Server Merge Discussion Thread

[Totemdancer]

Hint on european (french, at least) servers: people have already left.

 

I came back recently on Nihilus, french pvp. A quick eye on the GTN told me that things were bad.

Then the next night, prime time, i get a whisper to queue in gsf cause they wanted a match to proc (i did, and nope)

Then i try to queue for flashpoints, nothing after half an hour. same for uprisings.

 

Didn't try pvp or ops yet but i guess i'm gonna wait a lot.

Guess a lot transferred, but i don't really want to if i loose my tatooine stronghold.

 

At this point, and with the ability to switch pve/pvp, this server has no use, i'm alone on all planets (if i switch to pve, i see 4 or 5 on starter planets), fleet is empty prime time.

I saw one enemy player on yavin in a week.

 

I understand the arguments i read here, but they could merge us with a pve server and noone would see the difference.

 

This is a prime example of what's happening to people returning to the game. Except most don't post on the forums.

The only thing I can suggest is to do one transfer for 90cc to Red Eclipse (I think that's the most active). That will bring your legacy with you and you can start over. You also shouldn't lose your stronghold, but you will need to rehook everything once you get there, I took photos before I transferred to help me when I did it.

Hopefully they will merge soon and you'll be reunited with the rest of your characters. All the best and I hope you'll stick around till we at least know what's in the road map.

[Storm-Cutter]

The problem there is that BW/EA hasn't been great at business decisions for this game.

 

It hasn't been great at ANY decisions for this game.... hence the low populations, the reliance on direct market sales of shiny items, and the general apathy on important topics like the OP mentioned. - For instance the server merge discussion thread is currently at ~3,000 posts, and not even an acknowledgement of the general tone, theme or direction from the studio. - THAT'S how much they care.

[sknitro]

I'm returning player too, and it seems dead although i read on reddit that, my original server (Progenitor, rep side) is "well" populated server...it was not "great" in the past too but:

- waiting 4h for GSF is not healthy for my nerves

- PvP looks the same (low lvl is nonexistent I think)

- waiting for flashpoint was missery as well

- leveling planets is empty - onece in a while I saw someone doing heroics and that was all

 

Merge will help a little I think...(sorry for language but) why the hell we have 3x ENG + 3x FR + 3x DE servers?

Isnt 1x ENG +1x FR+1x DE not enough (or one "mega" server *puppy eyes*)

Sadly now it seems like I play singleplayer game...

[orangenee]

Oh yeah, Rep side Progenitor is vacant. It's pretty much Imps or bust.

[sknitro]

Oh yeah, Rep side Progenitor is vacant. It's pretty much Imps or bust.

 

its sad...now i feel like i make a mistake with resubing

I really like this game, but playing imp (side i dont like) only to be able to do "mmo" stuff in MMO is is.... *crying in corner*

[JattaGin]

BadCuzMad...now who does that remind me of:rak_03:

 

 

/5char

[TyonYlle]

+ 1 to include information on mergers.

 

- 1 on only having two servers.

 

There needs to be one server per region. One server in the US, regardless of which one it is, will drive more people away than now.

- The only solution I think would work is to merge east coast with TEH and west coast with Harb, I won't comment on EU because I don't know which server is the better choice -

 

+ 1 for sensible suggestion. I cannot understand what the fascination about having one US server is?

[Velgar]

A question for all those loudly advocating merges. What will you say if the people on the merged servers lose guild ships and/or other things and just quit altogether?

And what will you say if a good portion of the people still playing on those servers who have not moved on their own do not magically show up in your queues but instead continuing playing solo the way they are happy doing now and the merge does nothing for your queue times?

 

I play on JC and am quite happy to continue there. If JC gets merged, I will not suddenly start showing up in any type of queue. Getting merged is not going to change my play style. Merges are not the cure-all people think they are. They did merges in LOTRO, it did not bring people back. I doubt it will here either.

 

My formerly well populated friends list and the large raiding guild I was in are all empty and gone, none of them left over queue times, they left due to slow content releases of varying types, some due to pvp, some due to group content and some due to story content and the last over GC and CXP nonsense. And they are not coming back, they have moved on.

 

Spending money solving all the problems of a server merge just takes away from resources that could go to content, without fresh content of all kinds in sufficient quantities to hold interest and subs, server merges are a mirage that will solve nothing. Releasing an OP one boss at a time over a year+ shows just how thin their resources are at this point.

[SolarSaenz]

A question for all those loudly advocating merges. What will you say if the people on the merged servers lose guild ships and/or other things and just quit altogether?

And what will you say if a good portion of the people still playing on those servers who have not moved on their own do not magically show up in your queues but instead continuing playing solo the way they are happy doing now and the merge does nothing for your queue times?

 

I play on JC and am quite happy to continue there. If JC gets merged, I will not suddenly start showing up in any type of queue. Getting merged is not going to change my play style. Merges are not the cure-all people think they are. They did merges in LOTRO, it did not bring people back. I doubt it will here either.

 

My formerly well populated friends list and the large raiding guild I was in are all empty and gone, none of them left over queue times, they left due to slow content releases of varying types, some due to pvp, some due to group content and some due to story content and the last over GC and CXP nonsense. And they are not coming back, they have moved on.

 

Spending money solving all the problems of a server merge just takes away from resources that could go to content, without fresh content of all kinds in sufficient quantities to hold interest and subs, server merges are a mirage that will solve nothing. Releasing an OP one boss at a time over a year+ shows just how thin their resources are at this point.

 

To follow up on this point, I have questions for those who are "pro server merge".

How does server mergers benefit anyone, the player base, or the game in general?

Are those "pro server merge" people hoping that if BW is no longer paying the data center for the would be decommissioned servers, they will put that money back into the game?

I know it seems like a basic question "How does server mergers benefit anyone?", but in skimming through some of the server merger thread posts, I don't see where anyone gives a basic answer. Mostly, it's seems its just people saying "yeah we should do server mergers" and others saying "No. Let's not."

 

I've seen some people say they prefer being on a "quiet" or "dead" server. If there are enough people on a "quiet or dead" server that BW/EA thinks it warrants keeping said server alive, how does a server merger help those people? If those people were forcibly merged, then those forcibly merged people are not happy. And, I would think said people aren't likely to really contribute much to their new server's community. So, then, what was the point?

 

I can't speak for the European region servers, but I can speak a little bit about Harbinger.

I'll be frank. Harbinger's general chat is filled with sewer waste of people. Most of the time, I am so sick of it, I collapse my general chat window or switch it to a chat tab that filters out general chat and only shows group chat or whispers. Why would you wish that on anyone who actively chooses to stay out of the trash heap that is Harbinger general chat? Yes, people can collapse chat or otherwise not make it visible, but why should they have to do that if they can avoid being on Harbinger altogether?

 

If people on "dead" servers want to move to a more populated server, can't they just save up their monthly cartel coin allowance and in time move all their characters? For the "I want it all now" type of people or non subscribers, they can buy the cartel coins. If you think it's nickle and diming on BW/EA's part, maybe it is, but that's the way things are right now. Most of us (me included) probably want a lot of things either in game or real life that we don't have the budget for, so we have to save and/or adjust our financial priorities. I'm not saying that's desirable or the way things should be; that's just the way real life is.

 

The reality is that no matter what the player base thinks, BW/EA will make a decision on server merges based on $$$, not on what the players think.

[AlaricSevGirl]

Unless they went with a centrally located mega server, merges would not help. I'm on the east coast. I don't want to have to access a server on the west coast. People left because there isn't an endgame and the story became a one size fits all so those who stay are here because they like it. Without a major revamp, they are not going to bring more people in. EA will not put more money into the game. In fact, they put the money from this game into other IPs instead of reinvesting it back into the game. That's been going on for awhile. Plus, they need an active director who knows how to write a good story and get back to what SW has always been, Republic/Rebels vs Empire. I am just thankful that there are servers and even though the content updates are small, they do content updates. I play as a solo player, would love for every FP and OP to be made soloable. That would give me plenty to play even with the game on life support. Edited September 26, 2017 by AlaricSevGirl

[HuaRya]

To follow up on this point, I have questions for those who are "pro server merge".

How does server mergers benefit anyone, the player base, or the game in general?

 

Those 'Pro Merge' see how other games like ESO are designed around one regional mega server so no matter how much of a population hit the game takes there are still people running around to make the game feel alive.

 

Example: Instead of having 2 people per server on 17 servers, all 34 people could be on 1 server instead

 

As of September 2017 the majority of the 17 servers no longer have viable populations of active players to make a merger worthwhile (see my post above). Those dead servers are filled with inactive accounts going back 5 years. Best to seal off the servers so that nobody can transfer to them or make new toons on them. Servers designated dead should offer one transfer per toon to the servers Bioware wants to keep live.

[SolarSaenz]

Those 'Pro Merge' see how other games like ESO are designed around one regional mega server so no matter how much of a population hit the game takes there are still people running around to make the game feel alive.

 

Example: Instead of having 2 people per server on 17 servers, all 34 people could be on 1 server instead

 

As of September 2017 the majority of the 17 servers no longer have viable populations of active players to make a merger worthwhile (see my post above). Those dead servers are filled with inactive accounts going back 5 years. Best to seal off the servers so that nobody can transfer to them or make new toons on them. Servers designated dead should offer one transfer per toon to the servers Bioware wants to keep live.

 

BW/EA should flag the more populated servers so that when brand new players (yes, every once in a while, completely brand new players do come) create their first character, they are defaulted to select the most populated server for their region. In this scenario, they can still choose which server they want to be on in case they have a real life friend who they want to play with but is on a "dead or quiet" server. but, the default selection before confirmation is the most populated server and flagged with a tool tip saying something like "we recommend this server for those wishing the true mmo experience" or something.

 

That would accommodate new people who do minimal or no research into the game before playing. When I tried a few other MMOs, I didn't do any research into the servers. I just selected the default one or randomly chose a server.

And, it would accommodate those who truly wish to be on "dead or quiet" servers.

[Totemdancer]

A question for all those loudly advocating merges. What will you say if the people on the merged servers lose guild ships and/or other things and just quit altogether?

And what will you say if a good portion of the people still playing on those servers who have not moved on their own do not magically show up in your queues but instead continuing playing solo the way they are happy doing now and the merge does nothing for your queue times?

 

I play on JC and am quite happy to continue there. If JC gets merged, I will not suddenly start showing up in any type of queue. Getting merged is not going to change my play style. Merges are not the cure-all people think they are. They did merges in LOTRO, it did not bring people back. I doubt it will here either.

 

My formerly well populated friends list and the large raiding guild I was in are all empty and gone, none of them left over queue times, they left due to slow content releases of varying types, some due to pvp, some due to group content and some due to story content and the last over GC and CXP nonsense. And they are not coming back, they have moved on.

 

Spending money solving all the problems of a server merge just takes away from resources that could go to content, without fresh content of all kinds in sufficient quantities to hold interest and subs, server merges are a mirage that will solve nothing. Releasing an OP one boss at a time over a year+ shows just how thin their resources are at this point.

 

Keith has already stated that they will make it so nobody loses anything, they will have the systems in place before they merge.

So you've got nothing to worry about.

[Savej]

A question for all those loudly advocating merges. What will you say if the people on the merged servers lose guild ships and/or other things and just quit altogether?

 

 

There have been several large threads on this topic. But the active remaining one that hasn't been deleted yet has the responses to your concerns that have been answered over and over, even by Keith in a much referenced podcast.

 

But consider the plight of people on mostly dead servers now. They might have guild ships and names they really like and the will to play but... not on dead servers and not if it meaans they lose names and ships, etc.. For them merges done the way Keith and Eric mentioned are their only hope, right?

[Vodolebon]

...The only thing I can suggest is to do one transfer for 90cc to Red Eclipse (I think that's the most active). That will bring your legacy with you and you can start over. You also shouldn't lose your stronghold, but you will need to rehook everything once you get there, I took photos before I transferred to help me when I did it.

 

Not sure about separating my characters, but i guess it's an option.

Are you sure for the strongholds? because i always heard you lost them if you bought them with credits. Which is my case for 4 strongholds fully unlocked (roughly 30 Mil total)

I could put up with transferring, having to change name, having to redecorate, etc. but not that kind of credit loss.

[Threjyan]

Not sure about separating my characters, but i guess it's an option.

Are you sure for the strongholds? because i always heard you lost them if you bought them with credits. Which is my case for 4 strongholds fully unlocked (roughly 30 Mil total)

I could put up with transferring, having to change name, having to redecorate, etc. but not that kind of credit loss.

 

leave the progenitor - its sad the state that server is in - i started my mmo gaming in progenitor since 1.6, and when i left in 3.0 it was already dying so watching that server these days its just depressing.

 

save urslef from insanity

[SteveTheCynic]

Has anyone checked Torstatus lately? Harbinger is on life support having less population than servers like Shadowlands had this time last year. Torstatus can't even calculate below .99 so there is no exact way of telling how dead the other servers are. The 'merge' servers ship has sailed. All they can do is close down the dead servers giving the people who return to the game a free transfer to whatever servers they decide to leave up.

 

Servers September 2017

ø 1.20English Online The Red Eclipse (PvE)

ø 1.05West Online The Harbinger (PvE)

ø 0.99French Online Battle Meditation (RP PvE)

ø 0.99West Online Begeren Colony (RP PvE)

ø 0.99French Online Darth Nihilus (PvP)

ø 0.99German Online Jar'Kai Sword (PvP)

ø 0.99East Online Jedi Covenant (PvE)

ø 0.99East Online Jung Ma (RP PvP)

ø 0.99French Online Mantle of the Force (PvE)

ø 0.99East Online Prophecy of the Five (PvP)

ø 0.99German Online T3-M4 (PvE)

ø 0.99West Online The Bastion (PvP)

ø 0.99East Online The Ebon Hawk (RP PvE)

ø 0.99English Online The Progenitor (RP PvE)

ø 0.99East Online The Shadowlands (PvE)

ø 0.99English Online Tomb of Freedon Nadd (PvP)

ø 0.99German Online Vanjervalis Chain (RP PvE)

 

Servers October 2016

 

ø 1.86West Online The Harbinger (PvE)

ø 1.57English Online The Red Eclipse (PvE)

ø 1.41German Online T3-M4 (PvE)

ø 1.39East Online The Shadowlands (PvE)

ø 1.38East Online Jedi Covenant (PvE)

ø 1.38East Online The Ebon Hawk (RP PvE)

ø 1.17English Online The Progenitor (RP PvE)

ø 1.01West Online Begeren Colony (RP PvE)

ø 1.00French Online Battle Meditation (RP PvE)

ø 1.00French Online Darth Nihilus (PvP)

ø 1.00German Online Jar'Kai Sword (PvP)

ø 1.00East Online Jung Ma (RP PvP)

ø 1.00French Online Mantle of the Force (PvE)

ø 1.00East Online Prophecy of the Five (PvP)

ø 1.00West Online The Bastion (PvP)

ø 1.00English Online Tomb of Freedon Nadd (PvP)

ø 1.00German Online Vanjervalis Chain (RP PvE)

Yeah, well I can tell you that without units of measure, that list is useless. Both of them. I play normally on Mantle of the Force and for reasons not relevant to the discussion, I have a couple of characters on Darth Nihilus.

 

The population on Fleet (and elsewhere) on MotF is usually around ten times that on DN, roughly speaking, and yet DN is ranked higher on Torstatus? Does not compute.

[Totemdancer]

Not sure about separating my characters, but i guess it's an option.

Are you sure for the strongholds? because i always heard you lost them if you bought them with credits. Which is my case for 4 strongholds fully unlocked (roughly 30 Mil total)

I could put up with transferring, having to change name, having to redecorate, etc. but not that kind of credit loss.

 

I'm not sure because I can't remember how I got my Tat stronghold. All I know is when I transferred, all my SHs were there.

[kodrac]

Yeah, well I can tell you that without units of measure, that list is useless. Both of them. I play normally on Mantle of the Force and for reasons not relevant to the discussion, I have a couple of characters on Darth Nihilus.

 

The population on Fleet (and elsewhere) on MotF is usually around ten times that on DN, roughly speaking, and yet DN is ranked higher on Torstatus? Does not compute.

 

Yup that torstatus doesn't help with anything. It says both BC and TEH are 0.99. BC pub fleet will have less than 20 people during primetime while TEH has about 90. While BC Imp fleet has roughly 40 and TEH Imp fleet has over 110. 0.99 of what exactly? They're populations are not identical. Not even close. TEH is thriving (comparatively speaking) while BC is close to dead and ithey both have the same 0.99 as the old PvP server ghost towns. You really can't use it as a gauge of server population. The best way really is to make a toon and see for yourself.

[Ratajack]

LoL, then say that instead of trying to make me look like I'm lying. Why do you try and make a misdirect or twist people's words or the meaning of a post?

 

So, are you now posting an opinion on wether it's true that mergers arent the only option to fix the population problem or is that fact? It certainly sounds like you think it's fact because you're saying I'm lying about mergers.

 

Is there more than one option to handle server population issues? If the answer is "yes" (even if you personally do not like any of the other options, or think they "won't work"), then I guess that would make it a fact that server merges are not the only option.

 

You do like to keep repeating your rhetoric about paid transfers and people failing to avail themselves of paying for something they should not have to. You've been going on about it all year, but look where we are. The servers are dead because it doesn't work. The remaining people will not pay to transfer when they shouldn't have to. Instead, they just leave the game. Your solution doesn't work and even free transfers are unlikely to work now to solve the problem those other poster's were referring to.

 

So in my "opinion" ( see what I did there again 😉 ), mergers are now the only option and even they might not be enough now to save the game for long if Bioware dont fix all the other problems causing people to keep leaving.

 

I know you won't change your rhetoric, even though a lot of the people who don't want mergers now think free transfers should be offered and people shouldn't have to pay to get off dead servers. I guess you'll be one of those people still saying we don't need mergers or we should have to pay for transfers the day before they turn the servers into full maintenance mode and the game dies. Good luck with that attitude, I'm sure it will server you well in the future 😉

 

You are correct that I am not a big fan of paid transfers, but if you go back and read my posts with an open, objective and honest mind, you will see that my biggest objection is not to the idea of free transfers, but to the way those free transfers have been "suggested" to work--only from "low pop" to "high pop" servers. I have stated numerous times that if BW were going to allow free transfers to the person who wants off their current (low pop,) server because they are unhappy with one aspect of that server (population) then they should also allow free transfers to the person who wants off their current (high pop but toxic community) server because they are unhappy with one aspect of that server (toxic community).

 

The "problem", IMO, has been that many demand free transfers TO high population servers, but do not want to allow free transfers OFF the higher population servers. That is highly hypocritical, IMO.

 

Having said that, once BW resolves all the issues surrounding personal and guild transfers, I would support BW offering one free transfer to every character created before those issues were resolved from their current server to the server of their choice as a means of encouraging players to transfer and allowing those that wish to play on a more populates server to do so without forcibly moving those that are happy on their current server. That includes offering free transfers to those that are dissatisfied with the community on their current server, even if that server is a higher population server.

 

I would even be much more supportive of free transfers now, if they were offered to all players on all servers and worked BOTH ways--OFF high pop servers as well as TO high pop servers.

Edited September 26, 2017 by Ratajack

[Ratajack]

There have been several large threads on this topic. But the active remaining one that hasn't been deleted yet has the responses to your concerns that have been answered over and over, even by Keith in a much referenced podcast.

 

But consider the plight of people on mostly dead servers now. They might have guild ships and names they really like and the will to play but... not on dead servers and not if it meaans they lose names and ships, etc.. For them merges done the way Keith and Eric mentioned are their only hope, right?

 

No, that is not their only hope.

 

If BW can resolve all the issues surrounding guild and personal transfers, then those players that are "stuck" on "dead" servers due to concerns about losing their guild ship, guild name or personal assets would be able to transfer along with their guild to a higher population server without losing that guild ship, guild name or any personal assets.

 

That would allow those players who wish to play on higher population servers the CHOICE to do so, while still allowing those players who are happy on their current servers the CHOICE to do so, as well.

[Kyrra_T]

Are you developers going to include a thorough roadmap explaining what your plans are for resolving all these dead servers?

 

Realistically there are only 2 really viable server choices as far as being able to play this game utilizing the group finder and queue system and that is The Red Eclipse and The Harbinger. Besides those 2 servers the remaining server only exist for nostalgic reasons and are extremely unhealthy as far as population goes.

 

Can I get a developer to say yes or no on this question? I would like to know if this issue is going to be on the roadmap coming up in a few weeks.

 

So Jedi Covenant, who put up more conquest points during Iokath week, between two guilds, than the combined leaderboard of Harbinger is dead? Yeah. Right.

[NuSeC]

I was unaware that anyone was "trapped" on dead servers. Those claiming to be "trapped" on dead servers are CHOOSING to remain on those servers, whatever their excuse is for doing so.

 

That said, BW hopefully BW will be able to resolve all the issues surrounding guild and individual transfers, removing many of the excuses for people being "stuck" on dead servers.

 

No, they are trapped if they want to keep all their guilds and guild assets in tact. And that is becoming harder and harder to do on dead servers. Honestly man, why do you post this same nonsense over and over only for someone like me to come around and repeat myself and point out your logical errors?

 

You are right though... I am "choosing" not to forfeit the couple billion credits invested in guild assets

[Totemdancer]

Warning, everything below is my opinion and should not be considered fact or fiction. It is what it is, my thoughts on the topic.

 

You probably won't need to worry about mergers after this round of "class balancing" because there won't be enough people to make it matter, Those of us hardcore players who have stuck around in the hope some of this insanity would be fixed before the end of the year are now actively talking about leaving.

Hardcore swtor fans and white knights who have said they'd stay till they turned the servers off are now openly discussing leaving. These are the people who have stuck up for Bioware time and again and have been their most adamant supporters.

These players are the proverbial canaries in the mine and when they leave, it's a good bet the game is dead.

I'm a vocal critic of the Devs, but I'm still a hardcore fan of the game. I've locked horns with many of the white knights in the game and I'm extremely sad to hear they are discussing leaving because I know that will be the end of the game. Bioware has basically alienated everyone now. Well done guys, you should pat yourselves on the back for a job well done.

Merge or don't merge, I dont think it matters either way now.

Edited September 26, 2017 by Totemdancer

[TUXs]

Merge or don't merge, I dont think it matters either way now.

Exactly how I'm feeling now. It doesn't save anyone any longer...too late to make any difference and the negatives of 2017 FAR outweigh anything good that has happened...and the nerfs are just starting...next, in 5.6, they attack utilities!!!