedback from people and made their choices relating on that feedback (UC drops from operation bosses, buff bolster etc) just because they haven't asked everyone in the game. In addition to this, those who are not writing on forum are a type of people who just don't care, they will play whatever decisions are made here, and will start to complain only if something very serious happens.

 

Relying on that thread we can clearly see that there are MUCH MORE players who wants servers to be merged OR cross-server queues implemented. It's time for bioware to choose which one of these two will be implemented, YET they don't have a choice to ignore it. Whether it will be cross-server or server merges i don't care BUT IT must be done.

 

You said that there is 5/5 for and against merges but it is not.

[MissilyMilcasia]

I'm all for a good bioware "***" fest, but they really have made it quite clear.

 

Cross-Server is NOT happening. It's been said like 500 times by now. If it is that much of a problem, play another game. For anyone still confused: IT IS NOT HAPPENING.

 

With server merges:

 

People have too many assets that don't transfer across servers for this to be feasible.

 

Guilds, guild banks and guild ships (a fully decorated one can cost hundreds of millions) DO NOT transfer.

 

Strongholds and Legacy Storage (potentially millions to people) DO NOT transfer.

 

Stamped Dyes in outfit slots (again millions in value) DO NOT transfer.

 

Names right now are being held by everyone's nameholders or a random level 1 who hasn't logged in since 2014 and really are not helpful.

 

When they last did it, the only issues were character and legacy names. People didn't have so many alts at that time, and thus names weren't a major issue. At that time, legacy was an issue and then they corrected it by making legacy names whatever you want. Now everyone has lots of assets that don't transfer. That's why the server transfer cost is low. They want people to move, but they want people to be responsible for themselves so that bioware doesn't have to clean up the mess.

 

Besides, could you imagine the forum meltdown if server transfers were forced before this was fixed? This game would quite literally lose a majority of their subs and revenue overnight, and the forums would be 10x worse.

 

They have said the most likely solution is new megaservers (most likely so that the name issues aren't problematic) but have made it clear they have a lot of technical considerations before its feasible. Besides, they are trying (in my mind at least) to turn the ship around and bring some people back. I'm not saying they've been successful, or that there is much hope, but Keith has shown a shift in the status quo that I think might be well-received if they do another expansion, and might want to preserve whats in place.

 

This issue is so overblown. If its that bad, transfer to a populated server, and deal with the consequences of losing some of your assets by remaking them. If its isn't, stay put, and make a coffee while you wait for a PvP/PvE pop. I'd rather them focus on making actual content and keep players from leaving instead of just trying to round up the remaining people.

Edited July 30, 2017 by MissilyMilcasia

[Eshvara]

Maybe they can do server linking like Wow has/had.

[Cartiza]

Rat,

 

It is impossible to please everyone, all the time. I understand your point, even if I did have to wade deep into your sarcasm. But the fact of the matter is that players do not have the right to play on the server of their choice (all the time). There are, and have been for quite some time, far too many servers when compared to the server capabilities and player density.

 

Then by your own logic you have no right to ask for servers to be merged so you can play on a highly populated server..we do have the right to play on a server that meets our needs just like you do. I don't want to play on a highly populated server for MANY reasons and to force me to move to one WILL make me leave the game and I won't be the only one.

 

Server population is NOT what made people leave...the population is what it is because people left because of class balance...Iokath...Command Ranks etc There is a fix may not be easy but fixing all the technical problems isn't easy either. Cross over ques is the answer but they refuse to do this. Players losing all the things they have worked so hard for over the years and losing those things because people want faster ques will cause even more people to leave so merging servers will not solve the problem but go ahead and push for it and see what happens. I read that those of us who didn't want to merge would not be forced guess that was a lie to.

[Otaktey]

Concerning moving a Guild:

1. Let the Guild Master be able to sell the ship back to the vendor for a "Guild Ship Certificate". The certificate has no credit value, but will let the guild master respawn the ship on the destination server.

2. Allow the Guild master and Officers take the decorations out of the guild vault, but leave it bound. So no one can sell them. In the guild settings, the guild master can set which class of guild members can take decorations out, the same as it can be set for taking credits, items, making changes to the vault, etc... This will allow guilds to move and take everything with them.

3. Guild achievements and conquests are a different animal. The Guild itself would have to have a legacy or something for that to move. I recently tried to move a character and it said I could not because he was a guild master. So the game knows if you are trying to move as a guild master, we just need it to attach the guild accomplishments to that character and then move from server to server with that character.

4. Another approach to #1 and #2: Have all stronghold decorations attach to the stronghold like armorings, mods, and enhancements attach to gear. This would be even better, as when you get to the destination server, you can respawn the ship or your personal stronghold and everything will be right where you left it. Also allow players to sell their personal stronghold back to the vendor for a "Stronghold Certificate". The certificate is actually a file with all the information about the stronghold or guild ship.

 

Just some ideas for the team to think about. This could be implemented right now and would not have to wait for a decision to be made on server mergers. It would eliminate one of the topics of this thread and help us all chip away at this stone called server mergers.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Otaktey
spelling

[Mdgshorty]

Thanks for the /slap! Yep, we haven't been communicating anything about our server plans, but I have dropped a number of hints. Even in the interview I did, I said we are considering virtually everything in this thread, plus a ton of other technical details.

 

I know you all know this, but I'll remind you anyway, if a server merge was the direction, then we need to make sure we understand the reasons why players don't want to move. We have hardware/software, connectivity, and database considerations. We also have a ton of in-game 'things' to consider like Legacy Cargo Hold slots across multiple-servers, decorations and Strongholds, currency caps, merging of Legacies, number of characters on a server, keeping guilds and guild assets intact, and more. You also have Conquests and the domination of large guilds over everyone else, area respawn rates, and so on.

 

Lastly, as we've done with our East Coast servers, we need to upgrade the environment to ensure it's a great experience for everyone. I am very hopeful I can layout the game plan for you in the upcoming Roadmap. I'm not committing to that, yet, as there are a number of questions I need answered before I can give you any further insight.

 

Have a great weekend,

 

Keith---

 

Keith,

 

I can only imaging what you all go through. I know its not an easy choice to decide or not to decide to do server mergers. No matter which way you go, you are not going to keep people happy. Some people like the big servers and some people actually do like the smaller servers. People have different play styles.

 

I have been playing the game since since before it came out. I was in one of the last betas before the game came out. I have seen a lot over the years and how the game has evolved since then. I have to admit that I have not always liked every decision that was made, but I adapted to those changes. I usually come in without a huge expectation and that has always worked well for me.

 

Having said that, I have gone through the past server merges. I probably lost a number of character names in those server merges. I even had one that I had to change twice because of it. Back then, we did not have as many assets as we do now. We had guilds, but we did not have guild ships, guild strongholds, personal strongholds, legacy bank. At least the first time there was a server merge, it was a real pain to get the guilds reset up on the new server if my memory remembers correctly. I believe the last time was a lot easier as they added the guild name@servername for guilds that had same names and the GMs did not have to do anything that time.

 

We do have a lot more to think about these days Conquest, Strongholds, Guildships, Legacy storage, dyes and etc. I know I have said this before but I am going to say it again. If you are able to, it may be better to move mostly everything to account wide rather than Legacy Wide. This would save hopefully save most of the headache of trying to deal with legacy issues in case of server mergers. Legacy is fine if you only have characters on one server but it becomes more of a headache when there are people who have legacies on multiple servers.

 

Conquest would be a big sticking point. As you mentioned, there are certain guilds that always seem to dominate the conquest board. You would need to increase the top 10 to maybe top 20 or more. There are even some guilds that have multiple guilds that dominate multiple boards.

 

STO has armada. I would like to see something similar to it in SWTOR, but not exactly the same. I was thinking in something in regards to calling it a guild alliance. Whomever is main guild in the alliance is, is the one that sets the conquest for the week. The benefit of this is the bigger the alliance, the better chance of getting on the conquest board. So you can have a bunch of smaller guilds being able to get on the conquest board and bigger guild not being able to dominate multiple boards. If you have a system like this it would still be faction specific and you would have a separate chat similar to guild chat for the alliance.

 

If there is a merger in regards to multiple legacies on multiple servers, why not have the multiple legacy names and trees?

Edited July 30, 2017 by Mdgshorty